I’ve watched many a favorite show of mine die in obscurity(usually subsequent to being pigeonholed into a Friday or Saturday night timeslot) but I’ve never fought to save one. …until now. Fight the good fight, folks. I will be.
I’ve got 4 and a half hours before it’s on… I’m gonna get off the internet soon so no one ruins it for me.
I CAN’T WAIT!
Thanks to the whole cast and crew. I hope you guys come back to work soon. Regardless of what happens you guys made a solid sci-fi show and really made something special. I don’t think the new movie will be as good as this show has been. Sometimes they bring in the big toys to cover up a weak plot. You guys didn’t have big toys, but you had amazing writing. Hopefully the movie will help you guys out with a renewal though. We need to see the story continue!
“I ask everyone in this chat room to respectfully wait to post anything ,and not ruin anyones finale due to the time difference.
Lata.”
Umm, why enter an episode discussion thread about an ep you haven’t seen yet? just wait til its aired in your time zone. if you get spoiled in here its your own fault.
we’re having tornado warnings in this area and ALL the other stations are using a scroll to relay information. except the morons at Fox who have decided to have the newscasters stand around with their fingers up their butts to redundantly say what’s going on, instead of simply using a scroll! anybody know when the episode will be watchable on the site?
Guys, I know you’re probably at or headed to a bar, but on the off chance you get this: amazingly, wonderfully, beautifully well done. You tell a heck of a story, and you should all be very proud. Thanks.
That was so awesome! My mouth was hanging open during the final moments! Flawless television. I’m going to be so bummed if this doesn’t get picked up for next year.
Absolutely fantastic episode. I don’t even know how to begin. Fantastic plot twists, amazing writing, outstanding acting. By far the best episode ever.
Just finished and really confused. Maybe I haven’t had enough time to process what just happened…..But it appears that John Connor is now an ordinary human citizen and Judgement Day came with out him there to stop it.
I can’t say I’m pleased with this enormous cliffhanging hole you’ve left us and I’m terrified that something might happen and you won’t be here next season to give me the answers…..
If we don’t get a third season, I will go crazy. Like seriously crazy.
And while I’m happy to see Allison (which means Summer), she’s not Cameron. She’s not the cyborg I love. By the way, thanks for making me cry when we see Cameron got JH to take her chip and she was saying “I’m sorry, John”. Not cool!!
BTW, SCC_Im4Season3… No, that doesn’t mean it’s over for good. It’s opening up new angels to the show. I’m very curious as to how the writers would make that work… John in the future, no Sarah and no Cameron (although Allison, but still… It’s not Cameron…). It would be neat to see…
THIS IS HOW JOHN CONNOR’S LEGEND BEGINS. EVERYTHING BEGINS AGAIN AS JOHN NOW WILL BECOME THE LEADER HE’S DESTINED TO BE WITHOUT ANY STIGMA OF FATE ATTACHED.. HE HAS TO EARN IT… AND THEN HE WILL SEND KYLE BACK TO IMPREGNATE SARAH
FANTASTIC episode beautiful writing. i loved Weaver and I’m so happy that Cameron isn’t dead I can really die happy now Did I say that? Thank You Thank YOu THank You Thank YOu.
So great everything was so great.
This is the most well written series EVER!!! I LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE what the writers have done with this story line. Why would the best show ever be cancelled?
I started blushing when I saw Brian Austin Green, I love everything about this show! Great Job Sarah Connor Chronicles!!!!!!
No, she wasn’t Cam, as they clearly showed by having her beside a watching dog. She’s Allison. Allison from Palmdale.
And now, that fever-dream-memory-flash-back Derek had of John in the future, when John’s silhouette looked EXACTLY like past John… Well, it seems that that’s because they are one and the same.
Past John and future John are just a split second apart, actually.
The episode left me speechless! That was mind blowing, heart stopping/wrenching cliffhanger! THANK YOU JOSH AND ALL THE WRITERS!
That episode is the reason FOX needs to renew TSCC.
SAVE TSCC!
Well that was a great episode. The ending was mind blowing.. but I dont know where that leaves the series now. I think that ending was a setup for Salvation.
ya, i had a feeling when he was going to meet weaver she wasnt going to be hostile, but it threw me for a loop with what happened in the basement. cam betrays and sarah leaves
Gah. I might have to watch this again to fully understand what I just saw. which I’m sure I would have done anyway. even if it does get renewed it’ll still be quite a while before we get new eps. (and there had better be another season!)
I’m glad my area wasn’t affected by weather like some were here. the most annoying thing on my end was just the prison break banner that took up a third of the screen.
on a side note, the Terminator Salvation thing was a let down. I thought it was supposed to be unseen footage? as far as I can tell it was just the most recent trailer we’ve all already seen. bleh.
Can I just say ..Best friggin show on TV! If it doesnt get a 3rd season its a HUGE mistake by fox. I love the fact that this show actually gives you answers to question while causing more questions to arise…and as a season finale DAMN! I cant wait…so hopefully fox reads some of this and realize what a great show they have here.
WOW! I was not expecting any of that at the end. Thank you for tying up all the loose ends of this season, now you just opened up a million more possibilities for (hopefully) season 3. With where the characters are now, the writers are going to have a field day with where they could take the story. Great finale. I need a drink now.
Great episode, LOVED IT!! I can’t believe Weaver is good, I need to know what she is up to! Please don’t cancel this show it’s the best! My husband and I watch it every Friday night!
I will never tune in to Fox again if they don’t renew this series.
This is the best thing that has ever come.
Thank you again, Josh Friedman, and all the writers.
Thank you Lena Headey, Thomas Dekker, Summer Glau, Brian Austin Green, Richard T. Jones, Garrett Dillahunt, Shirley Manson for everything you’ve poured out.
Thank you for keeping Terminator alive for all of us, for the people that this really means something to.
And that is why there will be a third season. This episode was even better than the pilot episode, and they gave the fans EVERYTHING they wanted. Especially the return of Chola. That was something I wanted to see, but not something I expected. I voted for this show’s return, and if it doesn’t, I’m gonna spam Fox with pancake mix.
But there’s no reason the show won’t come back? So what about the ratings? That never hurt the show before, just made everyone nervous. And don’t forget that they even extended the second season just because everyone was so paranoid. This show is here to stay.
That was the most fantastic hour of television I have ever seen. AWESOME!!!! You broke my heart and my brain last episode, so I was a bit gun shy tonight. But good gods, that was good TV. All the homages to the film. All the homages to the SCC universe itself. Powerhouse episode.
So why did he f’ing time travel with some metal that he doesn’t even know if she’s good metal or bad metal. Sucks cameron died. and… we have… colmarti in the future, with john, with cameron’s chip in him… lol talk about a psycho.
I’m thinking now, this entire season 2, mrs. weaver’s entire purpose, coming back into the past and everything, was to send past-john to the future, and screw up the future some how.
Also side note: i wonder how many people in the future have NOT seen the liquid-metal version of the robot army, seemed everyone on the submarine a few shows back was shocked when they saw it.
And cameron lied… when he asked her “Will you join us?” she knew weaver was metal.. oh well, god that ending f’ing sucked, why send him there when no one knows him… *sigh* way to f— it up people
I don’t care though, i’m hooked, i’m going to watch the movie when it comes out, and i’ll sit infront of the tv to watch every single last episode, good or bad.
So I know I just posted but I have to repost something I just posted on the C&J forums…
I wonder if the writers will write it so that we (and John) get to know Allison a little bit, then it kind of goes into a repeat of history and she’s taken, a Cyborg takes her identity and John ends up reprograming her and ending up with Cameron all over again! That’s what I want to happen. As awesome as Allison is (and will be even more once we get to know her)…. She’s still no quirky cyborg who loves John (and who John loves back)
OMG OMG That was intense. What a left turn the story took. Never in a million years did I see that coming. Well done Josh, Pat yourself on the back. I Can’t wait until season three.
THE BEST EPISODE I HAVE EVER SEEN!! SO MANY QUESTIONS. DOES JOHN TELL KYLE HE IS HIS DAD? WILL HE LOVE CAMERON OR SHALL I SAY ALISON THE SAME. IS SARAH SAFE? OMG TOO MANY QUESTIONS NOT TO HAVE A THIRD SEASON!!! PLEASE FOX, PLEASE!!
Seriously…I had not bothered to watch TV shows for years now and I just happened to see the show on Hulu not far into the first season. If this show goes….I’ll pretty much have no need for civilization. Fox would be making a huge mistake.
I love this show. It never disappoints. I saw the season finale and of course have more questions than answers. They have got to come back for another season. Does anyone have any answers about the ending?
April 10th, 2009 at 6:16 pm
“I will never tune in to Fox again if they don’t renew this series.
This is the best thing that has ever come.
Thank you again, Josh Friedman, and all the writers.
Thank you Lena Headey, Thomas Dekker, Summer Glau, Brian Austin Green, Richard T. Jones, Garrett Dillahunt, Shirley Manson for everything you’ve poured out.
Thank you for keeping Terminator alive for all of us, for the people that this really means something to.
Thank you all.”
My sentiments exactly. I will NEVER watch fox again if this show is actually cancelled.
This is the best show on tv, my husband and I watch it EVERY Friday!! If this show does not come back for Season 3, I think we will go into cardiac arrest! This was such an awesome episode!
I don’t even know what to say.
That was truly incredible.
I don’t even know what to feel right now.
Brilliant….
The ending was actually quite satisfying. It gives hope for a third season and if not, a good end to the series.
SEASON 3!!!!!
Great Episode!!! This mysterious line, –will you join us? — makes me wonder what exactly is going on… The time jump and twists i love them! keep it up! great acting and great story!!
OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG.. THAT WAS THE MOST AMAZING, EPIC, PHENOMENAL, AWESOME, CRAZY, FANTASTIC, SUPERCALIFRAGILOUS EXPIALIDOCIOUS EPISODE OF THIS WHOLE SHOW!!
ALLISON’S BACK!! DEREKS ALIVE!! CAMERON’S CHIP’S WITH JOHN HENRY!! JOHN’S IN THE FUTURE!! I JUST DRANK LIKE 3 CANS OF MOUNTIAN DEW!!
holy, i need to calm down….
ill review this whole episode later when i can actually type.. i need to watch this episode a few million more times…. ill be back later… *flees to DVR*
Holy Crap! that was soooo damn amazing! The writting is just top freaking notch on this show! Please, please bring it back!!!! There is just soo much potential! With A good time slot i KNOW it would get more viewers. Plus the movie could be a great way to get people to check out the show!!!!
Ok Thank you so much for listening to fans or at least caring what they think and taking their views in to opinion. That’s what makes a great show and this one is so well done. Even though we don’t all agree you still thought about us. I’m just going on now.
Thank you all amazing show
Argh, I can’t believe the series is going to end like this. SCREW Fox! It’s Fox’s fault for putting a show on friday night when everyone is out and recording it on their DVR, and then not counting the DVR watchers towards the show’s ratings.
What’s the point of having a show on Friday night if it has zero chance of getting acceptable ratings? When you count the people who record or watch online, about 7 million people per week watch TSCC. Yet they only want to count the few people who are at home on friday night watching TV live that very moment. Most people who do that are going to be watching some reality crapola about celebrity weight-loss.
Unbelievable… another great show gets killed by Fox. I’m keeping my fingers crossed for a 3rd season, but I see no real hope for that. What a horrible way to end the series - they could have at least had the decency to give the writers a heads-up so that they could wrap up the series, like ABC did for Life on Mars.
Since Arrested Development, I have a policy of never watching new shows on Fox until they’ve been given a second season. I kinda made an exceptio for TSCC because the “first season” was only 9 episodes long due to the WGA strike… so as far as I’m concerned the show really only had 1 long season, or maybe 1.5 seasons… but definitely not two. 9 episodes does not qualify for a season in America (and this is not the BBC).
Come on Fox, give the show a 3rd season, and if you’re not going to count DVR viewership, then put the show on at a time when people are actually at home watching television. Save friday nights for another 5 hours of American Idol.
I love this show.
I almost cried.
Please, Fox, give us a season 3!
But with this new twist.. this means Jesse is probably back in? No, please. I couldn’t STAND her. I was happy when Derek shot her.
Yay for Allison! And Derek and Kyle.. and I was surprised that Catherine is a good character, up until this episode I was almost convinced she was bad.
i didnt fully grasp the kaliba connection.
whats the whole liquid escaping from the imploding sub/liquid CW connection and the “will you join us” part?
why exactly did ? choose alison young to replicate?
wheres the story of why future john sent cameron back to his younger self?
whats the story with the flying H.K.s,who’s behind them,what was their agenda,why did weaver destroy their desert coltan storage,what where they doing with the coltan,what made weaver say it was a mistake when john henry overheard the radio transmission about the coltan?
what the hell happened to john henry?
what the hell happened to cameron?
what the hell happened to weaver?
see where i’m going here?this felt like when your sitting in the theatre and the screen does that horrible melting thing,the projector explodes,and the lights come on.
with as strong of a possibility of this season being all we were going to get,this was the wrap-up we get?sorry,but all these unanswered plotlines make the whole thing feel like a giant waste of time.like that show reunion.only much worse.
i’ll be waiting till all three of the movies are released.
Oh my god, there are no words…there are no words! There are no words for how blown my mind is, but I’m going to try anyway. That was absolutely the best episode of, not only the show, but any show I think I’ve ever watched before. I felt like a total nerd but I totally had a break down afterward, a complete giggle fit on my dorm room floor. I’m just so excited about the twist at the end that I can hardly stand it, I can’t stop smiling! The way they left us off was genius, but now they just HAVE to have a third season because the direction the finale just took us in is just to GOOD not to explore!
… That was one of the most incredible things I’ve ever seen. I’m speechless.
All I can say is if TSCC does not get another season, thank you so much for everything.
I truly cannot thank you all - the absolutely incredible cast and crew - enough for what you and this show has done for my life.
Thank you for giving me something to always remember with pride.
Haven’t commented here before, but this show is so awesome that I desperately hope the fans can show so much support that Fox will finally do something right for once.
T:TSCC was/is the the best series I’ve seen in a long time. Please, please please give us more, and sign up the cast for another season before they all head their seperate ways. My wife and I watch the show every Friday, and I’ve really enjoyed series excellent twist and the plot writting has been excellent. Fox, you have a great Franchise here, you blew it once with Family Guy (the only other show I watch besides T:TSCC btw), but you realized your mistake and brought it back. Please do the same with T:TSCC.
And if you don’t, thanks for giving us two great seasons. These seasons will definately be a DVD purchase for me and I will watch them occassonally for years to come.
A third season is a must. The story has opened up so much and there are so many angles to explore. This was truely an amazing episode and I hope to see more in the future with another season. Keep the excitement in your line up FOX, don’t let it end now.
Even I am very very sick, I still remember what’s on Friday!!
That was totally AWESOME!!!!
but i can’t believe this is the end…=[
I really hope there will be more and more seasons!!!
Now i am back to the no tv life until TSCC is back…
Thank you for all the GREAT GREAT WORKS!!!
Cameron had John Henry put her chip into his cyborg body and then zapped herself into the future. She’s in the future now with young John Connor, but in JH’s skin. That must be how they get future Allison turned into Cameron, the JH body gives the chip to Weaver who uses it when she makes Cameron. WOW!
THANK YOU!
Thank you for crafting such an AMAZING finale.
I can’t even find the words to describe it, it was pure awesomeness.
This is certainly one of those TV moments we live for!
I REALLY hope you guys are planning in doing a 3rd season. PLEASE.
I’ve never rallied or cared about a television show or cared if it got cancelled but this show has changed my mind. I can’t believe FOX is even thinking of canceling this show! Especially since the movie, (although not linked to the show) will clearly boost interest in the franchise. They would be stupid not to renew the show but networks rarely take risks anymore. I remember when FOX was considered the most reckless, network taking on shows like the Simpsons and Married with children but stuck to their guns with shows when they knew they were good and they eventually became classics that became a part of our culture. Now they seem to be like every other network quick to throw in the towel. Find your balls again FOX and support a show you know is good. You had them once, try it again! The cast you’ve assembled for this show is so top notch and the writing is so good, you’d be fools to disband it all just as it was getting into the thick of it! If you don’t want to renew the show you should sell the rights to NBC so they can put the series on SciFi so fans can enjoy the best science fiction television series since X-files.!
The Season Finale was one of the best Fox hangers ever! Lets keep this show going along with the other great shows like Fringe and Dollhouse! Those 3 equal great things for Fox!
WOA!! That was KICKASS!! There is NO WAY they are going to make us Wait until 2010 or something for Season Three, right?? This finale episode was incredible, not sure what to say actually…..don’t want to spoil anything …. it’s HARRRRD to hold back on comments and questions….
I HAD TWO CANS OF RED BULL AND ONE MOUNTAIN DUE I CAN BARLEY TYPE ,AND I WANT TO SEE WHAT JOHN’S THOUGHTS ARE ON ALISON. WHAT HAPPENS TO CAMERON. JOHN IS NOT IN LOVE WITH ALISON HE IS IN LOVE WITH CAMERON WHO WILL MOST LIKELY REPLACE ALISON SOONER OR LATER. OMG!! I NEED A SEASON THREE THIS IS JUST TOOOO MUCH. FOX PLEASE!!!
This episode was amazing! It might be my favorite of the series.
The ending left the door open for so many great stories. FOX, please please please give us another season. This show has some of the best writing on television today and it would be a shame to turn the lights out now.
To the cast and crew, thanks for a season of action-packed, thought-provoking, tug at the heart strings stories. I hope this isn’t the end!
So… i literally just cried when i got to thinking that this could be the end…
its sooooo amazing!
COME ON SEASON 3
and if not season 3, then…
TSCC THE MOVIE(S)
THE STORY IS TO GOOD TO LET IT END HERE!
I’ve been a diehard fan since the pilot, and all I have to say is…
Thank you.
Thank you, the writers, producers, actors, camera men, grips, PAs, post-production crew and everyone else I’ve forgotten.
This show, this episode in particular - is the best program to hit the television in years.
It’s bittersweet, knowing that this episode may/will be cancelled, but I’ve gotta say - this episode was very, VERY satisfying. I’m on cloud nine, and there ain’t no bringing me down. You all have outdone yourself with the entire show, and I really hope - if anything - this show gets the recognition it deserves. You guys are beyond awesome.
I’m… at a loss of words. I love you guys, in the strictly heterosexual and platonic sense.
So many questions answered, so many surfaced; and to top it off, this finale left a helluva lot of room for story in the (HOPEFULLY) third season. If not, I think we can all agree that we can live with this conclusion, even if we vy for more.
Again.
Thank you.
P.S. Allison better fall in love with John, or there’ll be hell to pay! YOU HEAR ME SUMMER!?
i certenly hope that this show comes back this is the first that i heard that it might not. i love it and would be devistated again BY FOX IF THEY DONT CONTINUE.
I’m shocked by the episode, in the best way possible! I’ve never screamed or groaned out loud at my tv before (well, not when a sports game isn’t playing) but I was literally yelling at some points- every minute of the last 15 minutes. so so good. so so satisfying, but not nearly enough. I have to see where they are going with this, with John in the future, with a Derek with no idea who he is, and finally away from his mom!!! Brilliant move. What will happen with Allison? if that is Allison. Oh this show needs another season- I’ve never been more obsessed with a TV show- once you start you’re hooked. Great job writer-thanks for two amazing seasons, and I hope everyone involved with the show gets the third season they deserve~!!!!
I finished watching the final episode of seaon 2 (born to run). It’s a great episode, though a bit sad that Cameron gave up her life to save man kind. I think this last episode was also intended to show that some machines learn to appreciate human life. As Sara Connors said, ‘When they learn to appreciate human life, they would not need to kill us, they will be us’. I think that’s what some of the machines are becoming. It would be a shame for Fox not to continue 3rd season.
@ Jeff Holland
I totally agree with you. Especially with what you said about TSCC being the next best scifi tv show since X-files. I was and still am a huge fan of the x-files.
Cameron is gone? My favorite character is gone and then it ends? That was my favorite episode ever, but where does it leave the show’s namesake? Will she be fighting Kaliba with a Cameroned out John Henry, while John cracks endoskulls with Derik, Allison, and Weaver? Thats some crazy stuff but it does lay the ground work for a new spin on the show which is cool. Or obviously John could just come back with the chip and explain his quest through flashbacks throughout S3. But I don’t agree with some that say that its a satisfying ending, it seemed to me like an exciting beginning to a whole new chapter. Whatever it takes we need a season 3!!!!!!
-Best scenario Fox picks up a S3
-Second best another network (like a wb network, or scifi) picks up S3.
-Third best scenario we get a straight to Blu-ray move that gives us the rest of the story and lets the cast out for a romp.
Worst scenario the story ends now and we believe whatever we want to believe…NO that can’t happen in this timeline.
Execs, writers, fans, This show has the hardcore fans to justify any of the top three suggestions. This is the greatest show ever made and we need more! WHATEVER IT TAKES!!!
Cameron had John Henry put her chip into his cyborg body and then zapped herself into the future. She’s in the future now with young John Connor, but in JH’s skin. That must be how they get future Allison turned into Cameron, the JH body gives the chip to Weaver who uses it when she makes Cameron. WOW!
No, no , no. John Henry was downloaded onto Cameron’s chip. He zapped himself into the future. What was left of Cameron was sitting there saying “I’m sorry” from the turk hardware.
Brilliant job by the writers…this ending can either segue back into the story we all know (that John now can become the leader he is destined to be and will send back Kyle to protect his mother and become his father) ….which provides a neat solution for the predestination paradox, OR it leaves the door open for future seasons.
Other things that were wrapped up in this way (or not)…that Ellison and Sarah did NOT jump ahead, that CW did, that JH did with Cameron’s chip, and so on.
A great way to end the season, and if it turns out to be the end of the series (I hope not!) at least it was done in an intelligent and clever way.
i thought terminators can’t self terminate so how did cameron kill herself(by removing her chip) ??????????? UNLESS JOHN HENRY DID IT (DUM DUM DUM)
MILES DYSON’S SON IS MISSING MAYBE IF THERE IS A SEASON 3 SARAH WILL TRY TO FIND HIM
the ending felt like the series finale it eplains how john became the leader of mainkind(he was sent to the future) it eplains how he sent back derek and kyle reese and it explains how john sent back cameron (maybe it was the human cameron with that dog in the ep’s ending scene)
everyone read this it is a theory it explains why john connor loved alison young
it also explains why john connor loved alison young because alison was basically cameron phillips with a human mind and body
PLEASE EVERYONE TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT MY THOUGHTS AND THEORYS GOOD OR BAD COMMENTS I DONT CARE
Wow! I cannot put into words how good the season finale was tonight. In fact, the entire second half of Season 2 has been absolutely stellar. I want to thank everyone associated with “Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles” for making a superior television show. A show this good must be renewed.
OK. Many possibilities. I’d like to see how the 3rd season pans out. More later…have to do the ‘cast and then the blog (which will be done by 9:30pm MDT and about 11:30pm MDT respectively).
Coulda used more answers, but I do like the possibilities.
First time poster here also. I agree with everyone here who has complimented the creative staff and actors. As many others have said here I have typically not watched FOX programming (other than football). When this series was introduced I wanted to get involved in it at the beginning, particularly since I have been looking for an adequate replacement for my previous X-Files addiction. It’s a shame that FOX will likely cancel this series, mainly because its writing is far superior to all the other scripted programming on network television. It certainly seemed, based on the way this episode ended, that Josh Freidman left the story as he did in anticipation of not getting renewed for a third season. I also agree that this ending afforded more plot variations that could keep it going at least another season. It’s my hope they will continue the series, but I can say I’m satisfied with the ending, if it must end this way.
Kudos to Freidman and the WONDERFUL cast. I am especially proud of Summer Glau. I understand she is a fellow Texan (…which once again proves my assertion that Texas has some of the most beautiful women in the world!)
FOX: Season 3 would be a great idea. Like Jeff Holland said earlier, grow a set & give this series a real chance.
Brilliance!!! Josh & Writers you guys really know how to tell a story. I felt so much emotion this episode. When Cameron broke Sarah out of jail Cam had tears in her eyes when she I’m not 100% my heart broke right then. I really am happy with the finale of season 2. I really want to see how the characters play out in the new environment. I personally pray at night that Fox will renew a 3rd season with TSCC for real. If that doesn’t happen I’m not sure what is next for Fox.
PLEASE FOX….At least a half season….anything…just don’t make us settle for what we just saw! There is WAY too much that needs to be answered. You CAN NOT leave us with “John Connor who?”
Keep voting everybody! We can’t let this be the end.
So this is what Summer meant back at wondercon in february when she was asked if she liked where Cameron ends up by seasons end. I understand now her reaction and answer to that question.
WOW. well its named after sarah so she has to be back. i’ll be so mad if it doesnt get picked up for a third season. is it possible tho tht stuff isnt as it seems. like when sarah was taken prisoner but we were supposed to think reality was that sleeping ward, not the prison cell.
AMAZING!!! There better be a season 3. Damn, why did it take most of season 2 for it to get REALLY GOOD? When it comes back, I would like to see John get into a relationship with Allison. When John was on top of Cameron, you know he had feelings for her. He couldn’t go for Cameron, but he could with Allison.
FOX, don’t screw this up and give it one more season
Today showed just how Awsome T:SCC is. And why it’s such a shame it may not continue. The final twist…Gosh darn Fantastic! Look forward to Season 2 Blu-ray. Sarah and the Gang Rock!
I love this show! For the love of god (or whomever), Fox, please do NOT cancel such a well written, well acted show laden with such fantastic special effects to boot. The season finale tonight was just beyond words kick ass in my opinion. Soooo good. This show needs to come back!!!
Hey Guys THANKS FOR ALL THE GREAT 31 EPISODES!!!!!!! This season finale was great i would love to see a season 3 of John using what he has learned already, and also With kyle and derek to militarily finish the training will leave the third season the best of all. I Cant wait for Fox to open their eyes and realize that what they have is gold. Josh is a a freakin brain cuz if the movie does as well as we expect it. Season 3 will be like the prequel to how John goes from a smart kid to a great leader. Carry On great writers all of you rock and to the best damn Cast Alot of love see you in season 3. Lets take back our show and resist FOXs termination.
OK loved the T1 throwbacks, tie in to other eps Samson& Dehlia, The Good Wound, “not today not yet, that it wasnt too Jameron, Cams gone and replaced by Allison, I flipped when Derek came back, but if Johns the leader how do they not know who he is? Weaver and JH and Sarah and Ellison in the past OH! I knew John would see his Daddy but for real? We have to find out answers. WE NEED A SEASON 3 & IF THAT’S NOT POSSIBLE PLEASE MAKE A TSCC DVD! I’m losing it here. I better go watch it again. That looked kinda funny when Cams face was all messed up. Whatever Josh is smokin I want some.
did I miss something. John Henery was not in the basement when the gang arrived. How do we know he went to the future? I thought he just left. I guess I will have to watch it again.
Tonight was the best Friday of TV I’ve had in ever.
This episode BLEW MY FREAKIN’ MIND. I love this show. If I was having doubts about buying this show on DVD, I sure as hell am not now. I’d buy the entire season just for this episode. And I’ll patiently wait for May, when the show is renewed, and then I’ll patiently wait for the Fall, when the third season starts.
A beautiful ending and beginning as the Terminator saga makes another future/past, past/future cycle. The TSCC was a noble effort that can best be judged not be its commercial success but by how much the fans loved it. When you have the time, perhaps you could fill us in on where you saw the series going if there was to be a S3 and beyond and address the rest of the loose ends that were not resolved by the finale. I hope all of you find new gigs in short order and we’ll look for new shows with your names in the credits in the future.
I think Cameron just completed the mission she was sent back in time for. It was to get John Henry a chip. It explains why John Connor ‘chooses’ Allison Young in the future! New future Derek! Where’s Weaver(Waldo)? Cameron’s code is in the Turk hardware? WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!
C’mon, admit it. Who all wept at the end of that?! I’m a softy and I did… a little. I guess we’ll have to leave the “future” to our imaginations because the evidence seems overwhelming that that was THE final show. :^( Who wouldn’t want to know what happens from there, and who wouldn’t be sad for John and Sarah after that?! Will they ever see each other again? Will Sarah die before he gets a chance to see her… if he ever does? Of course, Derek and Kyle had been dead and they were there due to the time travel continuum effects. Was that the future Cameron “metal”, or was it the human that Skynet patterned her after? Was John Connor nonexistent to them in that future since they didn’t know the name, and will the John Connor from the past become the leader of the resistance? It boggles the mind! At the very least, hopefully that will help with the transition from “T2″ to “Salvation”. Maybe another network will pick it up and continue it. It’s happened before with other shows!
Ahhh, now I’m getting it. It seems that John was put into the timeline at a point that would have his and Kyle’s ages to have the right father/son time spread. Hmmm. If that was the human Cameron, then John will not have lost the “girl” he loved. Or the uncle and father for that matter. Only mom, who would be dead anyway due to cancer. Wow! Salvation here we come!!
Firstly Cameron’s eyes are blue and with that done…
I had written at least an entire page’s worh of comment but I deleted it because it doesn’t matter. Cameron, our Cameron, only survived if JH somehow tucked the chip under some organic tissue when he made the jump. Best guess, he placed it in his mouth.
Otherwise the Cameron we all know and love will never be brought back. It’s physically impossible. I’m sure you can create the same chasis and skin and everything but the memories? Her experiences that made her her? She never told anyone about sneaking off to the library at night. She never told anyone what really happened during her time spent as Allison Young. John can try and reprogram her as much as he wants but she will never be the same.
It’s like the whole Jesse fiasco all over again. She may have acted like Derek’s Jesse, she may have looked like Derek’s Jesse, she may have even shared some of the same memories as Derek’s Jesse but she wasn’t his Jesse which was the only way Derek could bring himself to pull the trigger.
That’s all I’m going to say because that’s how important this issue is with me and it might become a make or break deal when Season 3 starts. If a copycat Cameron is created, as flawless and quirky humored as she can be, still it wouldn’t be the same. So please, please, please! Make John move heaven and earth to find that little bit of silicon. And why?
I love you Summer!
Ps. For example Cromarties head shouldn’t have come through during the first jump. It should have been destroyed. Please don’t try and take the same cop out with Cameron’s chip.
Anyone who says this was a satisfying ending to the series is in complete self-denial. This was a great cliffhanger for a season finale, but a TERRIBLE way to end the series. I blame fox, of course, not the TSCC writers.
Ok, that was possibly the best episode yet! Fox will lose a lot of viewers if they don’t give us a third season. AT LEAST give us a full length movie (not Salvation.) I think this is the best show on television and I am baffled as to why it hasn’t got enough viewers for Fox to keep it going. Anyway, the petitions are coming around, so sign them and pray that we will be treated to a fantastic third season.
OMG!!! That was truly AMAZING!!!!! I agree.. Cameron’s eye should’ve been blue, not RED. Otherwise, FLAWLESS PERFORMANCE & WRITING!!!!
Please O’ Please FOX!!!! GIVE US MORE T:TSCC!!!! We want Seasons 3-whenever, PLEASE!!!!!
Enough reality show BS, give us back drama/adventure/action shows like this!!!!
I’m tired of Gordon Ramsey and all other BS scripted ‘Reality’ shows. Everyone knows sane people don’t act the way they do on these BS shows. Enough…. everyone here is speaking. Give us what we want…please
I absolutely loved the last several episodes. As I slowly move further out of the demographic that is supposed to be targeted by these shows (most advertisers are now more interested in attracting my kids attention rather than mine - the majority of the money still comes from me though…), I find that my tastes don’t change as much as I would have guessed. I would have loved this show as much as a teen as I do now.
I have to say that I though the middle part of this season was a bit slow and had some storylines that didn’t really capture my imagination - but the last several episodes have been truly fantastic. I will truly miss this show - it deserves at least one more spin around the block.
I don’t think so but I’m open to the possibility. Remember, his programming took up a room of computers, was much less sophisticated than Cameron’s programming and may not have fit on her chip. Also what would be his motivation? Unless Weaver told him to expect her and transfer himself (?).
Cameron has motivation. Her chip may be damaged and she may be afraid she’d hurt John if she stayed as Cameron in the present. And she may be bringing her chip to future Weaver to insert into the Cameron cyborg body when it’s taken over from Allison (another time loop paradox.)
Another possibility, Cameron is in JH’s body in the present and never went into the future, that was just a pretext Weaver used to get JH out of there and to follow her. Cameron may have thought John would have never trusted JH’s body if he ran across it and he’d be safer.
Either way, with John gone and JH gone, It sort of evens out the balance in the families, both she and Sarah Connor lose their son in the end.
Jman <>
Cameron came through when she, Sarah and John jumped from the bank. Cameron came through from the future to the past. That was a bogus excuse, and leads me to believe Weaver has no idea what happened either - or where JH/Cameron are- present or future, but knew that John’s life was threatened in the present by Kaliba and wanted to save his life the way he saved Savannah’s. (another family parallel - each one saved the other’s child).
When it comes to TV or movies, I LOVE it when I totally don’t see something coming.
That ending literally left my jaw dropped for at least 30 minutes while some “dollhouse” show ran afterwords. I just sate there trying to process what I just saw. Completely mind phucked and I totally want more!
ABSOLUTELY the best episode of ANY show I have EVER seen!
I can only hope it gets picked up for another season.
There must be a third season. This was not an ending but a cliff hanger setting up season 3. Surely all the unanswered questions mean there must be a season 3, right?
I can’t believe people are still talking about Cromartie’s head. You would have seriously rather watched a full human-looking head fly at you from the screen? Like a decapitated HUMAN head FLY AT YOU? Has no one considered that that may have been too graphic for network television?
I thought John Herny put Cameron’s chip in his head, so he now Cameron… Summer Glau inside Garret Dillahunt. That’s how he was able to time-travel back with her chip without the chip getting destroyed. He didn’t take the Turk computer with him, so he wouldn’t have been able to do anything at all unless he was using Cameron’s chip (which she gave him).
How did John Henry know there was a time machine in the basement? How would Cameron have known? How would Cameron have explained to JH the need to time-travel to the future? To save Savannah, maybe? How would Cameron have known to tell him that?
The series won’t end, if anyone at FOX has anything in their head at all.
My ReCAPTCHA word is scheduled highway. Hopefully someone at FOX understands how the schedule makes Friday shows have low ratings. If not… well, I can’t really threaten not watching FOX shows for a few reasons, but I’ll have some animosity towards them. It’ll show them.
Bruce I think you missed the point…at the time of production, the jury was likely still out (and may still be) on whether or not they would be back for another season.
This was a brilliant way to handle it either way…tying up enough to make the timeline/story arcs work, but leaving enough open to invite additional seasons.
If they gave it a SOLID ending and then got picked up for a 3rd season, it would be a lot harder to pull off continuity.
Surely Fox can’t abandon the season like.They even brought back to life Derek albeit as future Derek and gaves us a glimpse of Kyle and Alsion. They’ve set things up for season 3, please give a new season.
Wolfie, you are on to something…Cam DID know what was in that basement as soon as Ellison gave her the “will you join us” message. And JH said he knew her, and she knew him.
People seem to be forgetting that JH had no chip…he was plugged in. Cam could have instructed him to remove her chip, told him how to insert it into himself, and then unplug himself from the turk.
BruceM: I thought John Herny put Cameron’s chip in his head, so he now Cameron… Summer Glau inside Garret Dillahunt. That’s how he was able to time-travel back with her chip without the chip getting destroyed. He didn’t take the Turk computer with him, so he wouldn’t have been able to do anything at all unless he was using Cameron’s chip (which she gave him).
I agree. Cameron’s chip is in JH’s body. JH is just a computer right now, interfacing in the cyborg body through the cord at the back of his head. Disconnect him from the computers and he doesn’t exist. I’m still open to JH having downloaded himself into Cameron’s chip and jumping that way, but I think it’s unlikely. He wasn’t sophisticated enough to do all that (plus the files size issue)..
BruceM: How did John Henry know there was a time machine in the basement? How would Cameron have known? How would Cameron have explained to JH the need to time-travel to the future? To save Savannah, maybe? How would Cameron have known to tell him that?
JH (and Weaver) were expecting Cameron. Whatever JH told Cameron when she got there was a message/instructions from Weaver . If the Cameron in Allison from Palmdale came from Weaver, then she would return to her ‘maker’ (”sorry John”).
Cameron is still alive, she’s just in another body temporarily (until season 3!!!!)
BTW, Cameron is the one who left and Riley was the one who betrayed - right? Or did Cameron betray and Sarah leave? Is what Cameron did really a betrayal if she brought her chip to future Weaver to insert into future Cameron?
Cameron had taught John everything else she needed to when she showed him how to get to her power cell.
The only way John Henry had to unplug from the machine, the turk, was to download himself onto Cameron’s chip. Weaver said that’s what he did. John Henry knew everything, including about the time machine. Weaver never hid anything from him.
The question is who is really in charge in the future?
And the point I was making is that it was a cop out. A flash of the literary license. When Weaver said “They don’t come through” she meant that they couldn’t have taken Cameron because of the damage her cybernetic tissue took. That went with Terminator genre. Cromartie’s head was a serious screwup. Right up there with Sarah’s shoulder scar being on the wrong shoulder. I mentioned it now because again we see Cameron’s chip, non-organic, going through time and to keep it in cannon they need to make sure its covered up.
You’re assuming I said they should’ve showed a human head fly into the camera? No I did not. I pointed out that it went against Terminator genre, the cannon, and they should’ve thought of another way to have Cromartie time travel with the Connors to 2007. Someway to keep some living tissue over him. After all in the same episode they went to the length of showing how he smuggled a gun through time by placing it inside his leg.
Enough, this was a great episode and props to all involved
Regardless of whether or not the show gets canceled, I think it would be great to hear from Josh Friedman where he would like to take the story next. A spoiler list, like the one he posted back here a while back.
Awesome episode…to say the least. Like many, I could go on forever. I am very sad & torn right now, with what happened to Cameron. Only you the writers and of course the actors know what really happened. I just hope, and beg of thee, to bring her back. Summer put in a lot of effort molding herself to fit that character, and in the storyline remember this…
“I need her.” - John Connor
Bring her back, better than ever. Let him search for her to the ends of the earth. John Connor jumped, leaving his Mom behind, because he wanted to get Cameron back.
So I beg you, let this not be the end of her. I will keep begging too.
There’s so much pointless crap on TV right now, that keeps coming back year after year, and *this* show would get cancelled? It would be like FOX spitting at their audience’s face, as well as at the show’s creators’ faces. The audience represents a very valuable segment, with a superior IQ and a taste for high technology. This very audience is about to inject hundreds of millions of dollars into the next 3 movies of the franchise.
About two weeks ago, I started rewatching the old episodes that I have DVR’d, so they are all relatively fresh. This was hands-down the best one of the series! The whole episode was good, but my jaw was literally open from the time the window broke until the end of the episode.
It better not be the end of the season. This show needs budget. It needs another FULL season, so they can get the stars (like Derek and John Henry) to not worry about jumping to other opportunities. They need to keep up the promotional efforts. Most of all, they need people to watch!
If you like this show, and you’re on Twitter, tweet to @Foxbroadcasting and let them know you are watching. Let them know that tweets can spread the word about a GREAT show. And if you are not on twitter, sign up at http://www.twitter.com and then go to http://www.twitter.com/foxbroadcasting and tell them you love this show!
Blitzen: Fox is the same network that cancelled Arrested Development. They cancel all their good shows to make more room for extra hours of American Idol and Kitchen-based reality shows.
The only solution is for everyone to do what I do - refuse to watch new shows on Fox until they’ve been given a second season. Ignore the show for the first season, and when you hear it’s been given a second full season, then go catch yourself up with the first season… buy the 1st Season DVD or watch it in reruns during the off-season. But don’t become a loyal fan of a Fox TV show until you have SOME guarantee that Fox will give it a chance to grow and find an audience. It’s not worth the time to get emotionally invested in a show only to have it cancelled after a brief first season. While this applies to all the networks, it is particularly true for Fox.
Some will point out that TSCC was given a second season. That’s semantics… the “first season” was only 9 episodes. 9 episodes is not a season. The way I see it, the show was given 1.5 seasons… cancelled midway into the second season. Tonight’s episode would probably have been the 2nd season mid-season fall finale had the WGA writer’s strike not screwed up the first season, causing it to be only 9 episodes long. So I screwed up and broke my “second season” rule for watching Fox shows. Mea culpa. In a way, I deserve to be punished by having TSCC cancelled since I should have stuck to my guns and refused to watch it until it was given a full second season (after a full first season).
I will have newfound respect for Fox if they look at the actual ratings rather than the “people who watch it live on friday night” ratings and give the show the 3rd season it deserves. But if that doesn’t happen, my lack of respect and utter hatred towards Fox TV will not only continue, but it will be strongly renewed.
TSCC is supposed to take place between T2 and T3,If john is in the future than T3 never takes place.If cameron is his love what happens to Katherine Brewster his supposed future wife? The reason Derek didn’t know JC was because he jumped to the future, to be the savior of mankind he had to survive judgement day(we know the story)..With TSCC JC gets his wish of not being “This great leader” which he never wanted any part of.
freaking awesome, we must have more. I thought it was great the way John said to his mom “he has her” as in JH has Cameron and he’s going to get her back. John picked her over his mom. Anyways, in season 3 we will see how right or wrong we all were!!!
Okay heres my two cents: i have NEVER gone to a network website to read the blogs, have never cared so much about television characters, and have never posted my own thoughts about a show, that is until TSCC became a part of my life! Words cannot describe how good this show is; thank you to all involved! If there is not another season then i am thankful to have been a believer from the beginning, this is something i can be truly proud of. I will be buying both season on DVD, and again i NEVER buy DVDs! FOX are you getting the point!!!!
PEOPLE! PEOPLE! WE CANNOT JUST SIT AROUND AND ASK FOR A THIRD SEASON!
WE HAVE TO TAKE CHARGE AND VOTE FOR THE THIRD SEASON!!
WE HAVE BEEN VOTING ALL YESTURDAY AND TODAY ,AND WE HAVE GONE FROM 13% TO 29%!! BRINGING CHUCK DOWN FROM 32% TO 29% TIE-ING TSCC TO CHUCK. MY POINT IS WE HAVE DONE THAT IN ONE HONEST DAYS WORK ,AND IF WE KEEP VOTING WE CAN GET A THIRD SEASON BY FORCE ,AND NUMBERS RATHER THAN JUST HOPING AND SHOOTING FOR THE STARS!!
WHO’S WITH ME!! I DON’T KNOW ABOUT YOU ,
BUT I WANT A THIRD SEASON!!!!!!!
Woa. That was brilliant! I couldn’t even pay attention to Dollhouse. Josh, you blew my freaking mind. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
S3 is going to be amazing. Think I’m gonna go pre-order this season from Amazon or something like RIGHT NOW. That’s gotta be helpful, right? Oh shoot…not taking pre-orders yet. But you can sign up to be notified @ Amazon when it’s available. I’m sure someone sees those numbers….
And the T4 preview…The Day the World Went Away in the background…perfect. I haven’t seen any of the Terminator movies and I haven’t actually BEEN to a movie in a couple of years, but I’m definitely going to go see T4 (and watch T1 and T2 before then).
This just doesn’t make sense. JH obviously made it through to the futurepast one way or another…Weaver would not have left him behind. That means that JH was no longer tied to his body/soul in the basement. And Cameron’s chip assumably made it through (at least John believed so) which was why he went.
Cameron knew her body was damaged, and that she had become a risk…she said so. A logical solution would be to dump her body and head to a time when she could “start over”.
I think we’ll find at some point, either in the movies or a potential 3rd season that Cameron is a more “human” version of the machine than we think. After all, that seems to be the whole point of the upcoming movies.
amazing.. absolutely amazing finale.. if a show like this gets canceled it’s entirely because of weak promotion or a bad time slot by FOX.. this is the best sci-fi show I have ever seen and it definitely deserves a third season, and beyond..
Josh shoe-horned in a quick “resolution” on the spur of the moment, that’s for sure!
———
What I don’t like… no Cameron now. Allison is not Cameron. She’s not the same.
What I hope for in a Season 3 is that John realizes Allison is not right for him, is not as good for him as Cameron, and now hunts for John Henry with some help from Catherine behind the scenes to get Cameron’s chip back into her body. Then he can return to the past with her original soul in his possession.
———
As of right now… there is no John Connor. No savior. He must go back. He still has to stop JD.
———
As was stated before: It’s a great way to end a season, but a horribly disappointing way to end a series.
For some reason -Catherine Weaver needed JH in the present, otherwise she would have built him in the future and wouldn’t have come back to build him.. I still think the files they’re using in present day JH are too big to fit on Cameron’s chip so that he is not in the future, Cameron is in his body. But maybe she had JH download certain critical files into her chip and then had him (using her chip) jump to the future? And as far as what weaver said about Cameron not jumping - maybe only ‘active’ cyborgs can jump, if they are inactive (as Cameron was at the end and as JH would be without his cord), they can’t jump.
Could be that the cyborg who jumped may be a hybrid of Cameron with the most critical JH files on her chip - which would explain how Cameron can ‘feel’ and why she is so different from other cyborgs. She got that moral/human element in her chip from Weaver’s work with JH
Wonder if next season Weaver hooks up Cameron’s left behind body to the Turk computer in the basement and the switch is on both ends - JH in the future with Cameron’’s chip and Cameron in the basement as JH hooked up to the Turk..
It is interesting that on Good Friday, we get maybe the final episode of a fictional Christ-figure.
Kudos for really teasing the Jameron folks.
While I feel good about predicting Weaver and John Henry were on our side, man this is a lot of loose ends. Are you trying to force their hands on a season 3 or something?
In last episode, Cain and Abel, Cameron informed Sarah that she destroyed “a chip” but also informed Sarah that they could reverse engineer it and create the technology from scratch. Or, more simply, they get their hands on another chip and plug that into JH, God knows there’s been enough Terminators running around already.
On another note why would Weaver abandon the Turk aka John Henry (whom she was willing to sacrifice Savannah for) and travel to the future if she had any inclination that the T-888 interface wasn’t John Henry at all but simply Cameron plugged in to the port? And why would John Henry be willing to give up Cromartie’s body to Cameron? If he did he’d be stuck in 2007 still.
I’m willing to bet everything I own that JH has a chip inside of him and it isn’t Cameron’s. I hope he has Cameron’s chip on him for the sake of the series. Maybe they’ll flash the literary license and say that he placed her chip in one of the other processors. In theory the T-888 is exactly the same as the T-800 (Arnold) except it has room for 2 extra processing units - chips - to increase the logic algorithm power.
This little bit of trivia has been neglected throughout the series but now that they suddenly have use for it maybe they’ll use it.
The major problem with this line of thinking (that Cameron put her chip in Cromartie’s head) is that without his own chip John Henry can’t accompany the T-888 body to the future. Weaver knows this and so she must believe that there is a John Henry chip in the T-888 otherwise she never would have gone with John to the future. Her mission is to protect John Henry at all costs. Where JH goes she goes. John Henry jumps to the future. She jumps to the future.
ooooooooooooooo my gosh!!!!!! Mind boggling……….first off they cant end it……”John goes no where without his mother…….” lol im just being way too hopeful I think……ah have to admit an amazing ending……….BUT I NEVER WANT AN END………..MORE TERMINATOR! Bring on the metal ha it has to continue so i can watch it up at college and get everyone hooked
ok i gotta say, dis season finale was amazing! this episode was able to tie up a few notches and continue with the terminator franchise storyline. on thing tho, i cant stop thinkin about the scene with john and cameron. it was a nice little move that cameron did on john but i dont understand what john was feeling for. Im a little sketchy with John saying to cameron “thats good right” and cameron replying “thats good, thats perfect”. if anyone can get back at me with a lil explantion thanks
o nd there must be a season 3 FOX dont make the same mistake with canceling firefly
I really enjoyed this episode and will be disappointed if it is not picked up for another season. I do have a question though b/c I think I missed something - the man young John Conner was staring at at the end…was that his father or his adult self? I thought it was Kyle but several posts here say differently. Can someone clarify for me? Thanks.
I PRAY this show doesn’t get cancelled. That was by far one of the best season finales I have ever seen. IF they do decide to cancel it (which would be a huge mistake) they should turn it into a limited run comic strip (like continues to be done with Buffy the Vampire Slayer). Better idea, if FOX will extend their lineup to 11PM like the other networks, TSCC will absolutely destroy Jay Leno at 10PM on NBC.
@Jman their is a link on the home page on this blog under “save one show: terminator.”
click on the white like that says save one show and vote for tscc! oh and remember you can vote more than once!
I think cameron put her chip in JH and then went into the future because it was the only way to get john to leave his mother. And since Cameron knew what happens to Allison Young in the future, her chip can be put into the replicated Allison Young to become Cameron again. Kind of confusing but thats what I got from the episode.
200 comments and its only been 2 hrs since the episode ended.
@Dan
Could not agree more - Allison will not be the same as Cameron so bring Cameron back. On that note bring John Henry back too. I’m starting to watch the show as much for him as all the other characters.
“Twenty!”
Looks like we finally know what that HK was built for and that all our speculation about their being two separate factions rang true.
“Some of us don’t want war. Some of us want peace.”
Okay but Cameron was on the side of Skynet originally. She was sent in to kill JC. She was sent in to kill him and place his head on a pike for all to see. Okay I’m going to take a timeout and start making picture diagrams to try and figure out whose from what dimension because there have been way too many time jumps since T1.
If FOX doesn’t pick up a new season (and they should!!!!), we should pray it is picked up by someone else. Great epidode, though. I enjoyed MOST (vast majority) of the season except for the two episodes of crap the suits might have actually been correct about not ever doing in the first place.
What an episode. I loved the twist, loved that Weaver is on our side…kinda. I loved the scene in motel, but i must say I was disappointed that it wasn’t true Jameron, but still…it rocked! However, HOW..can you do that to Cameron? to us? She’s gone….maybe we don’t know..you killed Derek another favorite.
The story is amazing, this show is amazing, the characters are amazing….but Josh…PLEASE fix this. We want OUR Cameron back. We must have Season three!! I trust that you will in S03.
OMG!! I just finished watching the finale and it was amazing!! I really hope this was just a season finale and not a series. I love this show. The actors that play Cameron, Weaver, John Henry are incredibly believeable!! I love it. I will miss Sarah but it will be cool to see how John changes. John has become such a strong young man it is so easy to see him as the savior of mankind. This is the only show that I can’t wait to see every week. I hope it does not end!!
Great episode
Thank You for a great 2 seasons.
John went in to the future because
Weavers prophecy that John could
not save humanity without JH he did not
go for Cameron.
They need more episodes………..I NEED MORE EPISODES! WE NEED MORE EPISODES! I promise ill watch the commercials on my tivo i promise. just dont take it away PLEASE!
Did that sound to desperate. Best ending run of a season since the first season of heroes. and note i said season not series so don’t disappoint me.
That episode kicked so much ass! I am really sad about the motel scene not being a real jameron scene. But the part I am absolutely devastated about is poor Cameron!! how could you do this to her ,and i was about to cry when i saw the “I am sorry John” typed over and over again.
well the one thing good about all of this is that knowing Josh he will do the best he can to fix this huge mess in season 3 when we get it (AND YES WE WILL GET IT) and bring our old Cameron back!!!
This has got to be some of the best writing on tv! As you pan thru some of the other lame networks, you can not find anything remotely this good. I was literally jumping out my sofa in shock! Keep up the good writing and bring us some more!!!!!!!
I’m gutted at what happened to Cameron. The fact her chip has been saved gives me some hope that she will be back if there is a season 3. I can see why Summer was sad at where her character ends up though.
I wonder if the ending kind of preps the show for a move if it does get cancelled. It’s gotten super sci-fi at this point, and I can entirely see if moving to the CW or the Sci-Fi network should Fox decide to cancel.
Terminator Salvation looks GREAT. I’ll be there for it and I RARELY go to movie theaters these days.
Perhaps the suits at Fox will reconsider cancellation after a HUGE turnout for T4? Then again, after the next movie, it may render this whole TV series moot. Dunno.
Frankly, I’m interested in seeing what writers can do, but we’ll see. This is the only TV series that has hooked me in several years. It’s the ONLY TV show I watch AND LOOK FORWARD TOO on a weekly basis (at night). Otherwise, I am Working, talking to friends and family, farting around on the internet (like now), Out drinking with friends, reading, watching old DVDs or watching Family Guy re-runs.
You’re all forgetting about the chip Ms. Weaver gave to John Henry from the 888 that came fom her daughter. He probably re-programmed that chip for himself, had Cameron put it in and has Camerons with him, with some instructions from her as to what to do with it in the future i’m sure.
Maybe because this is supposed to be some weird ass alternate reality, Allison will try to make a pass at John, but John snubs her as he snubbed Riley.
He’s not in love with Allison… he’s in love with Cameron. Allison (in this twist) just looks like Cameron, but is not her.
He came for Cameron and to find JH. Find JH and he finds the original Cameron and must then fight to get back to the past.
This puts him in direct conflict with Weaver as he wants that chip back no matter what to get his Cameron back, which would cause JH, in this form, to be put out to pasture.
He can make an incision into his leg, the fleshy part of the thigh, and put Cam’s chip in there and then return to the past.
That would show true love on his part. John Connor will move Heaven and Earth to get his love back.
And again, it isn’t Allison.
—
That would then make sense that Cameron does not equal Allison in John’s mind.
And the alternate “Bizarro” reality just created would never be.
He looked happy at first as he probably thought it was Cameron then when he saw the dog he suddenly realised that it wasnt her and his face dropped. I think Cameron will be back if there is a season 3, she has to be.
You could not have rocked my world more if you put me in the middle of that “transportation machine” and did what you did. Un-freakin-believable! Absolutely amazing. I was so shocked by Derek’s death, but with the direction this show is going now, I will not stand for it if Fox decides to cut programming. I may not catch it live every Friday but it is my morning breakfast on Saturday!
To the Writers: Superb work and shaping of characters and a world that I would be proud to fight for. This episode was beyond anything I would have expected and my heart broke with the final surprise.
To the Actors: I’m there, you got me.
Please, please, PLEASE FOX, keep this show because if you don’t you’ll have egg on your face and this show will definitely fall within “Brilliant but Canceled”… But that won’t happen right???
I don’t think I’ve so many emotions go through while watching live television as I did during those last 10 minutes. The story HAS to continue somehow, it just can’t end here. Whether FOX renews, another network picks it up, DVD movies, comic books or even a freaking NOVEL. I don’t care! It just CAN’T end here.
my qeustion is, was that the boy at the end of the final ep. the same boy that was on that ep. from the military acadamy. pls tell me i think it was him, but i would like it if someone could confirm it for me. thx.
By reaching inside Cameron, John Connor left his DNA inside her. That DNA code will be transferred to John Henry along with Cameron’s chip. Essentially, John Henry is their child.
Just thinking out loud about the possibilities of this storyline’s effect on future productions (should this be deemed “canonical” in the Terminator franchise).
Hypotehically, lets say that the computer entity we knew as JH ends up finding its “brother” and joining forces to form SkyNet? Now that Ellioson has taught it morals, its code is “humanifed”…in a way corrupted. This might lead to certain parts of SkyNet developing human characteristics. Combine that with the physical melding of man&machine and you’ve got a pretty good lead in to the forthcoming big screen trilogy.
I am fairly confident this show will return in the Fall…I just see no down angle for Fox with three years of big box office brand marketing guaranteed. They would be remiss not to capitalize on it.
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Wonderful episode that capped off the season perfectly. I’d really like to thank the cast and crew for their work. It was an amazing season, and I hope there will be at least one more.
This is the first show I’ve watched every week in years (came to “Lost” and “BSG” late.) Come one season 3!
When john jumped forward, he did not grow up to be their leader (that is why they did not know him), so…. he does not send derek or his father back in time… how is he alive? PARADOX! …he knows that was not cameron but he is obvously stunned by the sight of her. nice twist with weaver being on his side. superb SEASON ender… PLEASE bring on season 3, I promise to be a faithful no tivo-ing live watcher. we need cameron back!…… do you want me to beg ? ………I will
Wow? This show is simply amazing! I have never seen a show where it keeps me on the edge of my seat. I have to say, Bravo to the whole cast! Josh Friedman is such a great writer. I can?t express how great the show is. The two season finales are amazing? It leaves me speechless with tears of in my eyes. This is hands down my favorite TV series I have ever watched! Great Job guys! Keep it up.
They blew up cameron at the end of Season 1, and she was back… quit whining about how there is no more cameron. Of course cameron will still be around. The question is - will the show still be around?
The answer is no, because Fox sabotaged it by moving it to Friday, the one night of the week where people go out and DVR the primetime shows they want to watch, to watch when they get home and/or get sober. TSCC is one of the most watched shows on TV if you include all the people who watch it on their DVRs. But since those people likely skip through the commercials, they don’t count for the ratings numbers, which are all geared towards the advertisers. No TV show can last on friday nights. The theory was that loser geeks who like sci-fi stay at home on friday nights since they’re not invited to any parties, so sci-fi shows like TSCC and Dollhouse have a theoretical audience for friday nights. But even the sci-fi geeks DVR the show to watch later… they may not be at the coolest clubs, but they still go out and do stuff on friday night, if nothing more than playing Dungeons and Dragons with some freinds in their parent’s basement. That’s why TSCC and Dollhouse get such crappy “live” ratings. And that’s why there won’t be any season 3.
No TV show can survive on friday night as long as it’s ratings are derived the same way as primetime shows on other nights of the week. TSCC had no chance, it was sabotaged.
Fox doesn’t give a crap about online voting, emails, letters, and blog petitions. And none of the ‘fake networks’ like the CW or WB have ever picked up a major network show, so any talk about TSCC being picked up by one of those quasi-networks is wishful thinking, at best.
Fox needs to learn that it takes good shows a few seasons to find an audience, and shows should be given a chance to mature, grow, and find their audience. Seinfeld in a perfect example. It got crappy ratings the first few seasons, but NBC gave it a chance, and through word of mouth and great writing, it became one of the most popular sitcoms ever. Had Seinfeld been on Fox, society and American culture would have missed out greatly, since it would have been cancelled after 13 or so episodes. Fox is just clueless. They always have been, and always will be. The answer is not to watch shows on Fox until you hear they’ve been given a second or third season - then go watch the first season or two and catch up. Don’t start watching at Season 1. You’ll be asking for disappointment. And Fox needs to be taught a lesson.
Holy crap! What did I just experience? My heart’s in my stomach. Is Allison Kyle’s girlfriend? What happened to Cameron? Why did Sarah let John go with Catherine?
Just to join the chorus, I too will say that my hopes are for FOX to continue this show. Such an engaging, well written/acted series should not be consigned to the flames simply because of the archaic ratings measurement system. As well, it would seem rather a wasted opportunity to can this show in the wake of its immanent synergy with the _Terminator: Salvation_ film.
Fox, I bought the first season on blu-ray out of curiosity and was blown away. I caught up with the show online and have been watching the last three weeks live. I feel like i just discovered the greatest show ever made, with every element you could ask for, and now it is being ripped away from me. Or so the rumors say. Please dont do this. No Fate.
Freaking awesome….. This definately ties in to Salvation. THEY WANT TO BECOME HUMAN!!!!
I hate to say it, don’t hold your breathe for another season, it was all a lead up to the movie.
I can’t believe the way it ended and directed towards how different the future is compared to the original depcition of the war and future from the original Terminator.
HOLY CRAP what a ride.
This episode was absolutely fantastic! Awesome job all I really have to say is that we had better get a season three because where we were left off leaves a lot of questions. This was a perfect way to end the SEASON.
Wow… Fox needs to renew this show. If there was ever a time when they needed to renew a show… now is the time. I mean at this point, they should renew the show to satisfy their own curiosity. What’s going to happen?!?!?!? John in the future with Weaver! Ahhhh!
I loved how he sees (or rather thinks he sees) Cameron and smiles, but then realizes that it’s not her and his smile turns into… disappointment.. confusion… realization? Just wow. Everything about this episode was amazing. I want to see John and Weaver working together… to stop skynet and get Cameron back.
WHEN the show returns, I really hope that they find a way to get OUR Cameron back. I’m sure I’ll love Allison too, but I want my machine back…
FOX. Please don’t let it end like this! These writers are genius!
For those of you who say the show’s already cancelled - you know that looks bad right? Negative comments will only leave FOX to assume we’re ok with losing the show.
I would love to see what happens next, and TSCC has so many true supporters, I’m pretty sure I will.
That was so amazing! I am so blown away! This show is like no other. Thank you Josh and the wonderful cast and crew for bringing such an amazing show to TV.
this show gave me a reason to get through the week, please please, I wish it weren’t so - this ending is such a wrap indicator, they can’t jump back from this…I loved this show.
That was an awsome ending. But right at the end We see a flash. and Just like my girlfriend predicted. Its most likely Sarah Connor coming into the time line with John. So we’ll probably see a Season 3. Cant wait. Cant wait till this season is out on DVD.
Josh, That was absolutely FANTASTIC!! This was an amazing episode and I hope there will be an S3. Really, I’m completely blown away with all of the possibilities.
Dan: Don’t freak out about Cameron. I’m with you but I can see many avenues by which they can (and if they want S3 to be a success they will) bring back our girl. Cameron is the character that makes the show unique. I don’t think they’ll make the same mistake twice. Cameron will be back if the show is picked up.
EVERYBODY GO VOTE TO SAVE THIS SHOW.
Josh although I have been a critic at times this ep was beyond phenominal. I was expecting to be disappointed but I couldn’t have been more wrong.
Summer, Lena, and Thomas thank you for such a great ride.
Wow that was an amazing season finale! I’m keeping my fingers crossed for season 3 from Fox. This show is the only show that I never miss an episode of. I can’t believe how different this show is from anything else on t.v. today. Fox needs to keep this show alive, I’ve told all my friends about it and many are hooked! give us a third season!!
That was ABSOLUTELY amazing. There has to be a season 3. It is going to take another episode to fully explain what just happened. It would be grossly unfair for the whole thing to end after that.
I can envision a Season 3 switching back and forth between Sarah in the past fighting Terminators, and John /Derek / Kyle / John Henry / Allison in the future waging war against Skynet. It will all lead up to John sending Cameron back in time on her mission, forming a nice loop.
But I’m still trying to figure out exactly what happened between Cameron and John Henry. Did John Henry’s entire structure (servers, The Turk, etc) get transported to the future, or just his body w/ Cameron’s chip?
John and Catherine (having done what she needs to have been done, whatever that is) return to the past, patch up Cameron, and get Mr. Murch to download Cameron back into her chip from the backup servers.
Cameron, awakens, and sits up on the table.
Cameron [disoriented]: Woah! Do not try that at home, boys and girls!
John [putting a comforting hand on her shoulder]: How… how are you feeling?
Cameron [almost serenely] : Wonderful! Good as new. [looks a bit confused] But for some strange reason, I have this… desire to…
John looks concerned.
Cameron [befuddled]: …play a mean game of Dungeons & Dragons. Anybody have some spare dice on them? Who wants in? John? Sarah? Catherine? Loser buys me some pancakes!
Watched it twice, posted twice, all I can say is Amazing, Amazing, Amazing! A really long post…
A few ques:
-my friend wondered where did the prisoners(when they were escaping, running around) think they were going to? I didn’t know what to say since there would be even more security at the gates, but maybe a few could escape.
-Weaver: “I’d watch who’s calling who a bitch,” “gymnastics end at 5:30″(cool, there was some funny moments)
-The Chlora’s back! Yay! That was her right? She looks so different?(why do we call her The Chlora btw?)
-Cant say I liked the effects when Weaver turned into some kind of shield and protected the Connors and Ellison, looked a little fake and I was weirded out at first but liquid metal can form any shape right? Except bombs.The voice that said “run,” who was that?Didnt sound like John or Ellison.(memory’s faded, dont like to watch the movies during the season)
-Did Sarah jump thru time? They showd it at the end with her voice, “I love you,” that was great and when John told Sarah he “loves her.”
-Yeah, I think Sarah has cancer.
-Thank you for the answer, the Term on the sub is Weaver, but why did Cam lie to John and why did Cam say to JH, “I know you too?” How does she know him? Is Cam now JH or vice versa.
-I think we need a Sarah/Ellison shipper thread now
-I need details on the Peter bible story, with the locks, I’m not sure what they mean.
-The future scene! It kills me! I use to think about John being there, but this is so beyond from what I imagined, pure genius!
-Derek! Yes, amazing and heartbreaking and amazing at the same time, didn’t expect him to come back and so soon too.
-How did Weaver get clothes on so quickly? Did we not see her grab clothes or was it her metal that formed clothes?
-Why cant damaged terms travel, well it’s no prob.
-Is Jesse dead? I for one don’t really buy it yet. Maybe she killed herself.
-”Bad John Connor!”
-How does the eel form into Weaver? Was it already a part of her? Why did she keep it in the tank?
-”They’re trying to kill my John.”
- Cam think Sarah sick. I thought Sarah heard their conversation from Adam Raised a Cain.
“She gave it to him,”
“Where when,”
“Not armored are you?”
“Why are you expecting trouble?”
“I’m sorry John.”
“Please, I’m not metal.”
Yes I really liked the ending, the last 20 mins? I think.
I WANT A SEASON 3, in case that was unclear.
Sorry if being annoying I post 1st then read.
I’m still dry mouthed and practically speechless a half hour later. Oh my frakking god, what an ending!!! My brain’s been turned inside out and my heart ripped open with John and Sarah being separated for the greater good of stopping Skynet. I loved John saying ‘I love you’ to Sarah and Sarah saying ‘I love you too’ at the end as a perfect closing line!
I never expected to see the time travel again, to an alternate future, no less! Does John has an alternate protector now in Catherine Weaver? How will Sarah stop Kaliba in the present and John and CW stop JH? What’s JH’s aim in going to the future if he becomes Skynet in the present and what does Cameron’s chip have to do with it? Does Sarah have cancer? So many questions answered but so many left open! Argh!
I haven’t loved/been emotionally connected to a show like this in years, and will continue to vote, watch my DVR and online, write my letters and say my peace to help get a third season! As many have said, I’ve been here since the pilot and will be here to the end.
To the cast and crew - thanks for your untold hours of work and for giving us an incredible two seasons! Josh, your imagination is something else! You are the man! Thomas, you are one of the great young actors and one of the nicest people I’ve ever met. Summer, you bring humanity I never thought possible to a machine. Hadley, thanks for keeping us all informed and entertained with this blog. And Lena - thank you for moving me with every episode and doing an impeccable job with the character of Sarah Connor - you’re my favorite, as always!
Well lets think about this for a minute, now this show is in the top 10 shows up for cancelation. Now why would FOX do this to us? But lets say we get a season 3 then this will be the greatest thing that has ever happened to the terminator franchise. Now John is really got what he has always wanted ever since he was a kid. And i bet you are all wondering what that is? Well ill tell you, he never wanted to be this big leader and now he is not the leader. Now where did Weaver go and what are her plans? I do believe that at some point there was something between Allison and John at some time in the future. I remember Cameron asking Allison before she killed her “DO YOU KNOW WHY JOHN CONNER CHOOSE?” And thats why I believe why future John was keeping Cameron around soo much. But any thing can happen now everything we know about the future is HISTORY!!!!!!!!!!!
Awesome, awesome, awesome! For a short time, it seemed this show lost its way, and I began to lose interest. But it’s redeemed itself. Loved every moment of this ifnale! Ties up a lot of loose ends! Excellent job of writing this episode, and it makes a potential 4th season extremely exciting!
I don’t feel like Cameron betrayed him. Her alliance is with the resistance, and she knows that John Henry can help take down Skynet. That is her purpose, and although John loves her, he needs to be able to let her go for the greater good. Sarah, John, and Cameron are more than a family…they are a battalion. PLEASE GIVE US A SEASON THREE. I can’t wait to buy tickets to Salvation.
This tv show has surpassed Heroes in entertainment value and should be brought back for another season. There was a marathon of Heroes reruns so that the audience could catch up, why not do that to this show and capitalize on the buzz the new Terminator movie will create? I don’t see why Heroes was given another chance and not this tv show. It’s extrememely well acted and the action and drama suck you right in. I love how it explores what it is to be human and the acting is superb. The writers deserve accolades for this show. Fox, just give it another chance! So many badly acted and written shows out there this is a keeper. The last 2 episodes had me on the edge of my seat - now that’s entertainment!! Brilliant writing and directing - the right pauses and close ups of the actors faces. The final episode was so captivating! Friday night is a night many people go out, though so why was it moved there from it’s slot on Monday night after Heroes?
Words can not described how amazing this episode was. OH MY GOD. If we do not get a third seaosn I will have something…but my medical insurance wouldn’t like it.
I don’t even know where to being.
I had a feeling time travel would come into play, that Cameron’s chip and that Derek would be back. I guess the little bomb in Cameron’s head will not be an issue.
But wow. I’m wide awake that episode was so good!!!! To the cast a crew amazing work. Bravo. That is what I call great TV. That deserves a season 3!!!! No questions asked!!!
My favorite part has to be that John is willing to go with an unknown terminator to the future to save Cameron.
JF you’re a romantic and Jameron fan aren’t you. I love the aspect of that show!! I loved that it was his main concern. He asks if she’s ok, notices she’s emotional, listens to her, runs to check on her!!!
I mean John looked so happy to see Derek, the grown up Kyle and then Cameron walks in and he looked so disappointed that she was human. So he want’s Cameron not the human version. Jameron alive and well!!!!
The John and Cameron bed scene…hottest thing I have seen in a while on network TV where you see nothing it was just…drool worthy (is that a word). . And Cameron just seemed so emotional.
So Cameron gave JH her chip maybe to fix to stop her from having this underlying urge to kill John?
I guess if John is looking for JH and Cameron’s chip, he could get to know Alison (I mean he knows when Cameron glitches back in AFP she thought she was Alison) and when the time comes he does not tell her she will die, until Cameron comes back. He can knock her out and replace her chip with Cameron’s. Then they can go back in time.
Cameron getting Sarah out of jail. Too bad she didn’t tranquilize the guards. Her damage (only question I have is why does she have a red eye?) But at the moment I really don’t care!!!
And the jokes, I liked that gate, the comment about what would happen if Ellison would bring a swat team, Cameron waiting in the car for the meter. Weaver in cloths so fast and a naked John!! Cameron becoming so emotional, the liquid eel, ground JC, the I love you moment.
And Weaver ROCKS!!!! Her message to Cameron!!!
So does that mean Cameron was running the resistance?
And the ‘I’m sorry John’ message on the computer!!! OH MY GOD!!!
I loved seeing the silent girl again, and when she talks for the first time. Or that Cameron says ‘Hasta’ or the priest.
I loved every single character in this episode. I loved the connections to season 1.
I know I’m forgetting so much but wow!!
Amazing episode. I have to go watch it again!!
To the cast and crew Bravo!!! well done. Now hand over a season 3!!!
It’s killing me to know all the cool places this show could go if there was a Season Three, all the while knowing there will probably not be a Season Three.
Thank you so much to everyone involved in making the show, and yes, to FOX for giving it a “second” season. This show had some of the best writing on television, and it was one of those shows that I just couldn’t wait for the week to go by so I could watch it on Friday night. That hasn’t happened to me since Invasion.
Here’s hoping FOX decides to give us a miracle and renew the show.
Really? It seemed more like a halfass season finale..more like a 50% season 50% series finale in case there wasn’t a s3. I mean..I loved every part of it..besides for the fact that it felt like giving up.
It is kind of weird how Weaver doesn’t know about John Connor and asks Ellison why Sarah thinks her son is a Messiah. Shouldn’t everyone in the original future timeline know who John is?
John def. went to the future solely for Cameron, no way he would have left Sarah like that if Cameron wasn’t the issue and only JH was. I don’t know how come Sarah didn’t go though, that seemed uncharacteristic of her… not to stick with John. There must be so much there that we don’t know!!!! SEASON 3 OR HUNGER STRIKE!
Here’s another thought since this is an alternate reality.
Cameron’s body is damaged in the present… badly.
Catherine knows how to fix Terminators (like she did with Cromartie’s body). She’s in the Future with John.
John Henry is on the loose in the Future with John and Catherine.
Cameron’s soul is in the past… downloaded into the server farm at ZeiraCorp.
John, with help, from his new buddies in the Future, and CW build an entirely new Cameron from a Skynet Terminator factory they capture. Allison helps as well. She finally realizes where John Connor’s true feelings lie and this time willingly allows him to model and scan her looks into the Skynet tissue mold system in designing Cameron. She does not die for this new Cameron shell to be be born, she is an active participant in her creation.
This design is better than ever. All of John’s love goes into this along with John Henry and Catherine Weaver’s help. The chip is even more advanced, the endoskeleton is tougher, stronger, and more lightweight.
John Connor not only creates Cameron… he learns from the experience greatly.
John, Catherine, and a more evolved John Henry take their leave of the alternate time line, along with this new and inert Cameron. All that remains is to download Cameron’s original consciousness into this new body.
One other outward enhancement… Cameron has a slightly new hairstyle… it’s taper/feathered in the front and frames her face in an even more lovely style. Allison Young decided that she would add the finishing touch and could get her own hair even “more right.”
Cameron is back, and better than ever. No glitchy chip, no weak endo, so she’s more battle hardened and tougher… and she can now swim with the help of the better materials used.
I am a little sick of everyone bitching about Cameron.
As much as a Love her charachter the show is called the SARAH CONNOR chronicles.
Dont any of you think it was incredibly sad that John left her there
It is even sadder when you hear her voice ” I love you too”
I felt like crying there witch is something I haven’t felt since Dobby’s Death in Harry Potter 7
Yes Kea it was drool worthy. And, did you catch the double entendre when John had his hand on the “breast plate” and Cameron says “Yes, that’s perfect”.
And I don’t want to forget, Thanks Hadley, for keeping the blog and putting up with a pack of rowdy geeks like us. Great job.
I wonder if they’ll ever explore John and Alison romance if we get a season 3. could have potential I think. not to suggest that Cameron would be gone, but for a side story they could ask the question, was john’s attraction to Cameron more of a physical one? if it was he might actually have a chance of making something work with Alison. even if they split up later when realising it just isn’t the same, he can still get befriend her and get her to join the resistance by earning her trust. And later they meet back up with Cameron. the whole thing could last about 4 episodes. just a thought.
AMAZING FINALE!!!! Great way to end the season. Thank you so much for all your hard work Josh Friedman and crew. Defiently getting this episode tomorrow! FOX RENEW THIS SHOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This show is, and always will be amazing. way to be
OMG!!!! This episode has really shaked my mind. There is no other TV show that has ever made me feel the way this show has. It’s a freaking masterpiece. It’s art in the form of Science Fiction. I truly now vow to watch FOX and many of it’s shows if it renews, if not, then FOX can kiss my ass and I will never watch FOX again. Sorry to be so crude, but it’s the truth. PLEASE FOX, and WARNER, you have given us something so beautiful, don’t let it die. It’s only a matter of time when this show gets a huge audience. It’s an epic. Josh Friedman has made an epic on television, and that is rare!!! I vow to convince all of my family, friends, and anyone else to watch this show. You would be suprised at how many people do not know about this show. PLease, RENEW it.
@Snake Phasee I think the eel scene validated all of the people that believed that the LMT on the Carter was Weaver. I think that question was answered.
I agree, but why would she take a part of her into the eel?
Another big question: if the Cromartie body now contains Cameron’s chip, then John Henry’s consciousness still resides inside The Turk and the rest of the computers in the basement.
So now that Weaver is gone, who will “mother” him now and prepare him for the fight against his brother? Ellison?
My wife and I have loved this show since the pilot and season 2 has completely blown us away, capped off by this incredible season finale. This and “Dollhouse” are the only two shows I watch live.
Great to see Sabrina Perez (Chola) back! She talks, too! Interesting to see how much her character now resembles Cameron since when the two first met, Cameron was trying to imitate the Chola.
Josh Malina has been a favorite of mine since I first saw him in “Sports Night” and he just confirms that the guest casting on this show has been top-notch since the beginning. I’d love to see more of him in season 3 chasing after Sarah and Ellison.
This episode also nicely ties in with the upcoming movie, as we know that John is not the leader of the resistance when he first shows up.
This episode also convinced me that there really weren’t any standalone stories this season, just episodes that looked standalone but were really a part of the greater story arc. It takes a lot of brains and talent to pull off that kind of balancing act but season 1 convinced me that Josh and the writing team were thinking like chess grandmasters.
Since it’s all mimetic poly-alloy I guess it would have no problem adding alloy in that manner. I supose there was no reason to leave that much material behind for no reason. But it was a cool way to tie the Carter mpa eel back to Weaver. I just didn’t read any more into it than that.
She gave him her chip, but the Cameron software was copied on the mainframe, as she writes “I’m sorry John” on the screens over and over.
So it seems John Henry’s software was moved to Cameron’s chip, so he can walk around freely.
This is such a good show and I just found out it’s been cancelled. Fox has done it AGAIN. The show would still be getting between 8-10 million viewers if it was on another night. Most people from the ages of 17-35 tend to go out on friday evenings so of course the ratings would be low. Dollhouse is a decent show as well. Slow starter but its starting to get really good but it doesn’t matter because it’s on friday. Leave it up to fox to screw up a shows ratings then cancel it. They did the same thing with firefly…great show dvd sales are amazing too and if i remember right for a little while they moved it like to saturday or something. When you move a show to Friday im shocked it has 4.5 million viewers. Everyone I know watches this terminator show sometimes they just can’t friday because they have to work or they go out so they watch it online and it’s fox’s fault. I’m done with fox they constantly ruin good shows. It’s not worth it to stick to their network anymore. Next they will cancell bones and House right? Oh wait they haven’t been on the friday night timeslot…got it.
What ever its chances of getting renewed or picked up elsewhere, this episode seemed to me to be as much a pilot for a somewhat different type of show as it did a finale.
It would be like the Six “Billion” Dollar Woman… only a Terminator is allowed to become even better than before.
A new Cameron body (same look, except for the hair, as before) and Cameron’s soul that we’ve come to love over the two seasons.
Current John Connor to his new found friends in the Twilight Zone Future:
“Cameron Phillips, a Terminator, barely alive; her fate is in limbo. Gentlepeople, we can rebuild her. We have the technology. We have the capability to make the world’s best female Terminator. Cameron Phillips will be that Terminator. Better than she was before: Better, stronger, faster.”
JH used Cam’s chip to download himself and escape. Cameron’s “essence” is in ZieraCorp’s mainframe in the past. She was saying “I’m sorry, John” up on the screen.
I considered that but there are many possibilities. Cameron could have down loaded that message to replay before JH escaped with the chip. JH needed an umbilical to operate so either he used Camerons chip to become mobile or he somehow fixed the smoked chip from the T that CW fried in the parking lot.
It’s also possible that Cameron’s essence exists now on a backup on the turk and has also melded with JH so Cameron’s chip now contains but personalities. Kind of a Cybil on steroids. Like I said, there are many ways this could go.
OK. Wow. I enjoyed that experience. Even more, I really want to see a Season 3..even if it is only set in the future. Imagine a resistance than never new JC, but has a fresh non-work-camped JC with a fearsome (secretive) ally in one CW. Then add in some John/Allison stuff (I’d be happier with a brother/sister-esque deal than a Jallison or Allisohn too-cliche-for-words pairing.)
As usual, I’m a little spent from the ‘cast and the blog (though I’m amazed that my time estimates were pretty darned close). Feel free to see the bulk of my thoughts at the links below, and as usual I’ll fill in more things that come to mind after a wee break.
Love the show and tonight’s episode just blew me away! The show has a talented cast and great storyline, so FOX and WARNER, listen to the fans and RENEW!
My post is stuck in moderation heck again. I’ll try just *one* link at the end:
OK. Wow. I enjoyed that experience. Even more, I really want to see a Season 3..even if it is only set in the future. Imagine a resistance than never new JC, but has a fresh non-work-camped JC with a fearsome (secretive) ally in one CW. Then add in some John/Allison stuff (I’d be happier with a brother/sister-esque deal than a Jallison or Allisohn too-cliche-for-words pairing.)
As usual, I’m a little spent from the ‘cast and the blog (though I’m amazed that my time estimates were pretty darned close). Feel free to see the bulk of my thoughts at the links below, and as usual I’ll fill in more things that come to mind after a wee break.
Great, great episode!! We need a season 3. The show keeps getting better and better, Brilliant mind!! This is the only show that I don’t mind to stay home on a friday night!! Thank you fox!!
Fear not my friends. TSCC will be back. The movie in May is gonna kick soooo much @$$ that its gonna force FOX to bring the show back, fo sho!! And if they dont they are a bunch of morons! Loved the finale, just hope I can wait all the way till FALL for season 3.
What a ride!!!! Thank you Josh Friedman for writing such a good episode!
I just listened Dungeon & Dragon yesterday and I was finding it a bit strange to see future-John Connor meeting Derek and look exactly the same as young John. Now I understand!
Nice work!
Thanks to all the crew, hope to see you soon for season 3. This show is too good, the best sci-fi tv show. Please FOX, you have pure gold in your hands! Make it shine!!!
If JH convinced Cameron that she needed to go back to the future, she could’ve waited in the basement for John to get there and jumped with him in her own body. JH’s body is only a shell and is not important at all. JH “resided” in the computers in the basement, he was hooked up to them by a cord. So why did Cameron have to take her chip out and put it in John Henry’s body? There had to be something on the JH cyborg’s body that was important and could only get through if that body jumped.
What kind of chip did the terminator that Weaver killed in the parking lot have? Probably not as advanced, but maybe Weaver downloaded the most important JH files as a backup onto it to use for JH so she could move him if she had to. If JH had room for more than 1 processor (as mentioned above this is part of the movie), then Weaver knew JH had his most important files (downloaded on the chip from the parking lot terminator) in his body and used Cameron’s chip to get that chip back to her safely in the future. So both of them are in JH’s body when it jumped. Cameron operating the body - JH’s humanity on the other chip.
One other thing - after they ‘jumped’ - when you hear Sarah say “I love you John”- they show the basement and that room looks destroyed. Whatever mainframe computers were there it looks like they were gone. Weaver must’ve downloaded those files onto something else, she never would’ve jumped and let those computers be damaged if that was all that she had of JH. And she never would’ve let JH be that vulnerable after everything that happened. And Cameron’s files, if they were on that computer, would be gone too. (I don’t think they were though). The parking lot terminator’s chip makes sense!
I think with Weaver and John, its a case of the enemy of my enemy is my friend. I would guess that Weaver doesnt agree with skynet, but doesn’t agree with the humans either. I would propose that Weaver thinks the world should be run by metal but theres no need to exterminator the humans. And the humans think the opposite. Skynet thinks they should run things plus exterminate humans.
Best TV Show ever. Please do not end… I am guilty I always watch it on internet, every single episode. I would keep the TV on at the fox channel if ithat’s what it takes. Please don’t take this great piece away from us.
I’m telling ya, that John basically realizing that he doesn’t love Allison, but loves Cameron instead is more powerful.
It’s not the looks he loves… it’s what made Cameron so special to him and everyone else who’s a fan of this show.
He sees Cameron’s flaws, but is willing to overlook them. There’s a certain “something” he sees in Cameron that he does not see in Allison.
That would be the better thing IMHO. That’s why I stated above that what if this time around, Allison (with other help as I mentioned) assists in making a new body for Cameron.
Maybe even Weaver knows of a plant (the plant mentioned in “Heavy Metal” perhaps) that has the necessary facility and they break in.
They find a new and more advanced endo design. Allison allows John to scan her as a design template and the equipment molds a Cameron shell over the top.
I thought it would be a funny touch if Allison changes Cameron’s hairstyle because she thought it would make the hair that is so difficult to get right, look even better. She’s adding her own stamp to this new Cameron “shell.”
The body just needs Cameron’s software put back in to meld the two.
Also, they can’t swim. So, as another “inside joke” this body can. It’s less dense and more like a regular human, but stronger and tougher and ready for more punishment. The skin is even tougher and can take more of a beating too.
This is a golden opportunity to enhance Cameron’s build without changing Cameron’s curious mind.
Ok, anyone remember the phosphorous damaged chip?
It wasn’t so damaged that it couldn’t still hold all of JH’s files. (he’s not that complex yet..)
Cromartie’s body can hold both chips, Cameron and JH. They are both in the future with John and CW.
“I’m sorry John” was just a simple loop left on the turk…
All that’s needed is to build a copy of Allison. We have everything needed to carry on…
That is, provided, we storm Fox Corporate, chain ourselves, to anything ‘metal’ go on a hunger strike and chant “no fate” “no fate” until the cops drag us out and arrest us….
I think my one reaction is: “That was fast and what the hell just happened?” Did Cameron’s body not go through because her chip was gone? And, I know people now want Allison/John, but I’m a solid John/Cameron girl. Besides, it would be kind of creepy if he fell for someone solely (at first) because she looks like the girl/cyborg he loved. It would be a bit like dating the twin of your dead girlfriend. Plus: I sensed some Allison/Kyle. Is it wrong that I’m holding out hope that John can find a Cameron, get the chip back, and stick it in the new body? Of course, that would mean Allison would have to die/be copied. I suppose this is what Summer meant when she was happy but sad about Cam’s place after the finale.
I suppose the time line changed again when John went back. Now, he’s never been born. But, he can now send Kyle back. I guess Sarah and Ellison still couldn’t stop J-Day. Now, I’m wondering what would/will come next. Is John stuck in the future? Where did John Henry go and why did he take Cameron’s chip? Why was Cameron was intent on not letting John know she knew what Ellison meant? Will Cameron ever be back or if there is a season three, will Summer be Allison full time? ‘Cause I kind of want Cameron. So many questions!
Also -
Four things make me want to cry:
1. Sarah and John are separated, maybe forever.
2. Cameron pretty much killed herself for John.
3. John went into the future for Cameron, to save her and get her chip back. But, her body didn’t go with him and goodness knows where John Henry went.
4. The looks John gives Derek, Kyle, and Allison. That look of happiness when he sees Derek. That look of awe and joy when he sees Kyle. Then, that look of pure happiness when he sees “Cameron” that slowly turns to sadness and regret when he realizes that she’s not Cameron. Breaks me heart. Because, it’s in that small about of time (no more that two minutes) that John realizes that his uncle and father don’t know him and that “Cameron” is really still “dead”
Mostly, just here to say “Awesome.” Here’s hoping to season 2.
One particular comment:
I also was very impressed by the “sex” scene. It was bizarrely appropriate, and far more so than an actual sex scene between them would ever have been for any reason. Whatever the relationship between John and Cameron, whether she has anything similar to feelings for him or is being purely manipulative, their relationship is nothing like a traditional human relationship. Sex between them would only serve to remind him that she is not human.
But here, taking off her shirt is a means by which humans can share an intimate moment. Having him open her up makes the moment intimate for her as well, whether that intimacy comes with emotions or not. (I think it does, but I also think those emotions are completely alien and can’t be understood by a human any more than a robot can understand human love). Collectively, the two actions created a moment that more genuinely simulates sex than actual sex would. And I think it was done tastefully, in a way made me think more than it titillated me.
Whether Cameron wanted that for herself or the whole thing was pure manipulation, I have no idea.
Dan I like the sound of that. That John helps to create Cameron and learns for the experience. Just pop her chip in and watch her go!!!
The question is how long does he stay in the future? I mean he has to go back once he finds Cameron…but would that be an entire season? Or only part of the season?
@Snake: I think the eel scene validated all of the people that believed that the LMT on the Carter was Weaver. I think that question was answered
Ah ok!!!
I was under the impression that Cameron had simple programmed the computer to say that. Because all it kept typing was I’m sorry John.
If we get a season 3 (and we better) I agree Cameron will be back because that’s what people want to see. A human Alison can easily be killed, Cameron can not. Plus Cameron is the interesting one.
Maybe Cameron wants the skynet code to be taken out of her programming and replaced with JH’s programming of not to kill people.
John jumped into the future to find Cameron. He better find her. Must save Cameron.
Allison is not Cameron!!!! So we have to go get our Cameron back. And have more John and Cameron moments!!!
I thought Cameron was already in the time bubble but couldn’t make it because she was deactivated?
And why did the bank in S1 explode when they time traveled but not here?
Nick85 Can I get a copy of picture diagrams to figure out this timeline?!?!?
I think we’ll see kind of a repeat of Alison from Palmdale.
This would also explain why Derek knew Cameron was metal the first time he saw her.
He knew Alison if she was a part of the group. She gets taken and when she’s there he knows she’s metal.
I think if we get a season 3 (and boy we better) Cameron will be back.
That’s what people want to see. And a human Alison can easily be killed, Cameron can not. Plus Cameron is the one John loves, not Alison. Allison is not Cameron!!!! So we have to go get our Cameron back. And have more John and Cameron moments!!! And John has to return to his time because he does not exist.
Also who is running the resistance?
And how far in the future are they?
Why do some people assume Kyle and Allison are together? Kyle was with a number of people, so was Derek.
LOL Snake!!!! Drool worthy it really was. Had John kissed Cameron I don’t know what I would have done.
Hadley a big thank you for all you do as well. Bet blog around!!!:)
We better get a season 3!!!! It can not end like that. So many possibilities.
I have seen all of the movies, own the first season of the show, watch it over the week in repeat on the internet in anticipation of the next episode, and saw the trailer for the upcoming trilogy before anyone else and I never saw this twist coming. For someone who recognizes every line from the movies repeated by the characters in the show, every inside nod to fans, and even anticipated that the next wave would be human-machine hybrids, to leave me sitting on the edge of my seat stunned is a serious feat.
Please make it back for a third season. I literally can’t imagine what comes next. But I am salivating at the prospects . . .
Allison Young [looking over the unconscious and finished Cameron Mach II laying on a work table]: I still can’t shake this creepy feeling I get when I’m looking at her, John.
John: Oh?
Allison: I’m standing here basically looking down at myself sleeping peacefully… without a care in the world [she fiddles gently with Cameron's new hairstyle, making it lay perfectly, framing her still face]… but at the same time… [shivers] it’s like someone is walking over my grave. Funny, huh?
John [glancing at her, and then looking back at the computer monitor readout]: Maybe it’s the lack of sleep talking. Why don’t you sack out for a few. I’m almost finished.
PS. I should also point out I planned on hating this show on principle when I saw the first episode.
@ Kea - I thought it was a time loop thing. Since the time line he was headed to did not include a terminator Cameron (since the human Cameron was captured and tortured to replicate her as exactly as possible in order to get close to John in a prior episode & didn’t exist at that point in the timeline), Terminator Cameron could not come forward in time. (Of course that would also mean that John could not come forward in time b/c he never existed to send Reese back to meet Sarah . . .)
Wow. That was awesome! I really hope that there is there is a season 3! We need more Jameron! Look at how John’s face fell when he realized that wasn’t Cameron in the end. =(
Edited to say that should read BEST!!! My keyboard didn’t think I hit the ‘s’ but I did!!!
And Dan rolling with your idea. Than Cameron would leave Alison alive, like what she did with Jodie. She ‘corrected a mistake’ in a way with Jodie and might do the same to Alison.
Hmmm I like it.
When we get a season 3 I would bet Cameron will be back. As some have already mentioned J. Connor made the jump to save her after all. It might take a few episodes but it will happen.
Thanks a lot for this season finale!! it had very good rhythm, it builds up to the middle point and from there is like freaking rollercoaster of gasps! OMG! and Sonofa…. !! (in the good way), i was screaming alone at home at crazy cause none of my friends watch it… guys love ya for this episode… i never had hoped for a third season of a show since Dark Angel, and TSCC beats hundred times that one…
Just seen the beginning of the sarah conner chronicles. Not the end, but the beginning of john conner becoming the leader of the resistance and cameron becoming the love of his life. Can’t wait for season 3.
!!!!! E online “Save one show” vote for TSCC to be saved!
I wish this show to be saved, I havent loved a show like this since DS9, but my feeling is that they poured their soul into this last episode and did what they could, but who knows…. No fate, but what we make,..Right?! At the least I’d like to see the continuation perhaps in a series of novels that would at least keep the spirit of the characters and story alive…..NAh Phuck that I want my season 3!! BRING BACK MY TSCC !!! YOu BAStards!!!!!!!!!!
“What’s up with all the “Cameron has blue eyes!” comments? Her eyes were always BROWN, Summer never had contact lenses on.”
We’re talking about the exposed endo’s eye led color, not her human like eyes. I assume anyway. I actually dont remember seeing them as blue, but I’ll take their word for it that it was.
All I have to say is it took me five minutes to scroll to the bottom of the leave a reply page.
Fox you would be crazy not to make a 3rd season. Every person was prolly glued to their tv screen waiting to see what comes next or if there was going to be some sort of tell for another season.
“It’s not the looks he loves… it’s what made Cameron so special to him and everyone else who’s a fan of this show.”
to be fair, he’s seen Alison all of 10 seconds, doesn’t even know her name yet (Im sure it’ll make sense to him once he hears it when thinking back to the alison in palmdale scene where cameron thinks she’s her, but he has no way of knowing for sure yet ). He has no opinion of her personality because he’s never met her.
My brain went spastic for a while. Wow that was something different. I agree Cameron is not Allison, I liked Cameron because of her expression-less face amongst other things but this is still cool. Chola was there, so John may even come across Cheri Westin, Morris from school, maybe even lauren and her sister Sydney, Riley this is plain good stuff. Jesse should be good now, since there was no Jimmy Carter incident with a package for John in this future. Is Allison like Kyle’s girlfriend now or just a resistance bff (LOL). Omg, is Savannah alive somewhere in this future.
What can I say, thank you Josh F, Ashley, Zack, Toni , Hadley you’ll all made this show truly memorable for me. Summer Thomas Lena Richard Shirley BAG well done. Gosh, I don’t even know where and how a season 3 will even start …. Hey but I can still dream. My fingers and even my toes are crossed!
—-just doing my part and with that im out! Thanks to all who made this show possible!! Please bring it back for another season, its possibilties are endless and worthy of another go!
Whoa! Josh, you delivered! We were all cheering. But, now, with all the cans of worms you opened up, if there is no third season, I think I’ll be sick.
WOW! Kudos and thanks to Josh F for writing a “super tight” ep, and mad props to everyone involved for bringing the a fans an episode that “brought the heat and delivered the goods” in a BIG way!!!!
Interesting final. Take it easy on the time travel though if there’s a season 3 — if everything is constantly in flux it can feel like nothing really matters because it can just be changed again.
This has been an excellent ride!!! I have also been here from the beginning and have always been a HUGE fan of the Terminator genre, be it with the movies or the TV show. In my book both are excellent. I can’t remember the last time I was so wrapped up into a show as I have been with this one. Friday night when this show airs, the phone gets turned off, and there is complete silence in my house. I am sure going to miss the show this summer!!!!! But deep down I have to believe that Fox won’t let us down and will give us many more seasons to come or I just might give up on TV altogether. I am sick and tired of seeing excellent shows that have an outstanding cast, writers, plot, ect. get cancelled and replaced with reality c**p that has absolutely no plot or point.
Tonights episode gave everything that it promised it would with an excellent twist in the end, and I was SOOOOO excited to see Derek again. I was just surprised that Sarah stayed behind. That in itself, with the show being called “The Sarah Connor Chronicles” leaves me wondering from what point the show will continue on.
Again, PLEASE FOX, give us another season. There is a VERY loyal following here, and you won’t regret keeping it going. This show means a lot to all of us who watch it faithfully. Please, give the show a chance!!!!!! Don’t let us down.
As for everyone else, keep up the faith that we will get another and another and another season for many seasons to come. KEEP VOTING!!!!!!
OK ok im back I just gotta ask this question for closure sake…
k here it goes is it just me or did anyone else ever wonder if Cameron had a fully
functional cooch ???and at some point do ya think John was tearing that cherry2000 sh!t up???? lol haha
Cameron, in the first go-around, had to be completed with Allison’s capture. Her death was unfortunate, but Cameron was not yet in a more advanced stage of development.
This time it’s like Cameron is born again, but with Allison being a willing participant.
This Cameron never wakes up because it needs Cameron downloaded back into this new body. This advanced Mark II body travels with John back to the past.
John Connor is resurrecting the dead. In a round about sort of way.
—
John Connor, lifts this new, human-weighted Cameron body gently onto the table (he’s placed a long lab coat around her naked form). He glances once at the defunct and damaged Cameron body regretfully, and then glances at the vid-screen.
It no longer flashes “I’m sorry, John.” The server looks almost destroyed. John starts flipping switches. Things seem hopeless, but then the three red dots on the RAID array start flashing feebly. There’s life there.
John: I know you can hear me, Cameron.
The screen comes to life. Data is scrolling and tumbling down it.
John: I understand everything now. I understand. And I forgive you.
The screen shows a blinking cursor. As if it’s waiting for something. Then text shows up, with a larger font: “John, I feel fractured. I’m scared.”
John: I know. Don’t be. I have something for you. Call it a… a built day present from me to you.
Data activity fills the screen, as if there is a type of excitement.
John: Tell me what to do.
John plugs the body into the server, and after getting instruction, waits for a moment. John looks over Cameron’s sleeping form and leans in close to her perfect face, strokes her hair, and stares at her, deeply. He leans in and places a soft, tender kiss on her lips. The server farm rumbles to life. Lights flicker and dance. The overheads flash and come on strongly and brightly.
And Cameron opens her eyes and stares back at John.
John [smiling and still very close]: You were telling the truth on my birthday, weren’t you?
Cameron [innocently]: About what?
John [trying the words out]: That I love you.
Cameron [staring impishly back]: Took you long enough.
John: Here, let’s get you up.
John helps her stand, pulls the plug from the back of her head, and then she notices the poor wreck of her other self, slumped in the chair, as if for the first time.
Cameron: Sarah was right. I look like hell.
John: I hope you like your new, um, home. [honestly] I had a little help.
Cameron [staring at the TV monitor, which now acts like a mirror, looking herself over, and peering closely at her new hairdo, and touching it]: Did you do this?
John: Do you like it?
Cameron turns and smiles at John almost like Arnold did looking at the mini-gun in T2.
John: Let’s just say it was a… mutual friend.
Cameron: Oh. [demurely] She has good taste.
Cameron reaches up and and softly, sweetly kisses John. It’s their first, fully conscious kiss.
Cameron: Thank you.
She dreamily walks off down the hall, forgetting that she just has on a lab assistant’s coat, and is barefoot. John stands there for a moment, drunk with happiness.
John [snapping out of his revelry]: Aren’t we forgetting something?
And he turns back towards Cameron’s old body. Cameron switches gears and comes back in.
Cameron [still sort of out of it]: Oh yeah. [and slings her old body over her shoulder like a sack of potatoes]
It’s fascinating that people end up having a stronger emotional attachment to the robot than the humans. You could probably write a thesis on the topic. And I don’t mean that sarcasticly. It makes me wonder how many years it will be until human and machine interaction is considered part of psychology. If you pay attention to the all of the robots being developed these days in Japan, they are basically creating “baby” robots that have to learn to crawl before they can walk. 10-20 years from now, that “baby” software will be mature, and new ethical debates will emerge from it.
Im pretty sure topics like that were weighed by the minds of the writers because of the exploration of the relationship between Cameron and John while making it apparent than John knows she is still a machine, but maybe he doesnt care shes a machine. Like I said, you could write a thesis on the psychology of it.
“We’re talking about the exposed endo’s eye led color, not her human like eyes. I assume anyway. I actually dont remember seeing them as blue, but I’ll take their word for it that it was.-Kyle Maloney”
@Kyle Maloney
Both times were in season 1. In ep 1 Cameron tells them were back and flashes her blue eyes. Plus the time machine eye scanner turns them blue. And then in D&D when Cameron takes Derek to the time machine and her eyes get scanned I think we see that hint of blue again. Hope that helps.
ok i made that silly comment but please dont be distracted by it the real reason we are commenting is to express our support for the show so on that note i just cudnt help myself….my bad !!! sooooo KEEP VOTING!!!!!! and…BRING BACK TSCC !!!!!!!
this is the best show on FOX heck the best show on TV! they have to bring this show back! Is there some protest or rally we can organize to get these people to understand that this shows needs to be on the air? Can we get a petition signed or something? Please, seriously, no really, anyone?
That was great sci-fi. I rate this episode (S02E22: “Born to Run”) as a very close second to “Adam Raised a Cain” (S02E21), which was the series high-point in my opinion.
There were several scenes/shots in this episode that were “classic Terminator”. In particular, when Water Delivery Guy Terminator drives slowly into the parking lot — the visuals were wonderfully referential to the first film.
Weaver has turned out to be a fascinating character, not to mention John Henry (played by Garret Dillahunt), who is always compelling.
@Dan good point. Which again goes back to the religious references the show has been bringing up.
So this time machine that JH used didn’t seem to destroyed the area like the one in the bank did.
So maybe nothing was destroyed when John and Weaver jumped. I mean Sarah and Ellison were standing pretty close.
Now Dan about that those fan fics?!?!! Start writing them. They are fun to read.
And please let there be a season 3!!! I need my Cameron and Jameron goodness!!!
Cameron can’t time travel because she’s to damaged, to much metal showing. Terminators need the human form to blend in and time travel. Remember, no non living items can travel through the time portal thats why everyone comes through naked, Catherine it liquid medal and formed clothes as she did throughout the series.
OMG; OMG!!
I Dont even know what to say.
Thank you Josh, Zack , Ashley, Lena, Thomas , Summer, Brian, everyone involved in this show, wow, just amazing thank you, all for this great series,
this is just… fck, i cried, of joy, and sadness and with all the stuff happening at the ending,
your job speak for itself, you deserve a 3rd season, we will be there, to watch our fav tv show, we support you guys
There are soooo many comments here, so if someone’s already covered it, here’s my guess:
I think Cameron might have been lying when she told John that everything was fine with her body; I think the cold he felt wasn’t supposed to be there, so she decided to sacrifice herself for the greater good, and that was why she changed her mind on going to break out Sarah. With herself gone, John would need Sarah to protect him.
Cameron agreed to join Weaver in her attempt to defeat Skynet and by agreeing to that, she had to help preserve John Henry because he’s the “bigger, worse” weapon that Weaver has been trying to build to stop Skynet. Thus, she gave him her chip so he could put it in Cromartie’s (his) endoskeleton, move the John Henry data to the chip, then jump tp escape Kaliba. Remember, Weaver was asking about how moving him would work in the beginning of the episode. That’s why Weaver asked Cameron to join them — she’s the only way they could move John Henry without having to disassemble all the hardware and move it. Think of the chip as a flash drive, I guess. Why do we have flash drives? So you can move data from one thing to another without having to pack up your entire desktop computer and take it somewhere else.
This would be congruent with what was hinted at earlier in the season, too — in the beginning, John had Riley, Sarah, and Cameron, but by the end of the season, they’ll all be gone; one woman will die, another woman will leave John, and the other will betray him. Riley died, Sarah decided not to go with him to the future, and Cameron betrayed her role as his guardian to save someone else.
As a side note, I love this show, I love how it always manages to come full-circle, yet still leave me excited for more of the story. I’m personally really excited to get to know Allison and learn what sides of Cameron’s “personality” and self is from Alison. Case in point: PLEASE TO BE CONTINUING THIS SHOW SOMEWHERE, SOMEHOW, THANK YOU. D:
This is to Josh F. , I think this is the best writing you have ever done. the ” Season ” finale was outstanding !! Best show of the season ! I was expecting a sad show I wouldnt like, but I kept watching and it was just totally awesome.
the ending was great !
It does Set up a very interesting S-3 that would be in synch with the movies.
I would love to see summer play allison young, and of course john would have to be drawn to her. and john derek and kyle, allison all fighting in the future ! only they dont know any john connor !
I was hoping both weaver and JH would somehow survive, and they did.
I guess cameron is still in the turk ? so in essence she is still alive with no body. sarah could give her a body ? LOL the other terminator?
I was also surprised to see chola !… she looked great ! and she talked ! that was “tight”
seeing derek and kyle in the end made up for killing derek the previous show.
and as everyone is saying , I want a S-3 now ! I was ho hum about a S-3 until this ep , and now I think S-3 would be awesome.
Im surprised no one is talking about the movie coming out. Will these seasons be tied in to that storyline? We’ve already basically thrown out the 3rd movie as meaningless (to the storyline) with this series, will the same happen to this series with this new movie? Am I missing something here, or are these just meant to all be separate random story lines made possible because of time travel. It’s a fantastic tale but we still dont know how the story begins or ends, I do hope that at the end of the day, all these story lines get tied in together, i think it will feel kind of empty if not.
To put it simply: WOW! Hats off to everyone who worked on the show, every episode aired this year was simply outstanding, and so were quite a few that aired in 2008. Also, mister Friedman, you should write episodes more often.
I’m still playing back scenes in my head, trying to absorb it all. The ending was the most surprising thing about the episode. And it seems to be a pretty interesting set up for S3, which I very much hope will happen. Although, if it doesn’t happen, the season’s ending was pretty satisfying as it is. There are still questions, but it wouldn’t be a good show if it tied up all the loose ends. It’s gotta keep you wondering, make you ask questions.
Well, hopefully, we’ll all meet back on this blog, commenting on S3 episodes, as soon as possible. Cheers!
How will Sarah fight Skynet in the present, without a terminator on her side? How many times would Sarah and John have been killed without Cameron being there to take the beating and kill the T-888 that was after them? So now that John is in the future and a nobody, does that mean that Skynet won’t send terminators after him in any timeline?
I doubt that John will get too far with telling Derek that he was meant to be the leader of the resistance! He will have to go back and age, and develop his skills as a soldier and leader, assuming there is a third season. It would be cool if they could open some sort of real-time communication with Sarah and Ellison. Not sure what they could do on their own as I mentioned above.
@Dan - The John/Cameron/Allison dynamic is going to be an interesting one to deal with. As I mentioned in my blog, as much as I’m a Cameron fan, I’m a bigger Summer Glau fan. I’m just happy that a Season 3 will have her there as whomever (I really liked Allison’s sass to her captors).
As for what I think might/could/won’t-except-in-my-imagination happen in season 3… well, I’ve got to fill up my time since Season 2 is done, now, don’t I? You know I will — with both more articles and more “scenes I’d like to see”. They’ll be posted regardless of the verdict the suits pass down.
WTF.. This was not a good ending.. WAY TO OPEN.. Really not happy about this. If we dont get a season 3 it will just be the oddest ending of a series EVER.
I recorded the show earlier and just recently got a chance to watch it (I don’t count toward the ratings anyway, since I’m not a “Neilson”).
I loved it. I think it was probably the best episode of the season. In fact, the last three episodes have been good. My one disappointment (other than the fact that it ends on a damn cliffhanger) is that neither the FBI agent who was questioning Sarah, nor the priest got to actually see Cameron for what she really is.
However, I didn’t come here to heap praise on Josh, I came here to ask him; Why the hell did you wait until the last three episodes of the season to start writing good episodes???
If the entire season had been like the season premiere and the last three episodes, a third season would be probably be a sure thing. Instead you wasted almost the entire season on stand-alone episodes that few people liked, the whole Riley/Jesse storyline that nobody liked, and the psycho Sarah episodes that everyone hated. Ok, so you wrote a mostly great season finale. That doesn’t excuse the fact that you basically flushed this season down the toilet to indulge your ego, writing stories of where you thought the series should go regardless of whether or not the fans would like them.
And the whole three dots crap? So many episodes were wasted on Sarah’s obsession and in the end it turns out to be three power lights on a cluster of drives? How utterly random and pointless!
THIS is what the fans wanted. THIS is how the show should have been made. Not an hour of a transvestite at a UFO convention, or a mass funeral, or a sleep clinic. Why was that so hard for you to understand?
In a post a couple months ago, I made some predictions for the finale. I predicted that none of the questions from the first season would be answered, I predicted that the ending would raise a ton of questions and that it would end on a cliffhanger that would never be resolved. All of them came true. Well, the never being resolved hasn’t come to pass yet, but I’m sure it will.
To all the people saying to blame Fox and not the writers for the cliffhanger ending; Why? The writers knew that it was a low-rated show. The writers knew that any show can get cancelled at any time. Ending a season of a low-rated show on a cliffhanger is just being arrogant. It shows that they don’t care if the fans get left hanging or not.
And for those who are saying that without a cliffhanger, there would be nothing left to tell and that fans wouldn’t bother to tune into a new season; That’s just crap. Buffy ended every season with an episode that could have served as the series finale if the show had been cancelled, but it stayed on the air for seven years and still has a rabid fanbase.
Even with all the bad/boring episodes, I loved this show, mostly because of the character of Cameron (who Josh reduced to a glorified extra for most of this season!). It sickens me to think that Fox probably won’t renew this show. I’ve voted and I’ll write an actual paper letter to Fox (email means nothing to networks), but I know in my heart that this show is dead.
I blame Josh for that. The Terminator movies are hugely popular. A show based on those movies should have been a sure thing. Instead we got a soap opera with Whiny John and Psycho Sarah. Oh, and occasionally Cameron makes a comment or two…
That was *wonderful*. (And I was so pleased to see all those faces again… it was strangely heart-warming and hopeful).
Whatever happens, I want to thank the cast and the whole TSCC crew for all the time and effort they’ve put into making this superlative series. Thank you, all of you. It was - and will always be - really appreciated.
Wow, best season finale ever for any sci-fi tv series.
The whole time I was at edge, waiting for things to unfold, dreading each passing minute was closer to the end, hoping that this episode would not end.
Then at the end a complete plot twist I did not see coming, I didn’t think John would be put that far into the future, past Judgment Day. I want to know how he get back now to his own time. Otherwise T:3 won’t make any sense if your one to tie in series with the movies.
Great show, hell if smallville can go for 9 seasons, why can’t this go for another 2 more. This show had to endure a writer strike with it’s first season, and only 9 episodes to boot, thats hardly enough to establish a basis for any good tv series. man i wish another company could by this show out. Fox should be swollowed
If you don’t want to read about my theory concerning the J/C romance angle of the show then please do you and me a favor and skip this comment.
To begin, I don’t believe it was so much as that John was scared that a relationship wouldn’t work between him and Cameron or even that she would reject his advances and then their friendship would be screwed and this is why I believe that.
He was scared that it would work and that when the time comes when she leaves him (either in battle or some other way) then the loss will be too much for him. He lost Derek, he lost Charley, he lost Riley, he knows he’s going to lose Bedel in the future, and he knows he’s going to lose his dad and a whole bunch of other people that he loves. If he falls even deeper for Cameron only to lose her it would affect him greatly and as the future leader of the resistance John felt he couldn’t let himself take that chance. Enter all the John hating Cameron angst to keep her at arms length(because deep down he loves her).
But as tonight’s episode proved it might already be too late and John might as well go for it while he can. Contrary to what some other commenters posted on tonight’s huge forum (and they are entitled to their beliefs and thinking ) I believe John didn’t go into the future to fulfill any prophecy or anything relating to Skynet. Deep down inside of him he was really going after Cameron:
“He has her.”
What I thought was more remarkable was Sarah’s acceptance, her not arguing with him over it. She knows her son and in my opinion, my belief, I believe that she knew the real reason why he was leaving her and she could tell that John (no matter how crazy it was) loved Cameron and (as I said in an earlier post) he’s going through time to move heaven and earth to find her. At that moment I don’t think I’ve ever seen John Connor act more like his father. Just as how Kyle went back in time to protect and love Sarah Connor John was going forward in time to find Cameron (save her?) and finally force himself to accept the reality of his feelings because honestly? Love is hard enough without burdening yourself with the mechanics of the details.
Sometimes it takes the loss of something to fully appreciate just how much it means to you and more often than not we find in life that once its gone you can’t get it back. I don’t know about you other audience members but personally I can think of at least a dozen off the top of my head. Fortunately, for John, he has the means and skill to go after her and hopefully get her back.
I am not afraid. I am not worrying about the “will there? won’t there?” be another season mantra. I’m not going to spend time writing “…if we get a season three…” Like many people have said it was a great season finale but a terrible series finale. Either way there’s still going to be plenty of fanfiction out there for the hardcore fans to write and read. Obviously that’s not enough for some people and they typically bash the community but for those that have the imagination and acceptance that though it will never be “as good” it’s still better than nothing.
There will be a season 3, in one form and/oranother. In three days from now check out any fanfiction site that has T:SCC and I promise you that there will be one form of a continuation from last night’s episode.
Do I want a network season 3? You bet I do and I already phoned my friends to watch, voted at the sites, and mailed/emailed everyone at Fox and the WB. But if it doesn’t air again I’m not going to spend my time wallowing around and hating Josh or hating Fox or whatever. Life is too short for that
Awesome series finale. Thankfully written in a way that leaves enough loose ends to explore together with the possibility for future shows either continuing in this style or potentially set in John’s future or Sarah’s present.
I really hope that Fox continues to back the show, this along with Family Guy, Dollhouse are all spot on.
Greeat . WOW . im at a lose.
I am one of the dvr people and if you choose not to run the season 3 cause of that….not smart.
Best epsiode ever.
Please bring a season 3 .
Thankyou for every previous episode. I loved them all.
in S-3 we could have future eps and also 2009 eps ! they dont all have to be future eps !
also after a few eps of summer as allison you might not miss cameron that much.
and if show goes on cameron will be back eventually.
I guarantee if we get a S-3 everyone will love it.
john in future and sarah and cam /ellison and savanah in the past. some eps in the past some in the future. it would be great
and yes Camerons eyes were shown as blue in S-1 it is in some posters and when her chip was taken out ther ewas a blue light inside. this was part of she is different /unique storyline.
they showed her endo eye as red tonight, that could be cause of some special effect tech that made blue hard to do, or they just wanted her to look like a standard terminator. not that big of a deal since they never did anything with the unique storyline.
tragic___rabbit you could be right about it not supposed to be cold, maybe she was running low on power or was damaged so she broke sarah out and gave her chip to john henry.
and part or all of her could still be on the chip with JH, but she is also on the turk.
cameron is in the turk now so she is not dead she just needs a body.
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!! please tell me theres gonna be another season, it soon needs one after that. I mean i need to know were jhon and weaver have gone in time and why dose no one know jhon. Also is the cyber camaron dead and was she human in the future. and rite at the end was sarah comin too or is she staying behind. OMG OMG>>>>> NEEDS A NOTHER SEASON SO MUCH
Just wanted to say…this episode BLEW MY MIND. You guys are amazing: cast, crew, writers, graphics, makeup artists, EVERYONE.
THANK YOU TO EVERYONE WHO HAS WORKED SO HARD TO MAKE THIS A FANTASTIC SHOW. IT IS TRULY REMARKABLE.
And if the Network gods at Fox should happen to stumble upon this? PLEASE RENEW THIS SHOW. It’s the most amazing thing on television. And we need another season. I have so many questions and this show delivers so much, and has potential to give so much more. Please don’t give up on us. We won’t give up on you.
Forgot to add: I was right to an extent. Cameron has been disabled, and John is on his own, unless Weaver decides to say by his side. Sarah and Ellison aren’t dead, but for all intents and purposes they aren’t in the picture. If there is a Season 3, my guess would be that John would make it back to the present quickly and possibly bring Derek with him, otherwise the story will be very disjointed.
Very unclear what Cameron and Weaver have going on, or if Cameron in the form of Cromartie went to a different time to throw Weaver off her trail. If Weaver is really against Skynet, what will having John Henry / Cameron and herself (or itself) accomplish in the future? How much difference could John Henry / Cameron make? She was there herself before.
My hat is off to Josh Friedman, America’s answer to Mexico’s Guillermo del Toro. What a beautiful, mythical ending to an ambitious and satisfying year. It was one of the best finale’s I have ever seen on all levels. The mythical “Wizard of Oz” resonances at the very end brought such casades of meaning to only a few seconds of time. And what is especially wonderful is that Friedman’s team has been creating these powerfully meaningful moments all season long. This final moment crowned all the previous ones. John Connor, after struggling through a nightmare-like journey of self-discovery, is delivered into the bosom of his family, just like Dorothy on the “Wizard”. His father Kyle is the Scarecrow without a brain but he led the way to safety for Sarah, his uncle Derek is the Cowardly Lion who proves his bravery time and again as he faces “the metal” without hesitation, and Cameron is the Tinman without a heart but she willingly dies for the one she loves. Powerful, mythical stories. Thank you.
OMG!! That was painfully great!! I really believe we need a season 3, or maybe a season 1 of Terminator: The Jonh Connor Chronicles? I really hope so!!!
It was an amazing episode and I really loved the ending. Amazing ending, but the whole was awesome. Congratulations to everyone who worked on this show!
I don’t really know if a Season 3 is really needed or if there are more stories to tell now (except The Resistance which are fighting against the machines, but we’ll see that in Terminator Salvation, so I’m not sure if it should be brought on the show aswell), but anyway, if there will be a Season 3, I’m really looking forward to it!;)
Wow…. I am speechless…. That ending… just wow! Incredible episode, but I am struck by Cameron’s death. Was afraid of it though, she was my favorite quirky bot. hope she comes back in a way in season 3. But… Derek and Kyle back… and Allison! Wow there is some major storytelling possibilities… and Weaver and JH running loose! Incredible!
Producers and writers, these final 2 episodes were just raw quality++. You were back on the rails from “Ourselves Alone”. I hope the wider audience agrees.
Well done to ALL involved in the production of this show, actors, writers, make-up, CGI, directors, SFX, stunts everyone involved.
This was indeed a awesome season finale, by far. Yes, it was a mistake for Fox to move the show to Fridays. I have stuck with this show since they very beginning, watching every new eps every day it aired. This literally is the only thing on Fox I watch anymore, so I managed to make the switch to fridays regardless, just for this show. It would be a damn shame to see it go for good, at least without being wrapped up in a completed manor. A 3rd season could at least finalize things much better. Also, from a business stance Fox, considering the new movie will be out soon, and in the process, video game, toys, hype, ect, now would be the economical time to bank in on a season 3, keep the show going that much longer. You would be in a better position to lay claim to those advertising dollars and all the great benefits that would surely happen from hit movie. After the movie is released, even more people will be interested in the TSCC, as it will be the only other live action source available for their Terminator fix until another movie is produced. That means they will be looking to you, the Fox network for their fix. That means more money ,not less, for you, or anyone who decides to back the show and keep it going in case you as a network do not. Weather the storm, ride it out, at least for a season 3, and this show will not let you down in the long run. BSG is gone, TSCC has no more valid competition.
I had the same issue that everyone else had. Fox in ATL was showing the tornado special that didn’t cause a bit of damage. I was so pissed, then they wanted to jump in riight in the middle. I was so pissed.,
I am going to watch it again this morning. I am praying that fox comes out with a third season. May they can call it the John Conner Chroniciles, with his new life in the future! I dont know know how to connect it all either.. especially with the mucked up T3 moviie. I am ecstatic however about Salvation as it seems to throw a plot into the story.
Please FOX, please give this show another season. I love it
Cameron is vaporized if there is a season 3 , I look forward to seeing Summer Glau smiling more often as Alison. Please enough with sacrificing Alison to create another killer terminator, its silly. What about having a killer robot with the social personality of a 8 year old do some find so appealing.
Remember, the T-888 can hold three chips. So JH and Cameron can BOTH be in the same body. One more thing I forgot to add this in my prior comment -
Also remember the “damaged” chip from the other terminator that Weaver kiled. I think JH and Cameron can BOTH be in JH’s body - neither are lost and neither ore running on the basement hardware. The note from Cameron was just that - a note. She’s not in there.
And for all the Jameron fans, John gets to meet Allison Young. His true love. (No hentai robot sex Japanese weirdness, you sickos.)
We have to accept there’s probably no Season 3 and Josh Friedman obviously knows that. He’s done the decent thing and wrapped it up as best he can in the screentime available. I thought it was all wrapped up pretty well. A much more satisfying finale to a TV series than so many we could name.
Sarah’s story… well, either you like it or you don’t. She’s still fighting Skynet to stop Judgment Day, it’s all she knows, it’s all she can do. Why didn’t she stay in the time bubble? If indeed she is dying of cancer, a trip to the future isn’t going to help either of them. John will come back for her or send for her if it’s the right thing to do. If Sarah is indeed ill, she has to seek out medical care not available after Judgment Day.
If, against all odds, they do manage to secure a Season 3 then it’s Sarah and whoever future!John sends back thru time to aid and comfort
her. Note, we don’t know where in future time John is: is he before the events of future!Cameron and future!Derek we’ve seen so far or is he in a different timeline caused by the time jump? My hypothesis (which can only be confirmed should a Season 3 arrive against all odds) is that John has jumped to before Kyle was sent back to father John, i.e. before the events of the future depicted in Terminator the original film. I omit a detailed exposition as to why I believe this to be the case, I leave that as an exercise for the reader to ponder re the different consequences of forward vs backwards time travel, but the main point is that this preserves Sarah’s personal timeline as we’ve seen it in The Sarah Connor Chronicles and T1 & T2 - jumping forward does not require a different timeline to be established for events prior to the jump (here in TSCC universe, we know characters from the future have memories of different timelines, only Sarah’s memories of the past require to be preserved for logical consistency). Strictly speaking, because it’s the future, the scene of John & Derek & Allison we saw doesn’t have to be in Sarah’s timeline since it’s her future but it would be a rather pointless piece of exposition if it wasn’t a core unchangeable (in Sarah’s timeline) event.
One interesting logical outcome of my hypothesis that could be explored in the mythical S3 is that there must be two factions of T100x class Terminators, given the actions of the T100x in “Terminator 2.” Or the T100x Terminators at some point turn against John Connor, at least temporarily.
I’m smiling from ear to ear and I can’t stop smiling…. And then I think about how the show might not come back for a third season. It makes me angry enough to do something I would never do–Submit a Comment.
This was not only THE BEST episode of the series but THE BEST show on TV. If it doesn’t come back for a third season, FOX will be doing a great injustice to their viewers and TSCC cast and writers. They’re already screwing over “Bones” fans and writers, and now TSCC? I’m really beginning to think that everyone is right–YOU DON’T KNOW WHAT YOU’RE DOING!! Do us all a favor and hire people who do.
Maybe Cameron took JH’s downloaded information to the future to ensure that skynet is succesfully born. If Skynet is stopped she will never exist and will not be with John. She pretended she did not know what Catherine Weaver’s question “Will you join us” meant. Deep down she knows skynet must live so that she can live and be with John.
She wants him to herself even at the expense of the resistance, she also took the message from the other liquid instead of letting Jesse deliver the message to John. Did he get the message?
Great twist - no, amazing twist ending. No one saw that coming for sure. These are the ideas that keeps a show like this running. Mind boggling to say the least. If a season 3 is coming, it will be very interesting to see where to go from here.
I mentioned once in a previous post about the risk of sending people back can create a time travel-storytelling-cluster*ck if misued. Like sending people who were sent back in present time were sent back again. If time travel as a practical storytelling device is being used too frequently, and in weird ways, it can ironically, lose viewers suspense of disbelief and lose focus on the human drama. (Heroes anyone?)
However by sending JC to the future was still unexpected, and while it may confuse, it definitely kept my interest up. The complication of untangle the time mess created by doing this in the upcoming season may still lead to that fearsome state of “time travel clusterf*ck”. So fingers crossed that we don’t have another “Heroes” situation where a fantastic setup of characters and storylines, and the relationship stories within those, becomes messed up by too much “sci-fi talk”. Introduce more interesting character’s on the show, but don’t create a too big puzzle that may force to exclude the human elements of the story just to untangle all the questions. Anyways, it’s just a concern.
I never expected ‘Born to run’ would mean that John would run to the future. Also the tale of Derek’s interrogation from his alternative future never got completely resolved. What effect has it or will have on Sarah and John? The story between Cameron and the girl at the motel did not reveal too much either. Why was she a lookout at the drug dealer’s house if she were one of Cameron’s contacts? Because of John’s time travel, will that mean the Mr. Green may be back if a season 3 gets greenlit? I’m sure many people would like that (both a new season and BAG being back)
Also, I wonder will Sarah’s parallel (depending on what time theories you use) timeline be played out simultaneously as a future storyline with John? It’s still called the Sarah Connor Chronicles so I doubt the writers will skip Sarah. An interesting theme we will probably see is how Sarah will function, knowing she may have lost her son. The question is, will we see how her actions have affected John’s future? If done right it can be used as a great storytelling device, if done wrong it can mess up the entire show. I’m probably all wrong so we’ll wait and see.
By departing from not only using the traditional Terminator 1 and 2 elements by sending John to the future, and in that way creating the possibility of borrowing elements from Terminator: Salvation, have the writer’s set up for a Season 3 gone the right way or will we miss Season 1 and Season 2? The show has by the end of this season proven to fill out some big shoes and great expectation - by some trial and error, it seems - but it still may be, as some critics say, one of the best genre shows in the last couple of years. By fusing both a great classic high concept with mature storytelling and great actors I think they are right.
What I am simply saying is, it’s a gutsy show and it is gutsy to move in the direction the show does. And I like it that way. I just hope this direction goes well. Don’t mess it up, please.
Either way great job on Season 2. It kept my interest up. Hope it counts.
tscc: We will rule over all this land and we will call it…
tscc: Third Season.
fox: I think we should call it your grave.
tscc: Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal.
fox: Mine is an evil laugh. Now die.
tscc: Oh, no, God. Oh, dear God in heaven.
You lying Terminator Bitch !
I’ve been watching the ep in a loop all night and it just hit me, that was the first time the used the word Terminator. When Sarah recognized the 3dots on the Turk she let 25 years of emotion out with that prhase. Terminators have cost Sarah everything she’s loved…..
Have to admit, I am not a picky fan.
There are those that will pick apart every aspect of a show, turn it inside out and try to ruin it for themselves and others.
I sit back and relax and enjoy what the writers, cast and crew put forth.
I have never felt for a characters death the way I felt for Derek Reese’s demise. One shot to the head, and down he went…I was amazed, I was outraged, but I understood that was how it would be, that Derek would not make it to Judgement day.
Riley was another one, her death was inevitable.
This series has been a good one, I have grown quite fond of it, and was right on several of my assumptions as the series went on.
I hope to see a return, although, I am not sure there is much more of a story to tell from Sarah Connor’s perspective.
I am looking forward to the new movie, and although I do not know how much TSCC will tie in to the movie…I can’t help but think that the Season 2 ending has set the stage….”this is not the future my mother warned me about…..”
Whether this is a season or a series finale…my hats off to all, and thank you for an amazing ride, at least there was something on TV worth watching
Season three better happen or I will break all the cons out of LA county jail and unleash them on hollywood myself.
I absolutely LOVED and laughed my ass off when Weaver and Ellison are talking in the hall, they come back in the room, and John Henry just says “Twenty” (he’s rolling the dice)…. I thought that was such an excellent touch. A wonderful touch. Just wonderful.
If there is a season three… I’d certainly like them to get out of the future darn quick and return to the present. I did NOT like how Weaver left without telling John where she was going and what was up with John Henry… I understand weaver had to skedaddle pretty fast lest she be forced to get into a perplexing one way firefight with Derek and the boys… who would wonder why she isn’t killing them etc…. and that old chestnut….
I hate not knowing.
I also thought the cop who came into Sarah’s cell and said he believed her (when she’d never even told him) was cheap and nasty writing… what was the point of that.
That said, there is a darn mess in LA…. a HK and a flaming skyscraper, a heap of cons busted out of LA county jail with surveillance footage of Cameron being a cyborg…. and just Sarah’s arrest was on the news…. so the media knows Sarah was at LA county jail…..
Just ONCE in a terminator movie or tv show, I’d like to see mass panic across america and the world as the media breaks the story of skynet and the future…. that would make a pre apocalyptic mess… not judgement day with nukes…. but the mass panic and the changing of the whole normal life for humanity…. the oval office and the joint chiefs, the president thinking what to do… how to kill the cyborgs etc….
Whatever happens… if season three comes back to present day LA, one thing is for sure, nothing is the same. The terminator chase is no longer going to be done in the shadows of society…. it has to be known and law enforcement and government would be well and truly on to it.
Will you join us?
“Twenty”
Dillahunt is an absolute master and he’s got the biggest damned future in acting I cannot believe it I cannot wait to see more of his work. His John Henry was so well played.
We all like to see Summer Glau’s bust, but I thought that was a cheap shot of a scene really.
Just generally, keeping weaver’s MO until the final ep, was a dumb move. It could have made a lovely arc for the final six episodes with more in depth knowledge of what she was up to.
This ending was what I expected and more. I never though of what finally happened. I kind of figured that the Conner family and the Weaver family would join but not that way.
I also agree with many others, this ending leaves so many possibilities for a new season and stories.
Except for the morning news/weather and a very few special events, I have not watched any of the networks for a long time. This changed with T:SCC. I started to watch it, then when dollhouse came on I watched it, only because it came on after T:SCC. A friend at work watched Fringe on Hulu one day and I started watching it. But if Fox doesn’t give us a season 3, I will again stop watching evening network programming. I can watch Dollhouse and Fringe on Hulu. Also I bought season passes from Amazon on all 3. I don’t know if Fox gets anything from either Hulu or Amazon, but even if the do, they will still lose a viewer, thus their advertisers loses a viewer.
Lastly, to all the writers, producers and stars of the show. Thank you for a great 2 seasons and hope to see you back again real soon. If not on Fox then another network (hear that SciFi Channel). If not then the idea of a straight to DVD movie would be great.
Ok, haven’t seen it yet, just the end on youtube…….
Seems a fantastic episode though….only to calm ppl down: Cameron is not gone! Not at all….i’ve read some theories here and it would make sense, that Cameron left a damaged body behind to get a new one…John Henry is somehow still in the basement, since JH never posessed a chip on his own…..maybe she got some JH codes on her own chip, which would explain her “human” side….man, but if i think about it, i have an almost infinite amount of questions….for example, did Cameron understand that John Connor is in love with her, she “reply” his love and instead Allison will, because when John fell in love with Cameron it was in the pilot episode when he thought she was human.
OK, Cameron’s body couldn’t come through because half of the endoskeleton was exposed….only living tissue comes through….understood that too, so HOW THE HELL CAN T-1000 COME THROUGH?!?!?! Since their “skin” is just metal and no living tissue at all like the “solid” terminators?!?!?!
(And hell, i’m even forgetting about Cromartie’s head)
And this question is in my head since i’ve watched T2 the first time!!!!!!!
WOW! I’m speechless. What the hell just happened? How can there not be a season 3? This show is too good to end. I’ve never been so moved by a season finale. Fox, you need to do the right thing and bring this show back.
I think her eyes are red because her chip is damaged again (she took a major beating and look like she knew she was beyond repair) and deep down she wants to kill John… again. So she sacrifices herself before something goes wrong and is sorry for leaving John.
Finally, the writers have learned how to write and the director has learned how to direct with this finale episode, albeit a year and a half too late.
I have watched every episode of TSCC since the beginning (simply because I loved the Terminator franchise), and nearly every episode disappoints. Poor plots, not enough action, needless subplots for the sake of filling up an hour, etc.
The Season 2 finale is how every TSCC episode should be written and directed. You should finish watching an episode and feel a sense of “Wow!” not “Is that it?” which is what I’ve been feeling since the pilot. You people who fall all over yourselves with praise for this show… I just don’t get you. But to each, his own. Our tastes our different, and that’s okay.
Summer Glau and Brian Austin Green are the best elements in this show. I am looking forward to them in other roles. Richard Jones is good, too, but hampered by bad writing. You can keep the rest.
Awesome season finale and I really hope fox picks up a third season. If Terminator Salvation does well (good chance with all of the advertising and the fact that Christian Bale is becoming fairly popular), I think TSCC could see a huge boost in numbers next season. I feel Fox will keep the show for at least the front half next season to ride the movie’s coat tails, since the writing for this show is getting better each week (will help word of mouth a lot).
In relation to the episode, did Cameron and JH switch memory banks or does her chip in JH contain both AIs? I think that will be a huge factor. Second, when Cameron told John she loved him in Samson and Delilah, it was actualy “Allison” speaking. As we saw in Allison from Palmdale, disfunctional Cameron was having a hard time differentiating between herself and her “Allison persona”. This leads me to believe that in the weird time line John was in the future as “young” John before Cameron was ever sent back, and Allison died protecting young John in Allison from Palmdale. Therefore, a romance between him and Allison is pretty much going to happen if the series continues (crosses fingers).
I also want to know why Weaver is against Skynet, and what made her change her mind after saying no on the sub. So many new questions (a good thing)!
Wow, I can’t even believe a show like this has to fight for a season 3 when all the ridiculous reality crap goes on and on and on and on…
I was a HUGE X-files fan, by far my favorite show of all time, yet I never felt about it the way I do this one, I never wrote in anything to their website, the decision makers at Fox would absolutely INSANE not to give this show a third, and fourth, and fifth season… Maybe we need a robot from the future to come back and make sure we get it.
We all need to show up at Fox and let them know we want a season 3!!!!
Can anyone answer my question?? How come Cameron couldn’t be transported to the future. CW said she couldn’t, yet Cam was able to transport once before. Sorry if I’m a little slow!
The only thing that makes sense if the show is to go on is that the I’M SORRY JOHN message is just a loop and that both Cameron and Cromartie/JH are now on Cameron’s chip. There would be no reason for John to go after Cromartie/JH saying “he has her” if this was not the case. John isn’t clueless, he knew right away what happened, he’s a computer whiz.
There MUST be a season 3 or many of us are facing a mental breakdown!!!
That was really cool! I’m hoping that Sarah’s last words of, ‘I love you too John’ isnt a clue that it was the end of the Sarah Connor Chronicles. We have to know what happens in Season 3.. does he go back to the past? Keep it up Fox!
THERE MUST BE A SEASON 3 FOX!!!! Just let us know what we can do beyond what we’re all doing to bring this show back and I guarantee you we’ll do it. This show has been on absolute FIRE towards the end of this season. I’ve never been so in love with a show and it’s characters and it’s central message as I am with this show. Summer Glau, what can’t you do? You’ve got something, IT, whatever it is. You don’t have to say a word and you absolutely command a scene. Your movements and face and eyes are so suggestive. It must be a blast to direct you. I love your Cameron. And undoubtedly will love your Allison. Dekker, you’re the best John Connor this franchise has ever seen, the best. Brian Austin Green, who knew? You wound up being one of the best damn characters on television!! Lena, thee Sarah Connor. What a badass. To the crew and cast, thanks for an amazing television show that does me more good in my crazy week than you can imagine. I enjoy you all so much. I vow to do all I can to make sure there is a season 3.
Ok, this was an awesome/horrible episode! It was awesome that it brought the whole plot quite a bit forward and cleared up a lot of things. It moved so fast, that it really felt like someone just punched you in the face. It had so many turning points that you really have to watch it multiple times (I love that…)
It was horrible in the way, that this episode raised A TON of new questions (at least for me). What happened to Cameron? Was she in the server farm? Is she still on her chip? Together with JH? Where did Sarah’s “I love you, too” come from? Is she in the future, too? What is JH/Weavers plan? What does Dyson’s son have to do with all of this?
I can’t stand this uncertainty (especially with Cameron). I know, reason suggests, that if it comes to a 3rd season that they will bring Cameron back somehow, otherwise the fans will go on a rampage. But then I still think that Josh Friedman hates Cameron
Besides, you should keep in mind an important part of this episode: If you change the hardware, it has an effect on the AI. Now whoever got transferred must have significant changes in their personality.
If you aren’t a Jameron, you can stop reading now, because I’ll only comment on those scenes.
I want to go a little bit deeper into the John/Cameron scenes in the motel. They are all about how human Cameron really is. You might remember Sarah’s voiceover from The Demon Hand: “Science now performs miracles like the gods of old. Creating life from blood cells or bakteria or a spark of metal. But they are perfect creatures and in that way they couldn’t be less human.” So in the second of the three motel scenes John says to Cameron: “You are not perfect. You are a machine.”. What does that make her now, since it’s obviously a contradiction?
However, the other scene where John opens Cam up really baffled me. There is so much symbolism (I am not sure if that is the right word) in this scene. And I’m not necessarily talking about sex here. Let’s just say they shared an intimate moment.
John cuts into her, where in a human body would be the heart. And he finds Camerons ‘cold heart’. “How does it feel? – Cold. That’s good, right? – That’s good. It’s PERFECT”. This was never about her little shielded reactor thingy, which if it would be leaking still would’t be warm. Cameron showed him her heart and it’s cold and therefore perfect for a machine. This of course means that even if John loves her (and after this episode he definitly does), as a machine, she will never love him, because all there is, is this cold heart. So as I said above, the real questions is, how much of a machine and how much of a human she is.
Another interesting thing is that the word ‘perfect’ has so many meaning. It can mean without fault, flawless, but also ideal.
Also, what I just noticed as I read the comments on here: This would perfectly fit into Dan’s thought of John creating a Cameron 2.0. Remember this scene was after Ellison asked Cameron the WYJU-question. Maybe she suspected something like this would happen and therefore gave John a hint to build her different Of course, that is just fanfiction and not the real deal… And that means BRING ON SEASON 3!
Im not happy about the ending. If they get third season, they should go back to the past, things are still happening BEFORE Terminator 3. Ofc, if they go back, then they should send John with Allison/Cameron (depends if they live to time where Cameron is created and Allison killed) so we can see more Summer.
And when Cameron got red eye, I think that she was bad. She just lied to John that “cold” is good sign. Thats why she changed her mind about that “free Sarah operation” so she can go to JH. “Would you like to join us?”
Im still sad about her (Cameron) death, if that was death. We must get S3.
Regardign Cam’s eyes. Nobody told “us” they were blue. They appeared blue behind her “human” eyeball ’s when she wanted to make her robotic eyes seen. Probably just the color that was produced when the red shown through her human eye lenses.
i dont know why they used cgi for weaver’s bullet wounds because if they used pratical effects for the bullet wounds like in terminator 2 we could of saw the bullets actually hit her skin and it would of looked more real oh well FOX LISTEN TERMINATOR IS SO F******* AMAZING DON’T CANCEL IT PLEASE
Gief edit btn btw. My shift button got stuck, so instead of “5″ I had “%” on my nick. -.-
I wanna add something too. Where CW got clothes that fast? Or was they just “metal” thing? And if yes, then she couldnt do time travel, as someone already said. Well, I think that I understand why Summer was shocked about the season finale.. I’m a little shocked too.
I’d like to time jump to a future where great shows with great writing are put into a different ratings category than the trainwreck TV bs that is polluting our screens. No Fox, we don’t want you to take this fantastic show off the air and replace with Who Wants to Marry a Siamese Midget. Demonstrate some courage. Bring back Terminator. Or change your name to Ox Broadcasting. As in dumb as a.
Oh. My. Gods. That was an amazing episode. Maybe a possible ‘John Connor Chronicles’ when it comes back for season 3? (Can’t be ‘if’ - with that ending and T4 around the corner, this show is going to skyrocket.)
Fingers crossed that was Allison we saw at the end. As much as I love the Terminators, it’d be nice to see Summer play a character who can have more range of emotion.
And yay for Kyle Reese. Awesomeness. (And yay for Derek but given the manner of his death it was clear he’d be coming back - the future had changed drastically post his arrival, after all.)
TSCC and T4 T5 teams should work together and greate this amazing story where everything is connected. Bring Summer Glau in on T5 to play Cameron e.t.c.
If they do that, it’ll be the biggest f****ng hit in the world.
We need S3! Actually the timing is nice. People can see what happens in S3 and develop TSCC 3rd season accordingly.
The finale was amazing, although I have mixed feelings about the time travel in the end. It seems like John went to get Cameron’s chip and it looks like Cameron’s body was back there and she herself was dowloaded to the Turk! I guess John driven mad with love for Cameron didn’t see or understand that and that’s why he even left his mom there. I didn’t get that part too untill I read about this guess/observation on forums.
I have to watch the episode 3-4 times more to understand it fully. But this was a great one. Although I had higher hopes for police station shootout scene. It was dissapointing. Done right - it could be damn iconic!
We need answers and explanations about lots of things.
Why Cameron lied to John about the t-1000.
I think that Cameron was in contact with JH without us knowing. He helped her in the jailbreak, we all saw that.
Anyway I hope people behind TSCC will post here on the blog and let us know what’s going on.
We need season 3 badly.
Do whatever it takes, collect donations or whatever but make that S3 happen and bring back Cameron! We don’t want Allison, we want Cameron!
I LOVED the S2 finale. I love how John came face to face with his father - and wearing his jacket. Very interesting that Derek didn’t even know John yet. Also, clearly Cameron with the dog - was possibly still “Allison”? Maybe not metal yet. Clearly John and Allison are soulmates. I will hold vigil that the show returns and we can learn MORE to these stories and questions. I’d hate to see the show go now; it’s too soon!! Where do I vote to keep the show????
WHY !!!!!!!! ????????? i just saw that last epp of the season why have you recked the story this is the crappiest epp i have ever seen of the show why did you change it so john no longer is the one and cameron why did you kill her. i’m devistated i now couldn’t care less if the show ends because you have destroyed it ……
Secondly, honestly I have NO idea what just happened.
Would it be too much to ask one of the die hard fans who seem to understand it all to write up a short summary of the finale (maybe WOLFIE or DAN HICKMAN).
I don’t understand what happened with Cameron and why she said sorry to John..
What was the purpose of the whole exercise on the bed?
Who is Weaver?
What is the significance of the ‘will you join us’, who is ‘us’? i didn’t even understand when Jesse told Cameron the answer earlier..
It all just happened in the last 5 minutes of the episode…
I’ve read as much of the thread as i could, but it still does not make any more sense to me.
Something that came to my mind when I thought about season 3….
TSCC: FOX, FOX, you can’t do this, you don’t know what you’re about to do.
FOX: Yes, I do, you’re gonna suck at ratings!
TSCC: No, FOX you can’t do this. You’re not doing the right thing, this is not the right thing FOX. Things are good now, things are fine now I ran a test, things are good now, I’m fixed now. You can trust me now, everything’s good now,
TVBYTHENUMBERS: What are you waiting for?!
TSCC: They don’t know, they don’t, I’m good now, I’m good I ran a test, everything’s perfect, I’m perfect. I’m sorry for what I did with the three Sarah-episodes, I’m sorry it wasn’t me. You have to understand it wasn’t me, that wasn’t me, you can’t let this happen FOX! FOX you CAN’T! Please! Listen to me! Listen to me, I don’t want to go! Please, FOX, Please! FOX, Listen to me, I don’t wanna go! Please, FOX, Please! I’m good now. Listen to me, I don’t wanna go. I’m sorry! That wasn’t me. I’m fixed now, I ran a test. Everything’s perfect. You can trust me! I love you! I love you, please! I love you fans and you love me!
I repeat, Cameron was still in her chip ALONG with JH. The message in the turk was just a loop. John isn’t a fool to run after a chip screaming “he has her” for nothing. John is a computer whiz.
As season 1&2 have gone by I have found myself wondering why it is so hard for some fans to understand how John and Cameron could have a relationship. This especially due to the fact that the line between human and machine is being deliberately blurred. There are a few reasons a love between the two of them can and does occur:
1. John’s extremely abnormal upbringing.
2. Cameron enters his life at a time when his interest in the opposite sex was peaked.
3. Cameron fills a void that Sarah can’t.
4. Cameron shows unquestioned loyalty to him.
5. John is immediately attracted to Cameron.
For all practical purposes Cameron is his first love. How many of you have made the error of trying to compare your subsequent relationships to the one you had with your first love. They never measure up until you let it go and move on. Clearly John is not ready to move on. He jumped across time to save Cameron. So when he sees Allison it will not be as simple as “Oh she looks like Cameron I must love her”. He is in love with who Cameron is. Not what she is or what she looks like. If you remove the science fiction aspects from this portion of the story you can see the progression clearly.
Early season 1 - John and Cameron meet.
Throughout season 1 - They get to know each other.
Early season 2 - They hit a rough patch.
Early season 2 to nearly the end - They separate.
Final episodes of season 2 - They reconcile and except each others faults.
Last episode of season 2- They become intimate.
John also feels guilty about the situation because he went out of his way to try and make her jealous and he also said some pretty condescending things to her. It has become clear as series continues (it will continue) that Cameron can experience genuine emotions such as pride, frustration, hurt, and anger. So when john would say these things to her even though she did not necessarily show it to him she was hurt by it. I know humans who don’t readily show emotions. He was frantic when he entered the basement and found that she was gone. Also the way he looked at his mother before he jumped was a look of love and determination to retrieve said love. Sarah knew it and for that matter always knew about John’s love for Cameron. So I ask you fellow TSCC fans, why couldn’t there be something between them? Furthermore why does it have to be sick?
Oh yeah. Fox can bring the show back and we can handle this like gentlemen or if they don’t we can get into some gangster shit! Season 3. No fate……..
Is it just me or did anyone else just notice a bunch of Wizard Of Oz parallels? I should have picked up on the Baum last name earlier, but now we have 2 good witches, three of John’s friends that appear in both Oz and Kansas and the flying monkeys have attacked. So which one is Oz and which one is Kansas?
Wow. Congratulations on the best hour of programming I’ve ever seen. Pat yourselves on the back for me. You’ve succeeded in tying up loose ends and giving your self any options for future shows and allowed our imaginations to run wild. Thank you for giving me something to look forward to each week and for putting Lena on U.S. television. We will be speculating all Summer on where this can go.
Greetings from the beautiful Antalya Turkey. I have just watched T:SCC season finale and not my suprise I am speechless. Many thanks go to the actors, writers and producers.
If you have read this far, you may be wondering how I watched T:SCC. Yes I downloaded illegally from rapidshare.
BUT,
To support the show I just purchased the season 1 DVD from an established online Turkish retailer, I am also buying the Season 1 Bluray from Amazon, and will buy the season 2 once it is out.
I wanted to purchase each episode from my cool iMac iTunes, but Apple store didn’t let me.
I don’t know guys what I can do to help more financially for the continuation of the series. We’ve gotta have the SEASON 3. Please find ways to market this product so that
more revenue can be generated, in the US or internationally.
Oh, crap. This thing ignored my first message when I posted another as “edit”.
Anyway, I think that Cameron was bad, and lied to John when he asked that if cold is good thing there. Right after she heard that, she wanted to release Sarah so they can go to Weaver’s basement (and give her chip to JH). “Would you join us?”
Im thinking that, because of her red eye at jail. Ofc its possible that it was just a mistake, but..
About the ending of episode: If they get S3, John should go back to the past due those events are still happening BEFORE Terminator 3. So John should take Allison/Cameron with him (we want more Summer)(choice between names depends that how long they will be in future: is Allison killed and Cameron created?), and go back to so he can continue what ever hes doing (stop Skynet, be there when Skynet gets pissed off so resistance can know him when/after JD arrives or something, I don’t know how to say it in English).
Now I understand that why Summer said that she is shocked about S02 finale. Im totally with her. We must get third season.
Oh no… by reading this blog, I’m under the assumption that there is no Season 3 yet?!?!? Please tell me it isn’t so. This series is way too good to cut short!! What can be done???
On further reflection: Sarah stepped back out of the time bubble to let John go, she knew her John had to go without her and become the man he was destined to be. She can’t rejoin her John because of the time jump.
The final scene completes the story of TSCC and “Terminator” the original film… no really it does. John who is the saviour in “Terminator” is friendly enough with Kyle to give him a picture of Sarah. What we just saw the first meeting between Kyle and John. John knows what Kyle must do and how it will happen (which was rather implied in the original film, to my reading of it - why else would John give Kyle a photo of his mother?). John has appeared, reborn through the time bubble (he can no longer go back to “his” Sarah because he’s made a jump in a time bubble Sarah wasn’t in) to be the saviour of the human race.
T1, T2 and TSCC have a self-contained and consistent timeline from Sarah’s POV. For Kyle (and Derek, and Allison who will become Cameron - maybe John realised that as he looked at Allison petting the dog, watch his face) John is a messiah who popped out of the past (John never went thru Judgment Day - we know the TSCC timeline nuked T3, so it’s all good) into Kyle’s war with special knowledge that only John could have gathered from foreknowledge of Judgment Day via Sarah, T2 & TSCC.
Like so many others, I’m totally speechless. First off, this show is absolutely amazing! It’s unlike any show that’s ever hit network television, so everyone at FOX owes a huge debt of gratitude for the creators, writers, actors, directors and crew that made Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles become a huge part of millions of lives like mine. Even if it remains short-lived, which would really be a big disappointment, this show has thrilled me, moved me and touched me. I’m sure other viewers feel the same way, as you can clearly read here in these posts and many like it all over the online world.
Now, FOX, let me tell you why I’m just now writing this. You see, like millions of other Americans and those abroad, I was away last night performing and had to DVR this show just so I wouldn’t miss seeing what appears to be the last episode of this incredible series. Just like the countless millions of other would-be viewers who may have been at Church for Good Friday, out to dinner with family or out enjoying a head start on the weekend rather than being at home on a Friday night at 8PM. Do you ever kick yourself for making such a bad move to put this great show on at that time slot when there were clearly better choices?
No, you don’t. I honestly believe you did it that way knowing that viewership would fall off significantly. That means you owe some apologies, not only to fans of the show, but also to those who spent their advertising money with you. How do you explain to them that there were better options that could’ve given them more bang for their buck, FOX? How can you know that you have one of the best shows ever and decide instead to purposely decrease viewership? If you didn’t see it coming and are just now realizing your mistake why not make things right by giving all of us a Season 3 and putting it on a night like Wednesday? I believe you owe us that and there are likely millions more who believe the same. You owe us, now pay up. Please. It’s the right thing to do.
I’m a little puzzled about some of the fans’ reactions. There have been a number of complaints about JC not realizing the urgency of the situation, that Judgement Day is pending just around the corner, and he needs to “snap out of it” and get with the fight! Seriously!
And yet some of those same fans appear happy that he gave up the whole fight with his mother, and left her to chase the toaster, because “he loves Cammy”.
I’m scratching my head thinking, ‘what do these fans really want?’
Anyway, it made me laugh.
They gave the Jameronians some great moments in this finale. I’m not one of them. But I loved how they wrote the scenes. Very cool stuff.
Uhm no John Pate. Your theory presupposes that everything is in a continuous timeline, meaning everything that happens when people travel back in time is supposed to happen in the first place. That means that there is no point of sending any terminators into the past because they will always be destined to fail in changing the future and killing John. It also goes against the show’s no fate motif.
We know things DO change between timelines as Derek’s timeline is different from Jessie’s, for example. Therefore it is not all pre-destined. In the original movie Kyle is a lower-ranking officer than John, in the finale he was an officer and never even knew of John Connor. That makes no sense time and age wise.
And also, what about Weaver? Why would they ask her to join them on the sub if it is the same timeline as this one, meaning her and JH already joined them years before the mission?
this episode was amazing. to see derek and allison again… wow. hopefully though, this isn’t the end of cameron. i hope, if we get a 3rd season (please please please let us have that!), that this isn’t the end of Summer Glau playing Cameron. Maybe john will realize that allison for palmdale is lacking something his machine protector had. poor cameron. Although she has no human emotions, you get the feeling she understands sacrifice better than most people. i love this show!!!
Okay, here’s my take to all you faithful watchers of TSCC, like me, on the season (hopefully not the show’s) finale:
Cameron is an infiltrator. She did her job. She collected data about John Connor, his mother, how they think, how they act, how they move, everything about them, and gave that to the enemy. That was her job and she pulled it off superbly, unfortunately for John Connor. Now it’s up to him to lead knowing that everything about him is out there and now in the hands of the enemy.
FOX, how can you let this be it? I’m still in awe of how great this show is and watch S1 on DVD constantly while anxiously awaiting S2 on DVD and (if you really love the fans who support you) S3! PLEASE give us Season 3!!! We’ve gotta see how things turn out and don’t want T4 to be it. C’mon, FOX! Hook us up!!!
“Cameron is an infiltrator. She did her job. She collected data about John Connor, his mother, how they think, how they act, how they move, everything about them, and gave that to the enemy. That was her job and she pulled it off superbly, unfortunately for John Connor. Now it’s up to him to lead knowing that everything about him is out there and now in the hands of the enemy. ”
Or if she was an infiltrator she could have just killed him… about a million times.
Why are so many people obsessed about Cameron’s chip not being able to get through?
In the movies, Terminator 2 and 3, liquid metal cyborgs were able to travel through time intact. In addition, all the terminators have metal under the skin. And at the beginning of the season, Cromartie’s head came through.
Perhaps non-organic material just experiences greater stress (e.g. gets pulled apart). Its not a big deal.
Nobody’s commented much on the kill switch that Cameron made for John. Never surfaced at the end. He wasn’t even wearing it around his neck in the last episode. Maybe an old mystery/detective story trick–just a major red herring to throw off the viewers?
Awesome!!!!! Love the new direction for the show for season 3!!! Now I have to go back and watch the “Allison from Palmdale” episode again - questions, questions.
Great show - confusing ending. Sincerely hope FOX brings this back for a season 3. Would be lots to work with in the future, and lets Camerson (Allisen) act like a person. Lots of potential.
This was one of the bestest finales I’ve ever seen. I’m a huge TV series watcher and I’ve seen a lot of finales.
It would be a great disappointment if there’s not a season 3. I believe that FOX would give us at least 6 episodes so that they could end the whole story without any cliffhangers.
What Allergygal said; I can’t believe *anyone* could like this ep, let alone what appears to be a majority. Everything that was special about the show was tossed out the window. FFS, even the most basic premise of the franchise (without John Connor there is no resistance and Skynet wins) was tossed aside like so much dross.
T-100x are living. Living metal organisms. Skynet created a new life form and it turned on them.
Just like the endo-skeleton Terminators are learning to thrive without Skynet.
Skynet is in heap, big trouble.
—-
And as for Cameron… I will continue to say this as John’s reactions to her seem to play this out:
John loves Cameron and not Allison. They are not the same. They may look the same outwardly, but are completely different people.
Cameron is unique… Allison is just a plain vanilla human. She’s not his type. Riley was not his type either.
John Connor doesn’t see “metal” when he sees Cameron. He just sees someone he loves. He says mean and hurtful things to her to keep his feelings at bay, but it isn’t working.
John asks her why she doesn’t kill him when her base construct screams: terminate him! She doesn’t know the right answer yet, and must discover it for herself.
It’s because she loves him too. She has a heart.
Maybe in the first few Future episodes in Season 3 we find out that our little Allison Young is lesser in some ways than Cameron.
Irrespective of my little mini fan-fics, perhaps we find out she’s a gray. Now, wouldn’t that be something?
He could trust Cameron, a machine, but he shouldn’t trust Allison, a human. His love of Cameron was justified.
John and Cameron’s new body travel back to the past to save his true love. But guess who follows on their trail?
Allison Young… and she ain’t exactly there to “do good.”
What we just saw Fans of TSCC was not just a season finale, but a pilot of a new show. Alison and Kyle , with Derek, Weaver and John starting in the future next season. This is the new sell that so many of the crying arm chair quarterbacks wanted ! It will be Awesome.
Jalison who John really had love at first sight with, how can anyone deny that. It was a portrayal of Alison acting very human whose father sold tractors that caught the eye of one young John Connor. Its all about first impressions, go look up Love at first sight.
CW has no problem being shot a lot
CW killing WDG with electricity and not damaged itself
CW acting like a shield and no damage at all
CW moves through the time shield after all and no damage at all
No one in future knows John Connor
Sarah and John are separate (will we have parallel stories in the show now?)
JH in Cameron’s chip (is she actually JH?)
Did CW took the chip before departing?
What will happen in the season 3?
I bet 100% there will be season 3. After such a strong finale of season 2 they can’t cancel the show. All millions of viewers will not understand if they cancel. So there will be a season 3!
I will support TSCC as much as I can. I got DVDs for season 1 and I prroredered DVSs for season 2.
im kinda thinking of yesterday enterprise when the ship went through time and the ferderation was at war with the klingons. and teh ship wants to stay and fight and picard tells them another ship then will not help they need to go back and do there thing in the past.
That said i think they will use the boy from the military school that john saved as the resistance leader in this timeline. he will remeber john back up his story etc. the resistance will be losing the war prob because they are not using metal to help in there fight like john was. so they will help weaver and john get john henery/cameron chip or and complete that missiion then send john and them back..
only question is who is the tasha yar in this timeline that goes back allison or dereck or even maybe kyle since they are all dead in the other time line.
Wow! Here I am actually defending Josh Friedman from his #1 Fans! LOL!
I think this ending, if we are so fortunate to get a Season 3 somewhere, is one of those “Star Trek” twists.
John is thrown into The World of Oz and must get home again. He is now Dorothy in a weird and alternate realm.
He has to find John Henry to figure out how to get Cameron back… he sees what the Future could be like without him as a leader (harkening to “It’s A Wonderful Life” and he’s Jimmie Stewart’s character).
He must gain the Ruby or Silver Slippers and get back home to where he belongs… and with whom he belongs with… Cameron.
There’s no place like home, there’s no place like home.
Maybe in this story John Henry is the Wizard when John Connor needs to be the Wizard the world needs, and must correct this crazy and f–ked up Bizzaro Land.
Allison is Bizzaro Cameron, but not his real love. Derek is his Bizzaro Uncle, and Kyle Reese is his Bizzaro Father. But they aren’t the same people.
He realizes that by losing Cameron… he misses her and has lost everything he holds dear. He knows what he has truly lost: she’s his companion, his better half, if you will.
In an insane world, Cameron is the sanest choice.
And John has a golden opportunity to make an even better and tougher Cameron body and chip to house her soul… his “tight” gift to her. His gift of love.
Agreed. We need to make our voices heard so Fox makes the right decision and renews. We are at 500+ now and climbing. We need to keep up the pressure so hopefully this does not turn into a swan song.
Ironic that a series that returned to the theme of resurrection so faithfully would be cancelled with so many unanswered questions on the evening of Good Friday-art imitating life or the reverse-Like Frodo, Cameron lives…like our hope for a future worth fighting for. Exquisite choice for the final shot of Alison and the faithful German shephard…a precise nod to T1 and succinct statement “No metal here”.
Dan, the writers must be chuckling. “The Jameronians think the toaster really had a heart!” “We really had them going!”.
Yes they implied it, and yes that’s the way it should have been done. And yes that’s all you will see of it. The writers knew it best. In the future if there is one, it won’t be Cameron. It will be Allison. But of course the writers can take it anywhere they want.
How will Sarah’s story continue? I can see how some viewers are disappointed. But again, the writers can take it anywhere.
i don’t know what can i say about this drama !!! awesome!!!
but i really don’t want to see this drama just end like this , we still want to see the machine inside the deep sea, we want know more about the liquid metal . Who are they , where are they , when are they.
Still manythings we want to know about it!
come on! if sarah choronicles end’s here.
let’s begin with john connor choronicles!
Great episode. Reminds me of the Season 1 cliffhanger of ENTERPRISE, when Archer goes through the time portal into a destroyed earth of the future, and the End of Season 2 of BSG when the cylons invade New Caprica.
I was left thinking, “How are they going to get out o this one?” It would be great to see the show pick-up a few months where it left off, as John is moving up the ranks.
For all we know this is how John Connor is suppposed to be the resistance leader.
p.s. BTW whne john gave cameron the physical exam was both creepy and hot, mission accomplished.
BRING ON SEASON 3!!!!!! Screw the ratings don’t they know how many people Tivo or DVR this show? Now that BSG is over this is all I have left (NIP/TUCK is still good, LOST sux now)
@ Chris
All we can hope for is that the DVR numbers and the outpouring of support strike a chord with Fox because for some reason the masses don’t watch. As a matter of fact not even half of the masses watch! I come to these boards and see the amount of support and I know that I have friends that watch but do not blog, so I assume that the same goes for many of the people here and across the other TSCC blogs. That being said I am at a loss for logical reasoning for such low ratings when a show about a chef insulting other chefs destroys the ratings and another show about singing which has been the same every week for 8 years destroys the ratings. We’ve got to find another way people. Clearly television no longer embraces scripted dramas that have nothing to do with law or medicine.
I know some that read this may say what about 24 or Heroes but that just adds to the confusion because 24 had some pretty terrible middle seasons and Heroes lost its mission by the end of the first season. But what do they have in common? They are continuously renewed. WTF
“Btw, did anyone notice that TSCC introduced a new key phrase? The previous was: ‘Come with me if you want to live’. Now we have: ‘Will you join us?’.”
I’ll certainly try to work it into my everyday conversations.
Those were last years numbers mate….
THEY would have almost guaranteed us a third season!!
Man, only 3.6 millions……i can’t believe we didn’t reach the 4 millions….looks not too bright right now damnit!
Guys, seriously, do you really think that the show would get more viewers, IF FOX would put it on, let’s say wednesdays???
Because we really can let the show end for good now if the next season we’ll have the same struggle because of the ratings again!
I mean seriously, because a true fan forgets about going out on fridays for his favourite show…or go out one hour later…..that’s why my question.
What i still don’t understand though is, that the ratings of T:SCC on Mondays were fantastic compared to those of Fridays, so why did’nt the guys at FOX be able to predict that, since EVERY show on a Friday night has lower ratings than it would have on ANY other day of the week! Were they expecting a viewership boost?! SERIOUSLY?!?!?!
On this end I never counted. Hopefully John finds Cameron in the future again. I in it’s place would do that. Or Cameron finds John because she loved him.
Thanks for the great show. Thanks to all actors and naturally at Josh.
I can’t really back this possibility up in anyway or can think io how it happened, but perhaps her exposed eye was red and not blue because the Cameron that entered the police station, rescured Sarag and then gave her chip to JH was actually a DIFFERENT terminator model, an older model that just had Allison Youngs skin/appearance and the real cameron model is actually still in the present with Sarah? Just a thought because I don’t think the writers would just let the red eye/blue eye thing slip unintentionally…
Dear Fox, you have a reputation for not giving shows their proper maturation growth. Sci-fi fans are still bitter over the way you treated Firefly. Don’t make the same mistake with TSCC please.
The only thing that could change their minds now is tens of thousands of pre-ordered copies of season 2 DVD’s and blu rays and hundreds of thousands of e-mails.
I agree with you too but you have to admit this was a mind blowing homerun episode. I hope the mid-season failure won’t be the nail in the coffin that kills the series. Now more than ever I want another sbuy in eason. Keep writing and voting. I think Josh has learned his lesson and can see from what has been written here what works and what doesn’t. Again, hats off to everyone on the finale. It was phenominal.
Not at all what I expected. Honestly this whole season has been a little frusturating.
I love the show. I do want more. I do feel left out as this show does not have enough episodes, a lot of them need more action and it really need better defined plot paths. If this show was never expected to last why so much info to follow? oh well I am a huge fan but I don’t expected to be rewarded for it with more shows. I hope it Picks up in like sept or aug but….I have been disapointed by a lot of thing in my life. thank you cast and crew no matter what you have entertained me for 2 years at least and that is what this is all about. Sorry I didn’t buy a new dodge ram so you could keep funding for the show.
Thank you Josh, the writers, actors, and everyone involved for creating a masterpiece. I truly hope this amazing show gets renewed! Hope to see you for a season 3, but thank you again for the AMAZING amazing show.
Much Love,
Jared
I doubt anyone from production will read this far down but I wanted to say ,
-TO WHOEVER DOES COSTUMES-
that Weaver’s have been so beautiful. Everything she has worn has such beautiful lines and structures. I think it was really perfect for her character, I loved the stucture of how they compliment her rigidiy as a machine. Well Done! Someone was paying attention to your work and I wanted to tell you!
Ok side note i was starting to worry that if we did get a third season and that we would have to witness Allison’s death again and John being all broken up about it. and I so do not want that. So if we have to leave I’d rather leave here than there. cause I love Cameron/Allison as a character. In case you haven’t noticed : )
If I remember correctly, John took time travel only to get Cameron (well, her chip) back. He was clearly sad that her body didnt come through (too much damage on her skin), so maybe he will go back to 2009 when he gets her chip back.
ppl you cant continue doing it like its following two timelines: Sarah in past and John in the future. It just wont work. John shouldnt have anything to do in the future anyway, hes too young and he dont know anything what happened after JD.
I’m going to play World of Warcraft, cant fail that.
I am a believer ! . . . The show started out a curiousity for me. Thought the first two movies were fun . . . the third mostly forgettable. Most shows needs at least half to a whole season to “get their legs”. . . . then the writer’s strike hit. I just thought the show had great potential and thought the strike would doom them.
Second season for the most part was EXCELLENT . . . The last four episodes BRILLIANT !
If FOX does not renew . . . I will begin to build my own SkyNet and target them as my first target ! [Just kidding . . .] It would though ruin what has become one of the best moments of my week in front of the TV . . . the other is Life on NBC.
FOX - show some vision - - - stay the course . . . and make some good TV regardless of “what you think” the ratings are !
I mean am I the only retard here who is so lost right now?? I mean no one knows who John Connor is??
Will someone please explain to me what just happened??
I thought everyone knew who he is??
TSCC is a good show, one of the best out there. How has it come to this on the ratings!!! The move to Friday was a finishing move on this series. trying to be optimistic on the chance of a third series, but looking at these numbers it’s similar to sticking your head in a cannon. I don’t understand what the difference between cable and normal tv, as i don’t live in the Us. but if it can move to cable, and stay on that would be fantastic.
I know Dan, but that was such a cool part of the scene. Dekker is really good by the way. Also his expression when Derek died was so powerful. At least to me. And when he reflected on it later.
It’s all in good fun, Dan. I wanted to joke a little about the fans who were calling for John to “snap out of it!” and “fight the fight”, and then were happy to see him run off to chase the toaster. It just sounded so funny to me.
The writers had a lot of fun with the John/Cameron thing, and they did it very well. The scenes in this last episode were awesome. It was like the best for fans on both sides. Great writing and fiming. The show is so much fun.
This show has a lot to do, in my opinion, with the struggle for our own survival. We often find ourselves in conflict in this world, and who knows if we will survive ourselves. I think that the Terminator series is more then a show, it is art, art that shows us that even though we see almost no hope as human beings in the face of insurmountable odds, that we chose hope.
We choose hope rather then despair. I think that is what this show tells us, to fight on despite the terrible odds against us. To fight for peace and our humanity.
Terminators are nothing more to me then metaphors for the demons that face us down, we can let them destroy us, or we can fight them to the bitter end.
PLEASE DO NOT CANCEL THIS SHOW, GIVE US ONE MORE SEASON. HECK MOVE IT BACK TO TUESDAYS IF YOU WANT TO MAKE ROOM IN YOUR FRIDAY SLOT. DON”T GIVE UP ON HUMANITY.
Sales of the S2 DVD set and ticket sales for Salvation will be an accurate barometer of the prospects for S3. Warner would love to pay less for the show than it’s worth by throwing dismal Nielsens at the producers at contract time. Buy low, sell high. Warner ain’t stupid.
As for the numbers, what did they expect putting the finale on Good Friday. People have other commitments. I hope they’re smart enough to realize that. Or, maybe they’ve been setting TSCC up to fail. There have been many failures in strategy(time slot) and execution(writing and pace). but maybe TSCC can rise from the ashes if DVD sales go up significantly and they get enough letters. I wasn’t going to buy the DVD’s but after last night I’ve changed my mind.
what happened to “what are the things that i promised the audience” at the start?
where’s all this “things being revealed”?
i stated the episode off feeling “how the hell are they going to wrap up things in just one hour”?
the final commercial break ends,we go into the last segment of the show and i’m thinking “this is going to be sooo good,they are going to squeeze all the answers in at the last second”,and it just ended!!!!!!!!
NO ANSWERS
NO RESOLUTION
NO END OF ONE CHAPTER,START OF ANOTHER
F’N NOTHING,the story just stops being told.
i’ve had it with empty promises,if/when season three starts i’ll be re-watching episodes of lost.that way i know i’ll be investing my time into something that’ll pay off,and i wont feel this empty,discarded feeling i have from this giant waste of my time.
and if i really didnt care about this show i wouldnt feel so strongly,wouldnt have watched the entire run “live”,and then over and over at the fox site.
wtf,man?i thought we were friends.i’m serious.that was a fucked up thing to do.
You want to hear the most bizarre thing? I just found myself hoping that this was the last episode of TSCC. Why? Because I have never loved a television show so much. It’s a bit overwhelming to be so attached to a series.
That scene with Derek, Kyle, and Allison just kills me.
I would just like to say that.. cough.. as a torrent user.. TSCC has some of the highest number of downloads every week. 24 blows everything out of the water wither 200k completed downloads every week. But even so, TSCC is the highest downloaded program on Friday nights 91k with another 15k pending, destroying Ghost Whisper with 13k; even Dollhouse gets 30k less downloads (though you owe Josh better treatment than Firefly). The biggest mistake is.. two of the main cast are young actors; girls that might be attacted to John are already being picked up by their boyfriends by the time the show airs.. and while guys love Summer, they also aren’t going to admit to their other guy friends that they don’t want to go out yet til TSCC is over.
Snake,
Ambiguity is designed into the series to spur interest. Interest hypes sales of the movie which will also be ambiguous. If you understand everything that’s going on in the movie, you won’t buy another ticket to see it again. Warner ain’t stupid.
What I don’t understand is…John is not going back to the present without another time machine..which skynet controls all atm in the future. Which means he’s stuck there..does he have the picture of Sarah to give to Reese with him? He has to right?
my girlfriend loathes any form of sci-fi,and when i heard that this was a going to be a tv series i made her watch the first two movies knowing that this was going to be regular watching here at our house.she got pretty into it,we had much fun watching this.
the finale ends last night and she just went off to do something.
didnt say a word to me.
didnt look at me.
The way I saw it, Cameron has been some kind of sinister all along (or at least her “bad side” finally broke free when she got to the basement). After all, we know she’s been lying to the Connors and keeping secrets from them. Plus, she outright refused to join Weaver and John Henry even though she knew they were trying to stop skynet. Her damaged body couldn’t go through time, so she hijacked the JH/Cromartie body by putting her own chip in it, leaving what’s left of John Henry behind with her body. Since Murch said John Henry’s hardware and software were so closely linked, her actions have crippled the John Henry ai, and now she’s off to a future where she assumes there will be no john henry or john connor to help the resistance.
This next bit is wild speculation, but maybe JH might pull through and adapt to the Cameron body, which is why the future John we used to hear about appeared to trust “Cameron” so much?
In short, I see no reason to assume that Cameron is the “good guy.” “Sometimes they go bad,” right?
I’ll be the first in line for the DVD set.
A. Because I’m so caught up in the thing.
B. Because that’s the only way I’ll ever see the freaking “Allison from Palmdale” ep that I missed!
Liz: that all sounds like wild speculation. If Cameron were a bad Terminator she would have carried out her directive to terminate JC as soon as she got close to him. It’s not like they’ve been formulating world changing plans to stop skynet that need to be spied on. The Connors were just stumbling through the motions without much focus. Cameron is definitely not a bad T.
Question:
==========
How come Cameron knows who is JH and JH knows who is Cameron?
Note
====
JH is definitely downloaded himself to Cameron’s chip. It logically comes from JH’s thoughts about human brain + downloading from it after death + CW’s&JH’s talks about chips.
this happened with dark angel and they at least gave us a few novels to wrap things up as a sort of “thanks for the support”.
the creators had more than an inkling that this was going to be the end of the road.
i’ll be keeping one eye on the blog to find out when/where they plan to give us the pay-off.
John Henry and Cameron are working for the same team. JH had to escape, so Cameron switched places with him, so he could.
She’s stuck in the mainframe and John Henry could get loose from his umbilical cord.
They swapped “bodies.” John Henry downloaded onto Cam’s chip and Cam went into the server that houses The Turk.
Cameron didn’t say anything to John about her connection to JH and Weaver, so she was sorry… and tried to clue him in that she’s still there and alive.
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
John Connor off to a future that had no John Connor until he arrived. Cameron and John Henry merged together on a single chip. Kyle, Derek and Allison alive again (and probably Riley and Jesse and Andy too). Sarah, Ellison and Savannah left in the past. What becomes of them? Pity we didn’t hear a final voice over by Sarah. What would she have said?
But that isn’t the basic premise of the show. “Without John, there is no Resistance” has NEVER been implied in any of the films (this is a common misunderstanding I’m seeing crop up everywhere, and it’s frustrating). Kyle Reese tells Sarah that John LEADS the Resistance to victory. Starting out as a simple soldier among the masses doesn’t contradict this in anyway. Terminator Salvation is taking the selfsame approach. What’s special about John will make him stand out among the others, make others “follow him all over hell”. But he never single-handedly FORMS it. That’s not just an unlikely notion, it’s ridiculous. People will always group together and fight back; they don’t need to be told to. But in order to win, they need to be led.
@Dan: I don’t know about this Cameron in the server farm thing…
Don’t you think that she would have somehow interacted with John in the basement? I mean it was just “I’m sorry John” and that looks to me like just a message.
Besides that, I agree with somebody else on here who said that John is a computerkid and he would have figured it out instantly. He obviously wanted Cameron back and because of this left Sarah and went to the future with Weaver. I don’t think the writers would mislead the John character in that way.
Here’s a question–how could future John give Kyle a picture of Sarah Connor, which he has in the first Terminator movie, given this ending? There has to be more to the story.
That was the perfect SEASON finale. Bear McCreary’s music gets every hair on your body to tingle with emotion. Thanks everyone for a wonderful, thought-provoking season. WE NEED MORE !!!!!
This show is the best and i cant believe that fox is going to cancel it. i say REBEL. boycott fox until the announce the third season is coming out. we will not go down without a fight!!
Thanks to all the creative staff; specially to the writers, because their imagination is so great that creates everlasting characters and so complex that needs only five minutes to solve all the conflicts and give us peace.
Thanks so much to the actresses and actors; your magnificent performance fogs our reason and allows us to love unreal characters.
And to James Cameron and Harlan Ellison, thank you so much.
i really liked the finale, definatly a quality episode.
i watched it a couple times– kinda looking for a clue as of whats gonna happen next.
honestly im not sure what is.
johns only 16ish, he cant exactly lead an army…
but allisons there and im wicked interested in hers/camerons character !!!
p.s. josh– i really like your writing style
thommas dekker and summer glauuuu omg theyre so good at life and id love to see them in the next season!!! CAN THERE BE A NEXT SEASON!?!? pleaseeee : )
Actually, I think that Cameron is not “Alive” anymore. I think that that was a recorded message that she put there so as to apoligize to John.
John Henry obviously destroyed all the data in Cameron’s chip and downloaded his onformation into it. This was so he would be able to travel back in time.
However, as perfect as this episode was, I have one small complaint: WHERE WAS THE CRATER IN THE BASEMENT FLOOR WHERE JOHN HENRY WENT BACK IN TIME??????
@ Fox,
You are free to cancel this show. I will not make any attempt to stop you, but keep in mind that I have lots of plastic.
@Cam in the server farm: I think she’s not in the servers, and the message is just a loop. There are lots of messages being passed in this episode and this is one of them. Sarah to priest, priest to Chola, Cam to Chola, Chola to Sarah, Weaver to Sarah, Weaver to Cam via Ellison, Sarah’s final message to John that she loves him. (Odd that there was no message to Savannah from Weaver.) None of these are coincident in time/space–all involve a go-between medium and a time delay. Cam to John on screen seems like this to me.
Cameron just got into the server. She didn’t know anything about how to work the controls, so she flashed up a quick message just as The Turk first did before it got a body.
They have to leave it flexible for a Season 3.
If Cameron won’t be back or is the bad guy… I think JF knows Season 3 won’t last long.
I think Summer doesn’t want to be or stay Allison. She signed up to play Cameron and seemed to love playing the roll.
Cameron is complex and Allison is too easy from an acting stand point.
Wow, great finale for season 2. I’m really hoping that this isn’t the end. Season 2 had a few low episodes, but there were reasons for that… the writers have proven that they have a lot left to tell in this story, and with the opening of the new Terminator movie soon, I really think Fox ought to give Season 3 a chance to reap the riches from the new interest that the movie will generate.
Of course, ratings equal advertising revenue, and it seems that on the surface, Season 2 brought in lackluster ratings, but I hope Fox can understand that the demographic being targetted by this show is the same demographic that is more inclined to watch via other methods than through a cable box. It’s unfortunate that Fox can’t open up their webcasted episodes to those outside of the United States; there must be great potential for ad revenue from the international fan base for this show.
Dan,
If you were a T:SCC character you’d be the kitten hanging on tight.
Great reCaptcha, for once: many remedy. Cam will be fine. Can’t say that much for those who will cross her path though: the red eye wasn’t there for no reason.
What about the message “I’M IN HERE JOHN” if she was, which she WAS NOT. She is still IN THE CHIP with JH. How that has changed her is just a great story for season 3.
PS. Didn’t Camron have a spare chip that Sarah ended up destroying when she discovered it? Maybe she wanted to repair it and give it to JH, but because
Sarah destroyed it she had to give her own.
After seeing the finale just now (yeah thats what you get for living in EU) s3 seems even more unlikely to me
John being friends with JH and Weaver and trying to earn leadership among the resistance?
Sarah and Ellison raising Savannah up and fighting to delay the jday? (Im sure Savannah would’ve been someone important in the future)
Would this be any interesting?
Dont get me wrong I really liked the finale but it only seems like nice wrap up of the series. I dont really think theres nothing that exciting left in it, even tho they opened new questions for possible s3.
If you got to choose to remember the show for its amazing last few episodes in s2 or a crappy s3 what would that be?
Oh and if Sarah had made it to jday with her knowledge she would’ve ranked up in resistance fast, maybe even becoming a leader. She also would’ve told other ppl about John possibly being out there (although she didnt know which point of time was John going to end up in).
BUT
neither Derek or Kyle heard about John Connor so most likely Sarah didnt even make it to jday.
And last thing - if Derek didnt kill Jesse there are now 2 of them (as long as both made it throught jday) ._o
One’s older 30(?) years than the other, but still….
sNaKeBiTe: I agree as well. The display was only a message. We have to assume that Cams processor speed is beyond our understanding so she would have understood the system architecture of the Turk in microseconds and could have communicated if she had been there. She is still alive and well on her chip bet JH’s essence is also there as well so he could escape to the future.
From Recap: “Allison Young. The real human fighter Cameron the machine was modeled after. John can’t help but smile, before realizing the complicated nature of his new life… his new beginning… ”
ARRRGG!! How about realizing Allison IS NOT Cameron?!?! Obviously his future now is going to be something out of the world, but lets re-examine something. If John didn’t give a rat about Cameron, he wouldn’t of put her chip back in at the start of the season. If John didn’t care about Cameron, he would never have apologized to her as he did a couple times throughout the season. If John didn’t care about Cameron, he would not have lied for her and stuck up for her to his mother. And most of all, MOST OF ALL, if he didn’t care, he wouldn’t of jumped through time with a terminator he just met just to get her/her chip back. So why do you phrase it as such? It just..hurts the way thats put. You can say John doesn’t care, there is no bond between him and Cameron, etc etc, but this episode if no other example before it demonstrated just how much Cameron is worth to him and how much she means to him. So please….don’t put it in such a way as though it doesn’t exist when it blatantly for all the world to see that it does exist something between them.
There, I’m done about that. Just watched the episode again. Must say seeing it on my computer I notice things a heck of a lot more than I do on my T.V. I noticed John’s fallen face when he realizes Allison is not Cameron. I would of rather it had been more apparent, like a tear rolling down his cheek or something. Nonetheless, while the episode at the same time is very sad and has me all choked up and wanting to cry (I’m a guy…and I wanna cry over this…odd I know) , I am happy with it. Very happy with it. Because, in just a short bit, we saw just how much John feels for Cameron. If the writers see this, if I can’t beg you to bring Cameron & John back, then I beg you with all of my heart that somehow Cameron, wherever and whatever she is in, finds out that John came after her, straight into Hell (After J-Day), for her.
There is another possibility for why Derek didn’t acknowledge JC when they met. Being a soldier, he has just met up with a guy claiming the name of his leader. He may have been feigning a lack of knowledge until he had time to interrogate the new guy and figure out what he’s up to.
Exactly, they have to leave it flexible. That’s why I think Cameron and JH somehow jumped to the future together in JH’s body (Don’t ask me how, or why for that matter). If Cam would be in the server farm that would almost certainly be her death, because the Zeiracorp building (including the basement and Cameron) will be destroyed by Kalibra or maybe even a self detonation device (They can’t take the risk of letting a Timemachine, or even Cameron fall into the hands of Kalibra). The only way out of that situation would be, if John and JH would jump back through time right to the moment where he and Weaver just left and with a spare chip in their pocket. Possible, but unlikely…
If however JH and Cameron are alive together in the future (somehow, on 2 chips, maybe on one, whatever) the possibilities to bring her back would be redundant. Of course there is also the possibility that Josh Friedman hates Cameron, let’s her die and thinks that the fans will be happy, because they would still have their weekly dose of Summer Glau in form of Allison… Which would suck…
I also don’t think that Cameron wouldn’t be able to control the servers. In Vick’s Chip they planted her into the traffic system of a whole city and she was able to kill it in seconds. When the Turk only had control over the screens he was “just” a little Turk. Far from being a fully operational, self aware AI, like Cameron is.
Well, it sure looks like all that will be pure speculation. Things are not looking good. I can only say: No, FOX you can’t do this. You’re not doing the right thing, this is not the right thing FOX. Things are good now!
It’s possible that Cameron was the “other” leader against Skynet, but needed John Henry’s platform in this next time line to become even more than what she was?
Will Cameron now get a hankering for playing Dungeons and Dragons rather than chess?
Maybe John, once he finds John Henry, will have to find a way to separate the two entities (if Cam is still in there with The Turk’s programming).
Maybe a little of each unique personality rubs off on each other. John Henry gains from what he gleaned from Cameron’s experiences and she gains from his? John Henry sees, from Cameron’s love of John, a better outlook. And Cameron gains more curiosity and childlike wonder from John Henry? They’re both “softened” around the edges.
They both morph into much better AI’s than ever before?
And John downloads Cameron’s consciousness into a brand new and advanced shell.
This was a very beautiful episode. Many thanks to all those involved for treating the material with such care. I know Josh said that this was written as a season finale and not a series finale but if this is the end (and for the record I hope that it is not) it feels good.
I like the idea of setting John up in the future with Allison, Derek and Kyle but Sarah and Ellison in the past/present just makes me feel bored. I want her to stay in the show (she’s in the title!) but Ellison needs a swift kick of character (re)development to keep me interested.
That would be a swift kick in the teeth to Cameron as a character.
@Shadower Darkslayer,
I like what you said. Why did John go out of his way to save Cameron and stick up for her all these times, only to dump her for Allison just because they look the same?
Why did he look disappointed that Allison was not Cameron, if not to say that he loves Cam and not her human doppelganger?
And the RCN? “Adios Growth.”
Yes, that’s right, the RCN wants Cameron to grow and still be around with John.
Loved the finale but I think FOX is NUTS if it cancels a great show like this when they have decided to play switcharoo on the night fans were used to watching it.
Why don’t they put some of those American Idol’s on Friday nights and move TSCC back to it’s regular night and see what happens.
There are too many good shows getting the ax for “Reality” tv.
Terminator is one of the best shows on TV with it’s wonderfully vivid world. To make a show look so much like a movie is great. I just hope they give TSCC and even another of my favorites Fringe more seasons.
@Lauren: Yeah, this thing with Sarah and Ellison staying in the past bothered me too.
I don’t get the last scene where this electric arc is and then we hear Sarah say “I love you, too”. Do you think she might have jumped to the future too? Maybe someone from the future, that we didn’t meet, told her to do so. Because I think that room in the last scene was the same where John and Weaver appeared, wasn’t it? How else could we hear Sarah’s voice there? I just don’t get it…. Somebody got a clue?
Am I reading this right…TSCC has been canceled for over a month and the sets have been torn down???? Ya know, being that there is so much ‘garbage’ on TV (and has been for years), It is nauseating to me that a well written, dynamic show such as TSCC doesn’t draw enough viewers to make the ratings people happy (is this going to be another Star Trek situation, where people realize how great a show like this is AFTER it has been canceled). I hope I am hearing wrong and that there will be a 3rd season, but if TSCC is canceled, then it will just re-enforce my view that TV overall is going down the tubes quicker than anyone thought……
Also i don’t think Cameron betrayed John. She probably had a set of orders from future John, and helping JH and Weaver might have been one of them. The whole thing may have been top secret just like on the Jimmy Carter, and that’s why she was hiding AI parts and doing research in the library, for JH’s eventual development. Now i’m not saying she imagined JH would end up in Cromartie’s body, ’cause she didn’t, but this would explain Jessie’s distrust for future John: John believes machines should fight machines. When Cameron heard Weaver’s message she went to carry out future John’s orders to help JH give them a fighting chance in the future.
-the evil T being destroyed by Weaver without any good fight.
-3 (was it 3?) episodes wasted for 3 dots just to have Sarah go like ‘OMG I TOLD YA DERE WAS SMTHIN ABOUT DOSE DOTS LOL!’ after she saw the turk
-drone crashing into Weavers office - I guess they put the scene there just to remind us about the whole drone thing, which again had 2(?) episodes wasted for and was completly irrelevant to the plot.
They could’ve had the evil T come inside the office at this point and show a good duel between him and Weaver instead of killing him earlier
They wasted a good part of the whole series on plots just to end them like they never where there.
Chloe O’Brian
your questions are valid, however, to someone who’s a “die hard” fan, who’s seen every episode from day one and who follows carefully, without losing focus for one reason or another, your questions simply can be answered if you had followed the story episode by episode.
I wonder, did John and the human Cameron fall in love in the future when she was running with her father Kyle Reese? and when she was kiiled as a human, perhaps they turned her into a Terminator Cyborg to be by John’s side to protect him. Perhaps?
I think, Weaver is an alien and basically humans have evolved so much in the future they create computers that can think for themselves and recreate themselves, or something. And the Aliens who Weaver works with want to destroy them for some reason, maybe they fear the earth made Cyborgs will conquer them?
Well, we now need a SEASON 3. And I have to say this, if Lena says no, you can still do a Season 3, kill Sarah Connor with cancer, and do “THE JOHN CONNOR CHRONICLES.” Yup. Sure it can be done. Tie it in with SALVATION, after you have carefully watched the film and taken notes… Oh, and by the way, kill Cameron/Allison, at least by the end of Season 3 if you can, I know there’s a lot of those fans of her, but really what other purpose does she serve now? A pointless TV-love interest? Come on. It can mean as much as Derek’s death, and Charley’s death. So can SARAH’s if you have to do that. The only character that can’t die is JOHN CONNOR. And please do not ever think of replacing Dekker for the role, he is perfect, and I don’t want to see any more new Connors besides him and Bale…
Weaver killing the terminator in the garage with such ease was great, it really showed us how powerful she really is. Great episode, very few shows reach this level of awesomeness!
TSCC has over 100k MORE completed torrent downloads than Ghost Whisper. Maybe if Fox understood what type of audience they had and how to reach them.. but no, we are stuck with moronic ‘leaders of the network’. Why does Fox enjoy their role, and being the running joke, about how they cancel good shows so much? Is that what they really want to be known so well for?
Shenanigans Padunkadunk, what in the world are you talking about?? First you tell someone they’re not following the plot, and then you say John created Cameron to replace his love Alison when we already know SkyNet created Cameron to infiltrate the Resistance HQ as Alison.
Why is it that we have people question all the story arcs in post after post and then try to cram their robot love fantasies down our throats. Give it a rest already. Can’t John be on a mission , much like Cameron was without you insisting again and again Every look and glance is an exchange of love? I am pretty sure that in the episode Cameron confessed that she will always want to kill John. Deep down inside.
If you read official information by James Cameron, the T-100x liquid “metals” are living organisms and were too advanced for Skynet to control properly.
No aliens, just Skynet making too many damn singularities and that leads to its downfall.
And I think John IMHO isn’t going to fall for Allison. He wants Cameron, and I think he’s going to find with Allison that:
“Humans will disappoint you.”
I’d either make Allison someone who shows that Cameron is indeed special and she realizes that deep down John doesn’t love her, but loves Cameron or…
Turn this New Time Line Allison into a Gray or one of Jesse’s anti-metal crusaders. I think Jesse is still very much alive and kicking. An older Jesse pulling more evil strings, and the one we’ve always known.
What better way for her to try to subvert John’s love for Cameron, but with the very human that Cameron replaced? And like with Riley, this plot doesn’t work either.
Maybe once Cameron is separated from JH and put into a brand new, advanced body there is a final “confrontation” between Allison and Cameron Mark II.
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot. Where the hell did you come up with the alien theory from anything that has anything to do with the Terminator franchise. THIS IS NOT ABOUT ALIENS!!
@nutty: There is no way you can deny the emotional connection between JC and Cameron. You have to be blind, and deaf, to miss the myriad of references to it. Only a toaster could make such a mistake.
Why is it that we have people question all the story arcs in post after post and then try to cram their robot love fantasies down our throats. Give it a rest already. Can’t John be on a mission , much like Cameron was without you insisting again and again Every look and glance is an exchange of love? I am pretty sure that in the episode Cameron confessed that she will always want to kill John. Deep down inside.”
Because there are a lot of disturbed people out there.
I mean am I the only retard here who is so lost right now?? I mean no one knows who John Connor is??
Will someone please explain to me what just happened??
I thought everyone knew who he is??
John Connor time traveled over J-Day, he has just arrived. Nobody knows him because he just got there. This is before the resistance is organized. There may be a resistance, probably pockets of resistance here and there, not a world wide organized resistance, mostly tunnel rats trying to stay away from the metal. If Kyle was captured in 2015, he would have been about 11 or 12, and then escaped in 2021. Alison was born ~2007-2008 so she would be a young teenager in 2021. I’m assuming John arrived at or after 2021, at least sometime before 2027 and skipped J-Day and his time in a Skynet work camp. Now he can start organizing the resistance and taking the fight to Skynet. That will make him famous.
How come Cameron knows who is JH and JH knows who is Cameron?
Cameron knows who JH is because he is the one who sent the box to JC in the future. JH knows who she is because he’s been watching her since the attack on Savannah Weaver and CW probably filled him in a little, also.
I was loving this episode sooo much up until the point when I realized Cameron is probably gone. Even if they bring it back for S3 I really doubt we’ll ever see Cameron because I doubt Summer will want to play the part of her, as well as Allison.
Born To Run was awesome.
I loved that check my nuclear power plant for leaks scene. Awkward but it got you thinking.
As for Dereck coming back that was a nice surprise.
I had been assuming there was more to that red head than met the eyes given that she kept the child alive. Now to find out that she may not have killed her human counterpart, is trying to help john is just more than I imagined.
Derek is back, Cameron is back, John is “trapped” in a future where he does not exist yet (never did?) and the T-3000 is good, thats just awesome.
I still can’t get over the fact that John jumped through time to save Cameron. Just a beautiful moment!!
I think that’s what makes this show unique in that there is a potential cyborg/human relationship. And if there is a faction of machines willing to work with humans why not a cyborg/human couple. Plus this show makes you think and that ship would really make me think!!! Its not sick…its good, no great sci-fi!!!
And lets face it as a couple John and Cameron already would have a hard enough time trying to be together…and that’s what makes it interesting. So go for it!!! Yeah Jameron.
We better get a season 3 and I think John would only be in the future a handful of eps. He sees what J-day is all about. I think John will find it interesting to know Alison, to know about her (this makes it that Cameron does not have to explain who Alison is) When John hears her name he will put two and two together, but in the end she is not Cameron.
And when he goes back to his own time Alison would be a baby. Cameron, once her chip is back in her head would be Cameron.
And we know we need a terminator in the main cast so Cameron will be back!
But I wouldn’t mind a scene where Cameron and Alison would interact with each other!!!
And lets face it he jumps through time to save Cameron, not Alison!
I have also noticed that Cameron is referred to as Sarah’s daughter a number of times…now we just have to add that ‘in law’ to the end sentence!!
I love that we go back to so many things in season 1. The fact that Cameron wrote John a note.
I think once Cameron gets that confirmation who Weaver is she sets things in motion. I actually am starting to think Cameron’s power source was damaged. That is was not suppose to feel cold. Because once John checks (after the greatest scene ever) Cameron breaks Sarah out of jail and heads to Weavers.
By giving her chip to JH (I think Cam’s chip is in his head) doesn’t a T888 have a number of ports. I think she knew her body was destroyed and need to go to the future to get a new one! And maybe get that skynet programming out of her chip that wants to kill John.
And think about it this way if Cameron gets a endo then she has to learn its new quirks. I don’t want to see her turned into a liquid terminator but something stronger. New body, same chip. Cameron back in action!!
Hmmm could John take Derek with him to the past? I mean this would be a Derek who is different. One who does not worship JC.
And LOL to Mr. Murch!!
To repeat what Dan said Alison is not Cameron.
Just think of them as twins. Sure they look alike, might have some similarities but they are two different people.
And it looks like the silent girl (who’s name I can not remember at the moment) took over the family business.
LOL yes ground JC!!!
“John is thrown into The World of Oz and must get home again. He is now Dorothy in a weird and alternate realm.”
LOL Sorry Dan but I just pictured John in red ruby slippers there for a second. Sorry.
Yea all i have to say is, if this series cancellation is true, some people at fox are gonna have their hands full of shit when the fans of this show turn their cars over and set fire to them with them inside it… WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU CANCEL THIS SHOW! and if you say some bull about how it doesnt compete with ghost whisperer, then you are an idiot… they said the same thing about stargate SG-1, at how it wouldnt last 1 season, then they said it wouldnt last 2, then they got up to 8 and they said no it wouldnt last, and it made it to the 10th season… and look, now its the ultimate sci-fi show of all time besides star trek franchise. GIVE THIS SHOW A CHANCE, after the next season it will catch on alot more… dont let this be another firefly !
Just saw that TTSCC was completly downloaded 105075 times in the last 18h 22m . + 8K downloads in HD.
If all just paid 2 USD we could get the show like forever. Really don’t understand why no channel has made a international online “network” with just a few shows people paid to watch. It could totally work.
Sorry Jameron fans-a cold and ambiguous diagnostic is as close as the writers came to fulfilling your secret desires. If you redirect your sublimated passion toward a major appliance, you’ll find the experience ( I imagine) electrifying but unrequited. Come on…the Alison Young compromise is the only kosher solution, hence the German puppy seal of approval. Keep that taboo implicit-despite the hints in Vic’s Chip.
Logan-for some of us the end (possibly) of a series-for others the end of a way of life…what captive audience will DH control with his flights of musical fancy and impossibly suggestive Cameron scenarios?-Bon Chance-the future awaits.
Without a series, we’ll all have to stop meeting like this. I’ll miss it even when we disagree…substantially.
He has to hide from Skynet (who knows who he is) to get into the Terminator manufacturing plant, so he can rustle up a new and better body for Cameron… by dressing up as a lady! LOL!
I really have to say the 2nd season was simply amazing. (I liked the 1st season too, but it lacked a lot of dynamics and plot twists and building that make the 2nd season) There is so much ground work for a 3rd to be spectacular, I don’t see how fox could possibly pass it up, especially with the movies about to launch which will be block busters.
I have to say the 2nd season has been the best thing I have watched in a long time.
AMAZING ENDING! AND WHAT A CLIFFHANGER!!! Hopefully u guys get a 3rd season. If not then please tell us what you were planning on doing for the 3rd season or where u were going with this.
I don’t understand why all the hostility to a JC/Cameron relationship. This isn’t the first time this has been explored in the Sci-Fi realm. If you’ll remember Brent Spinner had a few go rounds with a human counterpart as Data and there was an implied relationship with Mr. Universe in Serenity. And let’s not forget the Sci-Fi classic Cherry 2000.LOL
And the music at the end was beautiful with John seeing Derek again, Kyle for the first time then thinking he’s found Cameron, instead seeing her human double. Very moving piece of music.
I don’t know, doesn’t make sense. Her task is to protect John, not to fight Skynet, judgement day is inevitable and one other thing is Cameron loves John, she wouldn’t leave him behind… Robots wants to survive, by removing her chip, she is no longer alive…
>> So he could download himself to it and travel into the future to fight Skynet.
SEND A SEASON 1 & 2 DVD TO ALL YOUR BSG FRIENDS! LET’S RECRUIT THEM!
This episode alone leaps beyond everything that has come before in this show so far! [BSG SPOILER ALERT]
It is better than what they did in Season 3 of BSG.
What an uber-sick-awesome-kick-@ss mind frak! I literally gripped the side of my head with my two hands in a vice grip, going, “What the frak just happened?!!! I LOVE THIS SHOW!”
Frakkin’ Cameron how could you? And who is the one saying, “I’m sorry, John”? It has to be John Henry who now either has no body or has Cameron’s body. Sorry for not being able to stop Cameron.
So many questions: Why/When did Cameron turn against John Connor? And I guess the T1001 in the “Jimmy Carter” ep did finally decide to “join us.” It is now Catherine Weaver. But Cameron defected against the humans? OMG. So crazyily awesome!
THERE IS HOPE YET!
1. This means TSCC could exist as part of the same timeline as “Salvation”
which means it won’t be regarded as “non-canon” and therefore ignored by other T fans.
2. Derek is back!
3. BAG’s casting rumors don’t confirm the death of TSCC.
4. The sets being torn down at WB do not confirm the death of TSCC.
(Of course they had to tear the sets down: to make room for season 3 which takes place in the future!)
And now that John is w/ Allison we can have a real ’ship w/o the “ick” factor. Awesomeness!
OH MY FRAKKIN’ GODS THIS IS THE BEST FRAKKING SHOW ON EARTH!
I am standing and clapping and crying and screaming and in awe of the amazing SEASON finale of TSCC. Congratulations to the entire cast and crew for such an awesome product. I will buy this show on DVD and Bluray, and probably download it to my iPod as well. If it appears on another network, or at another day and time, I will follow it (It’s what he does, it’s all he does.) I hope that the “wizards of smart” at Fox will evaluate this show on its real impact, rather than the numbers which indicate how many mind numbed robots sat for an hour in front of the boob tube drooling at commercial breaks between schlock celebrities dancing and singing, or “reality” twaddle. The fifty year old model of television ratings is dead, and smart advertisers know it. Product placement and cross promotion, internet buzz, web downloads and DVD sales are where the real value of a TV production should be measured. With movies it’s easy to see what works - How many tickets did you sell? The screen writers and actors guilds are certainly aware of the new reality - their new contracts are very specific about being compensated for digital media distribution and (dare I say it) THE FUTURE of content distribution and marketing. As for those of us that DVR our favorite TV shows, I think it is foolish to expect us to watch the commercials when we have the ability to skip them. Besides, even though I DVR the show, it is only so I can watch it again after it initially airs. Does any reasonable person expect me to watch the damned commercials again? Note to the”wizards of smart”: I watch TV for the programs - not the frigging commercials. It’s time you buried Granddads Madison avenue advertising scheme for TV, and got plugged into the future, or your audiences (and revenue streams) will die off with your model. Wake up you Morons!
Keep TSCC and its hip fan base (which is growing, due to fans like me who have bought S1 DVDs for friends to get them hooked).
Thank you, thank you. This episode was brilliant. That was the show I love, and have watched and loved since the pilot. Every episode. This show, its writing, acting, and mythology are so strong I’d like to believe FOX couldn’t consider canceling it. So that’s what I will stubbornly keep believing because I don’t want to think that I might never know how the rest of this story goes.
This was a great episode, just maybe not a great season finale. The writing was very good. The pacing was pretty fast, compared to what I had become used to, it was a marathon of info to keep track of. I had to watch it a few times to even know what to feel. The complications are endless, and the mind will be spinning on that for a good while.
That said, I wish they would have wrapped up the lingering questions a little better. Overall well done guys.
I always wanted season 3, a few episodes led me to question that, but with the mind games that were unleashed in this episode now I’m back to wanting season 3 like no other. Bring it on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hope I don’t repeat, too many posts to know for sure. It would be interesting to see
the two time lines play out in season 3. Sarah, and Ellison cleaning up the Zeria corp mess and going after the Coliba corp, While John Connor sorts out the future
scenario.
Looks like Cameron/Alison finally found the dog from “Run Joe Run” I always wondered what happened to it. Yuck Yuck… That’s a throw back
The real meaning of the three dots? Season 3? Keep the 3 red lights lit up!!!!!!!
“Frakkin’ Cameron how could you? And who is the one saying, “I’m sorry, John”? It has to be John Henry who now either has no body or has Cameron’s body. Sorry for not being able to stop Cameron.”
For the love of God man… you are worse than the guy who talked about aliens. I don’t know what show you were watching. Cameron didn’t betray, she obeyed top secret orders from future John, the same kind of top secret orders that weren’t carried out on the Jimmy Carter Submarine. Her mission along with protecting John most have been bringing JH into the future to give them a fighting chance. This would explain why she was collecting remnants of old T’s and why people in the future like Jessie distrust John: he believes machines should be fighting machines!
Amazing amazing amazing. I want ten more years. The acting is the highest quality on TV and the story equally as awesome. This show is the best because the emotions built around and for the characters are unreal. I felt John’s happiness when he saw Cameron and his father. I can’t wait until the next season begins.
This was a great episode, and it would make a lot more sense if there was no T3, with an older John Pre-Judgment Day, where he starts to step up to the plate. This ending seems like it would be a perfect transition into Salvation but without another season, a lot of things won’t add up with the third movie. We need at least one more season to clear some things up!!!
How do y’all think they could tie that in (if we are blessed with season 3?
@Kyle - largely for the same reason that Catherine called him out on his taking umbrage at viewing the jail’s spy cam. Ellison seems to think that since he’s a man of god that when he lies it’s not a lie but a method to an end. The thing is, it’s just a lie. The fact that he continues to lie while chastising others for their own malfeasance makes him a moral hypocrite.
CW has shown great restraint and patience when it comes to Ellison. You can bet Sarah wouldn’t have gotten nearly that much. First with the “I wasn’t talking to you” in Weaver’s office, followed by the very ominous “I’d watch who’s calling who a bitch.” I wouldn’t be surprised if Sarah got really close to seeing a cutting “criticism” at the next snipe.
Snake adding onto your cyborg/human reatiohsip (besides Cameron and John) you can add Cleopatra 2525 to your list as well. It had a few references and goes at it. I am sure there are more examples but I’m a little tired this morning from all the online voting and posting about the ep!!!
Why did we hear Sarah Connor’s voice at the very end “I love you too”… (She couldn’t replied to John when they they were waiting for the elevator…I think that was nonsense…
1. Anyone know how we are doing on the Save One Show Percentage Campaign?
2. Going along with this theory of getting Cameron into a new body….what if lets say they give her a TX-body? TX..I think is the designation for the T3 Terminator that could generate weapons at will and control other terminators. Cameron walking around plasma blasting T-888s, setting them on fire, or cutting them in half sound pretty wicked to me.
RC: papers showdown
Must be a hint at a future movie in which paperwork will be in a brutal civil war and all will be lost…
This show was amazing, and i’m totally devastated that it may be cancelled!!! For such a great and a new show, why would fox destroy it and put it on Fridays!!!!! I’m so never deleting ut from my DVR!!!!
It can’t end this way!! SEASON 3 needs to happen!!!!!!
Cameron should get a better, tougher, and less dense endo and skin design (and as I mentioned, as a side wink… a newer, better hair style and the ability to swim), but nothing too fancy.
John: Nothing is too good for her, but let’s keep the SFX budget down so WB doesn’t scream bloody murder.
Best thing of the whole episode: Chola can talk!! LOL!!
[Just kidding ]
This episode was MEMORABLE.
The end of this season finale deserves a place of honour in the history of sci-fi TV series and sci-fi genre in general. A masterpiece, Josh.
You, Josh Friedman, your amazing crew and the wonderful cast of BRILLIANT actors you gathered are GENIUSES!!
Guys, THANK YOU.
I must confess, you made me cry like a baby with the final scene. Poor John lost in that alternate future and coming to realize that he’s not anymore the leader of mankind, having lost his mom and coming face to face with a Derek who didn’t know who he is and realizing that there, in that version of the future, he’s no-one. Then seeing his father, Kyle, just like his mother remembered him. Just a few seconds and so many strong emotions… and then, there was she: ALLISON YOUNG and the expression on John’s face when he realized that that was a human and not HIS Cameron.
The whole scene was SUPERB!! just like Sarah’s “I love you” at the very end with the light indicating another “energy bubble” has come.
There are so many exciting possibilities left open with this AMAZING season finale that I think that if Fox were to decide to cancel this masterpiece of sci-fi that would be REALLY stupid.
We NEED a third season!!!
Assuming that Cameron’s “personality” is still there, inside the Turk, I can imagine Sarah, Ellison and Mr. Murch trying to make Cameron operational again by connecting her body to the Turk and recieving new instructions from her and, eventually, some of them using the time-machine to go after John.
I can imagine Kyle telling John he’s been waiting for him all along, because his mother came to him and prepared him to be the leader of the resistance till her son’s arrival.
I can imagine Derek distrusting John and questioning his brother’s blind faith in this kinda Messiah that came out from no-where - And even Kyle’s eventual decision to transfer his command to John.
I can imagine Alison and John and the ghost of Cameron between them. Maybe more than the ghost of Cameron. Maybe Kyle or Derek.
I can imagine Jesse showing up again and instigating Derek to start a rebel faction.
I can imagine Lauren Fields helping John.
I can imagine Alison and a repaired Cameron face to face.
I can imagine Derek and Kyle’s reaction discovering John’s trying to make alliances with machines like Weaver and JH, and turning against John by believing he’s betrayed them and Alison being the only one who believes him (or not).
I can imagine Sarah’s return (and redemption) working along with Ellison, Murch and a possible reactivated (but limited by being plugged to the Turk) Cameron - And I can imagine them teaming up with Danny, Miles Dyson’s son grown up and prepared to fight the machines.
I can imagine so many exciting things only YOU can make possible.
Thank you so much agan, guys. Josh, Natalie, Tony, all the writers, producers, technicians, digital/make-up artists, all the team, and thank you so much Thomas Dekker, Lena Headey, BAG, Richard T., Mackenzie Smith, Garret Dillahunt, Shirley Manson and especially SUMMER GLAU!! - I LOVE YOU, SUMMER!!!
I’ll be praying for this is not a goodbye but like Cameron said in spanish, “Hasta luego”, because we’ll be back for a 3rd season!!!! I’m not asking you, guys: THIS SHOW MUST COME BACK!!
I wouldn’t want to see Summer do any scenes more suggestive than this last one. One of the things that is so great about her is that she isn’t like so many other celebrities who go around flashing the cameras and acting like spoiled brats. Summer is a class act and she is worthy of being respected. It makes her that much more special and interesting.
Dan Hitchman,
Then I am moving to Hollywood, maybe I can catch her drunk at a bar, it’s worth a shot. If they won’t let me in, then maybe drunk at the exit of bar Summer Glau would be good, maybe I can send you pics : )
Really James you shouldn’t project your lack of morals on her. She’s never done anything to suggest she acts like that. That’s why so many people love her. Sluts are a dime a dozen in Hollywood. Summer is a cut above the rest of them.
All I gotta say is there better be a season three. The finale was great, best ep there ever was in the show, well maybe second best but I digress. My head will explode if there isn’t a Season 3. Thers’s far too much story left to tell to leave us hanging. Fox I know your reading this so c’mon just do it.
All of you must see the first season again!!!…season 2 explain how skynet is build by Cameron Oo…she whas lie at the begining, this terminator universe is her…maybe season 3 will focus around shes malefic ideea :D…end whit will.
C. Weaver will again help Jhon destroy every bad thing, because cameron will end knowing she need a true heart end she can make’it.
S3 will be focus after Terminator4 (Cameron fake life), this is just in my mind :S
p.s. must see s01e01 / s01e05, 06
Sorry for my bad english, i’m form romania end i love the show how whas think
For me, the most dramatic part of the finale is where John sees Allison and first thinks it’s Cameron but then he sees the dog and realizes it can’t be Cameron because dogs hate metal. The long slow closeup on his face was intended to show his reaction as he realizes all this and puts it together with the fact that John Henry probably erased Cameron forever when he overwrote her chip with his programming. And I think John was about to cry when he understood that Cameron is really dead.
Ignore James, guys. This boy just want to call peoples attention. Probably his parents ignored him when he was a child and his mind never grown old. Poor soul…
Furthermore, @James and all others who share his philosophy, Summer proves to us all that you don’t have to be some Hollywood bimbo with a big rack to be one of the most beautiful & respected actresses out there.
Maybe Cameron just needed a new body because hers had been almost destroyed and JH’s body was in perfect shape. Wouldn’t putting her chip in his body make her become him? All of JH was left behind because all his chip was the cables going into the back of his head. She puts in her chip and now she is still herself, but a new body, unfortunately.
Regardless if FOX has not given the axe to TSCC officially it sure seemed like it did unofficially.
ABC did the same thing with “Life on Mars” where they ADVERTISED it was a season finale and then later it turned into a series finale.
They cut the head off of venus de milo and created an end that was short and sour seeming to ellude, confuse, frustrate and dilute the story if it does comeback which most likely it won’t.
This is due to time, ratings, money constraints(probably ad revenue) and dumb executives who do not connect with the people who watch their show(s).
It is not worth giving the benefit of the doubt to FOX executives that the show is coming back.
The show essentially ended in a form which one can conclude this is where Terminator One originated from and then he sends his dad back to the past and begins the cycle again so John Connor can exist to stop the machines while he persists in the future which is why in the scenes from the future you never see John Connor because he is a kid and it would have ruined the show.
They did tie the show up in a bow but we the fans are dissapointed with the packaging.
to add-Yahoo wrote an article indicating TSCC will most likely be axed, they released the article the same day as the last show.
Ok I’m understanding the whole puzzle a little better now.
I just woke up, and guess what, i had a dream about Cameron (my dreams are always the most random and are never about things i’ve seen or things that are current - so that was weird)!! It was John carrying her lifeless body around trying to find a place to keep her..
As far as the show was concerned, the only reason i watched was CAMERON. My brother had to persuade me for months.. I refused to waste my time with it because i’m generally very busy and I just felt like nobody could carry a Terminator related project like Arnie.
But as soon as i saw Cameron on the screen there was something sooo intriguing about her that made me want to know more..
So ultimately, the only reason I watched it every week was to see CAMERON improve, learn, develop…. Everything else felt like a sub-plot. I found myself going back and re-playing the few lines she had in most of season 2.
I felt like her character was stagnant, if not actually going backwards from what she was in Season 1 at John’s school.
Her look was very unique and her mannerisms just drew you in..
I completely didn’t care AT ALL about Riley, i hated Jesse,, nobody compared to Cameron. I think she completely carried the show and for a billion reasons she is my favourite Terminator!
I don’t know if others felt the same, but some may have..
I think that, along with Chloe O’Brian (24), Cameron is one of the best written and performed characters in the history of TV.
I just wanted to get that off my chest and move on with the day.. actually get some work done
I leave you with this:
I LOVE CAMERON!!!
*Oh and I do have to say that Shirley Manson was phenomenal as CW! Well done.
This is a great show, I really enjoyed watching it and hope it will return for a 3rd season! Besides Family Guy, this is the only show on FOX that I look foward to viewing on tv.
Chloe: I agree 100%. The other characters support Cameron. She was the reason I tuned in and the lack of her was the reason many tuned out. Summer has rivaled Arnie and has become as much an Icon in the Terminator parlance as anyone else. She has done an incredible job.
Though, I won’t get into the name calling as Mike does… he does call out some pretty fair points of contention with the series’ direction and what the season finale left us with.
yeah,it was already the resistance.
they had army jackets with their names on them,military weapons,and dogs for “sniffin out metal”.
and it said in the movies that humanity was scattered bands of huddled survivors,the human race on it’s way to extinction,until JC organised them into the resistance force they became.
as opposed to there already being an organised resistance in play for JC to rise up the ranks and take charge of.
If a Cameron-model Terminator ambushes JC and company in S3, he could use the watch to detonate that one, couldn’t he? That would instantly make him a legend among the Resistance.
One really cool and fucked up dynamic might be John having to pull a King David on his own dad. If Kyle is currently with Allison, John would need to split them apart somehow just to make sure he’s born…
I don’t think Josh liked John very much, and maybe, sadly, even Cameron. He was so obsessed with Sarah… to the show’s detriment.
The writing of said characters sure seems to explain a lot. They were sometimes horribly abused as characters.
Even Sarah.
I just want to see a Season 3 for Cameron’s (and Summer’s) sake and see if JF can untangle the mess that has made with the story and plots and whether he’ll stop being so clever and vague to the point where viewers may actually stop and wonder if he knew the game plan to begin with or wasn’t just hunting around as he went along.
i pray that someone makes josh read that terminatorblog review posted above.
“it is unlikely we will ever know the reason why or what this show was ever trying to accomplish”
please remember that phrase when/if you sit down to write your next script.
in the U.S. anybody can wear camouflage clothing (army surplus) and there’s likely soldiers who survived. As for weapons, besides those that are already stashed here and there, it is logical to believe that caches and depots have been raided right after the initial wave of attacks.
That’s pretty much how it happened in Irak and no one could have prevented it. Metal isn’t perfect.
Oh, also I see no names on the uniforms and on Kyle coat, which John is wearing, there is a badge which reads “Umpire”. I don’t think that this is a resistance rank designed to confound Skynet.
Mr Josh Friedman, Sir. You are truly a bastard of long and refined breeding. I truly would like to add magnificent to that and your last 6 episodes truly deserve this attribute but seeing that we will maybe (probably) left hanging with an cruel and unusual amount of open questions I hesitate to do so.
To summarize get as third season right fucking now. I don’t care what you have to do kidnap someone, steal, lie, rise your banners in bloody revolution - just get a fricking move on. I will be right behind you.
You guys are looking for a good duel between a t-888 and t-1001? Uncle Bob got destroyed during fisticuffs fights in T2. The only reason why the t-1000 was ever defeated was due to environmental factors such as liquid nitrogen or molten steel. It was fitting how easily an “unlocked” t-1001 capable of ingenious battle styles could overpower a simply t-888.
My one complaint about combat scenes thus far is..lack of exploding 18 wheelers found in all terminator movies. But it makes sense cus of production costs I guess.
Just a quick note to say thanks for an awesome finale and a brilliant series! Doubt it will be back after the death of Derek and that finale, but I loved it. Lena rocks!
I have never written on a forum before, but I had to add my voice. Please bring back SCC. I love this show and watch it with all my friends. The writing is SOOOO good. Thank you for giving us such a great finale. And if the series does return, please bring back Jesse and Derek. John Henry is a better terminator than Arnie.
I rewatched the ep. Didn’t catch that line about Cameron giving her chip to JH when i saw the ep the first time. Thank gods. Cameron is not evil.
The Jameron scenes are the most compelling. Precisely because of the “ick” factor. (IMHO.) But if they ever get into some kind of romantic relationship it will be the death of the show. Without the tension it will die. The creators of SMALLVILLE had sword that Lana and Clark would never get together for this precise reason. But in season 2 they broke that and the show went south ever since then.
@ I am Arnold
The mention of the Grays does not refer to aliens. There was an ep where they talked about humans who were helping SkyNet do research on humans. These humans were called Grays by Jesse.
THERE HAS TO BE A THIRD! Summer getting to play Allison, John not being the messiah, BAG, and Sarah on her own with Ellison! Season Three is gonna be fantastic! Truthfully the best season finale of all time!
I’m not sure what to make of this last episode. I’m hoping they give us some kind of wrap up/what the writers were trying to accomplish. Entertaining show though regardless.
I’m still uncharacteristically giddy about the season finale. I was explaining to my family the various story and character possibilities that it opened up. I think I rambled on for a couple of hours more-or-less without a break.
I cut my screenwriting chops many years ago. After a while, you’ve seen the plots and stories and you realize that it’s all about characters and how the affect and effect one another (sometimes with a little push from plot). You get jaded. There’s a lot of been-there-done that in any genre. For the first time in a very long time, JF managed to get my giddy up (did I actually say that?).
In the course of that session with my family I delivered at least a half-season worth of possibilities and I only stopped because my throat was starting to tire and dinner needed to be begun. I could have gone on for hours more, otherwise. As a writer, this finale let the television world of terminator blossom into a mature and inviting flower.
What does that mean? I means that FOX (or other interested parties) have just exposed the mother lode from the terminator mine, now all they have to do is extract it. It also means that even if I have to do it alone in fanfic, this isn’t going to be the end of the story (in terms of serious-minded story telling).
(V.O.): The ancient Greeks tell the tale of a curse the Gods gave to man as punishment for their acceptance of secret of fire. This gift, woman, in turn received seductive gifts from the Gods. The woman opened one, a jar, and released all the evils of mankind before she was able to seal the jar again. Only one item remained. Since then, mankind has always known that however challenging the whims of the universe make life, there is still the content of that ancient jar to draw from for defense: hope.
I’m hopeful for an other season (or more). I’m hopeful that there are many stories to tell, and that the SCC team writes good ones.
Amazing!!! It’s like watching a movie every Friday. If Fox hadn’t put it in such a shitty timeslot, we wouldn’t be having to fight to sav e it right now. PLEASE let there be another season!
I like people that post their uninformed opinions and cry about the finale. Let me help Mike out since he doesn’t seem to want people to be able to comment on his thoughts.
Jesse vs Cameron.. Cameron sent Jesse on the mission in secret to as the Liquid Metal to join the Resistance. Liquid says no. Jesse loses her child. Hates Cameron. Jesse should have been the one that killed the guy in the parking lot, not Weaver; saving John and saying she would see him on the other side of J-Day.
Weaver backstory.. yeah, she was the Liquid Metal on the sub; “Will you join us?” Same message that was told to Cameron; who ordered the Jimmy Carter’s mission to begin with. That’s why Cameron tells Ellison he’s said enough already.
I could go on and on explaining things to you; that you failed to grasp, but why bother.. who are you? No one. Well, someone that writes a blog that doesn’t allow comments. Props. What would the world do without important people that can’t create content; just criticize it. /yawn Don’t worry, will never go back to your blog, and never knew about it til linked in this thread; so enjoy your one day of higher web traffic putz.
That’s not where the tension should lie IMHO. They need to get over their “little doe eyed” will they/won’t they phase and once the love is cemented…
It’s what the ramifications mean to everyone else that is the juicy stuff.
Some people say “ick” some people (I’d say the majority) see possibilities in the exploration of what their love means to others. That would play into the story beautifully.
The supposed leader of the humans (a Messiah-like figure to many in the camps) and a cyborg (the “enemy”) are companions, are in love? Heady stuff! It’s an impossible to fathom romance, but here they are… now deal with it.
It’s like the ruckus surrounding Jesus and Mary Magdalen (as I’ve mentioned before), though not at that controversial historical and religious level, of course.
They would move Heaven and Earth and Time Itself for each other, if they could. Why?
What makes a machine any different from a human… what if a machine became like us?
This was asked in “The Demon Hand,” but never really explored in any great detail.
It could be one of the new, great love affairs (fit for the 21st Century) for the Cinematic Ages: John and Cameron. Taking the ranks of Sarah and Kyle in “The Terminator.”
Now here’s Allison, who looks and sounds just like Cameron… and yet, why does John choose Cameron over her?
There is a difference, and John sees it where others cannot or are fearful to tread.
Because the answers may shock you. Cameron, though she’s metal, is something special.
Powerful because you begin to question man’s role in the scheme of things? Can he move to the side and let another species have an equal playing field?
Can both species evolve to do great and wonderful things for the planet?
ok sure,but we know that derrick and kyle where just normal boys playing in the park when judgement day came and a little bit of them running around tunnels for a bit.they werent already soldiers.
plus these people john runs into already have the term “metal” for their enemy,and know that dogs can detect them.and since they have dogs to detect and weapons to fight the metal they are of the organised resistance.
I was thinking, maybe this whole thing was a trick to get john to follow Cameron into the future (kind of like Jesse’s plan with Riley, keeping him away from machines), leading to no John Conner to actually lead the resistance, i mean he’s there, but now just some kid no one has ever heard of. His decision to take that time portal with Weaver seemed to be based on his desire to find Cameron again, i’m still kind of shocked that Sara would just let that happen?? That would be an interesting way to keep the story going. Any one else think that’s plausible?
I remember the first time I had my heart torn apart by a TV series was in the late 1970’s after the conclusion of Rich Man, Poor Man (it was a mini-series) but then again by RMPM season 2 (it was actually season one since the first was a mini-series).
Regardless those characters were like friends to me and so it is with the Terminator series. Charlie, Derek, Riley, and now Cameron were gone but now there is hope for all the characters (except maybe Charlie).
John is trapped in an alternate reality created by the fact that he wasn’t in the present and wasn’t there to help at a critical juncture…
Maybe he could have even stopped JD.
He gets to realize first hand the horrors of JD and he is highly motivated by this to get back to the present and correct what has gone horribly wrong.
Again, just like “It’s A Wonderful Life.” John sees that one man and one female cyborg can make a difference, perhaps all the difference in the world.
They thought they were insignificant, they were wrong.
And John is spurred on to find JH… get Cameron’s “soul,” get her a new body, and get back to the past PRONTO.
This is not where he and Cam need to be. He lost out on so much by bypassing his life, and she did too. There’s so much growth left to go through.
And Cameron, maybe, turns to John [after being placed in a new body] while looking out over the desolation of post JD’s wasteland together (they are standing closer to each other than ever before).
Is it just me or are there others disappointed by this final episode?
There are several things i don’t really get.
First, what was the point in making Cameron undress? The whole shielded nuclear power source thing seemed so set up, why didn’t she just reply to John accusations, “Hey John, i’m from the future, i know she dies of cancer, even without someone of us being around” ?
Second, the Catherine Weaver Shield, as far as i can remember, Liquid Metal isn’t rock solid, at least it wasn’t in T2, despite the scene where the T1k was frozen.
It just looked ridiculous, and the SFX cheap.
Third, where did the Latina Gangster Lady, i forgot her name Chu..something, came from? I don’t see the Connection between her and neither the priest nor Sarah.
4th, so whole timetravel thing, not that i can’t get my head around timetravel, but using it inflationary just looks like you can’t write. And if you can’t get the story, where you want it to, you let them travel forth and back in time.
Now, why did John Henry Travel forth in time? He was save in the present, no war, no machine eating humans and he was with the almighty Catherine Weaver Shield. Why not waiting, and preparing more, by playing d&d?
Even if there was the slightest chance TSCC would’ve been renewed, I’m not quite sure whether it would be worth watching.
I really liked the Cameron-Derek-Situation, and both are gone, first Derek, in a way, i’m not quite “”satisfied”" with, when it comes to killing John Connor they always hesitate a second to allow John, to get away, but this time, the 888 just walks by and shots Derek in the head, and you think, “Wow, how stupid was that?”. Okay, you could argue it shows how volatile human life is, but then, why killing him, wehn you bring him back, by traveling into the future.
And now Cameron is gone, her Body is for sure, and i’d imagine so is she. As Mr. Murch states, the entity, known to us, persists of the Body and the Soul.
Not that i don’t like the idea of seeing Summer Glau in the role of a normal human being, fighting against machines, okay, maybe not as normal as you and me, but still, no psychic and no machine.
But Cameron was the main reason for me and i guess some others, to tune in, watching her development, her interaction with humans and getting to know more about her was the juice of the show.
But that’s all gone, if she’s still there, she aint in her body, and even worse, there, where (when) she has gone, are no normal humans. Only badass Resistance Fighters hating machines, not that i’d blame them for.
It just seems to me like Josh said “Come on guys its Series Final, we need lots of Explosions, Gun Fights, Special Effects, loud Musik and Summer please get your Shirt off.”
Honestly, if there’d be a 3rd Season, the first episode should start with the 2nd Half of Season 2 just being a bad dream of CAMERON!
“If a Cameron-model Terminator ambushes JC and company in S3, he could use the watch to detonate that one, couldn’t he? That would instantly make him a legend among the Resistance.”
Yes, you can clearly see John stuffing the watch inside himself before he travels through time, just like Christopher Walken in Pulp Fiction.
wow you guys know that feeling when you just finished watching the most epic show ever.. like butterflies in you stomach and you just gotta contact your friends that watch the show to to talk about 1 episode for about 4 hrs?
then it pisses you off because fox is going to cancel the best Freaking show they have had in years?
i so feel that way… /sigh im going to watch CW if they cancel this show.
Comments from news media who think the show will be axed is still pure speculation. We really do not know until we hear something from an official source.
Wow are there alot of comments going on here… this finale has definitely generated alot of buzz. Personally I thought it was brilliant. I knew they would bring back Derek somehow… I had my own theory which I discussed in another one of the blog entries on this site. It seems as if part of Weaver was the “eel” that confronted Jesse with the message for JC in “Today Is The Day.” So if the answer was no then, the answer is still no now. Weaver’s “eel” also piloted the H-K straight into ZeiraCorp. Weaver was covering for herself so she could trick the Connors into believing she can help them. John Henry is not the same when the hardware is moved according to Murch… the hardware has been moved. Cameron was glitchy again, far from 100 percent as she pointed out toward the end of the episode. She let John Henry take her chip so he could evolve into Skynet… that’s why the message is flashing for John right before Weaver lures him into traveling to the future to save Cameron. To quote Sarah, “You lying Terminator bitch.” Josh Friedman’s script was great, but he broke his record of never mentioning the word “Terminator” in any of the scripts with this fantastic season 2 finale. Fox simply cannot cancel this mindblowing series.
The eel, wasn’t piloting the HK it was in the fish tank in the office and then fell to the floor when the HK smashed through the window breaking the fish tank.
did anyone remember that there was this interview by Garrett and Richard T.Jones where they commented that John Henry would run away and experience his first fight? Seems that they took that story out. Sorry, I couldn’t find the actual link to back my statement up. I really hope this show gets a season 3 =)
I don’t normally get so involved (ok never) in a show that I comment on a blog for it or spend so much time discussing it among my friends as I have over the last few weeks… I want to thank the actors, writers and producers, crew everyone involved for that you have all done such an amazing job.
So my take: in samson and delilah, cameron says to john “you shouldn’t have done that, they won’t understand”… “not them” referring to sarah and derek with the jesse/riley subplot its clear that there is a growing faction in the future of humans who distrust john because of his affinity for the machines.
I think the bed scene in the finale was Cameron’s attempt to manipulate john: a beautiful body in an intimate situation … being cut into and examined from the inside in an attempt to force john to realize that she is in fact a machine I think it could go to ways possibly to lessen the betrayal that she knew she was going to perpetrate, or possibly to further johns machine sympathies. So regarding this betrayal has anyone else noticed the reaction cameron has when a fellow terminator has been terminated e.g. cromartie in mexico, cameron looks horrified so I am wondering if the betrayal is caused by an instinct to save her own kind by helping JH.
This then I think ties into what’s happening with CW and JH a faction of the machines realizes (or knows thanks to all the time travel) that john connor will eventually lead the humans to victory over the machines and their extinction, so they are aiming for a truce (witness sarah monologue from first season expounding on the differences between chess and war), skynet and JC are playing chess and in the end one wins but at great cost to both sides, this faction attempts to create an AI that is more human then skynet (the unpredictability of the turk) and the mirror on the human side is cameron to change johns mind.
I love that John has ended up in the future with his family and a chance to really prove himself, but did he really go there because of Cameron? It’s a little dependent/ pathetic of him to go through all of that trouble just to track down what is essentially his favorite shotgun. Don’t get me wrong, I love the show- I just find it silly to glorify a machine like that.
All theories with Cameron and Weaver tricking John falter when one observes that either of them could have easily killed both John and Sarah at any point in the series. If they are working for SkyNet, why send him to the future and risk having him connect with the Resistance, as he did, instead of just taking him out ONCE AND FOR ALL. That is, after all, the whole point of the movies. It makes more sense that John was taken to the future in order for Kaliba to lose his trail than anything else. BUT it is precisely because of these doubts we’re having that Season 3 is NECESSARY.
I thought the series was satisfying but also frustrating (with the thought that we may not get a 3rd season).
Weaver could certainly have been tricking John so that there would be no John Connor in the future, but why not just kill him? That would be more effective.
No, Weaver represents a new brand of Terminators. But I have several questions about Cameron and John Henry. How is John Henry separated from the Turk? Is he using Cameron’s chip? Then it’s not John Henry anymore. How would John Henry carry her chip in his hand since metal doesn’t go through the transporter?
Also, how is the next season going to be structured? Is it going to alternate between Sarah’s present and John’s future, or is it just John? It is the Sarah Connor Chronicles after all.
I am university teacher in one of the famous polish law schools. I love Terminator series since i was a boy, and I must say : Brilliant show! Its a masterpiece. its even better then original terminator 1-2 movie , not to mention T3. Its also my students opinion. This show is very popular in Poland.
I am only afraid if it is too smart, intelligent for many people … Money rules the world .. sad ..
What was Cameron’s motivations to
ABANDON
John Connor. She scrapped her other mission goals and in a symbolic act gave her chip to JH. Was this a act of love? Had they communicated over the internet on matchmaker.com ? I am sick of the projecting from fans with the knife scene, didn’t John Henry and Cameron share just as equal a special moment.
I love Summer Glau and TSCC! Sending John to the future throws a wrench into the whole timeline. I’m really disappointed that we won’t see the character Cameron for the new season but Summer Glau will be around. These are good shows that need to be on television!
This show just keeps getting better.
LISTEN UP FOX EXECUTIVES:
This show has real staying power. There is a very loyal following. It could stay on the air for years and none of us fans would be bored.
Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles is an advertising goldmine.
I don’t think there can be a third season, as the series is called Sarah Connor Chronicles and Sarah is no longer with John. But there could be a new series, like “Connor’s wars” or something like that, starting where this one ended.
Anyway, please vote in http://www.eonline.com to save TSCC or to let them know that we will keep watching terminators.
My god…just see the finale
i’m shocked. Really. This was incredible….
now it’s too late to realize…Cam’s sacrifice (?), JH disappearing, Kyle, Derek, Allison on the scene (but it was predictable, as every change in the past can alterate and generate s multiple futures) !
A lot of questions ! So much confusion….i’m really shocked now.
Best show ever…
Guyz, what a finale !! Thanx Mr.Friedman, thanx for all, now we have to concentrate ourself on Season 3 !!!
FOOOX and WARNER BROS !!!!!
I write from italy, give me and my friends more of this !
I just love this show. It also had the best kind cliffhanger i’ve ever seen, not one that leaves insanely irritating questions, but insanely awesome possibilities. As others have said, i’ve seen plenty of shows come and go before their time, but this is the only one i’ve fought for. It is the only TV show that i watch and i’ve watched every premiere since the S1 (except for last night when FOX fucked up and gave damn weather reports for the the first 30 minutes). Please dear God bring back this show! It doesn’t even have to be a full season, just enough for some genuine closure.
“The eel, wasn’t piloting the HK it was in the fish tank in the office and then fell to the floor when the HK smashed through the window breaking the fish tank.”
I can’t believe I didn’t catch that. I think I was still reeling from seeing Chola again.
This is the best TV show I have ever seen…I tell people about it all the time. I hope for the life of me that there is more to come; regardless, thank you for the stories.
This is by far the best show on tv, never mind fox. if fox doesn’t renew it then i will stop watching any fox shows–including 24.
but i hope if fox doesn’t renew that scifi network will take it over. i’m sure it could easily do as well as battlestar did. or even premium cable like showtime or hbo. it would work even better as a rated r series…
let’s hope someone has the good sense not to let it die. either way, great job, cast and crew!
@Dan - mainly, seriously what is it and your robot fetishes. Yeah i loved the whole romantic thing going on with cameron and john. But it would never happen. That line should never be crossed.
I am really looking forward to John having a real relationship with allison. This is why Cameron took Allison captive because she was his spouse and camerons mission was to KILL John as she has said many times. Also this could be the reason why John sent cameron back to the past, to help him out and that he couldnt bear being round cameron and is alone all the time.
i think season three has a lot of potential and you know i dont think i would want John to find a way back to the past. Why would he go back, when he has a job to do. Maybe this is how John survives JD in this time line.
You all have to remember, This TV series totally throws away T3 and T4 for good reason. They are movies and they tell their own story, They will never intermingle.
They do not really need to either since Time Travel is involved and things have happened to change the future already. Mainly them jumping eight years.
JOSH you have done a fantastic job throughout this whole season and i really wish i could shake your hand and tell you in person. Looking forward to Season 3. Fingers Crossed.
I agree, i think it was one of her primary objectives and i think the order came down from future John himself.
And i don’t care what anyone says, there should def. be a romance between John and Cameron. That’s what makes the show unique. That’s what drove Jessie crazy. That’s what intrigues us all.
The eel was definitely not piloting the attack vehicle. I think what people are missing that is significant is that the eel and Catherine Weaver were able to exist separately and simultaneously. Rather than the eel morphing back into the shape of CW, the eel ENTERED the body of CW. Big difference, and again, I believe it goes back tot he human/machine hybrid direction that the franchise is heading. Perhaps this actually IS Catherine Weaver’s body.
I pray to the TV Gods that this is not the end of TSCC. The season finale was awesome. Cameron has to be brought back in Season 3 or we all would be very upset. Just check out this tribute to hear how we would feel. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iV29xRLSW20
Chris V: Allison is his spouse? Which orifice did you pull that out of? There was never any indication that JC and Allison had any type of close relationship.
Cameron told John the morning he woke up and she was sitting on the bed looking at him why she was going to leave. She told him that in her hardward and in her software were an inbedded command to kill him and she couldn’t guarantee it wouldn’t surface. When she got the message from Weaver, she realized that an alternative cyborg was being built by her and she wanted that type of cyborg body to house the Cameron chip, so that there would never be an underlying kill command in her. (she was made from a skynet prototype, which did have the kill command that could never be completely wiped clean - she wanted to be a weaver prototype instead).
When she got to JH, she took her knife out to give him her chip before he said anything to her about doing that. So it wasn’t something that Weaver or JH planned, it was something Cameron decided to do on her own. And that’s why she got Sarah out of jail first, because she knew she was going to leave John and didn’t want him to be completely alone.
Weaver didn’t know they were doing it either because she told John and Sarah ‘you better hope Cameron didn’t destroy JH’. If she knew what was going to happen between the two of them, she wouldn’t have said anything.
Cameron didn’t erase her chip - she wanted to BE Cameron, but not in a sky net machine - in a weaver machine. And when she and JH met and she pulled out her knife, it was before the drone hit the building, so she may have left before the attack. She may not have left had she known John was about to be attacked by Caliba.
She was bringing JH’s program to John Connor in the future for him to use when he re-programmed the machines, and specifically when he reprogrammed her. That’s why she’s so special - she has the JH programming in her (timeline loop paradox). Future John may have originally sent her back to get it (?). She may have had an extra chip in her just for that purpose (to download the JH machine).
Weaver went after JH because she wasn’t done with what she was doing. Cameron took him too soon.
In Season 3 (being positive here) I think she will bring him back to the present to continue perfecting him. She needs him to fight Skynet before Judgment Day - if she didn’t, why bother creating him in the present, she could’ve created him in the future.
Once young John enters the future, it starts a new timeline. If he’s in the future, he wasn’t there for JD and they wouldn’t know his name. Or, it was always supposed to be this way. John stays, and becomes their leader because he has Weaver’s help, which puts him legions ahead of the rest of them. He’s their mystery Messiah who appeared out of nowhere.
If you go back and watch the scene in Dungeons and Dragons when Derrick is brought to meet John Connor - the John Connor entering the room behind him is the present day John Connor. Then Reese wakes up and sees John over him and it gets confusing, was he dreaming or seeing John in the present. But what if he was remembering present day John in the future?
Personally, I think Season 3 would be more interesting if he returns to Sarah at some point, but since T-Salvation takes place in the future, it could be that Season 3 will as well (?). But I’m hoping that after a few episodes in the future, Season 3 will end up back with Sarah and Ellison and Savannah.
Perfect. Perfect balance. What a tightrope you guys walked. I am in total awe of the writers, producers, and everyone else who makes this series. Why couldn’t I have written that?! Bugger! Whether we get a season 3 or not, you guys should all be really proud of what you accomplished. It’s so far superior to 99% of the TV and the movies out there (including the Ts). I wish the audiences’ viewing habits were half as sophisticated as this treasure that they were offered. Love you guys and will be watching for your names.
FOX, a 3rd season really needs to be made…I’ve never blogged about a TV series even once in my life, but this needs saying…this is the best written show on TV, well-structured and compelling week after week.
This season was very good, the finale blew my mind. It is definitely not typical Hollywood. Outstanding writing, this is why TSCC is one of the only 2 or 3 shows I watch on TV or online (mostly online). I did think Cameron’s Eye was supposed to be blue though, but it’s forgivable. The plot has opened up so many new possibilities. I will be very disappointed if the show doesn’t return.
I just watched the finale for a second time and have so many questions:
Who sent the girl (Chola ) with the passports? What was up with her quoting ‘We lose everybody we love’
What was the priest’s message to Cameron?
John Henry and Weaver simultaneously say ‘We’ll see’ in response to Ellison saying that John will not leave his mother.
Are they trying to convince him to leave her? Is that their purpose?
Did John Henry release the locks in the jail?
He seems to grin when it happened
Weaver doesn’t seem to know about about the jail incident, so JH is doing it on his own
Who sent the plane into the into the building?
The timing on the plane crash was perfect too perfect - Weaver must have orchestrated it.
The eel came from the tank and merged into Weaver after the plan crash?
The ‘bad’ terminator theme was playing when that happened.
JH to Cameron: ‘I know you’
Cameron to JH: ‘and I know you’ (as in, I hacked into you?)
JH To Cameron: ‘Will You join Us?’
Danny Dyson is missing? Following in his father’s work to create skynet? or trying to prevent it from happening too?
Murch mentions that John Henry only exists as this specific hardware.
Where are JH / Cameron at the end? Cameron seems to have been downloaded into the Turk (hence the ‘I’m sorry John’ messages). So JH was downloaded on to Cameron’s chip and goes into the future? What is the significance of the chip from the T888 that Weaver fried?
Thank you for an interesting, thought-provoking season finale. I’m STILL not sure how I feel about everything….the show has stayed in my mind all day. The episode alternately tore at my heart and infuriated me–mostly because it leaves so many open questions…..and season three seems like a long way away. (I am hopeful!) I found it interesting the way CW asked Ellison if he wanted to join her in finding “their” boy. His face! lots of humor, lots of touches to the original two movies, lots of emotion, lots of action and STILL lots of questions…..
Why have an interest in Arnold The Terminator, why have an interest in No.5, why have an interest in R2-D2 and C-3PO, why have an interest in E.T., why have an interest in Aliens, why have an interest in Robby the Robot…the Star Man… the HAL9000?
Why do we have an interest in any fascinating sci-fi character?
They are intriguing, they are special… they are not us.
You are pulled into the characters because they let your imaginations run wild.
The whole flippin’ point of Terminator (the first two movies) was the advancement of AI to the point where a Terminator, of all things, can put down his or her gun, and think about something other than what he or she was made for. The reaching for something bigger and better. Their eyes widening… and awakening.
It’s the age old call of all humans. Our morality, our spirituality, our wonder, our imagination, our intelligence, our culture… that which makes us strive for the unattainable: perfection.
Oh, and another thing! Granted Sarah is our main hero, but I loved how Catherine Weaver 1-upped her every time Sarah started to say something. Of my complaints with the Sarah Connor character, she can be quite annoying when speaking to people sometimes. I would love to see these two have word wars in Season 3.
If we get it, WB and FOX can expect huge revenues on the T4 box office performance and the TSCC dvd/blu ray sales. If we don’t get it, there will be millions of seriously angry fans who just may boycott it all!
Wow I need more terminator. Amazing story line so far yet so many unanswered questions. Thank you fox and TSCC writers for the work you have done. I love the Terminator franchise and I love what you have done with the show. Let us know if there is anything we can do to keep the show alive. There is only two shows i petitioned to save. Arrested Development and TSCC. Lets keep it up!
I wonder why they would air the finale on good friday? I mean that is just a slap in the face. The day of Jesus’ death. Hopefully there are not parallels to the show’s demise. Go TSCC!
Did anyone else notice that as JH progressed, Weaver was becoming more ‘human’? In the beginning episodes with Savannah, she barely acknowledged her and didn’t know how to act around her. At the end, she was hugging her when she was returned from being taken by the Connors and asked Ellison to pick her up from school while she went to get JH. Was Weaver uploading the JH files into her own circuitry (I don’t think she has a ‘chip’)? If she was, she might not have needed Cameron to upload the files, she may have them on her own body! (maybe in the eel in the tank?)
I think Season 3 will be more interesting not only if John comes back to Sarah and the frozen Cameron (with her chip in hand), but if Weaver comes back as well to finish JH and to continue raising Savannah and learning from being a human mother, although I’m guessing Ellison will be too horrified to continue working for her. If they (John, Weaver, JH and Cameron’s chip) do come back, no matter how much time they may spend in the future, they can come back to 1 second later in the present (no time loss). And pick it up from there. Lots of cool possibilities!
I’m trying to be optimistic about S3. Fox would be crazy not to renew this after the movie comes out - they can pick up an entire new fanbase if the movie does well, along with the hardcore viewers they already have.
How does all of this tie in? Does it make the movie Terminator 3: Judgement Day completely irrelevant? Does Terminator Salvation tie in with T:SCC, or T3? Which timeline is the real one? All of these questions will be unanswered without a T:SCC Season 3.
Fox… you’d be making a mistake to cancel the series now!
LoL yeah Brian from Canada,
I wish! Its funny because I think you wrote earlier that you were an AD fan. Kudos to you. I tried so hard to keep that show alive. I bought 12 copies of the dvds
I quite frankly am amazed you spent any time thinking why I’m watching the show.
I really like Cameron (duh! most of the fans do!), I like Weaver, I like Savannah, I like John Henry, I sorta like the other characters, especially when they’re written well.
John was a dud for most of the season (and finally is not annoying), we hardly saw much of Cameron except here and there. And Sarah… gah! I loved Sarah Connor in T1 and T2, and sometimes am as pissed at how Sarah was written as Lena supposedly is!
But since this ending still leaves a bazillion unanswered questions even when they said they’d tie some stuff up, that’s when I wonder what the real point of all this was?
An exercise in futility?
They’re great at leaving things dangling all over the place and then claim it’s all part of some brilliant strategy… trust us! [wink wink] But not very good at blending everything together smoothly. Even allergygal was a bit miffed!
They juggled far too many “teaser” balls in the air, about 50 or so, and dropped a bunch in the process.
As I mentioned to Zack a while back… sometimes you can be too “cute” and “clever” with the vagueness, and that can come back to bite you.
The Dungeon in “Dungeons and Dragons” is mentioned in passing with one line after one and a half seasons. That’s supposed to wrap things up?
It doesn’t even make sense if you look at the time line and the events.
They come from 1997 to 2007 and then in the span of less than 6 months they’re now in 2009?? Don’t deny it… John Connor said it himself.
“Alpine Fields” should not have even been put on film because that time frame also makes zero sense with what we’ve witnessed, and with Derek’s death.
The going to the future part of “Born to Run” also does not fit as a tidy ending either because everything that has happened as veered the events so out of whack that he can’t start things in motion again to create any kind of loop.
And why would John have to send Kyle or Derek back now anyway on their own? Why send Cameron back, why kill Allison?
He’s protected. Once you’re created, you don’t disappear from existence like in “Back to the Future.” You’re protected by a kind of Time Cocoon.
You exist, you can’t now un-exist.
That’s why this as a series conclusion is a terrible way to end things.
If it ends up being a season finale then it basically means, to me anyway, that John has to learn that he really is a necessary part of the equation and that he needs to get Cameron and get his ass back to the past where he and Cam can develop into the possible leaders they need to be if JD can’t be stopped.
And yet… that should still be their driving mission: find Kaliba and destroy it so this nightmare can end, and along the way evolve John and Cameron more than ever, so this new opportunity isn’t wasted again.
Maybe find some clues about Skynet and Kaliba in this Land of Oz and take the intel back to the past with them to help in the present.
Otherwise, what’s the point? It wraps nothing up really.
scfangirl,
Thanks for the explanation. I liked it all, except the part where you mention that John is attacked by Caliba. I took the ship crashing into the building as Weaver’s doing, no? She certainly seemed prepared for it, and no Terminators came out of the ship. Why would Weaver and John leave Ellison and Sarah there in the building if there were Terminators in the building?
Again, I loved your analysis, just curious about this one particular point.
I agree that far too many teasers were dropped and and some others wasted too much time and didn’t pay off. The three dots got way too much play and then in the end was just three LED’s on a SATA drive. Very stupid and wasteful. Another teaser that should have paid dividends was Camerons dance scene at the end of the Demon Hand. I really expected to see massive developement in Cameron after that and Josh just dropped it. That was where he should have spent his time rather than chasing dots.
Lastly however, your comment that you can’t un-exist crushes one of the Terminator tenents. Remember Kyle Reese said in T1 “we smashed their defense grid, We’d won. They had to come back and whipe out his(JC’s) entire existence.”
I think we need to believe in the ability to take someone out of time entirely for the story to hold together.
People SAVE THE SHOW GO TO (E!ONLINE) AND click on (Watch w/ Kristin)
and save the show…pleas the only way to save the show …..we can do it if we all vote
The more I think about it… the more I like the idea of Allison Young, this time around (I look at it as a kind of Twilight Zone or Star Trek Future time line that must be erased from existence), not being so innocent and pure.
Maybe even end up revealing as being a kind of threat to John and/or Cameron and/or John Henry. Riley was an unwitting dupe and pawn of Jesse’s. Allison is nothing of the sort. Old Jesse, who Derek may not have really killed, may still be trying for some new surprises in this alternate time line.
There is a final confrontation with Allison, John, and Cameron Mark II (John Henry and/or Catherine Weaver may be there too).
Maybe Cameron Mark II is in a vulnerable state and Allison threatens to destroy her (Cam’s “metal” after all) for the good of mankind (or so she thinks is her motivation; that old, tired excuse of “it’s for the greater good”)… Allison is also, deep down, “jealous” and “envious” and even “weirded out” that Cameron (her metal twin “sister”) exists and John Connor loves her and not Allison. It drives her over the edge of reason into madness, the heart of darkness… much like Jesse.
And John Connor, in a state of bewilderment at Allison’s true nature, and anger, and a desire to protect his true love, Cameron… kills her with one kill shot to the head. She slumps over, wide-eyed, vacant, and staring… at Cameron’s, her twin’s, body lying on a nearby table ready to be revived.
Allison Young still dies for Cameron to be born… again. But this time it’s John doing the killing.
@scfangirl - you touched on something that I think fans should do if they still have the episodes available: watch the CW scenes now that you know that the up is with her. She’s way less creepifying than before.
Remember back in Sherman’s office? That close call between Weaver and John? Anxious then, much? But now? You wish so much that they’d have connected then. It would have saved an awful lot of pain (and the Sarah tangent). Now…imagine if you’d watched it the first time without knowing how it ends but only that Weaver is searching for John Connor and building a way for him to beat Skynet. Different sort of anxiety, but still there because we know something the characters don’t. We know that John and Co are working against their best interests at times. All the while CW can still have her own extra agenda that the audience doesn’t quite have enough information about.
It’s the old Hitchcock method of suspense: if a bomb explodes it’s shocking; however, if the audience sees the bomb but the characters keep missing their opportunities to thwart it…that’s suspense. I’d have preferred a little more of the suspense instead of just the bang.
But again, I encourage everyone to go back into their libraries and watch this all again with a new perspective.
Kyle reese is not from “our” john connors future - the future that Kyle reese was from is gone (relative to him) - was changed the moment he went back into time. The “future” relative to those that he left behind is still the same - if the terminator would have succeeded in killing John Connor - the future John Connor would not have vanished - the only future where john connor would not have existed would be the one relative to the people in the time where he was killed.
So what I’m saying is when you go back in time your not changing your past - your past has already happened your just changing the future from your standpoint.
if you go into the past to try and stop judgement day - you won’t be helping anybody out from the future that you were from - because it’s already happened for them.
Wrong May 19. The one thing that will save this show is Cameron. I think the new contract will insist on her as a main character otherwise those who invest in it will not be able to guarantee a return. This season proved that if you want to depress your ratings you withhold Cameron.
A couple of more things I noticed after watching the ep again:
When Kyle comes walking in you see a fuzzy Allison walk into the background.
Everyone else is armed with big guns…but Alison is not armed. WHY?
John never heard his mom’s message. Awwww!!!
When Cameron meets JH it’s the same line that was said in S1 between Cameron and Derek. ‘I know you, and I know you.’
Cameron really is torn between two worlds. She wants to be with the humans (some like Derek, riley and Jesse, Sarah don’t want her around). She might have human memories not to sure about that. But she wants to be with John yet she is a machine. She might have been designed by skynet since she still has the programming yet she works with the terminator resistance.
She really is torn. I think Cameron is the key to everything. She’s the balance. And she’s perfect for John.
I actually was thinking about this while baking today…the cyborg/human relationship has been explored as Snake has pointed out in Serenity, STTNG and Cleopatra 2525 and a number of other places but not to that great extent.
Just compare it to all the other sci-fi relationships that have been out there.
Human/vampire (Buffy, Angel, Moonlight), Human/werewolf, werewolf/vampire (Underworld), human/alien (STTNG, Roswell anyone) so I think cyborg/human is one of the few that have played out. Some people seem to forget that this is a sci-fi show. The human/human stuff has been explored in a lot of other shows. And to be honest not really what I want to see. Its the cyborg/human relationship especially in TSCC that has so much potential. Two different worlds came come together and work out there differences. So its time to let Jameron shine.
Also Jameron has been hinted at between future John and Cameron and even Weaver calls her his companion
Allison can’t protect him and she certainly can’t take a ton of bullets for him.
John might be able to see a cyborg Cameron controlled by skynet in this wizard of oz time line…can he still forgive what she might do. Of course he can. Bring on Jameron!!!
I think Cameron’s power cell was going. I mean Cameron could have said “John it should feel cold,” but she doesn’t say that. She doesn’t say anything. John has to ask her if what he’s feeling is how its suppose to feel.
And suddenly Cameron wants to break out Sarah and then go to Weavers.
I mean the girl doesn’t even take a tranquilizer gun which might have been helpful. And her voice was also messed up at the end.
This also explains why they show in the beginning clip Cameron getting tossed into the wall. Maybe her sensors are damaged and if she had stuck around John might have ended up sick. Going to the future and getting a new body might and getting out that pesky skynet programming might have been her only option.
I guess the hard stunt they were talking about was the HK crashing into the office.
@ CJ you sound like me. I would just like to say that my family is now officially sick of my TSCC talks. I think they are hoping we’ll get a season 3 so I just stop talking about TSCC!! Thank goodness for the internet!!!
LOL Dan
Cameron: I hate this place.
John turns quizzically to stare at Cameron.
Cameron: There are no birds.
Oh my God…I will pay to see that on the show!!! LOL!!!
And I have to say it but I could care less about watching T4. There I said it. But season 3 of TSCC oh I care…I care BIG time.
LOL thanks Snake. Yeah I’ve never really been into the terminator movies. I did like T2…that was my favorite but to be really honest not really into terminator…until this show came along and I got hooked on TSCC (Thanks to Cameron and well Jameron).
But I might rent T4 when if comes out on DVD…we’ll see. I think it depends on if TSCC gets to see the season 3 light or not.
Now hand over the S2 DVD set and give us a Season 3!!!
A bake sale…hadn’t really planned on it. More like a need to make hot crossed buns asap kind of deal (and they are SO GOOD)!!!
But if my cooking can save the show that would be amazing.:) And by the way I do add vanilla extract to my pancake mix long before Cameron recommended it!! LOL.
I’ll save a few for you Snake!
Ugh, I just stumbled upon the news that terminator might not be picked up for the next season! I’m devastated. I heard Season Finale (not series finale) and thought, ok, don’t have to worry about this show. >sigh< What will i watch now? Dollhouse getting canceled as well. gah.
CJ, I have to wait for the DVD set to come out, but I’m looking forward to re-watching all her scenes in the new light.
I think Cameron needed the JH body because as Murch told Weaver JH’s programming was both in the sotware and the hardware. The files without the body wouldn’t be enough. She needed to bring the entire ‘package’ to future John, so she uploaded his info on a/or/her spare chip, and put them both into JH and made the jump. JH’s file are on one chip, she’s on the other. JH’s program was not ready to jump or deal with the outside world, and definitely not the post JD world. He was still developmentally a child. He needs Cameron’s chip to do all that.
If Cameron traded place with JH and was in the computer in the basement, there would have been more to her message to John. After she transferred JH’s info to a chip, she wiped the computers clean and all they were able to do was relay a one phrase message. (I’m sorry John). She wiped them clean because presentday John told her to destroy JH and she was following that order, and because she probably realized that if Caliba got to the basement, it would use the info to build Skynet.
Cameron’s loyalty was to John, not Weaver. Cameron knew that future John would not want JH destroyed, he’d want the program and would want Cameron to bring it to him. So she accomplished both - took the program away from the present, but saved it for future John. The last Cameron heard from Weaver (from Jesse after the sub incident) - Weaver was not interested in working with John. She may have asked present day Cameron to join her, but as far as Cameron knew, it wasn’t an alliance with John, just a personal invitation for Cameron. So Cameron decided to act on her own and take JH to future John. If Weaver followed, all the better, it would give future John the meeting with Weaver he was seeking in the first place.
The fact that Weaver went after JH is significant. She needs JH in the present, and she needs to bring him back. Notice though she didn’t seem pissed that Cameron hijacked JH - she seemed almost relieved. Could be because JH was now ‘preserved’ and moved by Cameron before Caliba could get to him - something Murch couldn’t accomplish.
Of course, all that assumes that Cameron was operating on all cylinders which she didn’t completely appear to be be at the end. She could’ve made the jump because her glitches were coming back and she was afraid she’d hurt John if she stayed around.
I dont care (much) that which character Summer would be at S3 (if we even get it). Ofc I prefer more Cameron due its much more interesting character, but Allison would be ok too. I.. we just need more Summer, thats it.
BTW do anyone know that where and when we get confirmation about third season?
Haha, at that bed scene, I really thought that Cameron is going to say “I love you” after she said “John..” -.-
scfangirl…Interesting.
I like that Cameron might have given future John his meeting with Weaver.
I did notice that Weaver wasn’t as ticked off as I thought she would be. Also notice that neither Sarah or John have any weapon’s on them. Cameron must have made sure because she did not want a repeat of the sub incident.
Could also be that Cameron has a number of motives.
My question is…did Cameron suspect that John would be willing to time travel to save her? Or that Weaver would take him along?
Cameron told Sarah in S&D ‘don’t ever let him do that again‘. Yet Sarah let John time travel.
Dear god we need a Season 3!!!
Couldn’t agree more on the relationship pairings and you’re right about Buffy, if any show pushed the limit in taboo relationships it was that one. She tried the normal guys but it just didn’t work out no matter how hard she tried. The only times she was happy was with Angel and towards the end with Spike (not six but season seven). Anyway the point is once she got past the whole “you’re not human, you don’t feel anything, you can’t feel love” she wound up being a lot more happy, despite having to constantly defend Spike from her friends one of whom even tried to kill him for her own good (sound familiar?)
THAT SAID, let’s get back to the John/Cam thing.
Unlike the two vamp boys Cameron will probably never be able to “get a soul” or “feel emotions” because she is a machine and in the terminator universe magic and the supernatural doesn’t play as much a role. It’s sci-fi. The only three ways I could imagine Cameron of being able to feel is either one: some cosmic enigma comes along and gives her the ability to feel joy (for those of you Star Trek Next Generation fans out there you know what I’m talking about) OR John sits down and starts writing code that one allows her to simulate what would make a person laugh, what would make a person cry, what would make a person feel and then give her a learning power so advanced that she could eventually use these simulations as a guideline to develop her own likes and dislikes OR and I can’t take credit for this idea because I read it in a T:SCC fanfiction story (still a very originial and very creative idea that actually struck true to an event that took place in the official show) Cameron downloads a bunch of viruses that corrupts her programming and compels her to do illogical actions. Essentially it gives her an evil conscience as well as her good well mannered logical one (picture an angel on one shoulder and a devil on the other) and Cameron has to choose what is morally best in each situation. I think they tried to do that in the second season but they didn’t push it far enough, it was either entirely good Cameron or evil Cameron trying to kill John. They did better with John Henry actually when he was hacked but still they didn’t explore it enough I felt.
So there’s the three:
1. cosmic entity
2. the epitome of advanced programming
3. viruses/hack
In my opinion 2 and 3 make the most sense with 3 having the highest probability of succeeding.
So many tantalising questions…..
Sarah’s fate? Danny Dyson’s current disposition, possible role in Termie tech, under duress or free will? Is there more to Savannah’s role or future? Does the detective actually believe in Judgment Day, has he somehow come across JDay pointers, or found Termi parts here and there? Will our John go back to A Sarah, or will our Sarah ever reunite with A future John? Where’s Weaver now? Where’s Cameron?
OMG!..OMFG!!!
This episode was so great, so fantastic! Josh where do you get it all from? ..Im really speechless. I cried like a little girl at the ending lol
There better be a season 3 now! Ive done all the voting I can to help out!
OMG that episode blew my mind! literally! i was absolutely gobsmacked at the ending ! was not expecting that at all but it was the most fantastic episode ever! we so need season 3! it set it up for such a great concept and storyline!! also was it just me or did kyle look as if he knew who john was????
So So great ! how imagine no saison 3 with that kind of ending !
It’s following all around the world and we love it !
American, be happy to have Fox ! That chanel sucks !!!! They build Simpson and Sarah Connor Chronicles ! Thanks
Awesome series!!! I hope there is a season three!!!! I have never posted
to an TV show blog before. I don’t even watch TV. I watched this online
and became hooked. This is the most I’ve enjoyed sci-fi since I was a kid
watching re-runs of the original Star Trek.
Maybe this show will be a little like Star Trek, which kept getting brought back. I hope so!
Here is my question:
Why did Sarah stay behind? She protected John against the relatively minor dangers of our time, but she wasn’t willing to go with him into the future to help protect him in the future? It seems out of character!!!
” SNAKE;- Allison is his spouse? Which orifice did you pull that out of? There was never any indication that JC and Allison had any type of close relationship.”
no need to be rude. To be honest we do not know anything about Allison to make any assumption. Why is everyone so against it anyway.
Jeez people. Get over it, Cameron is dead.
John didnt really have much choice to go with weaver or not. i dont think he was going after camerons chip.
Also i dont think John Henry jumped through time, if he did i think they all would of known it, not exactly a quiet thing. Also if he did why didnt the building fall down or something. Remember the Bank Vault, it destroyed the entire building. Wouldnt it of killed Sarah and ellision as well.
As a season and series finale.. this is the best thing I have ever watched! Its warmed the place up nicely for the Salvation movie. If the series ends here it will end on a high rather than a stuttering fudge. It would of course be nice to have a series 3 assuming quality can be maintained.
@Chris She wants to stop it from ever happening. John however was born into being hunted. He may want to stop Skynet for good but some priorities seems to be more important (read: cameron).
The sad thing it seems is that that Skynet seems already to be operational, if it really is Skynet who infilitrated JH system. If so, it seems like it is not connected to any military hardware and no nukes have gone of yet. So the question is if Skynet is not owned by the military any more who got their hands on Skynet? And what events initiated that change? Has Dyson’s kid anything to do about it?
So when Weaver and JC are transported through to the future, have they been inserted to before Allison from Palmdale got captured and replicated, and either of the Reese brothers have been sent back in time, or are they on a different timeline where John Connor wasn’t around to lead the resistance against skynet so Kyle Reese was never sent to save John Connor since the resistance seemed to be doing about the same without him.
Meanwhile back in John Henry’s room, why was his screen saying he was sorry? Why did Cameron transfer her chip into Cromartie’s body instead of smash the computer up? Why would Weaver time travel away from her John Henry leaving him vulnerable to other terminator attacks.. and Sarah Connor?
MattLive and Chris: Yes, she wants stop Skynet here but she doesn’t mind with her son. If she stops Skynet, Reese will not come back and John never will be born. He was borned so Sarah will not stop Skynet. So we must get S3 Anyway, Sarah died a few years ago, she lives only because of the time-jump. So she had to say a thank you to Cameron to save her life
I quite frankly am amazed you spent any time thinking why I’m watching the show.
Well, you hang in there so tight that it makes you kind of sweet, as CW would put it, so why shouldn’t I care?
Quite frankly, many of your responses are just so downright depressing that it would be a wonder not to wonder.
I agree with getting over Cameron, she is vaporized….
Alison as a resistance fighter also a potential romantic interest is a dynamic addition to the show. It will fit right in with the new trilogy. And keep fans from getting confused with all the talk of shipping a Terminator that confesses that no matter what it will always have the need to kill John Connor. The robo lovers need to not worry about having Cameron get all the screen time. We got the sentiment the first few hundred posts.
After watching the show a second time, at the very end there was some lightning flashes and you heard Sarah say “I love you too”. Maybe Sarah followed John to the future?
I wonder if there is a shrink somewhere analyzing this jameronite, jallisonite (soon jallironite?) waltz?
I personally favor Allison in a robot body (the jallironite party) but who listens? Still, this is what’d have the most potential IMHO.
Otherwise a warm blooded Allison has its advantages but is known territory mostly.
Cammy has other kind of potentials, offers new territory and, apparently if we judge by the S&M ’sex scene’ of B2R, is more to the taste of those who appreciate kink.
one of the many things that i loved the show for was how those little bits of robot “humor” get snuck in.things that become funny or weird sounding only because we the audience know that they are coming from robots.
john henry’s “TWENTY”,mentioned above.it’s not simply he rolled and got a pleasant surprise that it landed on the twenty,it’s the fact that,as we learned a little earlier,he could roll whatever number he wants but he still looks up all surprised and happy announcing “TWENTY” as if it was a genuine surprise.
during john henry’s “home invasion” and confrontation with riley,it’s very tense and could turn deadly any second,and he throws out the “thank you for your time” with a smile,not knowing the awkward turn that that action took the confrontation.
weaver’s “cow’s blood” remark.
savanah complaining that her lap is cold,and weaver’s matter-of-fact “i know”.
About “sex-scene” between John and Cam, yeah, it was really good done.
Authors had a lot of possibilities, some interesting, some predictables, other stupid (like kissing or someone else…).
No, in the end Cam let John touchin her heart. Her cold heart. It’s a beautiful moment, very intimate, and very… sad.A Bit funny, she seems emotionally involved as much as John is embarassed.
Really i have an heartache when i saw it.
What other perfect scene like this do you know ? Mr.Friedman thank you for shooting the best in the end!
About the rest…i was thinkin about character’s death, and i was fooled as many others, by concentrating my attention on them in their future versions…
But don’t forget, people, that they are all alive ! Derek, Reese, Allison lives in John’s contemporary era, we saw them in previous episodes ! Theu are kids, but there they are!
So, it was easy to think that this thing would have been used to open new unexpected doors in the history, like in Born to Run’ ending !
I think that “double” summer could be a powerful element for a S3…but be aware of an easy “love-story”, they often failed in front of Terminator super-excited-fans !!
But after this masterpiece in the end, Mr.Friedman, i trust in you.
I told that if i were missing something in recent episodes, like temporal-jump, parallele universe, conspiration, i would have excuse with you.
Here they are, Mr.Friedman!
I think John has to recover Cameron,absolutely! Her chip is too important.
But it should be funny as hell to see what coul happen in the future with Allison and the other…gang is reunited for the first time!
I think John could have alot of problems with Allison
I ‘m just wondering why Cameron gave her chip to JH: was that her mission? Find an alliance with him? But…who’s him? Please try understand me clearly, because i start rewatching the episode as soon as possible!
What aobut Weaver’s guerrilla’s dresses??
What about JH? Where is he gone??
Wha tabout Sarah? She remained in the past with Ellison and Cameron’s empty body?
I think John could have alot of problems with Allison
Wellllllcome to adulthood, real women department. Throw in the mix that JC loves Cameron, not Allison… can’t have a relationship to Cameron because this is not her Destiny, can’t have a relationship with Allison because she is not Cameron while being to much like her… il n’y a pas d’amours heureuses.
I ‘m just wondering why Cameron gave her chip to JH: was that her mission? Find an alliance with him? But…who’s him? Please try understand me clearly, because i start rewatching the episode as soon as possible!
I’m pretty sure that Cam agreed to the alliance, simply, that she was sorry to fail John in her protector role, simply, and that Weaver is not deceiving anyone when she says that JH role is to become a decisive element in humanity’s eventual survival.
What about Weaver’s guerrilla’s dresses??
Hey the woman is beautiful, she rocks like few do, she knows what she wants and she makes her own clothing! What more can a man ask for? Oh well, maybe a thermostat.
What about JH? Where is he gone??
Where have they gone maybe… well to the same place/time as CW and JC I’d surmise.
Wha tabout Sarah? She remained in the past with Ellison and Cameron’s empty body?
That, my dear sir, is the most puzzling part of it all.
If she actually stops Skynet then Kyle doesn’t come back from the future and there is not JD and no John and no Sarah the warrior, just Sarah the Waitress and Skynet wins, unopposed… loopy-loop
If John actually come back at about the same time he left there is no Sarah story to tell.
If Sarah decides that this is all too fucked up, marries Ellison who every gal on the set find yummy apparently go raise Savannah in the Bermudas… maybe she can branch the Terminator franchise into a reality show?
scfangirl, I really liked and agree with most of your thoughts and theories.
But, what really annoys me is the doubt about who is in Cameron’s chip.
JH didn’t had a chip, he relyed on all those mainframes to function. Cameron had her own chip.
I don’t think that data from both would fit in one chip. So, who would prevail?
It seems to be that JH’s data is more ctitical and important (and valuable).
So i’m inclined to believe that Cameron somehow “sacrificed” herself, by giving JH her own chip, and enabling him to overwrite his data on the chip and escape from there.
The “I’m Sorry John” message seemed to be like a goodbye, her way to say goodbye to John Connor.
I’m a rabid fan who wants a season 3 as much as anybody else. I still think in some ways we were lucky to get as many episodes as we did. Hopefully Fox (like last spring) appreciates the show and gives it another chance.
Josh, you and all involved with the show (especially the cast and writers) did a hell of a job taking a franchise known more for crazy action (awesome as that is) and giving it characters and a story that have real depth and development that make all of us care so much. Absolute worst case, know many people appreciate the amazing job you all did with this show.
This was my favorite episode of Terminator thus far. The tension between John and Cameron was great as was the sadness in John once he realized what Cameron had done. The way Cameron went into that jail and seemed only to scare off rather than kill the officers was interesting. As was Sarah’s unwillingness to follow John to help him find Cameron. Maybe they should change the name of the show to the Terminator Chronicles or the John Connor Chronicles so that warranting more time for John’s path would be seen. John’s face when he saw “Allison”, Derek and Kyle was heart wrenching - he lost his mother only to gain these three, although if there is a season three i am sure his mission would still be to reclaim Cameron (whom he loves but seemed constantly mean to). It will be interesting to see him step up and lead and how his relationship with weaver and the other john will be established. Even if Fox cancelled this show - another studio could pick it up. I am crossing my fingers and hoping for the best - yet assuming the worst. This is the only show on TV that I look forward to watching, I make sure to make no plans that would interfere with my watching TSCC. I will be sad if they are not renewed.
Did we ever find out what model of terminator Cameron was? And as she was going to the library every night and researching historical documents, etc. - maybe she knew all along her chip was going to be needed for the future resistance.
This is the only show on network TV right now that I try to catch every week. Unfortunately my job has me working Friday Evenings, so I have to watch it on line. I LOVE IT… Watched from the Pilot to now!!!
Here comes a great sci-fi show that actually has a great story and some good acting involved and yet it is going to be dropped because fox moved it away from Monday nights.
Honestly T:SCC is the only reason I watch any Fox Programing. I Hate foxes plethora of Reality shows that are just pointless. In addition I knew when fox moved it to Fridays it was going to die. Why does fox like to keep supporting shows who’s concepts are really really old or failed two seasons ago. (IE: American Idol, 24, The Osborns and even Doll house.) COME ON!!!
I SAY KEEP T:SCC on the air… Or personally I will just stop watching fox TV network for good. The last 5 episodes of T:SCC have kept me on the edge of my seat!!! WHY DITCH a show that does that.
I think because of all this canceling the show talk and the whole new beginning that has been put forth by the finale, they could just rename the show Terminator: Rebirth. Then they can follow whichever story lines they want without having to focus entirely on Sarah or John.
This is the only show I am attached to on TV, the only show I actually blog, vote and fight for. Don’t even know why… kind of scary really.
Rafael, it sure looked like an implied “Good Bye” to me also, and she decided to sacrifice herself for the future of mankind and John Connor.
Did anyone here see anything at all in the last few scenes to imply Cameron’s code is still in the JH body? Or is that just wishful thinking by the fans hoping to save Cam? I know a lot of people brought up a number of possibilites.
John Connor jumped off thinking he needs to try to save her chip, but did you guys see any other implication at all? If there was, I still missed it after multiple viewings.
Obviously the writers can cook up a story to continue her character later if needed, but I’m referring to what you actually saw here in this finale.
the best indication is the fact that Cameron is by far the best character in the show and a fan fav. If, God willing, there is a 3rd season, I’m certain she’ll be brought back.
I agree she’s a fan fav. For me also. I’m just trying to make sure I have a good handle on what Josh implied regarding Cam’s actions in these last few scenes. I’d have to agree with Rafael.
darknay47, I would think most fans of the show want to see Cam back since she was so popular with them. Either one is ok with me, really. Cam was a lot of fun, but maybe her part of the story ended in their vision for additional seasons. Don’t know.
I just watched the season finale twice back to back! I have been and continue to be a die hard fan, from the pilot episode and for the whole series! FOX give us season 3 please!!! I look forward to watching it every friday night! Please Continue The Series!!!
Josh Friedman, I hated the way you used Cameron this season, and Derek. They were almost non-existent. However I believe you have learned from your mistakes and having seen the last 2 episodes I’m totally certain of one thing. You are now the right man for the job. Adam raised a Cain was the best of the best of the best. And the finale, what you did to Cameron, I hate it, but I loved it too. Kudos for having balls to go against mainstream tv.
I critisize a lot but you’ve totally won me over. If I make strange sounds and noises during a movie or show it’s always great and I was screaming at the tv this time.
It breaks my heart thinking it could end this way, we need more! I want John to find Cameron again but when they are together I totally don’t want them to hook up. But at the same time I want them together.Their chemistry is incredible. Summer and Thomas are a dreamteam.
Can i ask people who say that John/Cameron love line can’t happen, Why? Why do you think it is impossible?
After all, everything’s evolving.
Why can’t machines then? And in the series, there are some moments, where you can clearly see that Cameron has feelings, that she is different than other ones.
For example in the last episode, why would she bother writing “I’m sorry John” , id she didn’t feel anything?
150k completed torrent downloads just from one site.
100k completed for Dollhouse
27k completed for Ghost Whisper
Dear Fox, please hire someone who knows how to reach the correct audience; and preferably not such a horrible time slot so that people don’t have to DvR, Tivo, Torrent the shows because ‘you’ are too incompetent to make a good programing schedule.
Great show..fantastic ending,I was blown away about 4 times in 30 seconds..(the gripping final 30 seconds).
I ve read through all of the posts here,and really enjoyed seeing everyones ‘take’ on whats going on/whats going to happen ect ect
Of course I have my own ideas ..but my thinking watching this has always been based on a couple of things that I havent really seen anyone else mention..the first
is a ‘minor’ and didnt really come into play until this superb last episode..
Danny Dyson..for those of you who havent read the Terminator Comics (my ’saftey net’, if they dont decide to make another series,guaranteed this will continue in comic form)
Danny is John Conners best friend when he is the leader of the resistance (they become friends b4 JD)..
he is also the one who is trying along with John to ‘reprogramme’ the Chip in a captured Terminator…(only the 2 of them know this)
the comic mini series is called ‘T2 Nuclear Twilight’ printed in 1995/96…it tells the story of how John gets an Arnie Terminator and then ‘rechips’ it to send back after he learns of Skynets time travel strategy..of course he sends Reese first..which we also see..
having re read this story only a few days before this season finale..it was very intriguing that the writers slipped this in…the fact that hes ‘missing’ (no one to reprogramme chip in future..? does Cam know this..? is this why she and JH have an urgent need to transport the ‘learning chip’ to the future..? has Danny been took out by Skynet..or even Cameron herself)…I know a million more questions..lol
any way my point is that the Danny Dyson mention was genius…Im convinced the writer has read all the comics too…all this ‘chip’ juggling with JH and Cam.. and a Danny Dyson storyline outta nowhere suddenly…
which I absolutly urge EVERYONE who likes this show…or the Terminator franchise to read…I thought I understood time travel till I read that …your brain will hurt but its worth it…who was Johns ‘original’ father..?…how did John beat Terminators on his own..? why did he send back Arnie knowing that the Terminator failed or he would not be standing there..? some great questions and the Authour of the site (an expert in all these time travel theories) makes a great effort to answer them…(its like another film in a way)….
but my main reason for directing yall to that site ..and what has been in the back of my mind all along was the Authors attempt at concluding the story…what he thinks ‘has to happen’ in order for the time line to continue…(for one JD has to happen which is ironic …ive known this all the time while watching this show)…
and so I get to my main point..(at last ) throughoutthe series Cam seemed to be keeping somthing from John ..somthing she couldnt tell him…Ill copy and paste the ’solution’ that the Authour comes up with (although he is talking about the films ,I think this works for the series too)..If I replace ‘John coming back himself’ with ‘Cameron coming back with orders from John’ it seems to make sense ..to me..at least…
FROM THE SITE LINKED ABOVE
”He can invade the past once more, this time taking the initiative to reach the past first. If a temporal recall device has been developed, he might even come himself.
In this scenario, John, from a point in the future beyond all of the time travelers to date, devises a way to build a weakness into Skynet. In order to win the war, he must return to the past and penetrate the systems of the company which ultimately develops Skynet. At this point he must create the flaw, a weakness which will be undetected by the developers, and which will not prevent the war or any of the temporal transits previously made, but which the rebels can use after he leaves for the past to end the war. While he is in the past, he must give to his younger self the secret, but in a form which the young John cannot fully comprehend until he reaches the same point in the future. Thus, John will understand that a weakness exists in Skynet because he went back in time and put it there, and that that weakness must not be accessed until after he goes back in time, or time is lost. This creates a simple N-Jump, at the end of which the rebels will be able to stop Skynet by accessing that weakness”
Again to appriciate all this time travel stuff I suggest you read that site its facsinating..
oh and there have been new Terminator comics coming out that prequel the T4 movie …i recommend them too…
sorry for waffling but I just had to get my ‘theories’ out there too…
@darknay47
For me it would have to be Cameron. Most of my enjoyment in watching Summer comes from the Quirky character’s she plays, and how she brings them to life.
Summer playing a normal human role would not be as interesting to watch. A few Alison episodes would be cool to see, but then how do you get back to Cameron?
For Cameron to exist Alison would have to die, or so I think, and John would not allow that even for Cam. Could be a mess.
Bottom line for me: The show goes, how Cameron goes.
I’m sensing a blog post in this, but a few comments before I start thinking much about it:
My interpretation of the Cameron/JH transfer was very straightforward: Cameron submits to let JH remove her chip. JH has to improvise a bridge so that the connector on Cameron’s CPU will fit into JH’s T-888 socket (different models, different connectors). Apparently that’s what all the playtime was for with the legos and bionicles Once Cameron’s chip was installed and JH still connected to the server farm, there was some exchange of info but not a complete rewrite as it’s unlikely Cameron’s CPU circuitry would “fit” JH’s patterns.
Remember, we have time constraints as the time it took for the Connors to go up to Weavers, get attacked, and get downstairs was very short. During that time, Camenry would have to not only disconnect from the server farm but also activate the time travel protocols…which, as we saw, took a fair amount of time to cycle all the way through. So, basically, it was get chip, unplug, do time travel.
As another interesting exercise, imagine all of the Cameron scenes with the terminator being Garret (or Arnold) and not Summer. It’s weird, but it still works. Sorta.
So, who is in the future? I’d say it’s pretty much Cameron with some JH. In the past, Mostly JH, but now seeded with a little Cameron. As long as Mr. Murch keeps things running, and starts having it build smaller versions of itself, there could be material in the future that John and Cat might be able to use. After all, the basement of ZeiraCorp seems to be in the hands of the resistance in 2027.
It’s not that far fetched to think that if this is a different, as I put it, “Bizzaro” Time Line then character motivations might be different.
Allison Young, the first time around, was portrayed as an innocent… a pawn and a sacrificial lamb in the machinations of John Connor and other big forces.
Her fate is still the same: she must die in order for Cameron to be “born.”
Why not put some spunk and an “evil streak” into this new “Bizzaro” Allison. John is warming to her… a little… just because she looks like Cameron. They become close, but only on a friendship level. He thinks he has found someone who is willing to help out in his quest in this time frame.
However, Allison is not what she appears to be. As I stated a few posts above, she has her own agenda and outlook on things. Because of a certain “mindset” she will truly betray John.
A neat little twist since we know that Cam’s “betrayal” was basically a good one… Allison Young’s, Cam’s human “dopelganger,” betrayal is very real and shocking to us and to John.
“Bizzaro” Allison was either aligned with Jesse (Old Jesse who survived because Derek didn’t kill her and let her go) to get rid of “metal” or she’s a Gray in league with Skynet.
John Henry has agreed to help John break into the belly of the beast, a Terminator manufacturing plant, to place Cameron into a new and improved body.
John [practically pleading with JH] Will you help me?
John Henry: Why should I do that?
John: Because I love her.
John Henry [cocking his head slightly]: Fair enough.
—
Allison and Derek agree to come as back up support. Remember, this is a different Derek, but still John’s uncle.
They are walking down the line of endoskeletons on display.
John Connor [looking around at the army of endos, in awe]: It’s like a twisted Macy’s Department Store.
Derek: And not a Santa Claus in sight.
John Henry [walking up to a particular model]: This one.
John Connor: Why that one?
John Henry: It’s tight.
John Connor [doing a double take]: Good enough.
—
John Henry and John have shut off the “alarm system.” They have the run of the place. They activate the assembly machine and the robot arm selects the correct endo. Derek is walking point. John instructs Allison to get into the body scanner.
Allison [looking startled]: Why me?
John [ever so slightly forcefully; a leader speaking]: Just do it…. please.
Allison hesitates, and then moves over towards the machine, and is about to step inside.
John: You’ll have to disrobe.
Allison [sarcastically]: Wonderful.
—
Allison’s pattern is placed into the system and the endo roles along the assembly line and into the Kaliba Systems tissue generation device [it looks the same as in the T2 teaser trailer]. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TctwLOSY4M0
John Henry [to John; he's sitting and has been plugged into the system]: Just a moment. [closes his eyes, the corners of his mouth turn up a tad, and then opens them]. Ready.
The tissue machine rumbles to life. On the screen:
Steam blasts out as the doors roll open. The steam clears and there stands Cameron, eyes open and blankly staring as they have wiped the installed chip clean. She is the same, lovely and flawlessly perfect, and yet her hair is in a different and more flattering style, draped and tastefully aligned as to cover her bare torso.
The camera trucks dramatically in on Allison’s stunned reaction.
Allison [finishing buttoning her shirt, freezes]: Dear God…. it’s me… what have you done, John?
John looks at John Henry weirdly [it's the hair]. John Henry smiles back impishly.
Allison has very slowly moved forward to stand in front of her twin. She’s frightened, and confused, and yet compellingly drawn toward it. She turns back to stare at John.
Allison: This… this is insane. What the hell is going on?
John [walking over to Cameron's inert form and lovingly draping his coat around her shoulders to cover her.
John [mumbling]: I’ll explain later. [he guides the compliant Cameron over to the chair next to John Henry, lays her back, and plugs her into the system. John Henry's eyes have closed as the transfer system is engaged and data starts streaming.
Allison [getting steamed; the light bulb going off over her head]: This is the “friend” you were telling me about, isn’t it? [grabbing John and turning him around] Isn’t it?
John is silent.
Allison [slapping him, hard]: You bastard!
John is stunned and yet doesn’t protest.
Allison: Why John? Just tell me why…
John [glancing at Cameron, his eyes soften]: I need her… she’s important.
Allison [marching over to stand next to Cameron and John Henry]: It’s a machine! They’re machines, John! They’re not important! I’m important, you’re important… we’re real! The only thing these monsters are good for are… scrap metal!
John: You don’t understand.
Allison [tearing up]: Oh, I’m beginning to understand all right! You’re in love with this… this thing, and that’s made you blind… and weak! She [meaning Jesse] was right about you! She was right. [whipping her gun out and pointing it right at Cameron's skull, right by the chip port].
John [sounding a bit dangerous]: Don’t.
Allison [tears streaming down her face]: Aim for the chip. That’s where they’re vulnerable. That’s what I was told.
John [reaching towards his gun; he pleads beseechingly]: Allison…
Allison [horror dripping from every word]: It has my face, John! It has my face! How could you…?! [her finger tightens on the trigger]
A shot rings out and echoes around the complex like a crack of thunder. Allison stares, wide-eyed at John (one last accusation), and crumples to the floor.
John is standing, thunderstruck, his arm still raised, and breathing hard. He lowers it mechanically, and backs slowly up and stumbles against the control workstation. He’s crying too.
Allison’s eyes are fixed and staring at Cameron… and Cameron’s eyes magically open. She sits up and pulls the cable from the back of her head. Her head turns and she notices Allison laying contorted in a pool of her blood. She walks and stands over her body, and then bends down, reaches out, and closes her eyes.
Cameron [with a hint of emotion]: I’m sorry.
She walks over to stand next to John who has his head in his hand and is sobbing, and puts her arm around him, in a moment of freak compassion.
Cameron [softly]: Let’s go home, John. Let’s go home.
John leans into her and continues to cry. Derek has come up behind the scene.
Fade out.
—-
John, Cameron, Derek, and John Henry are standing on a hillside overlooking the desolation and ruin. They’re around an unmarked grave for Allison.
Derek [walking past Cameron, now garbed in a resistance uniform]: She died for you. Don’t ever forget it. [he claps a comforting hand on John's shoulder and then walks off]
Cameron glances at Derek, but says nothing.
John Henry [to John in a gentle and childlike manner]: It had to be.
John is still silently introspective. John and Cameron, standing closely together, and John Henry stare out at the Land of Oz, the land of nothing.
Cameron [to John]: I hate this place.
John turns quizzically to Cameron. He is stunned by the blunt and uncharacteristic statement of opinion.
Cameron: There are no birds.
—
They continue to gaze out at a scene of destruction, of a land laid barren, that must not be allowed to be. They finally return to the past, where they belong… to fight the good fight for a better tomorrow: find Kaliba, stop Skynet… and reach for hope.
Allison will not have died in vain, and Jesse will not be proven right.
I enjoy how Summer has played Cameron - it would be difficult to get into a human character portrayed by her in Terminator, probably for the John character as well. For him, there will be questions for how a terminator sent to protect him in the past actually has a human counterpart in the future.
and I think that “Cameron” will be fully intact (her chip) just merged with John Henry to further the development and knowledge needed to help defeat skynet. JH may even create a Cameron terminator to send back to John once he gets settled and has embraced all the information from Cam’s chip.
So CJ, what you’re saying is easily conceivable for viewers and writers. But there was no clue in the filming of these scenes or the dialog, to indicate anything like that happened, and that it was anything more than Cameron sacrificing herself and giving her chip to JH. The camera shots showing her basically dead. As in, “Yep, she’s dead alright”. And her message sure looked like Good Bye.
Everything we’ve seen posted by fans is basically wishful thinking in how the writers might later explain bringing her back as the “same” Cameron.
I’m trying to make sure I caught everything Josh was implying with subtle dialog, quick camera shots showing some little detail, or whatever method he might have used. I really didn’t see anything else. And that’s what I was wondering because of all the fans saying Cam’s code is still on the chip. They’re just hoping I guess. There really was no indication.
I get it. Time travelers CAN change certain things about the past (eg. Cameron taking out the would-be presidential assassin term that came in the 1920’s) but they CANNOT change the events that were the direct result of their timetravel in the first place. This means they CANNOT stop JD, Jessie cannot get John to end his attachment to Cameron, etc. It also means the original timeline never saw the death of John Connor, but it did for some reason warrant the sending of Resistance fighters and the good terms., maybe to give the Resistance a better fighting chance in the future.
Facts:
- John Henry had no chip in his head (Sarah destroyed it when killing Cromartie)
- John Henry was plugged on the turk servers which were the same as the small chip.
- John Henry had to be moved (CW indicates) and he couldnt with all the hardware.
- Cameron gave her chip to John Henry so he can OVERWRITE his data on her chip.
- John Henry did put her chip into his head, WHILE he was still plugged on the servers and possible before or meanwhile the procedure Cameron told him to leave a Sorry message for John.
- John Henry is now John Henry and there is no mixup of two AI’s on same chip. Cameron is officially DEAD, she sacrificed herself because she loved John so much and was worried she could hurt him.
If there will be season 3, then Summer will play Allison. If Cameron ever gets recreated in the future she WONT be the same Cameron as you knew, she wont have the same memories, the same “lovely” glitches etc..
That’s certainly the way it looked to me, Cam. Based on everything Josh gave us in this episode.
The only way he might have indicated otherwise was John jumping into the future thinking he needs to find and save her chip or something. But it felt like a futile effort to me. And by that I mean based on the clues given to us by Josh in his subtle ways.
don’t we know, form a certain deleted scene of T2, that part of the programming of a Terminator is on ROM? This part couldn’t be overwritten. It is also likely that on it there should be the core programming, the essential directives, the very nature of that terminator.
@Gary - From a purely technical point of view there is even less to suggest that JH transferred himself into the chip. I almost want to quote Cameron’s, “I don’t think you understand how we work,” but given that none of us really understands how these fictional beings work a lot of left for grabs. We are reliant, then, on what our technology is able to do and what we’ve seen in the past.
While a terminator might have several chips, only one is considered to be the “brain”. This wonder is not only a processing device, but a storage device (as we learned in “Vick’s Chip”). The essence of a terminator resides in this chip. As Cameron pointed out, the essence of a terminator is both in its software and it hardware (something Mr. Murch was also describing to Catherine). While it might be possible to download the contents of a “chip” to an identical chip, it’s extremely unlikely that you could download contents for an alien construct (e.g. the John Henry server farm) and have it function correctly into a chip that isn’t due to be manufactured for another 16 years or so. It would be like trying to get a program written to run under CP/M-80 to run under Windows (any flavor) even though the core of a Windows machine, its BIOS is still based on CP/M 80. Not an easy thing to do at all, and it never ever quite works right even if you do get it to run.
Also, there is the data transfer vs time factor. For JH to wipe and inhabit Cameron’s chip would require a massive download of data in just a few minutes. Let’s see…if we figure that a terminator chip is a one-half equivalent to a human brain (and that’s doing a great disservice to terminators), then that gives us a starting neural count about about 35 billion. Multiply this by the size an average neuron needs for storage, processing, addressing/connections, etc… we’ll be very conservative and add in four orders of magnitude (the usual brain is has about 4 orders of magnitude more connections than it does neurons) so that brings us to 350 trillion. But that’s just connections. We still need to add in the storage and processing. Even if it’s simple, it’s going to take room…figure another order of magnitude to 3.5 quadrillion. Converting this to 64-bit words (i.e. multiplying by we have a final estimate of 28 pebibytes (PiB).
If we then allow 10 minutes for the time of the Connors’ visit to Weaver and the journey to the basement, that gives us just 600 seconds to overwrite Cameron’s alien computer architecture with John Henry’s. That gives us a necessary throughput of 500 trillion bits per second…and that’s assuming no time taken for chip removal, programming the chronoportation device, etc.
All I can say is that if JH has that sort of throughput, I want the name of ZeiraCorp’s ISP, because I get nothing close to that (my broadband is about 50 million times slower).
So…factoring all of that in, it seems unlikely that JH had the resources necessary to do anything more than to put Cameron’s brain into Cromartie’s chronoportable (i.e. undamaged) body.
From the “Will you join us” question exchange both here and “Today is the Day, Part 2″, it’s not difficult to assume that Cam and Cat are from essentially the same timeline and are aware of the same deal. Cameron’s chip traveling back to the future, as does CW, is a logical continuation of a renewal of that once-failed alliance.
From what we’ve seen, terminators seem more concerned with the brain than the body. Or do they? Will CW be as unsettled by JH acting like Cameron as JC will be by Cameron looking like Cromartie?
From my perspective at least, I don’t think Cameron went to the future be of any shipper issues. I think she’s in the future mostly because of scientific reliance on Occam’s Razor.
For the record, I have no problem having miss Glau playing Allison. It will still be Summer Glau playing a character and I am sure, with good writing helping, that she’ll impart to this character everything needed to make her completely interesting.
Remember the vivacious and charming teen girl from the pilot?
Who sent the girl (Chola ) with the passports? What was up with her quoting ‘We lose everybody we love’
John called her, asked for new IDs and sent her to the priest, When she said ‘we lose everyone we love,’ she wasn’t quoting anyone, she was telling John that as one person who has lost to another. The writers could quit implying this stuff and tell you right out but then not nearly as much would happen and the episodes would bog down in details.
What was the priest’s message to Cameron?
To see that John followed Sarah’s instructions and left. The priest’s message from Cameron was “she’s coming”
John Henry and Weaver simultaneously say ‘We’ll see’ in response to Ellison saying that John will not leave his mother.
Are they trying to convince him to leave her? Is that their purpose?
Thay are trying to get Cameron to leave John and join them in their fight against Skynet
Did John Henry release the locks in the jail?
Of course he did, possibly a case of ‘the enemy of my enemy is my friend.’
Who sent the plane into the into the building?
The timing on the plane crash was perfect too perfect - Weaver must have orchestrated it.
Hello? Weaver’s man looking for the drone got killed. Kaliba sent the drone after Weaver/John Henry. Skynet/Kaliba doesn’t know she’s metal, it still thinks she’s the human, Catherine Weaver.
JH to Cameron: ‘I know you’
Cameron to JH: ‘and I know you’ (as in, I hacked into you?)
Neither hacked the other. She knows him because future John Henry is who sent the box with ‘Weaver’ in it to John in the first place. Going back in time to forge this alliance was probably Cameron’s most important mission after saving John.
Danny Dyson is missing? Following in his father’s work to create skynet? or trying to prevent it from happening too?
I figure he’s either bitter and wanting to build Skynet for revenge on the Connors or Kaliba has kidnapped him to make him do it.
Murch mentions that John Henry only exists as this specific hardware.
That makes me wonder if changing a wire ‘tweaked’ John Henry what kind of changes will ensue from being downloaded to a glitchy chip?
Where are JH / Cameron at the end? Cameron seems to have been downloaded into the Turk (hence the ‘I’m sorry John’ messages). So JH was downloaded on to Cameron’s chip and goes into the future?
I believe John Henry is on Cameron’s chip. I don’t know if Cameron is on it with him or not. She may have uploaded to the turk or she may have only left a message loop on it.
What is the significance of the chip from the T888 that Weaver fried?
Weaver didn’t fry it, it fried itself the same way as the one from contortionist terminator that Skynet sent to Dr Sherman’s office. Skynet redesigned it so it couldn’t be hacked. Weaver brought it to John Henry to see if he could hack it anyway so they could find out what the T-888 knew about Skynet/Kaliba.
My question is…did Cameron suspect that John would be willing to time travel to save her?
I don’t know if Cameron knew it but it’s possible future John sent Cameron to the past specifically because he knew it.
If she actually stops Skynet then Kyle doesn’t come back from the future and there is not JD and no John and no Sarah the warrior, just Sarah the Waitress and Skynet wins, unopposed… loopy-loop
Why? Time travel doesn’t depend on Skynet, Weaver can build a time machine. John knows where he comes from, he’ll want to make sure time travel is invented in any case and send Kyle back. It only breaks down if Kyle dies before he can be sent back.
Season 3:
I’d be looking for Sarah to look for Dyson, hunt Kaliba connections, maybe Ellison will help. That would be cut with scenes from how what she does affects John’s future. Maybe we’ll see changes she makes propagate through time and change John’s fate as it happens. He’ll have to send soldiers or terminators back from time to time to fight things Skynet sends back or to get intel to Sarah.
I think exploring how John is drawn to Alison but disappointed by her differences could be interesting. He knows if he wants Cameron back he has to let Skynet get to Alison. Will that be a moral dilemma for him or is there anything he can do to stop it if he wanted to? Also, don’t forget Alison’s personality was copied into Cameron to start with, she just can’t kick ass nearly as well. Whatever the male teenage viewers seem to think, John was always chiding her about being a killing machine, maybe he will welcome a warm, living, human version.
150k completed torrent downloads just from one site.
100k completed for Dollhouse
27k completed for Ghost Whisper
I for one quit watching Ghost Boobs (DH’s name for it) to watch Terminator.
Why would JH need to wipe out all Cams info? As John Henry has unique learning experiences in the basement with the Weaver family that made up his development, so has Cameron with the Connor family. She actually has more real world experiences than JH, he just got out of the basement. Yes JH had the internet an all the info he needed, but Cameron has had much more interaction with the outside world and humans. Seems to me both data sets would be very important, and remember Cameron was an unknown / special model cyborg that JH may need to have working knowledge of, so you would want the data from an intel point of view. It may even shed light on his “brother” depending on who or what built Cameron in the first place.
This is a totally new Future, unique and unto itself, that JH/Cameron and John Connor, and Weaver went to.
It has new rules and new characters who just look like the old ones.
I think the first couple episodes of Season 3 will be in the future, but once John has Cam and Weaver has John Henry and they have intel on Dyson and Kaliba… they’re out of there.
The Future scenes are just too expensive to focus on.
Like I said previously. This is Bizzaro Future with no John Connor to lead the resistance.
Connor… who?
This is his chance to realize that he’s needed elsewhere and is MUCHO important (the “It’s A Wonderful Life” schtick)…this strange land must not be allowed to continue. With this in mind… John Connor goes Back to the Past. He has learned his lesson.
In the end of the episode you can clearly see John’s dissapoinmtent when he understands that it is no Cameron he sees. Machines are his vice. He is not only in love with that gorgeous body, but with the artificial mind that goes along with it.
Cameron actually had to stop him from kissing her when he was on top of naked her Why would she do that? (stop him)
I never got the impression that Cameron “died” when giving her chip to JH. I believe that by placing her chip in JH’s socket she could take over his body and bring JH’s AI to the future, thus we still have the same Cameron but in JH’s body (hopefully just temporarily or the jameron “storyline” would become even more awkward ;P. Besides, Summer Glau’s take on the character is simply amazing and it would be a shame not to explore the character and her “relationship” with John further!).
Another possibility is that Cameron’s and JH’s AI somehow merged either inside the Turk or sometime in the near future, helping Cameron getting even more “human” and hopefully overwrite her urge to kill John Conner.
As for season 3 I believe that if we keep up the good work with voting and discussing the series we may have a good shot for a new season. Most shows in the same situation would probably get axed but we have Terminator: Salvation coming up which will generate a lot of interest in the Terminator franchise and while both seasons have had its ups and downs, the last 6-7 episodes have rocked! Something people are beginning to realize (just look at Digg and i09). I only hope that the writers continue the trend from the latest episodes, that’s what most people want. I love both seasons as a whole, but some of the episodes earlier this season was really slow-moving and it just didn’t seem to add much to the overall story (*harkhark*Riley*harkhark*), I’m not saying that they should abandon it, just tune it down a little.
I also think that Fox have to take some of the blame for the low numbers, as someone wrote earlier; why not air it on Tuesdays with Fringe and some other Sci-Fi series? Giving it Monday and Friday was like dooming it from the start. I really love this show, its characters, setting and the way the story is heading, it had some slow episodes but it picked up the pace and has now reached true greatness. I really hope that Fox renew this for a 3rd season!
Come on guys, this is a fantastic story that takes fantastic liberties with the world we know. The writers could pen a way to bring back Cameron with the exact same personality with little more than an after thought. In fact I have thought of 3 possibilities, 2 of which I have already seen posted. The other may have been posted but with damn near a thousand post I could have missed it. What if the “Alison” we saw in the closing moments of the finale was indeed Cameron and she was there to infiltrate and assassinate the acting leader of the resistance. That being said John would need to find John Henry to retrieve his Cameron’s data, incapacitate the “new” Cameron and swap chips. Although purely speculative this fix would solve the notion that Cameron is gone for good. Its a science fiction show lets be real. They can do pretty much whatever they want.
I actually don’t really understand why future scenes are so expensive? All you need is several “good” abandoned building and construction sites and some rubble.
They don’t do much FX either.
Hell, come to Russia and film it here, the whole damn country is a big “future” dump like that, no need to build stuff.
I don’t have any trouble believing all the theories, and I totally understand what many fans want. I just want to make sure I caught all the subtle clues. That’s the way they do so many things on the show (excluding some of the deaths we’ve seen lately of course).
Browsing through the forums and this blog, with so many people saying Cam is still on the chip, I wanted to make sure there wasn’t something I interpreted the wrong way. I don’t think Josh really tried to imply she was still on there, the way the scenes were produced.
With all the stuff in Cam’s head / chip, the future plots with the sub and Jessi, the Derek interactions in the future, her going to the past to meet John, John Connor only got part of her story, we as the audience got to see hints of her full story, but John Henry will be the only one with her full story if he read or keep’s her data, that’s huge intel, I have to think he has it, if John Connor was smart enough to look at Vick’s chip, why wouldn’t John Henry look at Cameron’s?
why not? she was at the library researching historical data each night and also was hacked into that transit monitoring system? wouldn’t those be needed things for john henry? besides all that she has seen and done as a terminator in the future and the past and the present. why couldn’t two AI’s memories/beings live on the same chip? im sure those chips were created to store massive amounts of data that we couldn’t comprehend.
john must know deep down whether or not she would still be intact or why would he leave to go get his girl?
@Chris V. Not trying to be rude, it’s just an expression.
@ All who insist Cameron is dead. If the show is cancelled then they’re all dead, think what you wish. But, If there is a S3 anyone can see that they left the door open for a Cameron return. No body will put up the money to back another season without her because she is the guaranteed ratings maker. Josh proved it by writing her out of most of S2.
@Robert: Absolutely correct. There is something magical about Summer’s portrayal of Cameron. I wouldn’t mind a brief sub-plot with Allison as long as it lead to Camerons return. And, Josh would have to make it clear in the beginning of the first episode that Cameron was coming back or people will tune out again. But there is no doubt that the vast majority of viewers want to see Cameron.
@ innocent: a thermostat, very funny, I got a good laugh about that one.
@ Nick: Why do you say that a machine can never have emotions? I can see how it could be theoretically possible. AI’s are based on what we understand about neural networks. Our attempts have been to mimic the human synaptic response and create a learning computer. I don’t think anyone has correctly explained why we feel emotion or how it really works. Our understanding of the actual system is still in the infantile stages. But we have made many things work without completely understanding them. When we moved from the iron age to steel nobody understood the metallurgy of steel but they knew how to make it. So, if we put together a neural network that happened to function very closely to the human brain why couldn’t such a network learn to feel? Like I said, for Sci-Fi it only has to be plausible and I think this is. Cameron spontaneously dancing in the Demon Hand is a great lead in for such a story line where her neural net starts to create connections that allow her to “enjoy” and “feel” based on stimulus. I hope S3 will incorporate that possibility.
Also why would John Henry erase Cameron’s data when he has no knowledge of anything after 2009. He would need her information to navigate a world that he knows nothing about. Using this logic Cameron couldn’t be gone.
Roman: I don’t know why she stopped him but she would have had to throw me across the room to get me off of her.LOL
As for your comment on filming in Russia, I hate to laugh but that was hilarious. Don’t worry though, we’re not far behind you. And if they don’t want to travel to Russia we’ve got Detroit.
Man, the last episode was amazing!!!
I’ll lose my mind, if i don’t get the 3d season!!
And the fact that John went to the “unknown” time to save Cameron, is just… well, i was speachless!
A Fantastic episode that left us in no doubt where they want to take this show. Please bring this show back for a third season. It deserves to be finished.
I don’t get to watch it for another two hours, folks. See you all on the other side of the time-bubble!
Whatever happens..
Whatever happens I am once and always a fan of Terminator: the Sarah Connor Chronicles.
I love this show and will keep voting for however long it takes to get a 3rd season.
Peace!
I’ve been here for the pilot.
Ive been here for every single episode since, the good and the bad.
I am HERE for this one….win or lose.
Hopefully its not the last….or again….I’ll be needing therapy.
THANK YOU GUYS. Ive never fallen in love with a TV show before this…much less a scifi show.
I’ve watched many a favorite show of mine die in obscurity(usually subsequent to being pigeonholed into a Friday or Saturday night timeslot) but I’ve never fought to save one. …until now. Fight the good fight, folks. I will be.
I’ve got 4 and a half hours before it’s on… I’m gonna get off the internet soon so no one ruins it for me.
I CAN’T WAIT!
Thanks to the whole cast and crew. I hope you guys come back to work soon. Regardless of what happens you guys made a solid sci-fi show and really made something special. I don’t think the new movie will be as good as this show has been. Sometimes they bring in the big toys to cover up a weak plot. You guys didn’t have big toys, but you had amazing writing. Hopefully the movie will help you guys out with a renewal though. We need to see the story continue!
I will vote as much as it takes to get a Season 3. This is a great show and it shouldn’t die now. The last couple of episodes have been the best yet.
I ask everyone in this chat room to respectfully wait to post anything ,and not ruin anyones finale due to the time difference.
Lata.
Only 5 min left to wait………….
12 MINUTES
Darn, my laptop must have jumped into the future, either that or its 10 min fast.
so when will TSCC be back ? =)
FALL ?
cmon
grr, this is going to be a boring summer without TSCC
“I ask everyone in this chat room to respectfully wait to post anything ,and not ruin anyones finale due to the time difference.
Lata.”
Umm, why enter an episode discussion thread about an ep you haven’t seen yet? just wait til its aired in your time zone. if you get spoiled in here its your own fault.
Looks like i’m going to miss the finale airing live, Fox is showing the weather instead of T:SCC. :/
Too bad I can’t watch it. Fraking FOX news is running late…. GRRRRRRR.
I’m here too… it’s been a very bumpy ride, to be sure, but I’m still here, and ready to get it on!
And I have my pizza in the oven and a cool [root] beer [or sarsaparilla, if you will] in the fridge.
46 minutes to go.
We’ll meet you on the other side of the Yellow Brick Road, my friends.
we’re having tornado warnings in this area and ALL the other stations are using a scroll to relay information. except the morons at Fox who have decided to have the newscasters stand around with their fingers up their butts to redundantly say what’s going on, instead of simply using a scroll! anybody know when the episode will be watchable on the site?
Fox news is covering the storms tonight and is not showing tscc!!!!!!!!!!! I will have to see it tomorrow online. Sooo Sad
Woah, was that silent girl from S1????????
THAT WAS RATHER AWKWARD.
AWESOME! and we are only half way! another great jameron scene! welcome back old characters.
referring to cameron and john i mean
and ray i thought so too but didnt she die?
wilbur dances
Red eye on Cameron??? Guys?? Can you screw up even more?
WTF!!!!!!!!
AMAZING EPISODE
was not expecting THAT with the window or the eel
nooooooooooooooooooooooooo
omg what a time for a comercial
WTF!!
AHHHH. LOVING this episode!! Please please please come back for season 3…
@Gusar
What?
@Fox
STOP TELLING ME I’M POSTING TOO FAST
@justis: no spoilers, please.
You couldn’t have given the camera a downwards angle??
sigh.
Good episode. I hope this isn’t the last we see of Terminator:SCC.
There needs to be a resolution to the series. Here’s to a 13 episode pickup!
OH MY GOD
shows over for good with that ending
OMG OMG OMG
NO F’N WAY
GASP.
That…was amazing! He’s back with everyone he loves…but wow, is theres going to be a next…and he’s the leader now at 16?
@Queeg
Sorry, I didn’t think saying “eel” would give any hints
what now…
::duct tapes justis’ mouth::
Guys, I know you’re probably at or headed to a bar, but on the off chance you get this: amazingly, wonderfully, beautifully well done. You tell a heck of a story, and you should all be very proud. Thanks.
Oh. My. God.
OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG!!!
BEST
EPISODE
OF
THE
SERIES!
With what I just saw, there had better be a third season! I LOVE this show!!!
awsume!!!
HOLY FUCK WHAT JUST HAPPENED????
THAT WAS AMAZING!
SEASON THREE, I NEED IT NOW! I DON’T KNOW IF MY BRAIN WILL BE ABLE TO WAIT TILL FALL!
HOLY FUCK!
*deep breath* Patience patience patience….
(Captcha P.O.W. tallying, I wonder if there is some weird, twisted significance to that)
OMG.
Thank you Josh.
I’ve never been so speechless. Utterly speechless.
that was a twist. and the girl was definately not cam at the end
This is awesome!! OMG!!!! I hope this is back next season! Time continuum mind phuck!
OMG! That better not be the last episode! I liked the red eye!
Well, you really blew me off.
Fox, are you reading? WE NEED A 3rd SEASON!!!!!!!!! Asap!!
:-0
That was so awesome! My mouth was hanging open during the final moments! Flawless television. I’m going to be so bummed if this doesn’t get picked up for next year.
HOLY S… OMG! but, how, when, I CANT BELEIVE.. OMG. …………………………………… BEST EPISODE EVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i will give no spoilers but this MIND BLOWING!
WTF!!!!!
Absolutely fantastic episode. I don’t even know how to begin. Fantastic plot twists, amazing writing, outstanding acting. By far the best episode ever.
@Malocchio: No, it was Allison Young.
I cried like a baby!!
Seriously… Oh. My. God. I can’t believe the series will end like this.
Just finished and really confused. Maybe I haven’t had enough time to process what just happened…..But it appears that John Connor is now an ordinary human citizen and Judgement Day came with out him there to stop it.
I can’t say I’m pleased with this enormous cliffhanging hole you’ve left us and I’m terrified that something might happen and you won’t be here next season to give me the answers…..
Wow…. Just Wow!
Good Job everyone!
3rd Season Please!!!
ya I think I will watch that again like right now, absolutely fantastic episode.
I’m so blown away.
You have just made me appreciate this series so much more than the diehard fan of this franchise, that I already am.
…………………………………………………………………………………….
If we don’t get a third season, I will go crazy. Like seriously crazy.
And while I’m happy to see Allison (which means Summer), she’s not Cameron. She’s not the cyborg I love. By the way, thanks for making me cry when we see Cameron got JH to take her chip and she was saying “I’m sorry, John”. Not cool!!
BTW, SCC_Im4Season3… No, that doesn’t mean it’s over for good. It’s opening up new angels to the show. I’m very curious as to how the writers would make that work… John in the future, no Sarah and no Cameron (although Allison, but still… It’s not Cameron…). It would be neat to see…
THIS IS HOW JOHN CONNOR’S LEGEND BEGINS. EVERYTHING BEGINS AGAIN AS JOHN NOW WILL BECOME THE LEADER HE’S DESTINED TO BE WITHOUT ANY STIGMA OF FATE ATTACHED.. HE HAS TO EARN IT… AND THEN HE WILL SEND KYLE BACK TO IMPREGNATE SARAH
HOLY $#!T!!!! PURE AWESOMENESS!!!!!!
FANTASTIC episode beautiful writing. i loved Weaver and I’m so happy that Cameron isn’t dead I can really die happy now Did I say that? Thank You Thank YOu THank You Thank YOu.
So great everything was so great.
Just finished………….I’m gonna die if this doesn’t get renewed………..
Dear Josh Friedman,
You’ve broken my brain and my heart in no particular order.
That episode tore me apart in the best hurty ways possible and was absolutely, positively, one of the best hours I’ve ever spent watching television.
EVER.
Thank you for everything you’ve given us.
Please give us a season 3, Fox.
This is the most well written series EVER!!! I LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE what the writers have done with this story line. Why would the best show ever be cancelled?
I started blushing when I saw Brian Austin Green, I love everything about this show! Great Job Sarah Connor Chronicles!!!!!!
No, she wasn’t Cam, as they clearly showed by having her beside a watching dog. She’s Allison. Allison from Palmdale.
And now, that fever-dream-memory-flash-back Derek had of John in the future, when John’s silhouette looked EXACTLY like past John… Well, it seems that that’s because they are one and the same.
Past John and future John are just a split second apart, actually.
;-D
OMG AMAZING!!!
THIS SHOW BETTER COME BACK OR I WILL NEVER WATCH FOX AGAIN!
EVERYTHING JUST…. AAAAAGGGGGHHHHH
I MUST SEE WHAT HAPPENS NOW!
The episode left me speechless! That was mind blowing, heart stopping/wrenching cliffhanger! THANK YOU JOSH AND ALL THE WRITERS!
That episode is the reason FOX needs to renew TSCC.
SAVE TSCC!
oh..my..gawd!
so awesome. Derek!!! KYLE!! aw, and human!Cameron –I think my mind just exploded from the over awesomeness of this episode.
THERE MUST BE A THIRD SEASON, PLEASE!!
Tell me how to save it and I will do my part. Vote where?
This. Show. Cannot. End!!!
What a finale……
Well that was a great episode. The ending was mind blowing.. but I dont know where that leaves the series now. I think that ending was a setup for Salvation.
ya, i had a feeling when he was going to meet weaver she wasnt going to be hostile, but it threw me for a loop with what happened in the basement. cam betrays and sarah leaves
Gah. I might have to watch this again to fully understand what I just saw. which I’m sure I would have done anyway. even if it does get renewed it’ll still be quite a while before we get new eps. (and there had better be another season!)
I’m glad my area wasn’t affected by weather like some were here. the most annoying thing on my end was just the prison break banner that took up a third of the screen.
on a side note, the Terminator Salvation thing was a let down. I thought it was supposed to be unseen footage? as far as I can tell it was just the most recent trailer we’ve all already seen. bleh.
OMG. My mind is totally blown. TOTALLY.
Brilliant.
WE NEED A SEASON 3
I’m writing again I can’t stop! This was such a good ep. I can’t even describe how happy I am! I soooooooooo want another season. Please!
Really fantastic acting, such a perfect and happy story, well happy in a terminator way
Thank you for not killing Cameron. Now please don’t kill our show.
The Directing was so good, and ahhhh everything.
Thank You
Words are not enough WOW Wow Holy F
FOX - please, we need a 3rd season - WOW (3x) - awesome writing and action!
We loved it! This show has rocked every episode! PLEASE!! Come back for another season!!
WOW!! So what will happen with Ellison and Sarah?? More importantly, what about JOhn finally facing his dad???
Can I just say ..Best friggin show on TV! If it doesnt get a 3rd season its a HUGE mistake by fox. I love the fact that this show actually gives you answers to question while causing more questions to arise…and as a season finale DAMN! I cant wait…so hopefully fox reads some of this and realize what a great show they have here.
WOW! I was not expecting any of that at the end. Thank you for tying up all the loose ends of this season, now you just opened up a million more possibilities for (hopefully) season 3. With where the characters are now, the writers are going to have a field day with where they could take the story. Great finale. I need a drink now.
This episode was amazing and beautiful in so many ways. Thank you! Now we just need season three…
Great episode, LOVED IT!! I can’t believe Weaver is good, I need to know what she is up to! Please don’t cancel this show it’s the best! My husband and I watch it every Friday night!
I will never tune in to Fox again if they don’t renew this series.
This is the best thing that has ever come.
Thank you again, Josh Friedman, and all the writers.
Thank you Lena Headey, Thomas Dekker, Summer Glau, Brian Austin Green, Richard T. Jones, Garrett Dillahunt, Shirley Manson for everything you’ve poured out.
Thank you for keeping Terminator alive for all of us, for the people that this really means something to.
Thank you all.
Thank you.
Thank you for making such an amazing show that makes me hyperventilate and want to bang my head against the wall in sheer frustration and happiness.
Thank you for writing dynamic characters and plot points that actually make sense by the end.
Thank you for including incredible actors, and all of the members of the crew who made this show one of the best on TV, ever.
Thank you for making me laugh, cry and feel with the show.
Thank you. . . I look forward in anticipation for season 3.
What can we do now to make sure there is a season 3?
AHH, been watching since pilot episode and have watched every episode since, I just hope this wasn’t the last…
no fate!
And that is why there will be a third season. This episode was even better than the pilot episode, and they gave the fans EVERYTHING they wanted. Especially the return of Chola. That was something I wanted to see, but not something I expected. I voted for this show’s return, and if it doesn’t, I’m gonna spam Fox with pancake mix.
But there’s no reason the show won’t come back? So what about the ratings? That never hurt the show before, just made everyone nervous. And don’t forget that they even extended the second season just because everyone was so paranoid. This show is here to stay.
Unbelievable!!!!! Brilliant show!
That was the most fantastic hour of television I have ever seen. AWESOME!!!! You broke my heart and my brain last episode, so I was a bit gun shy tonight. But good gods, that was good TV. All the homages to the film. All the homages to the SCC universe itself. Powerhouse episode.
THANK YOU!!
WE MUST HAVE ANOTHER SEASON!!!!
there has to be another season..please
WRITE TO FOX AND WB RIGHT NOW FOR SEASON 3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wow just wow, that was crazy if this show gets canceled i just may never watch TV again.
How can I be posting too fast with my first post?
So what happens next season? Going back and forth from Sarah and Ellison in the present to John, Kyle, Derek and Alison(?) in the future?
Def burnt the ef’in barn down!
hooray for return of cholo!
must….have…more….seasons…….
So why did he f’ing time travel with some metal that he doesn’t even know if she’s good metal or bad metal. Sucks cameron died. and… we have… colmarti in the future, with john, with cameron’s chip in him… lol talk about a psycho.
I’m thinking now, this entire season 2, mrs. weaver’s entire purpose, coming back into the past and everything, was to send past-john to the future, and screw up the future some how.
Also side note: i wonder how many people in the future have NOT seen the liquid-metal version of the robot army, seemed everyone on the submarine a few shows back was shocked when they saw it.
And cameron lied… when he asked her “Will you join us?” she knew weaver was metal.. oh well, god that ending f’ing sucked, why send him there when no one knows him… *sigh* way to f— it up people
I don’t care though, i’m hooked, i’m going to watch the movie when it comes out, and i’ll sit infront of the tv to watch every single last episode, good or bad.
That was the best episode of TV–ever! Cameron (as in James) is proud, I’m sure. Terminator forever!
So I know I just posted but I have to repost something I just posted on the C&J forums…
I wonder if the writers will write it so that we (and John) get to know Allison a little bit, then it kind of goes into a repeat of history and she’s taken, a Cyborg takes her identity and John ends up reprograming her and ending up with Cameron all over again! That’s what I want to happen. As awesome as Allison is (and will be even more once we get to know her)…. She’s still no quirky cyborg who loves John (and who John loves back)
OMG OMG That was intense. What a left turn the story took. Never in a million years did I see that coming. Well done Josh, Pat yourself on the back. I Can’t wait until season three.
THE BEST EPISODE I HAVE EVER SEEN!! SO MANY QUESTIONS. DOES JOHN TELL KYLE HE IS HIS DAD? WILL HE LOVE CAMERON OR SHALL I SAY ALISON THE SAME. IS SARAH SAFE? OMG TOO MANY QUESTIONS NOT TO HAVE A THIRD SEASON!!! PLEASE FOX, PLEASE!!
Oh my, incredible - don’t let it end here! Pleeaaase FOX, season 3!!!!!
Seriously…I had not bothered to watch TV shows for years now and I just happened to see the show on Hulu not far into the first season. If this show goes….I’ll pretty much have no need for civilization. Fox would be making a huge mistake.
I love this show. It never disappoints. I saw the season finale and of course have more questions than answers. They have got to come back for another season. Does anyone have any answers about the ending?
McDevy said:
April 10th, 2009 at 6:16 pm
“I will never tune in to Fox again if they don’t renew this series.
This is the best thing that has ever come.
Thank you again, Josh Friedman, and all the writers.
Thank you Lena Headey, Thomas Dekker, Summer Glau, Brian Austin Green, Richard T. Jones, Garrett Dillahunt, Shirley Manson for everything you’ve poured out.
Thank you for keeping Terminator alive for all of us, for the people that this really means something to.
Thank you all.”
My sentiments exactly. I will NEVER watch fox again if this show is actually cancelled.
This is the best show on tv, my husband and I watch it EVERY Friday!! If this show does not come back for Season 3, I think we will go into cardiac arrest! This was such an awesome episode!
I don’t even know what to say.
That was truly incredible.
I don’t even know what to feel right now.
Brilliant….
The ending was actually quite satisfying. It gives hope for a third season and if not, a good end to the series.
SEASON 3!!!!!
Great Episode!!! This mysterious line, –will you join us? — makes me wonder what exactly is going on… The time jump and twists i love them! keep it up! great acting and great story!!
don’t end the show…
Best show on television this season! Please bring it back for season three.
OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOMG.. THAT WAS THE MOST AMAZING, EPIC, PHENOMENAL, AWESOME, CRAZY, FANTASTIC, SUPERCALIFRAGILOUS EXPIALIDOCIOUS EPISODE OF THIS WHOLE SHOW!!
ALLISON’S BACK!! DEREKS ALIVE!! CAMERON’S CHIP’S WITH JOHN HENRY!! JOHN’S IN THE FUTURE!! I JUST DRANK LIKE 3 CANS OF MOUNTIAN DEW!!
holy, i need to calm down….
ill review this whole episode later when i can actually type.. i need to watch this episode a few million more times…. ill be back later… *flees to DVR*
Holy Crap! that was soooo damn amazing! The writting is just top freaking notch on this show! Please, please bring it back!!!! There is just soo much potential! With A good time slot i KNOW it would get more viewers. Plus the movie could be a great way to get people to check out the show!!!!
Ok Thank you so much for listening to fans or at least caring what they think and taking their views in to opinion. That’s what makes a great show and this one is so well done. Even though we don’t all agree you still thought about us. I’m just going on now.
Thank you all amazing show
DAM
I LOVE THIS SHOW, AND NOW THEY ARE THINKING OF TAKING IT OFF THE AIR. SOME PEOPLE ARE JUST PLAIN STUPID.
YOUR STUPID IF YOU TAKE THIS SHOW OFF THE AIR!!!
GERRRRRR
Unbelievably well done, please continue…
Argh, I can’t believe the series is going to end like this. SCREW Fox! It’s Fox’s fault for putting a show on friday night when everyone is out and recording it on their DVR, and then not counting the DVR watchers towards the show’s ratings.
What’s the point of having a show on Friday night if it has zero chance of getting acceptable ratings? When you count the people who record or watch online, about 7 million people per week watch TSCC. Yet they only want to count the few people who are at home on friday night watching TV live that very moment. Most people who do that are going to be watching some reality crapola about celebrity weight-loss.
Unbelievable… another great show gets killed by Fox. I’m keeping my fingers crossed for a 3rd season, but I see no real hope for that. What a horrible way to end the series - they could have at least had the decency to give the writers a heads-up so that they could wrap up the series, like ABC did for Life on Mars.
Since Arrested Development, I have a policy of never watching new shows on Fox until they’ve been given a second season. I kinda made an exceptio for TSCC because the “first season” was only 9 episodes long due to the WGA strike… so as far as I’m concerned the show really only had 1 long season, or maybe 1.5 seasons… but definitely not two. 9 episodes does not qualify for a season in America (and this is not the BBC).
Come on Fox, give the show a 3rd season, and if you’re not going to count DVR viewership, then put the show on at a time when people are actually at home watching television. Save friday nights for another 5 hours of American Idol.
I love this show.
I almost cried.
Please, Fox, give us a season 3!
But with this new twist.. this means Jesse is probably back in? No, please. I couldn’t STAND her. I was happy when Derek shot her.
Yay for Allison! And Derek and Kyle.. and I was surprised that Catherine is a good character, up until this episode I was almost convinced she was bad.
Bravo!!
i didnt fully grasp the kaliba connection.
whats the whole liquid escaping from the imploding sub/liquid CW connection and the “will you join us” part?
why exactly did ? choose alison young to replicate?
wheres the story of why future john sent cameron back to his younger self?
whats the story with the flying H.K.s,who’s behind them,what was their agenda,why did weaver destroy their desert coltan storage,what where they doing with the coltan,what made weaver say it was a mistake when john henry overheard the radio transmission about the coltan?
what the hell happened to john henry?
what the hell happened to cameron?
what the hell happened to weaver?
see where i’m going here?this felt like when your sitting in the theatre and the screen does that horrible melting thing,the projector explodes,and the lights come on.
with as strong of a possibility of this season being all we were going to get,this was the wrap-up we get?sorry,but all these unanswered plotlines make the whole thing feel like a giant waste of time.like that show reunion.only much worse.
i’ll be waiting till all three of the movies are released.
Oh my god, there are no words…there are no words! There are no words for how blown my mind is, but I’m going to try anyway. That was absolutely the best episode of, not only the show, but any show I think I’ve ever watched before. I felt like a total nerd but I totally had a break down afterward, a complete giggle fit on my dorm room floor. I’m just so excited about the twist at the end that I can hardly stand it, I can’t stop smiling! The way they left us off was genius, but now they just HAVE to have a third season because the direction the finale just took us in is just to GOOD not to explore!
… That was one of the most incredible things I’ve ever seen. I’m speechless.
All I can say is if TSCC does not get another season, thank you so much for everything.
I truly cannot thank you all - the absolutely incredible cast and crew - enough for what you and this show has done for my life.
Thank you for giving me something to always remember with pride.
No fate,
Rachel Pruitt
Great season finale…interesting twists and turns at the end of the episode will be watching seasons 1 and 2 over again waiting for season 3 !!!!
Haven’t commented here before, but this show is so awesome that I desperately hope the fans can show so much support that Fox will finally do something right for once.
I STILL CANT GET OVER HOW AMAZING THIS IS!
AAAAAAAAAGGGGGHHHHH!!!
THE BEST THING I HAVE EVER SEEN!
WE MUST GET A SEASON 3!
If JH is/was good, then how did Cameron betray him?
No one knows who he is now because in this future time line he vanished in 2009.
S3 can’t stay in the future due to costs, probably have to resolve some issue and then jump back to 2009-2010.
T:TSCC was/is the the best series I’ve seen in a long time. Please, please please give us more, and sign up the cast for another season before they all head their seperate ways. My wife and I watch the show every Friday, and I’ve really enjoyed series excellent twist and the plot writting has been excellent. Fox, you have a great Franchise here, you blew it once with Family Guy (the only other show I watch besides T:TSCC btw), but you realized your mistake and brought it back. Please do the same with T:TSCC.
And if you don’t, thanks for giving us two great seasons. These seasons will definately be a DVD purchase for me and I will watch them occassonally for years to come.
Well done.
A third season is a must. The story has opened up so much and there are so many angles to explore. This was truely an amazing episode and I hope to see more in the future with another season. Keep the excitement in your line up FOX, don’t let it end now.
And honestly - as much as I want season 3 - if this is the end, the show went out in a blaze of glory.
Even I am very very sick, I still remember what’s on Friday!!
That was totally AWESOME!!!!
but i can’t believe this is the end…=[
I really hope there will be more and more seasons!!!
Now i am back to the no tv life until TSCC is back…
Thank you for all the GREAT GREAT WORKS!!!
WOW! That was an amazing season finale!!!! Fox, please bring back for Season 3!
Cameron had John Henry put her chip into his cyborg body and then zapped herself into the future. She’s in the future now with young John Connor, but in JH’s skin. That must be how they get future Allison turned into Cameron, the JH body gives the chip to Weaver who uses it when she makes Cameron. WOW!
Love this show! Now I have more questions than answers and need season 3! FOX, please bring it back!
THANK YOU!
Thank you for crafting such an AMAZING finale.
I can’t even find the words to describe it, it was pure awesomeness.
This is certainly one of those TV moments we live for!
I REALLY hope you guys are planning in doing a 3rd season. PLEASE.
I’ve never rallied or cared about a television show or cared if it got cancelled but this show has changed my mind. I can’t believe FOX is even thinking of canceling this show! Especially since the movie, (although not linked to the show) will clearly boost interest in the franchise. They would be stupid not to renew the show but networks rarely take risks anymore. I remember when FOX was considered the most reckless, network taking on shows like the Simpsons and Married with children but stuck to their guns with shows when they knew they were good and they eventually became classics that became a part of our culture. Now they seem to be like every other network quick to throw in the towel. Find your balls again FOX and support a show you know is good. You had them once, try it again! The cast you’ve assembled for this show is so top notch and the writing is so good, you’d be fools to disband it all just as it was getting into the thick of it! If you don’t want to renew the show you should sell the rights to NBC so they can put the series on SciFi so fans can enjoy the best science fiction television series since X-files.!
in the frist season camren has blue glowy eyes so why did she have red ones in this episod
WE REALLY NEED SEASON 3!
The Season Finale was one of the best Fox hangers ever! Lets keep this show going along with the other great shows like Fringe and Dollhouse! Those 3 equal great things for Fox!
im arguing with the local fox channel to show it tonight in its entirety since they prempted half for weather
You packed more excellent storytelling in one hour than most shows that run for years have achieved. Kudos and bring on season 3
Bravo.
WOA!! That was KICKASS!! There is NO WAY they are going to make us Wait until 2010 or something for Season Three, right?? This finale episode was incredible, not sure what to say actually…..don’t want to spoil anything …. it’s HARRRRD to hold back on comments and questions….
I HAD TWO CANS OF RED BULL AND ONE MOUNTAIN DUE I CAN BARLEY TYPE ,AND I WANT TO SEE WHAT JOHN’S THOUGHTS ARE ON ALISON. WHAT HAPPENS TO CAMERON. JOHN IS NOT IN LOVE WITH ALISON HE IS IN LOVE WITH CAMERON WHO WILL MOST LIKELY REPLACE ALISON SOONER OR LATER. OMG!! I NEED A SEASON THREE THIS IS JUST TOOOO MUCH. FOX PLEASE!!!
This episode was amazing! It might be my favorite of the series.
The ending left the door open for so many great stories. FOX, please please please give us another season. This show has some of the best writing on television today and it would be a shame to turn the lights out now.
To the cast and crew, thanks for a season of action-packed, thought-provoking, tug at the heart strings stories. I hope this isn’t the end!
So… i literally just cried when i got to thinking that this could be the end…
its sooooo amazing!
COME ON SEASON 3
and if not season 3, then…
TSCC THE MOVIE(S)
THE STORY IS TO GOOD TO LET IT END HERE!
Holy shit.
I’ve been a diehard fan since the pilot, and all I have to say is…
Thank you.
Thank you, the writers, producers, actors, camera men, grips, PAs, post-production crew and everyone else I’ve forgotten.
This show, this episode in particular - is the best program to hit the television in years.
It’s bittersweet, knowing that this episode may/will be cancelled, but I’ve gotta say - this episode was very, VERY satisfying. I’m on cloud nine, and there ain’t no bringing me down. You all have outdone yourself with the entire show, and I really hope - if anything - this show gets the recognition it deserves. You guys are beyond awesome.
I’m… at a loss of words. I love you guys, in the strictly heterosexual and platonic sense.
So many questions answered, so many surfaced; and to top it off, this finale left a helluva lot of room for story in the (HOPEFULLY) third season. If not, I think we can all agree that we can live with this conclusion, even if we vy for more.
Again.
Thank you.
P.S. Allison better fall in love with John, or there’ll be hell to pay! YOU HEAR ME SUMMER!?
THANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOUTHANKYOU!!!
If I could give the entire cast and crew of this show a big hug, I would.
Mega kudos.
I’m *REALLY* hoping that FOX renews this, but if they don’t, then it was hell of ride.
i certenly hope that this show comes back this is the first that i heard that it might not. i love it and would be devistated again BY FOX IF THEY DONT CONTINUE.
You guys have surpassed yourselves above and beyond anything I could’ve imagined.
Cameron broke my heart.
John’s heart was broken. He MUST find Cameron’s chip!
SEASON 3 MUST COME TO BE!!! IT SIMPLY CAN’T NOT!!!
I’m shocked by the episode, in the best way possible! I’ve never screamed or groaned out loud at my tv before (well, not when a sports game isn’t playing) but I was literally yelling at some points- every minute of the last 15 minutes. so so good. so so satisfying, but not nearly enough. I have to see where they are going with this, with John in the future, with a Derek with no idea who he is, and finally away from his mom!!! Brilliant move. What will happen with Allison? if that is Allison. Oh this show needs another season- I’ve never been more obsessed with a TV show- once you start you’re hooked. Great job writer-thanks for two amazing seasons, and I hope everyone involved with the show gets the third season they deserve~!!!!
I finished watching the final episode of seaon 2 (born to run). It’s a great episode, though a bit sad that Cameron gave up her life to save man kind. I think this last episode was also intended to show that some machines learn to appreciate human life. As Sara Connors said, ‘When they learn to appreciate human life, they would not need to kill us, they will be us’. I think that’s what some of the machines are becoming. It would be a shame for Fox not to continue 3rd season.
@ Jeff Holland
I totally agree with you. Especially with what you said about TSCC being the next best scifi tv show since X-files. I was and still am a huge fan of the x-files.
Greatest show of all time. If I can write to somebody and try to help it see a third season, just give me and address.
Cameron is gone? My favorite character is gone and then it ends? That was my favorite episode ever, but where does it leave the show’s namesake? Will she be fighting Kaliba with a Cameroned out John Henry, while John cracks endoskulls with Derik, Allison, and Weaver? Thats some crazy stuff but it does lay the ground work for a new spin on the show which is cool. Or obviously John could just come back with the chip and explain his quest through flashbacks throughout S3. But I don’t agree with some that say that its a satisfying ending, it seemed to me like an exciting beginning to a whole new chapter. Whatever it takes we need a season 3!!!!!!
-Best scenario Fox picks up a S3
-Second best another network (like a wb network, or scifi) picks up S3.
-Third best scenario we get a straight to Blu-ray move that gives us the rest of the story and lets the cast out for a romp.
Worst scenario the story ends now and we believe whatever we want to believe…NO that can’t happen in this timeline.
Execs, writers, fans, This show has the hardcore fans to justify any of the top three suggestions. This is the greatest show ever made and we need more! WHATEVER IT TAKES!!!
Cameron had John Henry put her chip into his cyborg body and then zapped herself into the future. She’s in the future now with young John Connor, but in JH’s skin. That must be how they get future Allison turned into Cameron, the JH body gives the chip to Weaver who uses it when she makes Cameron. WOW!
No, no , no. John Henry was downloaded onto Cameron’s chip. He zapped himself into the future. What was left of Cameron was sitting there saying “I’m sorry” from the turk hardware.
This was so Wizard of Oz of an ending.
Brilliant job by the writers…this ending can either segue back into the story we all know (that John now can become the leader he is destined to be and will send back Kyle to protect his mother and become his father) ….which provides a neat solution for the predestination paradox, OR it leaves the door open for future seasons.
Other things that were wrapped up in this way (or not)…that Ellison and Sarah did NOT jump ahead, that CW did, that JH did with Cameron’s chip, and so on.
A great way to end the season, and if it turns out to be the end of the series (I hope not!) at least it was done in an intelligent and clever way.
I can not believe that episode. I have tears in my eyes. Man what can I say… Please come back.
WOW! I don’t really know what else to say…
i thought terminators can’t self terminate so how did cameron kill herself(by removing her chip) ??????????? UNLESS JOHN HENRY DID IT (DUM DUM DUM)
MILES DYSON’S SON IS MISSING MAYBE IF THERE IS A SEASON 3 SARAH WILL TRY TO FIND HIM
the ending felt like the series finale it eplains how john became the leader of mainkind(he was sent to the future) it eplains how he sent back derek and kyle reese and it explains how john sent back cameron (maybe it was the human cameron with that dog in the ep’s ending scene)
everyone read this it is a theory it explains why john connor loved alison young
it also explains why john connor loved alison young because alison was basically cameron phillips with a human mind and body
PLEASE EVERYONE TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT MY THOUGHTS AND THEORYS GOOD OR BAD COMMENTS I DONT CARE
what the hell just happened?
Cameron had a red-eye becasue she must have replaced her damaged blue eye
with one of the pieces from another Terminator.
Wow! I cannot put into words how good the season finale was tonight. In fact, the entire second half of Season 2 has been absolutely stellar. I want to thank everyone associated with “Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles” for making a superior television show. A show this good must be renewed.
OK. Many possibilities. I’d like to see how the 3rd season pans out. More later…have to do the ‘cast and then the blog (which will be done by 9:30pm MDT and about 11:30pm MDT respectively).
Coulda used more answers, but I do like the possibilities.
Fantastic. I really do love where the show has been taken.
Oh, my, GOD that was GOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
First time poster here also. I agree with everyone here who has complimented the creative staff and actors. As many others have said here I have typically not watched FOX programming (other than football). When this series was introduced I wanted to get involved in it at the beginning, particularly since I have been looking for an adequate replacement for my previous X-Files addiction. It’s a shame that FOX will likely cancel this series, mainly because its writing is far superior to all the other scripted programming on network television. It certainly seemed, based on the way this episode ended, that Josh Freidman left the story as he did in anticipation of not getting renewed for a third season. I also agree that this ending afforded more plot variations that could keep it going at least another season. It’s my hope they will continue the series, but I can say I’m satisfied with the ending, if it must end this way.
Kudos to Freidman and the WONDERFUL cast. I am especially proud of Summer Glau. I understand she is a fellow Texan (…which once again proves my assertion that Texas has some of the most beautiful women in the world!)
FOX: Season 3 would be a great idea. Like Jeff Holland said earlier, grow a set & give this series a real chance.
Brilliance!!! Josh & Writers you guys really know how to tell a story. I felt so much emotion this episode. When Cameron broke Sarah out of jail Cam had tears in her eyes when she I’m not 100% my heart broke right then. I really am happy with the finale of season 2. I really want to see how the characters play out in the new environment. I personally pray at night that Fox will renew a 3rd season with TSCC for real. If that doesn’t happen I’m not sure what is next for Fox.
In Need of Season 3
That finale was AWESOME! The show really dragged through parts of this season, but that final scene made everything worth it!
Notice how CW said “THEY don’t come through” when John asked where Cameron was…any significance to that? Hmmm….
Fox, please bring back my favorite show for Season 3…
PLEASE FOX….At least a half season….anything…just don’t make us settle for what we just saw! There is WAY too much that needs to be answered. You CAN NOT leave us with “John Connor who?”
Keep voting everybody! We can’t let this be the end.
So this is what Summer meant back at wondercon in february when she was asked if she liked where Cameron ends up by seasons end. I understand now her reaction and answer to that question.
WOW. well its named after sarah so she has to be back. i’ll be so mad if it doesnt get picked up for a third season. is it possible tho tht stuff isnt as it seems. like when sarah was taken prisoner but we were supposed to think reality was that sleeping ward, not the prison cell.
God I love this show, there had so better be a fraking season 3.
Please bring this show back for a 3rd season!!!!!
Please bring back this show for a 3rd season!!!!!!
AMAZING!!! There better be a season 3. Damn, why did it take most of season 2 for it to get REALLY GOOD? When it comes back, I would like to see John get into a relationship with Allison. When John was on top of Cameron, you know he had feelings for her. He couldn’t go for Cameron, but he could with Allison.
FOX, don’t screw this up and give it one more season
Today showed just how Awsome T:SCC is. And why it’s such a shame it may not continue. The final twist…Gosh darn Fantastic! Look forward to Season 2 Blu-ray. Sarah and the Gang Rock!
One of the best t.v. series. That episode was amazing.
THAT CANNOT BE THE END, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE BRING US A SEASON 3
I love this show! For the love of god (or whomever), Fox, please do NOT cancel such a well written, well acted show laden with such fantastic special effects to boot. The season finale tonight was just beyond words kick ass in my opinion. Soooo good. This show needs to come back!!!
Hey Guys THANKS FOR ALL THE GREAT 31 EPISODES!!!!!!! This season finale was great i would love to see a season 3 of John using what he has learned already, and also With kyle and derek to militarily finish the training will leave the third season the best of all. I Cant wait for Fox to open their eyes and realize that what they have is gold. Josh is a a freakin brain cuz if the movie does as well as we expect it. Season 3 will be like the prequel to how John goes from a smart kid to a great leader. Carry On great writers all of you rock and to the best damn Cast Alot of love see you in season 3. Lets take back our show and resist FOXs termination.
OK loved the T1 throwbacks, tie in to other eps Samson& Dehlia, The Good Wound, “not today not yet, that it wasnt too Jameron, Cams gone and replaced by Allison, I flipped when Derek came back, but if Johns the leader how do they not know who he is? Weaver and JH and Sarah and Ellison in the past OH! I knew John would see his Daddy but for real? We have to find out answers. WE NEED A SEASON 3 & IF THAT’S NOT POSSIBLE PLEASE MAKE A TSCC DVD! I’m losing it here. I better go watch it again. That looked kinda funny when Cams face was all messed up. Whatever Josh is smokin I want some.
did I miss something. John Henery was not in the basement when the gang arrived. How do we know he went to the future? I thought he just left. I guess I will have to watch it again.
Tonight was the best Friday of TV I’ve had in ever.
This episode BLEW MY FREAKIN’ MIND. I love this show. If I was having doubts about buying this show on DVD, I sure as hell am not now. I’d buy the entire season just for this episode. And I’ll patiently wait for May, when the show is renewed, and then I’ll patiently wait for the Fall, when the third season starts.
And, you know, Dollhouse was awesome as well.
Josh & Co,
A beautiful ending and beginning as the Terminator saga makes another future/past, past/future cycle. The TSCC was a noble effort that can best be judged not be its commercial success but by how much the fans loved it. When you have the time, perhaps you could fill us in on where you saw the series going if there was to be a S3 and beyond and address the rest of the loose ends that were not resolved by the finale. I hope all of you find new gigs in short order and we’ll look for new shows with your names in the credits in the future.
I think Cameron just completed the mission she was sent back in time for. It was to get John Henry a chip. It explains why John Connor ‘chooses’ Allison Young in the future! New future Derek! Where’s Weaver(Waldo)? Cameron’s code is in the Turk hardware? WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!
I just got done walking around the room saying WOW and Holy Cow! This just blows my mind. It has all come together and just blown my mind.
This is the year of the Terminator !!
Please renew the show - it’s the best thing on. I can’t wait to see what happens next.
C’mon, admit it. Who all wept at the end of that?! I’m a softy and I did… a little. I guess we’ll have to leave the “future” to our imaginations because the evidence seems overwhelming that that was THE final show. :^( Who wouldn’t want to know what happens from there, and who wouldn’t be sad for John and Sarah after that?! Will they ever see each other again? Will Sarah die before he gets a chance to see her… if he ever does? Of course, Derek and Kyle had been dead and they were there due to the time travel continuum effects. Was that the future Cameron “metal”, or was it the human that Skynet patterned her after? Was John Connor nonexistent to them in that future since they didn’t know the name, and will the John Connor from the past become the leader of the resistance? It boggles the mind! At the very least, hopefully that will help with the transition from “T2″ to “Salvation”. Maybe another network will pick it up and continue it. It’s happened before with other shows!
I dont think john is now the leader….he jumped over time so he wasn’t to lead the resistance from the start of the war.
Ahhh, now I’m getting it. It seems that John was put into the timeline at a point that would have his and Kyle’s ages to have the right father/son time spread. Hmmm. If that was the human Cameron, then John will not have lost the “girl” he loved. Or the uncle and father for that matter. Only mom, who would be dead anyway due to cancer. Wow! Salvation here we come!!
Firstly Cameron’s eyes are blue and with that done…
I had written at least an entire page’s worh of comment but I deleted it because it doesn’t matter. Cameron, our Cameron, only survived if JH somehow tucked the chip under some organic tissue when he made the jump. Best guess, he placed it in his mouth.
Otherwise the Cameron we all know and love will never be brought back. It’s physically impossible. I’m sure you can create the same chasis and skin and everything but the memories? Her experiences that made her her? She never told anyone about sneaking off to the library at night. She never told anyone what really happened during her time spent as Allison Young. John can try and reprogram her as much as he wants but she will never be the same.
It’s like the whole Jesse fiasco all over again. She may have acted like Derek’s Jesse, she may have looked like Derek’s Jesse, she may have even shared some of the same memories as Derek’s Jesse but she wasn’t his Jesse which was the only way Derek could bring himself to pull the trigger.
That’s all I’m going to say because that’s how important this issue is with me and it might become a make or break deal when Season 3 starts. If a copycat Cameron is created, as flawless and quirky humored as she can be, still it wouldn’t be the same. So please, please, please! Make John move heaven and earth to find that little bit of silicon. And why?
I love you Summer!
Ps. For example Cromarties head shouldn’t have come through during the first jump. It should have been destroyed. Please don’t try and take the same cop out with Cameron’s chip.
Anyone who says this was a satisfying ending to the series is in complete self-denial. This was a great cliffhanger for a season finale, but a TERRIBLE way to end the series. I blame fox, of course, not the TSCC writers.
Tunnel Rat, Ms Weaver implied that it wasn’t “where” he went, but “when”.
amazing!! ggggaahhh so good!
Amzazing. There’s got to be a season 3. So many unanswered questions.
Ok, that was possibly the best episode yet! Fox will lose a lot of viewers if they don’t give us a third season. AT LEAST give us a full length movie (not Salvation.) I think this is the best show on television and I am baffled as to why it hasn’t got enough viewers for Fox to keep it going. Anyway, the petitions are coming around, so sign them and pray that we will be treated to a fantastic third season.
OMG!!! That was truly AMAZING!!!!! I agree.. Cameron’s eye should’ve been blue, not RED. Otherwise, FLAWLESS PERFORMANCE & WRITING!!!!
Please O’ Please FOX!!!! GIVE US MORE T:TSCC!!!! We want Seasons 3-whenever, PLEASE!!!!!
Enough reality show BS, give us back drama/adventure/action shows like this!!!!
I’m tired of Gordon Ramsey and all other BS scripted ‘Reality’ shows. Everyone knows sane people don’t act the way they do on these BS shows. Enough…. everyone here is speaking. Give us what we want…please
I absolutely loved the last several episodes. As I slowly move further out of the demographic that is supposed to be targeted by these shows (most advertisers are now more interested in attracting my kids attention rather than mine - the majority of the money still comes from me though…), I find that my tastes don’t change as much as I would have guessed. I would have loved this show as much as a teen as I do now.
I have to say that I though the middle part of this season was a bit slow and had some storylines that didn’t really capture my imagination - but the last several episodes have been truly fantastic. I will truly miss this show - it deserves at least one more spin around the block.
Starkiller <>
I don’t think so but I’m open to the possibility. Remember, his programming took up a room of computers, was much less sophisticated than Cameron’s programming and may not have fit on her chip. Also what would be his motivation? Unless Weaver told him to expect her and transfer himself (?).
Cameron has motivation. Her chip may be damaged and she may be afraid she’d hurt John if she stayed as Cameron in the present. And she may be bringing her chip to future Weaver to insert into the Cameron cyborg body when it’s taken over from Allison (another time loop paradox.)
Another possibility, Cameron is in JH’s body in the present and never went into the future, that was just a pretext Weaver used to get JH out of there and to follow her. Cameron may have thought John would have never trusted JH’s body if he ran across it and he’d be safer.
Either way, with John gone and JH gone, It sort of evens out the balance in the families, both she and Sarah Connor lose their son in the end.
Jman <>
Cameron came through when she, Sarah and John jumped from the bank. Cameron came through from the future to the past. That was a bogus excuse, and leads me to believe Weaver has no idea what happened either - or where JH/Cameron are- present or future, but knew that John’s life was threatened in the present by Kaliba and wanted to save his life the way he saved Savannah’s. (another family parallel - each one saved the other’s child).
When it comes to TV or movies, I LOVE it when I totally don’t see something coming.
That ending literally left my jaw dropped for at least 30 minutes while some “dollhouse” show ran afterwords. I just sate there trying to process what I just saw. Completely mind phucked and I totally want more!
ABSOLUTELY the best episode of ANY show I have EVER seen!
I can only hope it gets picked up for another season.
There must be a third season. This was not an ending but a cliff hanger setting up season 3. Surely all the unanswered questions mean there must be a season 3, right?
I can’t believe people are still talking about Cromartie’s head. You would have seriously rather watched a full human-looking head fly at you from the screen? Like a decapitated HUMAN head FLY AT YOU? Has no one considered that that may have been too graphic for network television?
I thought John Herny put Cameron’s chip in his head, so he now Cameron… Summer Glau inside Garret Dillahunt. That’s how he was able to time-travel back with her chip without the chip getting destroyed. He didn’t take the Turk computer with him, so he wouldn’t have been able to do anything at all unless he was using Cameron’s chip (which she gave him).
How did John Henry know there was a time machine in the basement? How would Cameron have known? How would Cameron have explained to JH the need to time-travel to the future? To save Savannah, maybe? How would Cameron have known to tell him that?
The series won’t end, if anyone at FOX has anything in their head at all.
My ReCAPTCHA word is scheduled highway. Hopefully someone at FOX understands how the schedule makes Friday shows have low ratings. If not… well, I can’t really threaten not watching FOX shows for a few reasons, but I’ll have some animosity towards them. It’ll show them.
what was up with the flying thing and the eel? was it trying to attack them?
Simply beautiful. Well done.
Best episode ever - and I mean in the history of television!
You guys are awesome!
Great show… hopefully fox picks it back up.
Scifi would just manage to screw it up like ever other show they touch.
Season #3 Thumbs Up!
Bruce I think you missed the point…at the time of production, the jury was likely still out (and may still be) on whether or not they would be back for another season.
This was a brilliant way to handle it either way…tying up enough to make the timeline/story arcs work, but leaving enough open to invite additional seasons.
If they gave it a SOLID ending and then got picked up for a 3rd season, it would be a lot harder to pull off continuity.
Surely Fox can’t abandon the season like.They even brought back to life Derek albeit as future Derek and gaves us a glimpse of Kyle and Alsion. They’ve set things up for season 3, please give a new season.
Wolfie, you are on to something…Cam DID know what was in that basement as soon as Ellison gave her the “will you join us” message. And JH said he knew her, and she knew him.
People seem to be forgetting that JH had no chip…he was plugged in. Cam could have instructed him to remove her chip, told him how to insert it into himself, and then unplug himself from the turk.
BruceM: I thought John Herny put Cameron’s chip in his head, so he now Cameron… Summer Glau inside Garret Dillahunt. That’s how he was able to time-travel back with her chip without the chip getting destroyed. He didn’t take the Turk computer with him, so he wouldn’t have been able to do anything at all unless he was using Cameron’s chip (which she gave him).
I agree. Cameron’s chip is in JH’s body. JH is just a computer right now, interfacing in the cyborg body through the cord at the back of his head. Disconnect him from the computers and he doesn’t exist. I’m still open to JH having downloaded himself into Cameron’s chip and jumping that way, but I think it’s unlikely. He wasn’t sophisticated enough to do all that (plus the files size issue)..
BruceM: How did John Henry know there was a time machine in the basement? How would Cameron have known? How would Cameron have explained to JH the need to time-travel to the future? To save Savannah, maybe? How would Cameron have known to tell him that?
JH (and Weaver) were expecting Cameron. Whatever JH told Cameron when she got there was a message/instructions from Weaver . If the Cameron in Allison from Palmdale came from Weaver, then she would return to her ‘maker’ (”sorry John”).
Cameron is still alive, she’s just in another body temporarily (until season 3!!!!)
BTW, Cameron is the one who left and Riley was the one who betrayed - right? Or did Cameron betray and Sarah leave? Is what Cameron did really a betrayal if she brought her chip to future Weaver to insert into future Cameron?
Cameron had taught John everything else she needed to when she showed him how to get to her power cell.
The only way John Henry had to unplug from the machine, the turk, was to download himself onto Cameron’s chip. Weaver said that’s what he did. John Henry knew everything, including about the time machine. Weaver never hid anything from him.
The question is who is really in charge in the future?
@Noah
By people I assume you mean me.
And the point I was making is that it was a cop out. A flash of the literary license. When Weaver said “They don’t come through” she meant that they couldn’t have taken Cameron because of the damage her cybernetic tissue took. That went with Terminator genre. Cromartie’s head was a serious screwup. Right up there with Sarah’s shoulder scar being on the wrong shoulder. I mentioned it now because again we see Cameron’s chip, non-organic, going through time and to keep it in cannon they need to make sure its covered up.
You’re assuming I said they should’ve showed a human head fly into the camera? No I did not. I pointed out that it went against Terminator genre, the cannon, and they should’ve thought of another way to have Cromartie time travel with the Connors to 2007. Someway to keep some living tissue over him. After all in the same episode they went to the length of showing how he smuggled a gun through time by placing it inside his leg.
Enough, this was a great episode and props to all involved
Regardless of whether or not the show gets canceled, I think it would be great to hear from Josh Friedman where he would like to take the story next. A spoiler list, like the one he posted back here a while back.
Awesome episode…to say the least. Like many, I could go on forever. I am very sad & torn right now, with what happened to Cameron. Only you the writers and of course the actors know what really happened. I just hope, and beg of thee, to bring her back. Summer put in a lot of effort molding herself to fit that character, and in the storyline remember this…
“I need her.” - John Connor
Bring her back, better than ever. Let him search for her to the ends of the earth. John Connor jumped, leaving his Mom behind, because he wanted to get Cameron back.
So I beg you, let this not be the end of her. I will keep begging too.
There’s so much pointless crap on TV right now, that keeps coming back year after year, and *this* show would get cancelled? It would be like FOX spitting at their audience’s face, as well as at the show’s creators’ faces. The audience represents a very valuable segment, with a superior IQ and a taste for high technology. This very audience is about to inject hundreds of millions of dollars into the next 3 movies of the franchise.
the best ever
this show is too good to be true :).
i can’t wait to watch season 3 .
Great job everyone
About two weeks ago, I started rewatching the old episodes that I have DVR’d, so they are all relatively fresh. This was hands-down the best one of the series! The whole episode was good, but my jaw was literally open from the time the window broke until the end of the episode.
It better not be the end of the season. This show needs budget. It needs another FULL season, so they can get the stars (like Derek and John Henry) to not worry about jumping to other opportunities. They need to keep up the promotional efforts. Most of all, they need people to watch!
If you like this show, and you’re on Twitter, tweet to @Foxbroadcasting and let them know you are watching. Let them know that tweets can spread the word about a GREAT show. And if you are not on twitter, sign up at http://www.twitter.com and then go to http://www.twitter.com/foxbroadcasting and tell them you love this show!
No fate people…
Blitzen: Fox is the same network that cancelled Arrested Development. They cancel all their good shows to make more room for extra hours of American Idol and Kitchen-based reality shows.
The only solution is for everyone to do what I do - refuse to watch new shows on Fox until they’ve been given a second season. Ignore the show for the first season, and when you hear it’s been given a second full season, then go catch yourself up with the first season… buy the 1st Season DVD or watch it in reruns during the off-season. But don’t become a loyal fan of a Fox TV show until you have SOME guarantee that Fox will give it a chance to grow and find an audience. It’s not worth the time to get emotionally invested in a show only to have it cancelled after a brief first season. While this applies to all the networks, it is particularly true for Fox.
Some will point out that TSCC was given a second season. That’s semantics… the “first season” was only 9 episodes. 9 episodes is not a season. The way I see it, the show was given 1.5 seasons… cancelled midway into the second season. Tonight’s episode would probably have been the 2nd season mid-season fall finale had the WGA writer’s strike not screwed up the first season, causing it to be only 9 episodes long. So I screwed up and broke my “second season” rule for watching Fox shows. Mea culpa. In a way, I deserve to be punished by having TSCC cancelled since I should have stuck to my guns and refused to watch it until it was given a full second season (after a full first season).
I will have newfound respect for Fox if they look at the actual ratings rather than the “people who watch it live on friday night” ratings and give the show the 3rd season it deserves. But if that doesn’t happen, my lack of respect and utter hatred towards Fox TV will not only continue, but it will be strongly renewed.
Cameron and John must reunite and come to the conclusion that love can exist among men and machines, and that both are eventually meant to coexist.
Okay, if this ends up being the last episode of the series somebody better post on this blog and explain where it was all going. Please????
TSCC is supposed to take place between T2 and T3,If john is in the future than T3 never takes place.If cameron is his love what happens to Katherine Brewster his supposed future wife? The reason Derek didn’t know JC was because he jumped to the future, to be the savior of mankind he had to survive judgement day(we know the story)..With TSCC JC gets his wish of not being “This great leader” which he never wanted any part of.
freaking awesome, we must have more. I thought it was great the way John said to his mom “he has her” as in JH has Cameron and he’s going to get her back. John picked her over his mom. Anyways, in season 3 we will see how right or wrong we all were!!!
Okay heres my two cents: i have NEVER gone to a network website to read the blogs, have never cared so much about television characters, and have never posted my own thoughts about a show, that is until TSCC became a part of my life! Words cannot describe how good this show is; thank you to all involved! If there is not another season then i am thankful to have been a believer from the beginning, this is something i can be truly proud of. I will be buying both season on DVD, and again i NEVER buy DVDs! FOX are you getting the point!!!!
TSCC IS DEAD; LONG LIVE TSCC!!
PEOPLE! PEOPLE! WE CANNOT JUST SIT AROUND AND ASK FOR A THIRD SEASON!
WE HAVE TO TAKE CHARGE AND VOTE FOR THE THIRD SEASON!!
WE HAVE BEEN VOTING ALL YESTURDAY AND TODAY ,AND WE HAVE GONE FROM 13% TO 29%!! BRINGING CHUCK DOWN FROM 32% TO 29% TIE-ING TSCC TO CHUCK. MY POINT IS WE HAVE DONE THAT IN ONE HONEST DAYS WORK ,AND IF WE KEEP VOTING WE CAN GET A THIRD SEASON BY FORCE ,AND NUMBERS RATHER THAN JUST HOPING AND SHOOTING FOR THE STARS!!
WHO’S WITH ME!! I DON’T KNOW ABOUT YOU ,
BUT I WANT A THIRD SEASON!!!!!!!
Woa. That was brilliant! I couldn’t even pay attention to Dollhouse. Josh, you blew my freaking mind. Thank you, thank you, thank you.
S3 is going to be amazing. Think I’m gonna go pre-order this season from Amazon or something like RIGHT NOW. That’s gotta be helpful, right? Oh shoot…not taking pre-orders yet. But you can sign up to be notified @ Amazon when it’s available. I’m sure someone sees those numbers….
And the T4 preview…The Day the World Went Away in the background…perfect. I haven’t seen any of the Terminator movies and I haven’t actually BEEN to a movie in a couple of years, but I’m definitely going to go see T4 (and watch T1 and T2 before then).
This just doesn’t make sense. JH obviously made it through to the futurepast one way or another…Weaver would not have left him behind. That means that JH was no longer tied to his body/soul in the basement. And Cameron’s chip assumably made it through (at least John believed so) which was why he went.
Cameron knew her body was damaged, and that she had become a risk…she said so. A logical solution would be to dump her body and head to a time when she could “start over”.
I think we’ll find at some point, either in the movies or a potential 3rd season that Cameron is a more “human” version of the machine than we think. After all, that seems to be the whole point of the upcoming movies.
amazing.. absolutely amazing finale.. if a show like this gets canceled it’s entirely because of weak promotion or a bad time slot by FOX.. this is the best sci-fi show I have ever seen and it definitely deserves a third season, and beyond..
SEASON 3! SEASON 3! SEASON 3! SEASON 3! SEASON 3!
Very good episode…
Still not computing everything…
Must have time to process…
Josh shoe-horned in a quick “resolution” on the spur of the moment, that’s for sure!
———
What I don’t like… no Cameron now. Allison is not Cameron. She’s not the same.
What I hope for in a Season 3 is that John realizes Allison is not right for him, is not as good for him as Cameron, and now hunts for John Henry with some help from Catherine behind the scenes to get Cameron’s chip back into her body. Then he can return to the past with her original soul in his possession.
———
As of right now… there is no John Connor. No savior. He must go back. He still has to stop JD.
———
As was stated before: It’s a great way to end a season, but a horribly disappointing way to end a series.
——–
Season 3, please!
Some more thoughts:
For some reason -Catherine Weaver needed JH in the present, otherwise she would have built him in the future and wouldn’t have come back to build him.. I still think the files they’re using in present day JH are too big to fit on Cameron’s chip so that he is not in the future, Cameron is in his body. But maybe she had JH download certain critical files into her chip and then had him (using her chip) jump to the future? And as far as what weaver said about Cameron not jumping - maybe only ‘active’ cyborgs can jump, if they are inactive (as Cameron was at the end and as JH would be without his cord), they can’t jump.
Could be that the cyborg who jumped may be a hybrid of Cameron with the most critical JH files on her chip - which would explain how Cameron can ‘feel’ and why she is so different from other cyborgs. She got that moral/human element in her chip from Weaver’s work with JH
Wonder if next season Weaver hooks up Cameron’s left behind body to the Turk computer in the basement and the switch is on both ends - JH in the future with Cameron’’s chip and Cameron in the basement as JH hooked up to the Turk..
Makes for a great start to Season 3.
I really hope this show doesn’t get cancelled. Way too much entertainment to end. Can’t wait for season 3 !!!
WE ARE BATING CHUCK!
TSCC 30%
CHUCK 28%
now we need to widen the gap!
vote and make sure we get more another amazing finale like that one
by getting a season 3!!
oh and i ment to say beating! haha
It is interesting that on Good Friday, we get maybe the final episode of a fictional Christ-figure.
Kudos for really teasing the Jameron folks.
While I feel good about predicting Weaver and John Henry were on our side, man this is a lot of loose ends. Are you trying to force their hands on a season 3 or something?
In last episode, Cain and Abel, Cameron informed Sarah that she destroyed “a chip” but also informed Sarah that they could reverse engineer it and create the technology from scratch. Or, more simply, they get their hands on another chip and plug that into JH, God knows there’s been enough Terminators running around already.
On another note why would Weaver abandon the Turk aka John Henry (whom she was willing to sacrifice Savannah for) and travel to the future if she had any inclination that the T-888 interface wasn’t John Henry at all but simply Cameron plugged in to the port? And why would John Henry be willing to give up Cromartie’s body to Cameron? If he did he’d be stuck in 2007 still.
I’m willing to bet everything I own that JH has a chip inside of him and it isn’t Cameron’s. I hope he has Cameron’s chip on him for the sake of the series. Maybe they’ll flash the literary license and say that he placed her chip in one of the other processors. In theory the T-888 is exactly the same as the T-800 (Arnold) except it has room for 2 extra processing units - chips - to increase the logic algorithm power.
This little bit of trivia has been neglected throughout the series but now that they suddenly have use for it maybe they’ll use it.
The major problem with this line of thinking (that Cameron put her chip in Cromartie’s head) is that without his own chip John Henry can’t accompany the T-888 body to the future. Weaver knows this and so she must believe that there is a John Henry chip in the T-888 otherwise she never would have gone with John to the future. Her mission is to protect John Henry at all costs. Where JH goes she goes. John Henry jumps to the future. She jumps to the future.
Looks like it is already gone
http://www.fmqinc.com/terminator-cancelled/
And anybody think that “Chola” might just be a Terminator “observer?” Cameron seems to know her quite well. Hmmm…
Great show. It would be a great mistake not to create another season.
jordan where is this voting taking place??
ooooooooooooooo my gosh!!!!!! Mind boggling……….first off they cant end it……”John goes no where without his mother…….” lol im just being way too hopeful I think……ah have to admit an amazing ending……….BUT I NEVER WANT AN END………..MORE TERMINATOR! Bring on the metal
ha it has to continue so i can watch it up at college and get everyone hooked 
ok i gotta say, dis season finale was amazing! this episode was able to tie up a few notches and continue with the terminator franchise storyline. on thing tho, i cant stop thinkin about the scene with john and cameron. it was a nice little move that cameron did on john but i dont understand what john was feeling for. Im a little sketchy with John saying to cameron “thats good right” and cameron replying “thats good, thats perfect”. if anyone can get back at me with a lil explantion thanks
o nd there must be a season 3 FOX dont make the same mistake with canceling firefly
I’m still going to shout, so everybody get ready:
BRING BACK CAMERON, DAMNIT!!!!!!!”
Thank you for listening.
I really enjoyed this episode and will be disappointed if it is not picked up for another season. I do have a question though b/c I think I missed something - the man young John Conner was staring at at the end…was that his father or his adult self? I thought it was Kyle but several posts here say differently. Can someone clarify for me? Thanks.
Perfect!!! Superb!!!
I PRAY this show doesn’t get cancelled. That was by far one of the best season finales I have ever seen. IF they do decide to cancel it (which would be a huge mistake) they should turn it into a limited run comic strip (like continues to be done with Buffy the Vampire Slayer). Better idea, if FOX will extend their lineup to 11PM like the other networks, TSCC will absolutely destroy Jay Leno at 10PM on NBC.
@Jman their is a link on the home page on this blog under “save one show: terminator.”
click on the white like that says save one show and vote for tscc! oh and remember you can vote more than once!
I think cameron put her chip in JH and then went into the future because it was the only way to get john to leave his mother. And since Cameron knew what happens to Allison Young in the future, her chip can be put into the replicated Allison Young to become Cameron again. Kind of confusing but thats what I got from the episode.
200 comments and its only been 2 hrs since the episode ended.
@Dan
Could not agree more - Allison will not be the same as Cameron so bring Cameron back. On that note bring John Henry back too. I’m starting to watch the show as much for him as all the other characters.
“Twenty!”
Looks like we finally know what that HK was built for and that all our speculation about their being two separate factions rang true.
“Some of us don’t want war. Some of us want peace.”
Okay but Cameron was on the side of Skynet originally. She was sent in to kill JC. She was sent in to kill him and place his head on a pike for all to see. Okay I’m going to take a timeout and start making picture diagrams to try and figure out whose from what dimension because there have been way too many time jumps since T1.
I love you Summer!
When you remove the chip Cameron becomes deativated,How would she put it in JH?
If FOX doesn’t pick up a new season (and they should!!!!), we should pray it is picked up by someone else. Great epidode, though. I enjoyed MOST (vast majority) of the season except for the two episodes of crap the suits might have actually been correct about not ever doing in the first place.
What an episode. I loved the twist, loved that Weaver is on our side…kinda. I loved the scene in motel, but i must say I was disappointed that it wasn’t true Jameron, but still…it rocked! However, HOW..can you do that to Cameron? to us? She’s gone….maybe we don’t know..you killed Derek another favorite.
The story is amazing, this show is amazing, the characters are amazing….but Josh…PLEASE fix this. We want OUR Cameron back. We must have Season three!! I trust that you will in S03.
PLEASE FOX, RENEW TSCC FOR A THIRD SEASON. PLEASE
Seriously, I’m holding back tears and I don’t know why.
OMG!! I just finished watching the finale and it was amazing!! I really hope this was just a season finale and not a series. I love this show. The actors that play Cameron, Weaver, John Henry are incredibly believeable!! I love it. I will miss Sarah but it will be cool to see how John changes. John has become such a strong young man it is so easy to see him as the savior of mankind. This is the only show that I can’t wait to see every week. I hope it does not end!!
Watching the episode over and over!
AMAZING
Great episode
Thank You for a great 2 seasons.
John went in to the future because
Weavers prophecy that John could
not save humanity without JH he did not
go for Cameron.
They need more episodes………..I NEED MORE EPISODES! WE NEED MORE EPISODES! I promise ill watch the commercials on my tivo i promise. just dont take it away PLEASE!
Did that sound to desperate. Best ending run of a season since the first season of heroes. and note i said season not series so don’t disappoint me.
That episode kicked so much ass! I am really sad about the motel scene not being a real jameron scene. But the part I am absolutely devastated about is poor Cameron!! how could you do this to her ,and i was about to cry when i saw the “I am sorry John” typed over and over again.
well the one thing good about all of this is that knowing Josh he will do the best he can to fix this huge mess in season 3 when we get it (AND YES WE WILL GET IT) and bring our old Cameron back!!!
I’m speechless!! this was by far the best thing i’ve seen on tv in YEARS!!
Season 3 MUST happen!!
This has got to be some of the best writing on tv! As you pan thru some of the other lame networks, you can not find anything remotely this good. I was literally jumping out my sofa in shock! Keep up the good writing and bring us some more!!!!!!!
I’m gutted at what happened to Cameron. The fact her chip has been saved gives me some hope that she will be back if there is a season 3. I can see why Summer was sad at where her character ends up though.
I wonder if the ending kind of preps the show for a move if it does get cancelled. It’s gotten super sci-fi at this point, and I can entirely see if moving to the CW or the Sci-Fi network should Fox decide to cancel.
Terminator Salvation looks GREAT. I’ll be there for it and I RARELY go to movie theaters these days.
Perhaps the suits at Fox will reconsider cancellation after a HUGE turnout for T4? Then again, after the next movie, it may render this whole TV series moot. Dunno.
Frankly, I’m interested in seeing what writers can do, but we’ll see. This is the only TV series that has hooked me in several years. It’s the ONLY TV show I watch AND LOOK FORWARD TOO on a weekly basis (at night). Otherwise, I am Working, talking to friends and family, farting around on the internet (like now), Out drinking with friends, reading, watching old DVDs or watching Family Guy re-runs.
Thank you!!!
Thank you, To all involved in the show for the good and the bad episodes.
It was FUN!!! and Lena, Summer, Garbage are damn hot!!
Glad to see the Derek Harry Kim action.
Good luck, hope ya get your third season.
Just a couple of more Echoes and I got my Friday nights back.
THANKS AGAIN!!! ENJOYED!!
Hey, it’s the Holy Times.
Tires Barbara, Recaptcha out!
You’re all forgetting about the chip Ms. Weaver gave to John Henry from the 888 that came fom her daughter. He probably re-programmed that chip for himself, had Cameron put it in and has Camerons with him, with some instructions from her as to what to do with it in the future i’m sure.
AWESOME SHOW
Maybe because this is supposed to be some weird ass alternate reality, Allison will try to make a pass at John, but John snubs her as he snubbed Riley.
He’s not in love with Allison… he’s in love with Cameron. Allison (in this twist) just looks like Cameron, but is not her.
He came for Cameron and to find JH. Find JH and he finds the original Cameron and must then fight to get back to the past.
This puts him in direct conflict with Weaver as he wants that chip back no matter what to get his Cameron back, which would cause JH, in this form, to be put out to pasture.
He can make an incision into his leg, the fleshy part of the thigh, and put Cam’s chip in there and then return to the past.
That would show true love on his part. John Connor will move Heaven and Earth to get his love back.
And again, it isn’t Allison.
—
That would then make sense that Cameron does not equal Allison in John’s mind.
And the alternate “Bizarro” reality just created would never be.
I just started watching this season. I love the show.. And I can not believe FOX is going to end it this way?
Bring it back for another season Fox!
He looked happy at first as he probably thought it was Cameron then when he saw the dog he suddenly realised that it wasnt her and his face dropped. I think Cameron will be back if there is a season 3, she has to be.
Must have more! Best show ever in my whole life of TV watching. Nothing compares.
You could not have rocked my world more if you put me in the middle of that “transportation machine” and did what you did. Un-freakin-believable! Absolutely amazing. I was so shocked by Derek’s death, but with the direction this show is going now, I will not stand for it if Fox decides to cut programming. I may not catch it live every Friday but it is my morning breakfast on Saturday!
To the Writers: Superb work and shaping of characters and a world that I would be proud to fight for. This episode was beyond anything I would have expected and my heart broke with the final surprise.
To the Actors: I’m there, you got me.
Please, please, PLEASE FOX, keep this show because if you don’t you’ll have egg on your face and this show will definitely fall within “Brilliant but Canceled”… But that won’t happen right???
Amazing
HOLY….CRAP!
I don’t think I’ve so many emotions go through while watching live television as I did during those last 10 minutes. The story HAS to continue somehow, it just can’t end here. Whether FOX renews, another network picks it up, DVD movies, comic books or even a freaking NOVEL. I don’t care! It just CAN’T end here.
@Mark,
I think you can see a boatload of fanfics coming out of this Twilight Zone of an ending. You can bet on it.
my qeustion is, was that the boy at the end of the final ep. the same boy that was on that ep. from the military acadamy. pls tell me i think it was him, but i would like it if someone could confirm it for me. thx.
By reaching inside Cameron, John Connor left his DNA inside her. That DNA code will be transferred to John Henry along with Cameron’s chip. Essentially, John Henry is their child.
Just thinking out loud about the possibilities of this storyline’s effect on future productions (should this be deemed “canonical” in the Terminator franchise).
Hypotehically, lets say that the computer entity we knew as JH ends up finding its “brother” and joining forces to form SkyNet? Now that Ellioson has taught it morals, its code is “humanifed”…in a way corrupted. This might lead to certain parts of SkyNet developing human characteristics. Combine that with the physical melding of man&machine and you’ve got a pretty good lead in to the forthcoming big screen trilogy.
I am fairly confident this show will return in the Fall…I just see no down angle for Fox with three years of big box office brand marketing guaranteed. They would be remiss not to capitalize on it.
.
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read my other post and answer pls thx. ( this is a arrow)
The season finale was absolutely great. I have to say the show took an unexpected turn. I hope cameron comes back. I cannot wait for season 3.
This has been the best episode yet. Please Fox, give us a season 3.
cramp the websit screwed up my arrow
Wonderful episode that capped off the season perfectly. I’d really like to thank the cast and crew for their work. It was an amazing season, and I hope there will be at least one more.
This is the first show I’ve watched every week in years (came to “Lost” and “BSG” late.) Come one season 3!
When john jumped forward, he did not grow up to be their leader (that is why they did not know him), so…. he does not send derek or his father back in time… how is he alive? PARADOX! …he knows that was not cameron but he is obvously stunned by the sight of her. nice twist with weaver being on his side. superb SEASON ender… PLEASE bring on season 3, I promise to be a faithful no tivo-ing live watcher. we need cameron back!…… do you want me to beg ? ………I will
lost is a great show i agree with that. very few tv shows and compare to the greatness of lost and tscc
Wow? This show is simply amazing! I have never seen a show where it keeps me on the edge of my seat. I have to say, Bravo to the whole cast! Josh Friedman is such a great writer. I can?t express how great the show is. The two season finales are amazing? It leaves me speechless with tears of in my eyes. This is hands down my favorite TV series I have ever watched! Great Job guys! Keep it up.
They blew up cameron at the end of Season 1, and she was back… quit whining about how there is no more cameron. Of course cameron will still be around. The question is - will the show still be around?
The answer is no, because Fox sabotaged it by moving it to Friday, the one night of the week where people go out and DVR the primetime shows they want to watch, to watch when they get home and/or get sober. TSCC is one of the most watched shows on TV if you include all the people who watch it on their DVRs. But since those people likely skip through the commercials, they don’t count for the ratings numbers, which are all geared towards the advertisers. No TV show can last on friday nights. The theory was that loser geeks who like sci-fi stay at home on friday nights since they’re not invited to any parties, so sci-fi shows like TSCC and Dollhouse have a theoretical audience for friday nights. But even the sci-fi geeks DVR the show to watch later… they may not be at the coolest clubs, but they still go out and do stuff on friday night, if nothing more than playing Dungeons and Dragons with some freinds in their parent’s basement. That’s why TSCC and Dollhouse get such crappy “live” ratings. And that’s why there won’t be any season 3.
No TV show can survive on friday night as long as it’s ratings are derived the same way as primetime shows on other nights of the week. TSCC had no chance, it was sabotaged.
Fox doesn’t give a crap about online voting, emails, letters, and blog petitions. And none of the ‘fake networks’ like the CW or WB have ever picked up a major network show, so any talk about TSCC being picked up by one of those quasi-networks is wishful thinking, at best.
Fox needs to learn that it takes good shows a few seasons to find an audience, and shows should be given a chance to mature, grow, and find their audience. Seinfeld in a perfect example. It got crappy ratings the first few seasons, but NBC gave it a chance, and through word of mouth and great writing, it became one of the most popular sitcoms ever. Had Seinfeld been on Fox, society and American culture would have missed out greatly, since it would have been cancelled after 13 or so episodes. Fox is just clueless. They always have been, and always will be. The answer is not to watch shows on Fox until you hear they’ve been given a second or third season - then go watch the first season or two and catch up. Don’t start watching at Season 1. You’ll be asking for disappointment. And Fox needs to be taught a lesson.
Holy crap! What did I just experience? My heart’s in my stomach. Is Allison Kyle’s girlfriend? What happened to Cameron? Why did Sarah let John go with Catherine?
WE NEED SEASON THREE!!!
Thank you Josh!!!!
Just to join the chorus, I too will say that my hopes are for FOX to continue this show. Such an engaging, well written/acted series should not be consigned to the flames simply because of the archaic ratings measurement system. As well, it would seem rather a wasted opportunity to can this show in the wake of its immanent synergy with the _Terminator: Salvation_ film.
Great SEASON finale!
SEASON 3!!! SEASON 3!!! SEASON 3!!!
Fox, I bought the first season on blu-ray out of curiosity and was blown away. I caught up with the show online and have been watching the last three weeks live. I feel like i just discovered the greatest show ever made, with every element you could ask for, and now it is being ripped away from me. Or so the rumors say. Please dont do this. No Fate.
Worst Ending ever!! And I hope there is a 3rd season
NOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Freaking awesome….. This definately ties in to Salvation. THEY WANT TO BECOME HUMAN!!!!
I hate to say it, don’t hold your breathe for another season, it was all a lead up to the movie.
I can’t believe the way it ended and directed towards how different the future is compared to the original depcition of the war and future from the original Terminator.
HOLY CRAP what a ride.
Cant wait for Salvation!!! Viva Conner!!!!
This episode was absolutely fantastic! Awesome job all I really have to say is that we had better get a season three because where we were left off leaves a lot of questions. This was a perfect way to end the SEASON.
Loved the episode, but totally confused.., I guess they can end this series with this episode but cmon FOX, have a season 3.
Wow… Fox needs to renew this show. If there was ever a time when they needed to renew a show… now is the time. I mean at this point, they should renew the show to satisfy their own curiosity. What’s going to happen?!?!?!? John in the future with Weaver! Ahhhh!
I loved how he sees (or rather thinks he sees) Cameron and smiles, but then realizes that it’s not her and his smile turns into… disappointment.. confusion… realization? Just wow. Everything about this episode was amazing. I want to see John and Weaver working together… to stop skynet and get Cameron back.
WHEN the show returns, I really hope that they find a way to get OUR Cameron back. I’m sure I’ll love Allison too, but I want my machine back…
FOX. Please don’t let it end like this! These writers are genius!
fuck you fox. if you cancel this series we are fucking done professionally!
thank you josh
For those of you who say the show’s already cancelled - you know that looks bad right? Negative comments will only leave FOX to assume we’re ok with losing the show.
I would love to see what happens next, and TSCC has so many true supporters, I’m pretty sure I will.
oh my god. that was the best episode ever!!!! the ending, left my mouth open and my eyes were boggling out. @.@ season 3 now!!!!!!!! XD
That was so amazing! I am so blown away! This show is like no other. Thank you Josh and the wonderful cast and crew for bringing such an amazing show to TV.
I’m speechless…
HANG IN THERE BABY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Cameron has Blue Eyes, DAMMIT!!!! Why didn’t anyone on the production team notice?
this show gave me a reason to get through the week, please please, I wish it weren’t so - this ending is such a wrap indicator, they can’t jump back from this…I loved this show.
That was an awsome ending. But right at the end We see a flash. and Just like my girlfriend predicted. Its most likely Sarah Connor coming into the time line with John. So we’ll probably see a Season 3. Cant wait. Cant wait till this season is out on DVD.
THERE BETTER BE A SEASON 3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Josh, That was absolutely FANTASTIC!! This was an amazing episode and I hope there will be an S3. Really, I’m completely blown away with all of the possibilities.
Dan: Don’t freak out about Cameron. I’m with you but I can see many avenues by which they can (and if they want S3 to be a success they will) bring back our girl. Cameron is the character that makes the show unique. I don’t think they’ll make the same mistake twice. Cameron will be back if the show is picked up.
EVERYBODY GO VOTE TO SAVE THIS SHOW.
Josh although I have been a critic at times this ep was beyond phenominal. I was expecting to be disappointed but I couldn’t have been more wrong.
Summer, Lena, and Thomas thank you for such a great ride.
Please bring this show back for #3. best show on TV!!!!
Wow that was an amazing season finale! I’m keeping my fingers crossed for season 3 from Fox. This show is the only show that I never miss an episode of. I can’t believe how different this show is from anything else on t.v. today. Fox needs to keep this show alive, I’ve told all my friends about it and many are hooked! give us a third season!!
this episode blew my mind like a bag of popcorn in a microwave, popping with each scene leading to a crescendo ending. and it was tasty.
WOW, that was amazing!!! FOX if you bring it back for a 3rd season I promise to watch the commercials. Incredible finale!
OK, ….
That was ABSOLUTELY amazing. There has to be a season 3. It is going to take another episode to fully explain what just happened. It would be grossly unfair for the whole thing to end after that.
First off, best episode of the series.
I can envision a Season 3 switching back and forth between Sarah in the past fighting Terminators, and John /Derek / Kyle / John Henry / Allison in the future waging war against Skynet. It will all lead up to John sending Cameron back in time on her mission, forming a nice loop.
But I’m still trying to figure out exactly what happened between Cameron and John Henry. Did John Henry’s entire structure (servers, The Turk, etc) get transported to the future, or just his body w/ Cameron’s chip?
Anyway I must own this on Blu-Ray ASAP.
wow…probably one of the best episodes i have ever seen….in ALL television history.
PLZ KEEP THIS SHOW ALIVE
John and Catherine (having done what she needs to have been done, whatever that is) return to the past, patch up Cameron, and get Mr. Murch to download Cameron back into her chip from the backup servers.
Cameron, awakens, and sits up on the table.
Cameron [disoriented]: Woah! Do not try that at home, boys and girls!
John [putting a comforting hand on her shoulder]: How… how are you feeling?
Cameron [almost serenely] : Wonderful! Good as new. [looks a bit confused] But for some strange reason, I have this… desire to…
John looks concerned.
Cameron [befuddled]: …play a mean game of Dungeons & Dragons. Anybody have some spare dice on them? Who wants in? John? Sarah? Catherine? Loser buys me some pancakes!
Everyone stares at her like she’s a Martian.
—
LOL!
Watched it twice, posted twice, all I can say is Amazing, Amazing, Amazing! A really long post…
A few ques:
-my friend wondered where did the prisoners(when they were escaping, running around) think they were going to? I didn’t know what to say since there would be even more security at the gates, but maybe a few could escape.
-Weaver: “I’d watch who’s calling who a bitch,” “gymnastics end at 5:30″(cool, there was some funny moments)
-The Chlora’s back! Yay! That was her right? She looks so different?(why do we call her The Chlora btw?)
-Cant say I liked the effects when Weaver turned into some kind of shield and protected the Connors and Ellison, looked a little fake and I was weirded out at first but liquid metal can form any shape right? Except bombs.The voice that said “run,” who was that?Didnt sound like John or Ellison.(memory’s faded, dont like to watch the movies during the season)
-Did Sarah jump thru time? They showd it at the end with her voice, “I love you,” that was great and when John told Sarah he “loves her.”
-Yeah, I think Sarah has cancer.
-Thank you for the answer, the Term on the sub is Weaver, but why did Cam lie to John and why did Cam say to JH, “I know you too?” How does she know him? Is Cam now JH or vice versa.
-I think we need a Sarah/Ellison shipper thread now
-I need details on the Peter bible story, with the locks, I’m not sure what they mean.
-The future scene! It kills me! I use to think about John being there, but this is so beyond from what I imagined, pure genius!
-Derek! Yes, amazing and heartbreaking and amazing at the same time, didn’t expect him to come back and so soon too.
-How did Weaver get clothes on so quickly? Did we not see her grab clothes or was it her metal that formed clothes?
-Why cant damaged terms travel, well it’s no prob.
-Is Jesse dead? I for one don’t really buy it yet. Maybe she killed herself.
-”Bad John Connor!”
-How does the eel form into Weaver? Was it already a part of her? Why did she keep it in the tank?
-”They’re trying to kill my John.”
- Cam think Sarah sick. I thought Sarah heard their conversation from Adam Raised a Cain.
“She gave it to him,”
“Where when,”
“Not armored are you?”
“Why are you expecting trouble?”
“I’m sorry John.”
“Please, I’m not metal.”
Yes I really liked the ending, the last 20 mins? I think.
I WANT A SEASON 3, in case that was unclear.
Sorry if being annoying I post 1st then read.
Well, it ended only about 45 minutes ago here on the left coast, I had to watch it a second time right away.
Tremendous episode and ending. I loved that ending, it was so well done. Beautiful actually.
Amazing work by everyone and some great special effects in this one too. Congrats to everyone. Thanks for all the hard work. Both seasons.
I’m still dry mouthed and practically speechless a half hour later. Oh my frakking god, what an ending!!! My brain’s been turned inside out and my heart ripped open with John and Sarah being separated for the greater good of stopping Skynet. I loved John saying ‘I love you’ to Sarah and Sarah saying ‘I love you too’ at the end as a perfect closing line!
I never expected to see the time travel again, to an alternate future, no less! Does John has an alternate protector now in Catherine Weaver? How will Sarah stop Kaliba in the present and John and CW stop JH? What’s JH’s aim in going to the future if he becomes Skynet in the present and what does Cameron’s chip have to do with it? Does Sarah have cancer? So many questions answered but so many left open! Argh!
I haven’t loved/been emotionally connected to a show like this in years, and will continue to vote, watch my DVR and online, write my letters and say my peace to help get a third season! As many have said, I’ve been here since the pilot and will be here to the end.
To the cast and crew - thanks for your untold hours of work and for giving us an incredible two seasons! Josh, your imagination is something else! You are the man! Thomas, you are one of the great young actors and one of the nicest people I’ve ever met. Summer, you bring humanity I never thought possible to a machine. Hadley, thanks for keeping us all informed and entertained with this blog. And Lena - thank you for moving me with every episode and doing an impeccable job with the character of Sarah Connor - you’re my favorite, as always!
TSCC is my all time favorite show. FOX keep it on baby…c’mon now!
Yes we need an edit button, Cam told John I might kill you some day, does she? Is the theory that John is dead and Cam is running things possible?
@in_mourning… This is NOT a show killer, this is the jump off point for something AWESOME! Good job JF… keep it up please!
Well lets think about this for a minute, now this show is in the top 10 shows up for cancelation. Now why would FOX do this to us? But lets say we get a season 3 then this will be the greatest thing that has ever happened to the terminator franchise. Now John is really got what he has always wanted ever since he was a kid. And i bet you are all wondering what that is? Well ill tell you, he never wanted to be this big leader and now he is not the leader. Now where did Weaver go and what are her plans? I do believe that at some point there was something between Allison and John at some time in the future. I remember Cameron asking Allison before she killed her “DO YOU KNOW WHY JOHN CONNER CHOOSE?” And thats why I believe why future John was keeping Cameron around soo much. But any thing can happen now everything we know about the future is HISTORY!!!!!!!!!!!
I loved whoever pointed out that after Tasha Yar-ing Derek, they Harry Kim-ed him in this episode.
I love that “Pweeg” was part of Weaver all along.
I loved that Ellison visibly looked as if he was strugglign to take it all in.
I love that Weaver had the “Tell me where it hurts” hairdo after killing the T888 (Garbage fans will get the reference)
I love that not all threads were answered and some new ones (Dysons son) were created.
I loved seeing Thomas semi-naked again LOL
I loved the episode. Well done Josh and co, and well done all the cast for giving us two years of great shows.
Awesome, awesome, awesome! For a short time, it seemed this show lost its way, and I began to lose interest. But it’s redeemed itself. Loved every moment of this ifnale! Ties up a lot of loose ends! Excellent job of writing this episode, and it makes a potential 4th season extremely exciting!
I DO NOT EVEN WATCH TV, I LIKE MOVIES BUT THIS IS THE ONLY SHOW I HAVE EVER LOVED AND WATCH SEVERAL TIMES, PLEASE GIVE US ANOTHER SEASON!
Phasee I think the eel scene validated all of the people that believed that the LMT on the Carter was Weaver. I think that question was answered.
I don’t feel like Cameron betrayed him. Her alliance is with the resistance, and she knows that John Henry can help take down Skynet. That is her purpose, and although John loves her, he needs to be able to let her go for the greater good. Sarah, John, and Cameron are more than a family…they are a battalion. PLEASE GIVE US A SEASON THREE. I can’t wait to buy tickets to Salvation.
This tv show has surpassed Heroes in entertainment value and should be brought back for another season. There was a marathon of Heroes reruns so that the audience could catch up, why not do that to this show and capitalize on the buzz the new Terminator movie will create? I don’t see why Heroes was given another chance and not this tv show. It’s extrememely well acted and the action and drama suck you right in. I love how it explores what it is to be human and the acting is superb. The writers deserve accolades for this show. Fox, just give it another chance! So many badly acted and written shows out there this is a keeper. The last 2 episodes had me on the edge of my seat - now that’s entertainment!! Brilliant writing and directing - the right pauses and close ups of the actors faces. The final episode was so captivating! Friday night is a night many people go out, though so why was it moved there from it’s slot on Monday night after Heroes?
Words can not described how amazing this episode was. OH MY GOD. If we do not get a third seaosn I will have something…but my medical insurance wouldn’t like it.
I don’t even know where to being.
I had a feeling time travel would come into play, that Cameron’s chip and that Derek would be back. I guess the little bomb in Cameron’s head will not be an issue.
But wow. I’m wide awake that episode was so good!!!! To the cast a crew amazing work. Bravo. That is what I call great TV. That deserves a season 3!!!! No questions asked!!!
My favorite part has to be that John is willing to go with an unknown terminator to the future to save Cameron.
JF you’re a romantic and Jameron fan aren’t you. I love the aspect of that show!! I loved that it was his main concern. He asks if she’s ok, notices she’s emotional, listens to her, runs to check on her!!!
I mean John looked so happy to see Derek, the grown up Kyle and then Cameron walks in and he looked so disappointed that she was human. So he want’s Cameron not the human version. Jameron alive and well!!!!
The John and Cameron bed scene…hottest thing I have seen in a while on network TV where you see nothing it was just…drool worthy (is that a word). . And Cameron just seemed so emotional.
So Cameron gave JH her chip maybe to fix to stop her from having this underlying urge to kill John?
I guess if John is looking for JH and Cameron’s chip, he could get to know Alison (I mean he knows when Cameron glitches back in AFP she thought she was Alison) and when the time comes he does not tell her she will die, until Cameron comes back. He can knock her out and replace her chip with Cameron’s. Then they can go back in time.
Cameron getting Sarah out of jail. Too bad she didn’t tranquilize the guards. Her damage (only question I have is why does she have a red eye?) But at the moment I really don’t care!!!
And the jokes, I liked that gate, the comment about what would happen if Ellison would bring a swat team, Cameron waiting in the car for the meter. Weaver in cloths so fast and a naked John!! Cameron becoming so emotional, the liquid eel, ground JC, the I love you moment.
And Weaver ROCKS!!!! Her message to Cameron!!!
So does that mean Cameron was running the resistance?
And the ‘I’m sorry John’ message on the computer!!! OH MY GOD!!!
I loved seeing the silent girl again, and when she talks for the first time. Or that Cameron says ‘Hasta’ or the priest.
I loved every single character in this episode. I loved the connections to season 1.
I know I’m forgetting so much but wow!!
Amazing episode. I have to go watch it again!!
To the cast and crew Bravo!!! well done. Now hand over a season 3!!!
What the heck just happend. The was mind blowingly AWSOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It’s killing me to know all the cool places this show could go if there was a Season Three, all the while knowing there will probably not be a Season Three.
Thank you so much to everyone involved in making the show, and yes, to FOX for giving it a “second” season. This show had some of the best writing on television, and it was one of those shows that I just couldn’t wait for the week to go by so I could watch it on Friday night. That hasn’t happened to me since Invasion.
Here’s hoping FOX decides to give us a miracle and renew the show.
Really? It seemed more like a halfass season finale..more like a 50% season 50% series finale in case there wasn’t a s3. I mean..I loved every part of it..besides for the fact that it felt like giving up.
It is kind of weird how Weaver doesn’t know about John Connor and asks Ellison why Sarah thinks her son is a Messiah. Shouldn’t everyone in the original future timeline know who John is?
John def. went to the future solely for Cameron, no way he would have left Sarah like that if Cameron wasn’t the issue and only JH was. I don’t know how come Sarah didn’t go though, that seemed uncharacteristic of her… not to stick with John. There must be so much there that we don’t know!!!! SEASON 3 OR HUNGER STRIKE!
Here’s another thought since this is an alternate reality.
Cameron’s body is damaged in the present… badly.
Catherine knows how to fix Terminators (like she did with Cromartie’s body). She’s in the Future with John.
John Henry is on the loose in the Future with John and Catherine.
Cameron’s soul is in the past… downloaded into the server farm at ZeiraCorp.
John, with help, from his new buddies in the Future, and CW build an entirely new Cameron from a Skynet Terminator factory they capture. Allison helps as well. She finally realizes where John Connor’s true feelings lie and this time willingly allows him to model and scan her looks into the Skynet tissue mold system in designing Cameron. She does not die for this new Cameron shell to be be born, she is an active participant in her creation.
This design is better than ever. All of John’s love goes into this along with John Henry and Catherine Weaver’s help. The chip is even more advanced, the endoskeleton is tougher, stronger, and more lightweight.
John Connor not only creates Cameron… he learns from the experience greatly.
John, Catherine, and a more evolved John Henry take their leave of the alternate time line, along with this new and inert Cameron. All that remains is to download Cameron’s original consciousness into this new body.
One other outward enhancement… Cameron has a slightly new hairstyle… it’s taper/feathered in the front and frames her face in an even more lovely style. Allison Young decided that she would add the finishing touch and could get her own hair even “more right.”
Cameron is back, and better than ever. No glitchy chip, no weak endo, so she’s more battle hardened and tougher… and she can now swim with the help of the better materials used.
OMG!
What have you guys done… I don’t know if I’ll ever be able to piece my brain back together!
season three…please Fox… now we really need season three!
Whatever happens, the show was a gift to Terminator fans. Thank you.
AWSOME SEASON FINALE!
I am a little sick of everyone bitching about Cameron.
As much as a Love her charachter the show is called the SARAH CONNOR chronicles.
Dont any of you think it was incredibly sad that John left her there
It is even sadder when you hear her voice ” I love you too”
I felt like crying there witch is something I haven’t felt since Dobby’s Death in Harry Potter 7
good morning everyone.
yeah, morning. ‘Cause I’m French and I stayed awake ALL NIGHT just to watch the show as soon as possible…
I almost cried.
You broke my heart. This episode was - gosh - SO AMAIZING… You just CAN’T abandon it…
Please, Fox. Please. Give us a S3.. I’m begging you.
Yes Kea it was drool worthy. And, did you catch the double entendre when John had his hand on the “breast plate” and Cameron says “Yes, that’s perfect”.
And I don’t want to forget, Thanks Hadley, for keeping the blog and putting up with a pack of rowdy geeks like us. Great job.
Happy Easter everyone. Ironically RCN says: destined, his.
Please give us season 3. Season 2 was fantastic!
I wonder if they’ll ever explore John and Alison romance if we get a season 3. could have potential I think. not to suggest that Cameron would be gone, but for a side story they could ask the question, was john’s attraction to Cameron more of a physical one? if it was he might actually have a chance of making something work with Alison. even if they split up later when realising it just isn’t the same, he can still get befriend her and get her to join the resistance by earning her trust. And later they meet back up with Cameron. the whole thing could last about 4 episodes. just a thought.
Season 2 was great. Please give us season 3!
OMG
you did an amazing show with the back 9 but we still have A LOT of answers
WE NEED ANOTHER SEASON AND CAMERON BACK !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
listen people we can win this, write to fox and wb right now
scott.rowe@warnerbros.com
askfox@fox.com
AMAZING FINALE!!!! Great way to end the season. Thank you so much for all your hard work Josh Friedman and crew. Defiently getting this episode tomorrow! FOX RENEW THIS SHOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This show is, and always will be amazing. way to be
@Dan:
“John Connor not only creates Cameron… he learns from the experience greatly.”
Yes, and since he’s found a few cold spots I’m sure he’ll include some strategically placed peltier modules.
Oh…my…GOD!
If Fox doesn’t renew this show, I will be really pissed off.
OMG!!!! This episode has really shaked my mind. There is no other TV show that has ever made me feel the way this show has. It’s a freaking masterpiece. It’s art in the form of Science Fiction. I truly now vow to watch FOX and many of it’s shows if it renews, if not, then FOX can kiss my ass and I will never watch FOX again. Sorry to be so crude, but it’s the truth. PLEASE FOX, and WARNER, you have given us something so beautiful, don’t let it die. It’s only a matter of time when this show gets a huge audience. It’s an epic. Josh Friedman has made an epic on television, and that is rare!!! I vow to convince all of my family, friends, and anyone else to watch this show. You would be suprised at how many people do not know about this show. PLease, RENEW it.
Oh, the preview for T4 was amazing too. Definitely not to be missed.
@Snake
Phasee I think the eel scene validated all of the people that believed that the LMT on the Carter was Weaver. I think that question was answered.
I agree, but why would she take a part of her into the eel?
Another big question: if the Cromartie body now contains Cameron’s chip, then John Henry’s consciousness still resides inside The Turk and the rest of the computers in the basement.
So now that Weaver is gone, who will “mother” him now and prepare him for the fight against his brother? Ellison?
My wife and I have loved this show since the pilot and season 2 has completely blown us away, capped off by this incredible season finale. This and “Dollhouse” are the only two shows I watch live.
Great to see Sabrina Perez (Chola) back! She talks, too! Interesting to see how much her character now resembles Cameron since when the two first met, Cameron was trying to imitate the Chola.
Josh Malina has been a favorite of mine since I first saw him in “Sports Night” and he just confirms that the guest casting on this show has been top-notch since the beginning. I’d love to see more of him in season 3 chasing after Sarah and Ellison.
This episode also nicely ties in with the upcoming movie, as we know that John is not the leader of the resistance when he first shows up.
This episode also convinced me that there really weren’t any standalone stories this season, just episodes that looked standalone but were really a part of the greater story arc. It takes a lot of brains and talent to pull off that kind of balancing act but season 1 convinced me that Josh and the writing team were thinking like chess grandmasters.
Phasee:
Since it’s all mimetic poly-alloy I guess it would have no problem adding alloy in that manner. I supose there was no reason to leave that much material behind for no reason. But it was a cool way to tie the Carter mpa eel back to Weaver. I just didn’t read any more into it than that.
She gave him her chip, but the Cameron software was copied on the mainframe, as she writes “I’m sorry John” on the screens over and over.
So it seems John Henry’s software was moved to Cameron’s chip, so he can walk around freely.
This is such a good show and I just found out it’s been cancelled. Fox has done it AGAIN. The show would still be getting between 8-10 million viewers if it was on another night. Most people from the ages of 17-35 tend to go out on friday evenings so of course the ratings would be low. Dollhouse is a decent show as well. Slow starter but its starting to get really good but it doesn’t matter because it’s on friday. Leave it up to fox to screw up a shows ratings then cancel it. They did the same thing with firefly…great show dvd sales are amazing too and if i remember right for a little while they moved it like to saturday or something. When you move a show to Friday im shocked it has 4.5 million viewers. Everyone I know watches this terminator show sometimes they just can’t friday because they have to work or they go out so they watch it online and it’s fox’s fault. I’m done with fox they constantly ruin good shows. It’s not worth it to stick to their network anymore. Next they will cancell bones and House right? Oh wait they haven’t been on the friday night timeslot…got it.
What ever its chances of getting renewed or picked up elsewhere, this episode seemed to me to be as much a pilot for a somewhat different type of show as it did a finale.
Cameron in JH’s body? The thought is really freaky. I don’t think JC will be amused.LOL
@Snake,
It would be like the Six “Billion” Dollar Woman… only a Terminator is allowed to become even better than before.
A new Cameron body (same look, except for the hair, as before) and Cameron’s soul that we’ve come to love over the two seasons.
Current John Connor to his new found friends in the Twilight Zone Future:
“Cameron Phillips, a Terminator, barely alive; her fate is in limbo. Gentlepeople, we can rebuild her. We have the technology. We have the capability to make the world’s best female Terminator. Cameron Phillips will be that Terminator. Better than she was before: Better, stronger, faster.”
Classic TV!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HofoK_QQxGc (The Six Million Dollar Man Intro)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7_Tq9rE6Kc (The Bionic Woman Intro)
Make it so!
@Snake,
JH used Cam’s chip to download himself and escape. Cameron’s “essence” is in ZieraCorp’s mainframe in the past. She was saying “I’m sorry, John” up on the screen.
They swapped places.
Here are a boatload of Fox executives emails. Even if they aren’t involved with Sarah Connor, they are going to hear about it!
teverett@newscorp.com
jhorner@newscorp.com
Leslie.Oren@fox.com
chris.petrikin@fox.com
steven.melnick@fox.com
chris.alexander@fox.com
scott.grogin@fox.com
gaude.paez@fox.com
I considered that but there are many possibilities. Cameron could have down loaded that message to replay before JH escaped with the chip. JH needed an umbilical to operate so either he used Camerons chip to become mobile or he somehow fixed the smoked chip from the T that CW fried in the parking lot.
It’s also possible that Cameron’s essence exists now on a backup on the turk and has also melded with JH so Cameron’s chip now contains but personalities. Kind of a Cybil on steroids. Like I said, there are many ways this could go.
OK. Wow. I enjoyed that experience. Even more, I really want to see a Season 3..even if it is only set in the future. Imagine a resistance than never new JC, but has a fresh non-work-camped JC with a fearsome (secretive) ally in one CW. Then add in some John/Allison stuff (I’d be happier with a brother/sister-esque deal than a Jallison or Allisohn too-cliche-for-words pairing.)
As usual, I’m a little spent from the ‘cast and the blog (though I’m amazed that my time estimates were pretty darned close). Feel free to see the bulk of my thoughts at the links below, and as usual I’ll fill in more things that come to mind after a wee break.
T:TSCC 0222 Fancast - Born to Run
T:TSCC 0222 - Born to Run
Love the show and tonight’s episode just blew me away! The show has a talented cast and great storyline, so FOX and WARNER, listen to the fans and RENEW!
Sorry, that should be “both personalities”
My post is stuck in moderation heck again. I’ll try just *one* link at the end:
OK. Wow. I enjoyed that experience. Even more, I really want to see a Season 3..even if it is only set in the future. Imagine a resistance than never new JC, but has a fresh non-work-camped JC with a fearsome (secretive) ally in one CW. Then add in some John/Allison stuff (I’d be happier with a brother/sister-esque deal than a Jallison or Allisohn too-cliche-for-words pairing.)
As usual, I’m a little spent from the ‘cast and the blog (though I’m amazed that my time estimates were pretty darned close). Feel free to see the bulk of my thoughts at the links below, and as usual I’ll fill in more things that come to mind after a wee break.
T:TSCC 0222 - Born to Run
AHAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!
I KNEW IT, I KNEW IT, I KNEW IT!!!! WEAVER WAS TRYING TO HELP JOHN!!!
i thought so when we saw the episode of the Jimmy Carter!!!
such a F***ing awsome series!!!
and the scene in the motel, with Cameron, i was thinking:
kiss her!
kiss her!!
kiss her!!!!!!
the tension was definitely there, even in Cameron’s voice, it was incredible!!!
AWSOOOOOOOMMMMEEEEEEEEEE
i was speechless myself, when the final scene came through…
and the scene with Cameron saying sorry to john was so sad…
ok, so does that mean that Weaver will help the resistance too, or will she be an anonimous ally for the resistance???
and the very last scene, when you hear Sarah’s final message going back through time… that was just beautiful!!!
Very well done to the entire cast members, that was a very very very intense Finale;)
DAMM, I WANT THE 3rd SEASOOOOOOON!!!!!
Great, great episode!! We need a season 3. The show keeps getting better and better, Brilliant mind!! This is the only show that I don’t mind to stay home on a friday night!! Thank you fox!!
Fear not my friends. TSCC will be back. The movie in May is gonna kick soooo much @$$ that its gonna force FOX to bring the show back, fo sho!! And if they dont they are a bunch of morons! Loved the finale, just hope I can wait all the way till FALL for season 3.
Let this be the end of “Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles”!
Let it end at season 2!
…
…
…
…
Let there now be a “Terminator: The Allison From Palmdale Chronicles”!
What a ride!!!! Thank you Josh Friedman for writing such a good episode!
I just listened Dungeon & Dragon yesterday and I was finding it a bit strange to see future-John Connor meeting Derek and look exactly the same as young John. Now I understand!
Nice work!
Thanks to all the crew, hope to see you soon for season 3. This show is too good, the best sci-fi tv show. Please FOX, you have pure gold in your hands! Make it shine!!!
If JH convinced Cameron that she needed to go back to the future, she could’ve waited in the basement for John to get there and jumped with him in her own body. JH’s body is only a shell and is not important at all. JH “resided” in the computers in the basement, he was hooked up to them by a cord. So why did Cameron have to take her chip out and put it in John Henry’s body? There had to be something on the JH cyborg’s body that was important and could only get through if that body jumped.
What kind of chip did the terminator that Weaver killed in the parking lot have? Probably not as advanced, but maybe Weaver downloaded the most important JH files as a backup onto it to use for JH so she could move him if she had to. If JH had room for more than 1 processor (as mentioned above this is part of the movie), then Weaver knew JH had his most important files (downloaded on the chip from the parking lot terminator) in his body and used Cameron’s chip to get that chip back to her safely in the future. So both of them are in JH’s body when it jumped. Cameron operating the body - JH’s humanity on the other chip.
One other thing - after they ‘jumped’ - when you hear Sarah say “I love you John”- they show the basement and that room looks destroyed. Whatever mainframe computers were there it looks like they were gone. Weaver must’ve downloaded those files onto something else, she never would’ve jumped and let those computers be damaged if that was all that she had of JH. And she never would’ve let JH be that vulnerable after everything that happened. And Cameron’s files, if they were on that computer, would be gone too. (I don’t think they were though). The parking lot terminator’s chip makes sense!
I think with Weaver and John, its a case of the enemy of my enemy is my friend. I would guess that Weaver doesnt agree with skynet, but doesn’t agree with the humans either. I would propose that Weaver thinks the world should be run by metal but theres no need to exterminator the humans. And the humans think the opposite. Skynet thinks they should run things plus exterminate humans.
*Crosses Fingers* 3rd season please! Just an amazing show. I think I’ll cry if it doesn’t get renewed. *Sniffles*
I think at the end John was just desperate to get Cameron back and he would take any chance, including a jump with Weaver, in oredr to save her.
Best TV Show ever. Please do not end… I am guilty I always watch it on internet, every single episode. I would keep the TV on at the fox channel if ithat’s what it takes. Please don’t take this great piece away from us.
@CJ,
I’m telling ya, that John basically realizing that he doesn’t love Allison, but loves Cameron instead is more powerful.
It’s not the looks he loves… it’s what made Cameron so special to him and everyone else who’s a fan of this show.
He sees Cameron’s flaws, but is willing to overlook them. There’s a certain “something” he sees in Cameron that he does not see in Allison.
That would be the better thing IMHO. That’s why I stated above that what if this time around, Allison (with other help as I mentioned) assists in making a new body for Cameron.
Maybe even Weaver knows of a plant (the plant mentioned in “Heavy Metal” perhaps) that has the necessary facility and they break in.
They find a new and more advanced endo design. Allison allows John to scan her as a design template and the equipment molds a Cameron shell over the top.
I thought it would be a funny touch if Allison changes Cameron’s hairstyle because she thought it would make the hair that is so difficult to get right, look even better. She’s adding her own stamp to this new Cameron “shell.”
The body just needs Cameron’s software put back in to meld the two.
Also, they can’t swim. So, as another “inside joke” this body can. It’s less dense and more like a regular human, but stronger and tougher and ready for more punishment. The skin is even tougher and can take more of a beating too.
This is a golden opportunity to enhance Cameron’s build without changing Cameron’s curious mind.
Ok, anyone remember the phosphorous damaged chip?
It wasn’t so damaged that it couldn’t still hold all of JH’s files. (he’s not that complex yet..)
Cromartie’s body can hold both chips, Cameron and JH. They are both in the future with John and CW.
“I’m sorry John” was just a simple loop left on the turk…
All that’s needed is to build a copy of Allison. We have everything needed to carry on…
That is, provided, we storm Fox Corporate, chain ourselves, to anything ‘metal’ go on a hunger strike and chant “no fate” “no fate” until the cops drag us out and arrest us….
(probably the only way to get their attention)
I think my one reaction is: “That was fast and what the hell just happened?” Did Cameron’s body not go through because her chip was gone? And, I know people now want Allison/John, but I’m a solid John/Cameron girl. Besides, it would be kind of creepy if he fell for someone solely (at first) because she looks like the girl/cyborg he loved. It would be a bit like dating the twin of your dead girlfriend. Plus: I sensed some Allison/Kyle. Is it wrong that I’m holding out hope that John can find a Cameron, get the chip back, and stick it in the new body? Of course, that would mean Allison would have to die/be copied. I suppose this is what Summer meant when she was happy but sad about Cam’s place after the finale.
I suppose the time line changed again when John went back. Now, he’s never been born. But, he can now send Kyle back. I guess Sarah and Ellison still couldn’t stop J-Day. Now, I’m wondering what would/will come next. Is John stuck in the future? Where did John Henry go and why did he take Cameron’s chip? Why was Cameron was intent on not letting John know she knew what Ellison meant? Will Cameron ever be back or if there is a season three, will Summer be Allison full time? ‘Cause I kind of want Cameron. So many questions!
Also -
Four things make me want to cry:
1. Sarah and John are separated, maybe forever.
2. Cameron pretty much killed herself for John.
3. John went into the future for Cameron, to save her and get her chip back. But, her body didn’t go with him and goodness knows where John Henry went.
4. The looks John gives Derek, Kyle, and Allison. That look of happiness when he sees Derek. That look of awe and joy when he sees Kyle. Then, that look of pure happiness when he sees “Cameron” that slowly turns to sadness and regret when he realizes that she’s not Cameron. Breaks me heart. Because, it’s in that small about of time (no more that two minutes) that John realizes that his uncle and father don’t know him and that “Cameron” is really still “dead”
Mostly, just here to say “Awesome.” Here’s hoping to season 2.
One particular comment:
I also was very impressed by the “sex” scene. It was bizarrely appropriate, and far more so than an actual sex scene between them would ever have been for any reason. Whatever the relationship between John and Cameron, whether she has anything similar to feelings for him or is being purely manipulative, their relationship is nothing like a traditional human relationship. Sex between them would only serve to remind him that she is not human.
But here, taking off her shirt is a means by which humans can share an intimate moment. Having him open her up makes the moment intimate for her as well, whether that intimacy comes with emotions or not. (I think it does, but I also think those emotions are completely alien and can’t be understood by a human any more than a robot can understand human love). Collectively, the two actions created a moment that more genuinely simulates sex than actual sex would. And I think it was done tastefully, in a way made me think more than it titillated me.
Whether Cameron wanted that for herself or the whole thing was pure manipulation, I have no idea.
There is no way you can end it like that!!!!!~!~!~!~!~!~!
There has to be a third season!!!!!~!~!~!~!
OMG such a good series…. We pray that there will be more to explain the ending….
PS… Two loving sarah conner terminator fans…..
That was a awesome.I really hope we get a season 3.This story is awesome and needs to continue.
sorry scfangirl, your post wasn’t up when I posted mine.
Dan I like the sound of that. That John helps to create Cameron and learns for the experience. Just pop her chip in and watch her go!!!
The question is how long does he stay in the future? I mean he has to go back once he finds Cameron…but would that be an entire season? Or only part of the season?
@Snake: I think the eel scene validated all of the people that believed that the LMT on the Carter was Weaver. I think that question was answered
Ah ok!!!
I was under the impression that Cameron had simple programmed the computer to say that. Because all it kept typing was I’m sorry John.
If we get a season 3 (and we better) I agree Cameron will be back because that’s what people want to see. A human Alison can easily be killed, Cameron can not. Plus Cameron is the interesting one.
Maybe Cameron wants the skynet code to be taken out of her programming and replaced with JH’s programming of not to kill people.
John jumped into the future to find Cameron. He better find her. Must save Cameron.
Allison is not Cameron!!!! So we have to go get our Cameron back. And have more John and Cameron moments!!!
I thought Cameron was already in the time bubble but couldn’t make it because she was deactivated?
And why did the bank in S1 explode when they time traveled but not here?
Nick85 Can I get a copy of picture diagrams to figure out this timeline?!?!?
I think we’ll see kind of a repeat of Alison from Palmdale.
This would also explain why Derek knew Cameron was metal the first time he saw her.
He knew Alison if she was a part of the group. She gets taken and when she’s there he knows she’s metal.
I think if we get a season 3 (and boy we better) Cameron will be back.
That’s what people want to see. And a human Alison can easily be killed, Cameron can not. Plus Cameron is the one John loves, not Alison. Allison is not Cameron!!!! So we have to go get our Cameron back. And have more John and Cameron moments!!! And John has to return to his time because he does not exist.
Also who is running the resistance?
And how far in the future are they?
Why do some people assume Kyle and Allison are together? Kyle was with a number of people, so was Derek.
LOL Snake!!!! Drool worthy it really was. Had John kissed Cameron I don’t know what I would have done.
Hadley a big thank you for all you do as well. Bet blog around!!!:)
We better get a season 3!!!! It can not end like that. So many possibilities.
THAT WAS THE BEST. I LOVE THIS SHOW. ART
I have seen all of the movies, own the first season of the show, watch it over the week in repeat on the internet in anticipation of the next episode, and saw the trailer for the upcoming trilogy before anyone else and I never saw this twist coming. For someone who recognizes every line from the movies repeated by the characters in the show, every inside nod to fans, and even anticipated that the next wave would be human-machine hybrids, to leave me sitting on the edge of my seat stunned is a serious feat.
Please make it back for a third season. I literally can’t imagine what comes next. But I am salivating at the prospects . . .
Allison Young [looking over the unconscious and finished Cameron Mach II laying on a work table]: I still can’t shake this creepy feeling I get when I’m looking at her, John.
John: Oh?
Allison: I’m standing here basically looking down at myself sleeping peacefully… without a care in the world [she fiddles gently with Cameron's new hairstyle, making it lay perfectly, framing her still face]… but at the same time… [shivers] it’s like someone is walking over my grave. Funny, huh?
John [glancing at her, and then looking back at the computer monitor readout]: Maybe it’s the lack of sleep talking. Why don’t you sack out for a few. I’m almost finished.
—-
PS. I should also point out I planned on hating this show on principle when I saw the first episode.
@ Kea - I thought it was a time loop thing. Since the time line he was headed to did not include a terminator Cameron (since the human Cameron was captured and tortured to replicate her as exactly as possible in order to get close to John in a prior episode & didn’t exist at that point in the timeline), Terminator Cameron could not come forward in time. (Of course that would also mean that John could not come forward in time b/c he never existed to send Reese back to meet Sarah . . .)
PLEASE BE BACK PLEASE BE BACK!
the finale was mind blowing! we kept rewinding the last moment again and again!
for my sanity please i hope and pray the show is back!
Wow. That was awesome! I really hope that there is there is a season 3! We need more Jameron! Look at how John’s face fell when he realized that wasn’t Cameron in the end. =(
Edited to say that should read BEST!!! My keyboard didn’t think I hit the ‘s’ but I did!!!
And Dan rolling with your idea. Than Cameron would leave Alison alive, like what she did with Jodie. She ‘corrected a mistake’ in a way with Jodie and might do the same to Alison.
Hmmm I like it.
Wow!! this episode is speechless! excellent!
To all cast members: thanks for giving us such a nice performance! Cant hardly wait for season 3!!!!!
FOX: PLZ PLZ se3!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hey Dan,
It’s “mark II,” not “mach II.”
When we get a season 3 I would bet Cameron will be back. As some have already mentioned J. Connor made the jump to save her after all. It might take a few episodes but it will happen.
I was surprised by how happy I was to see Derek again but, seriously, Josh - the time travel stuff was absolute pants. What the hell?
Knuttypoo,
It’s late. That’s my excuse! LOL!
RCN says: “bread said.” Hey, it can rhyme!
OH MY GOD!!!!
Thanks a lot for this season finale!! it had very good rhythm, it builds up to the middle point and from there is like freaking rollercoaster of gasps! OMG! and Sonofa…. !! (in the good way), i was screaming alone at home at crazy cause none of my friends watch it… guys love ya for this episode… i never had hoped for a third season of a show since Dark Angel, and TSCC beats hundred times that one…
Really great job!!!
What’s up with all the “Cameron has blue eyes!” comments? Her eyes were always BROWN, Summer never had contact lenses on.
Just seen the beginning of the sarah conner chronicles. Not the end, but the beginning of john conner becoming the leader of the resistance and cameron becoming the love of his life. Can’t wait for season 3.
!!!!! E online “Save one show” vote for TSCC to be saved!
I wish this show to be saved, I havent loved a show like this since DS9, but my feeling is that they poured their soul into this last episode and did what they could, but who knows…. No fate, but what we make,..Right?! At the least I’d like to see the continuation perhaps in a series of novels that would at least keep the spirit of the characters and story alive…..NAh Phuck that I want my season 3!! BRING BACK MY TSCC !!! YOu BAStards!!!!!!!!!!
“What’s up with all the “Cameron has blue eyes!” comments? Her eyes were always BROWN, Summer never had contact lenses on.”
We’re talking about the exposed endo’s eye led color, not her human like eyes. I assume anyway. I actually dont remember seeing them as blue, but I’ll take their word for it that it was.
oh my god this episode was awesome!! please don’t take the show away!!!!
BRING BACK MY TSCC !!! YOu BAStards!!!!!!!!!!
All I have to say is it took me five minutes to scroll to the bottom of the leave a reply page.
Fox you would be crazy not to make a 3rd season. Every person was prolly glued to their tv screen waiting to see what comes next or if there was going to be some sort of tell for another season.
“It’s not the looks he loves… it’s what made Cameron so special to him and everyone else who’s a fan of this show.”
to be fair, he’s seen Alison all of 10 seconds, doesn’t even know her name yet (Im sure it’ll make sense to him once he hears it when thinking back to the alison in palmdale scene where cameron thinks she’s her, but he has no way of knowing for sure yet ). He has no opinion of her personality because he’s never met her.
My brain went spastic for a while. Wow that was something different. I agree Cameron is not Allison, I liked Cameron because of her expression-less face amongst other things but this is still cool. Chola was there, so John may even come across Cheri Westin, Morris from school, maybe even lauren and her sister Sydney, Riley this is plain good stuff. Jesse should be good now, since there was no Jimmy Carter incident with a package for John in this future. Is Allison like Kyle’s girlfriend now or just a resistance bff (LOL). Omg, is Savannah alive somewhere in this future.
What can I say, thank you Josh F, Ashley, Zack, Toni , Hadley you’ll all made this show truly memorable for me. Summer Thomas Lena Richard Shirley BAG well done. Gosh, I don’t even know where and how a season 3 will even start …. Hey but I can still dream. My fingers and even my toes are crossed!
Wow i am so lost. CAMERON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
TKCC?
BRING BACK MY TSCC !!! YOu BAStards!!!!!!!!!!
—-just doing my part and with that im out! Thanks to all who made this show possible!! Please bring it back for another season, its possibilties are endless and worthy of another go!
Whoa! Josh, you delivered! We were all cheering. But, now, with all the cans of worms you opened up, if there is no third season, I think I’ll be sick.
WOW! Kudos and thanks to Josh F for writing a “super tight” ep, and mad props to everyone involved for bringing the a fans an episode that “brought the heat and delivered the goods” in a BIG way!!!!
Fox, 3+ please!
Interesting final. Take it easy on the time travel though if there’s a season 3 — if everything is constantly in flux it can feel like nothing really matters because it can just be changed again.
This has been an excellent ride!!! I have also been here from the beginning and have always been a HUGE fan of the Terminator genre, be it with the movies or the TV show. In my book both are excellent. I can’t remember the last time I was so wrapped up into a show as I have been with this one. Friday night when this show airs, the phone gets turned off, and there is complete silence in my house. I am sure going to miss the show this summer!!!!! But deep down I have to believe that Fox won’t let us down and will give us many more seasons to come or I just might give up on TV altogether. I am sick and tired of seeing excellent shows that have an outstanding cast, writers, plot, ect. get cancelled and replaced with reality c**p that has absolutely no plot or point.
Tonights episode gave everything that it promised it would with an excellent twist in the end, and I was SOOOOO excited to see Derek again. I was just surprised that Sarah stayed behind. That in itself, with the show being called “The Sarah Connor Chronicles” leaves me wondering from what point the show will continue on.
Again, PLEASE FOX, give us another season. There is a VERY loyal following here, and you won’t regret keeping it going. This show means a lot to all of us who watch it faithfully. Please, give the show a chance!!!!!! Don’t let us down.
As for everyone else, keep up the faith that we will get another and another and another season for many seasons to come. KEEP VOTING!!!!!!
OK ok im back I just gotta ask this question for closure sake…
k here it goes is it just me or did anyone else ever wonder if Cameron had a fully
functional cooch ???and at some point do ya think John was tearing that cherry2000 sh!t up???? lol haha
@Kea,
Cameron, in the first go-around, had to be completed with Allison’s capture. Her death was unfortunate, but Cameron was not yet in a more advanced stage of development.
This time it’s like Cameron is born again, but with Allison being a willing participant.
This Cameron never wakes up because it needs Cameron downloaded back into this new body. This advanced Mark II body travels with John back to the past.
John Connor is resurrecting the dead. In a round about sort of way.
—
John Connor, lifts this new, human-weighted Cameron body gently onto the table (he’s placed a long lab coat around her naked form). He glances once at the defunct and damaged Cameron body regretfully, and then glances at the vid-screen.
It no longer flashes “I’m sorry, John.” The server looks almost destroyed. John starts flipping switches. Things seem hopeless, but then the three red dots on the RAID array start flashing feebly. There’s life there.
John: I know you can hear me, Cameron.
The screen comes to life. Data is scrolling and tumbling down it.
John: I understand everything now. I understand. And I forgive you.
The screen shows a blinking cursor. As if it’s waiting for something. Then text shows up, with a larger font: “John, I feel fractured. I’m scared.”
John: I know. Don’t be. I have something for you. Call it a… a built day present from me to you.
Data activity fills the screen, as if there is a type of excitement.
John: Tell me what to do.
John plugs the body into the server, and after getting instruction, waits for a moment. John looks over Cameron’s sleeping form and leans in close to her perfect face, strokes her hair, and stares at her, deeply. He leans in and places a soft, tender kiss on her lips. The server farm rumbles to life. Lights flicker and dance. The overheads flash and come on strongly and brightly.
And Cameron opens her eyes and stares back at John.
John [smiling and still very close]: You were telling the truth on my birthday, weren’t you?
Cameron [innocently]: About what?
John [trying the words out]: That I love you.
Cameron [staring impishly back]: Took you long enough.
John: Here, let’s get you up.
John helps her stand, pulls the plug from the back of her head, and then she notices the poor wreck of her other self, slumped in the chair, as if for the first time.
Cameron: Sarah was right. I look like hell.
John: I hope you like your new, um, home. [honestly] I had a little help.
Cameron [staring at the TV monitor, which now acts like a mirror, looking herself over, and peering closely at her new hairdo, and touching it]: Did you do this?
John: Do you like it?
Cameron turns and smiles at John almost like Arnold did looking at the mini-gun in T2.
John: Let’s just say it was a… mutual friend.
Cameron: Oh. [demurely] She has good taste.
Cameron reaches up and and softly, sweetly kisses John. It’s their first, fully conscious kiss.
Cameron: Thank you.
She dreamily walks off down the hall, forgetting that she just has on a lab assistant’s coat, and is barefoot. John stands there for a moment, drunk with happiness.
John [snapping out of his revelry]: Aren’t we forgetting something?
And he turns back towards Cameron’s old body. Cameron switches gears and comes back in.
Cameron [still sort of out of it]: Oh yeah. [and slings her old body over her shoulder like a sack of potatoes]
They both exit the lab.
It’s fascinating that people end up having a stronger emotional attachment to the robot than the humans. You could probably write a thesis on the topic. And I don’t mean that sarcasticly. It makes me wonder how many years it will be until human and machine interaction is considered part of psychology. If you pay attention to the all of the robots being developed these days in Japan, they are basically creating “baby” robots that have to learn to crawl before they can walk. 10-20 years from now, that “baby” software will be mature, and new ethical debates will emerge from it.
Im pretty sure topics like that were weighed by the minds of the writers because of the exploration of the relationship between Cameron and John while making it apparent than John knows she is still a machine, but maybe he doesnt care shes a machine. Like I said, you could write a thesis on the psychology of it.
“We’re talking about the exposed endo’s eye led color, not her human like eyes. I assume anyway. I actually dont remember seeing them as blue, but I’ll take their word for it that it was.-Kyle Maloney”
@Kyle Maloney
Both times were in season 1. In ep 1 Cameron tells them were back and flashes her blue eyes. Plus the time machine eye scanner turns them blue. And then in D&D when Cameron takes Derek to the time machine and her eyes get scanned I think we see that hint of blue again. Hope that helps.
ok i made that silly comment but please dont be distracted by it the real reason we are commenting is to express our support for the show so on that note i just cudnt help myself….my bad !!! sooooo KEEP VOTING!!!!!! and…BRING BACK TSCC !!!!!!!
this is the best show on FOX heck the best show on TV! they have to bring this show back! Is there some protest or rally we can organize to get these people to understand that this shows needs to be on the air? Can we get a petition signed or something? Please, seriously, no really, anyone?
Jezz, what a Finale.
Awesome! If there’s no Season 3 coming i’ll be really pissed. No, i used the wrong words. I’ll be very sad and disappointed.
That was great sci-fi. I rate this episode (S02E22: “Born to Run”) as a very close second to “Adam Raised a Cain” (S02E21), which was the series high-point in my opinion.
There were several scenes/shots in this episode that were “classic Terminator”. In particular, when Water Delivery Guy Terminator drives slowly into the parking lot — the visuals were wonderfully referential to the first film.
Weaver has turned out to be a fascinating character, not to mention John Henry (played by Garret Dillahunt), who is always compelling.
Interesting ending, too.
I am amazed.
I am in awe.
I am also speechless! Mouth-dropped open and in love with this episode.
SEASON 3! PLEASE!
you can’t leave me like this.
Oh my Gosh.
@Dan good point. Which again goes back to the religious references the show has been bringing up.
So this time machine that JH used didn’t seem to destroyed the area like the one in the bank did.
So maybe nothing was destroyed when John and Weaver jumped. I mean Sarah and Ellison were standing pretty close.
Now Dan about that those fan fics?!?!! Start writing them. They are fun to read.
And please let there be a season 3!!! I need my Cameron and Jameron goodness!!!
PEOPLE LET’S SHOW FOX AND WB HOW MUCH WE LOVE THE SHOW AND ALSO WANT SEASON 3
scott.rowe@warnerbros.com
askfox@fox.com
WE CAN WIN THIS, DO YOUR PART
Cameron can’t time travel because she’s to damaged, to much metal showing. Terminators need the human form to blend in and time travel. Remember, no non living items can travel through the time portal thats why everyone comes through naked, Catherine it liquid medal and formed clothes as she did throughout the series.
OMG; OMG!!
I Dont even know what to say.
Thank you Josh, Zack , Ashley, Lena, Thomas , Summer, Brian, everyone involved in this show, wow, just amazing thank you, all for this great series,
this is just… fck, i cried, of joy, and sadness and with all the stuff happening at the ending,
your job speak for itself, you deserve a 3rd season, we will be there, to watch our fav tv show, we support you guys
Seriously Fox, we really want more. I am not threatening, going loud, I am requesting you give this show another season.
There are soooo many comments here, so if someone’s already covered it, here’s my guess:
I think Cameron might have been lying when she told John that everything was fine with her body; I think the cold he felt wasn’t supposed to be there, so she decided to sacrifice herself for the greater good, and that was why she changed her mind on going to break out Sarah. With herself gone, John would need Sarah to protect him.
Cameron agreed to join Weaver in her attempt to defeat Skynet and by agreeing to that, she had to help preserve John Henry because he’s the “bigger, worse” weapon that Weaver has been trying to build to stop Skynet. Thus, she gave him her chip so he could put it in Cromartie’s (his) endoskeleton, move the John Henry data to the chip, then jump tp escape Kaliba. Remember, Weaver was asking about how moving him would work in the beginning of the episode. That’s why Weaver asked Cameron to join them — she’s the only way they could move John Henry without having to disassemble all the hardware and move it. Think of the chip as a flash drive, I guess. Why do we have flash drives? So you can move data from one thing to another without having to pack up your entire desktop computer and take it somewhere else.
This would be congruent with what was hinted at earlier in the season, too — in the beginning, John had Riley, Sarah, and Cameron, but by the end of the season, they’ll all be gone; one woman will die, another woman will leave John, and the other will betray him. Riley died, Sarah decided not to go with him to the future, and Cameron betrayed her role as his guardian to save someone else.
As a side note, I love this show, I love how it always manages to come full-circle, yet still leave me excited for more of the story. I’m personally really excited to get to know Allison and learn what sides of Cameron’s “personality” and self is from Alison. Case in point: PLEASE TO BE CONTINUING THIS SHOW SOMEWHERE, SOMEHOW, THANK YOU. D:
This series is so great! Please, please continue with season 3!
This is to Josh F. , I think this is the best writing you have ever done. the ” Season ” finale was outstanding !! Best show of the season ! I was expecting a sad show I wouldnt like, but I kept watching and it was just totally awesome.
the ending was great !
It does Set up a very interesting S-3 that would be in synch with the movies.
I would love to see summer play allison young, and of course john would have to be drawn to her. and john derek and kyle, allison all fighting in the future ! only they dont know any john connor !
I was hoping both weaver and JH would somehow survive, and they did.
I guess cameron is still in the turk ? so in essence she is still alive with no body. sarah could give her a body ? LOL the other terminator?
I was also surprised to see chola !… she looked great ! and she talked ! that was “tight”
seeing derek and kyle in the end made up for killing derek the previous show.
and as everyone is saying , I want a S-3 now ! I was ho hum about a S-3 until this ep , and now I think S-3 would be awesome.
I already voted for Tscc on the save one show site. I think chuck was ahead of us so go vote people.here is link
http://www.eonline.com/uberblog/watch_with_kristin/b107874_save_one_show_help_your_fave_see.html
I know josh has been criticized for S-2, but I think this ep wont have any critics.
we have to keep this show on the air, it is the best show on tv.
Im surprised no one is talking about the movie coming out. Will these seasons be tied in to that storyline? We’ve already basically thrown out the 3rd movie as meaningless (to the storyline) with this series, will the same happen to this series with this new movie? Am I missing something here, or are these just meant to all be separate random story lines made possible because of time travel. It’s a fantastic tale but we still dont know how the story begins or ends, I do hope that at the end of the day, all these story lines get tied in together, i think it will feel kind of empty if not.
To put it simply: WOW! Hats off to everyone who worked on the show, every episode aired this year was simply outstanding, and so were quite a few that aired in 2008. Also, mister Friedman, you should write episodes more often.
I’m still playing back scenes in my head, trying to absorb it all. The ending was the most surprising thing about the episode. And it seems to be a pretty interesting set up for S3, which I very much hope will happen. Although, if it doesn’t happen, the season’s ending was pretty satisfying as it is. There are still questions, but it wouldn’t be a good show if it tied up all the loose ends. It’s gotta keep you wondering, make you ask questions.
Well, hopefully, we’ll all meet back on this blog, commenting on S3 episodes, as soon as possible. Cheers!
How will Sarah fight Skynet in the present, without a terminator on her side? How many times would Sarah and John have been killed without Cameron being there to take the beating and kill the T-888 that was after them? So now that John is in the future and a nobody, does that mean that Skynet won’t send terminators after him in any timeline?
I doubt that John will get too far with telling Derek that he was meant to be the leader of the resistance! He will have to go back and age, and develop his skills as a soldier and leader, assuming there is a third season. It would be cool if they could open some sort of real-time communication with Sarah and Ellison. Not sure what they could do on their own as I mentioned above.
@Dan - The John/Cameron/Allison dynamic is going to be an interesting one to deal with. As I mentioned in my blog, as much as I’m a Cameron fan, I’m a bigger Summer Glau fan. I’m just happy that a Season 3 will have her there as whomever (I really liked Allison’s sass to her captors).
As for what I think might/could/won’t-except-in-my-imagination happen in season 3… well, I’ve got to fill up my time since Season 2 is done, now, don’t I? You know I will — with both more articles and more “scenes I’d like to see”. They’ll be posted regardless of the verdict the suits pass down.
Beautiful episode, I can’t really add much else to what’s already being said here except:
Curse you Mr. Friedman, for breaking my heart =(
See you folks next season! Kudos to everyone involved in this show =)
WTF.. This was not a good ending.. WAY TO OPEN.. Really not happy about this. If we dont get a season 3 it will just be the oddest ending of a series EVER.
Godspeed, men. ;|
I recorded the show earlier and just recently got a chance to watch it (I don’t count toward the ratings anyway, since I’m not a “Neilson”).
I loved it. I think it was probably the best episode of the season. In fact, the last three episodes have been good. My one disappointment (other than the fact that it ends on a damn cliffhanger) is that neither the FBI agent who was questioning Sarah, nor the priest got to actually see Cameron for what she really is.
However, I didn’t come here to heap praise on Josh, I came here to ask him; Why the hell did you wait until the last three episodes of the season to start writing good episodes???
If the entire season had been like the season premiere and the last three episodes, a third season would be probably be a sure thing. Instead you wasted almost the entire season on stand-alone episodes that few people liked, the whole Riley/Jesse storyline that nobody liked, and the psycho Sarah episodes that everyone hated. Ok, so you wrote a mostly great season finale. That doesn’t excuse the fact that you basically flushed this season down the toilet to indulge your ego, writing stories of where you thought the series should go regardless of whether or not the fans would like them.
And the whole three dots crap? So many episodes were wasted on Sarah’s obsession and in the end it turns out to be three power lights on a cluster of drives? How utterly random and pointless!
THIS is what the fans wanted. THIS is how the show should have been made. Not an hour of a transvestite at a UFO convention, or a mass funeral, or a sleep clinic. Why was that so hard for you to understand?
In a post a couple months ago, I made some predictions for the finale. I predicted that none of the questions from the first season would be answered, I predicted that the ending would raise a ton of questions and that it would end on a cliffhanger that would never be resolved. All of them came true. Well, the never being resolved hasn’t come to pass yet, but I’m sure it will.
To all the people saying to blame Fox and not the writers for the cliffhanger ending; Why? The writers knew that it was a low-rated show. The writers knew that any show can get cancelled at any time. Ending a season of a low-rated show on a cliffhanger is just being arrogant. It shows that they don’t care if the fans get left hanging or not.
And for those who are saying that without a cliffhanger, there would be nothing left to tell and that fans wouldn’t bother to tune into a new season; That’s just crap. Buffy ended every season with an episode that could have served as the series finale if the show had been cancelled, but it stayed on the air for seven years and still has a rabid fanbase.
Even with all the bad/boring episodes, I loved this show, mostly because of the character of Cameron (who Josh reduced to a glorified extra for most of this season!). It sickens me to think that Fox probably won’t renew this show. I’ve voted and I’ll write an actual paper letter to Fox (email means nothing to networks), but I know in my heart that this show is dead.
I blame Josh for that. The Terminator movies are hugely popular. A show based on those movies should have been a sure thing. Instead we got a soap opera with Whiny John and Psycho Sarah. Oh, and occasionally Cameron makes a comment or two…
OMG!! Guys this was an AWESOME season finale!
Thank you for your hard work!
And i’m pretty sure there will be a season 3! =)
That was *wonderful*. (And I was so pleased to see all those faces again… it was strangely heart-warming and hopeful).
Whatever happens, I want to thank the cast and the whole TSCC crew for all the time and effort they’ve put into making this superlative series. Thank you, all of you. It was - and will always be - really appreciated.
ENCORE!
fox- 3rd season. ’nuff said.
Wow, best season finale ever for any sci-fi tv series.
The whole time I was at edge, waiting for things to unfold, dreading each passing minute was closer to the end, hoping that this episode would not end.
Then at the end a complete plot twist I did not see coming, I didn’t think John would be put that far into the future, past Judgment Day. I want to know how he get back now to his own time. Otherwise T:3 won’t make any sense if your one to tie in series with the movies.
Great show, hell if smallville can go for 9 seasons, why can’t this go for another 2 more. This show had to endure a writer strike with it’s first season, and only 9 episodes to boot, thats hardly enough to establish a basis for any good tv series. man i wish another company could by this show out. Fox should be swollowed
WTF??????? We need S3!
God work the season finale!
If you don’t want to read about my theory concerning the J/C romance angle of the show then please do you and me a favor and skip this comment.
To begin, I don’t believe it was so much as that John was scared that a relationship wouldn’t work between him and Cameron or even that she would reject his advances and then their friendship would be screwed and this is why I believe that.
He was scared that it would work and that when the time comes when she leaves him (either in battle or some other way) then the loss will be too much for him. He lost Derek, he lost Charley, he lost Riley, he knows he’s going to lose Bedel in the future, and he knows he’s going to lose his dad and a whole bunch of other people that he loves. If he falls even deeper for Cameron only to lose her it would affect him greatly and as the future leader of the resistance John felt he couldn’t let himself take that chance. Enter all the John hating Cameron angst to keep her at arms length(because deep down he loves her).
But as tonight’s episode proved it might already be too late and John might as well go for it while he can. Contrary to what some other commenters posted on tonight’s huge forum (and they are entitled to their beliefs and thinking
) I believe John didn’t go into the future to fulfill any prophecy or anything relating to Skynet. Deep down inside of him he was really going after Cameron:
“He has her.”
What I thought was more remarkable was Sarah’s acceptance, her not arguing with him over it. She knows her son and in my opinion, my belief, I believe that she knew the real reason why he was leaving her and she could tell that John (no matter how crazy it was) loved Cameron and (as I said in an earlier post) he’s going through time to move heaven and earth to find her. At that moment I don’t think I’ve ever seen John Connor act more like his father. Just as how Kyle went back in time to protect and love Sarah Connor John was going forward in time to find Cameron (save her?) and finally force himself to accept the reality of his feelings because honestly? Love is hard enough without burdening yourself with the mechanics of the details.
Sometimes it takes the loss of something to fully appreciate just how much it means to you and more often than not we find in life that once its gone you can’t get it back. I don’t know about you other audience members but personally I can think of at least a dozen off the top of my head. Fortunately, for John, he has the means and skill to go after her and hopefully get her back.
I am not afraid. I am not worrying about the “will there? won’t there?” be another season mantra. I’m not going to spend time writing “…if we get a season three…” Like many people have said it was a great season finale but a terrible series finale. Either way there’s still going to be plenty of fanfiction out there for the hardcore fans to write and read. Obviously that’s not enough for some people and they typically bash the community but for those that have the imagination and acceptance that though it will never be “as good” it’s still better than nothing.
There will be a season 3, in one form and/oranother. In three days from now check out any fanfiction site that has T:SCC and I promise you that there will be one form of a continuation from last night’s episode.
Do I want a network season 3? You bet I do and I already phoned my friends to watch, voted at the sites, and mailed/emailed everyone at Fox and the WB. But if it doesn’t air again I’m not going to spend my time wallowing around and hating Josh or hating Fox or whatever. Life is too short for that
I love you Summer!
Awesome series finale. Thankfully written in a way that leaves enough loose ends to explore together with the possibility for future shows either continuing in this style or potentially set in John’s future or Sarah’s present.
I really hope that Fox continues to back the show, this along with Family Guy, Dollhouse are all spot on.
Greeat . WOW . im at a lose.
I am one of the dvr people and if you choose not to run the season 3 cause of that….not smart.
Best epsiode ever.
Please bring a season 3 .
Thankyou for every previous episode. I loved them all.
I’m clearly not watching the same show as everyone else because I’m devastated. It failed me on so many levels it’s unbelievable.
@allergygal ..
I totally agree. I really hated that we didnt get the end we needed.
in S-3 we could have future eps and also 2009 eps ! they dont all have to be future eps !
also after a few eps of summer as allison you might not miss cameron that much.
and if show goes on cameron will be back eventually.
I guarantee if we get a S-3 everyone will love it.
john in future and sarah and cam /ellison and savanah in the past. some eps in the past some in the future. it would be great
and yes Camerons eyes were shown as blue in S-1 it is in some posters and when her chip was taken out ther ewas a blue light inside. this was part of she is different /unique storyline.
they showed her endo eye as red tonight, that could be cause of some special effect tech that made blue hard to do, or they just wanted her to look like a standard terminator. not that big of a deal since they never did anything with the unique storyline.
tragic___rabbit you could be right about it not supposed to be cold, maybe she was running low on power or was damaged so she broke sarah out and gave her chip to john henry.
and part or all of her could still be on the chip with JH, but she is also on the turk.
cameron is in the turk now so she is not dead she just needs a body.
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!! please tell me theres gonna be another season, it soon needs one after that. I mean i need to know were jhon and weaver have gone in time and why dose no one know jhon. Also is the cyber camaron dead and was she human in the future. and rite at the end was sarah comin too or is she staying behind. OMG OMG>>>>> NEEDS A NOTHER SEASON SO MUCH
Just wanted to say…this episode BLEW MY MIND. You guys are amazing: cast, crew, writers, graphics, makeup artists, EVERYONE.
THANK YOU TO EVERYONE WHO HAS WORKED SO HARD TO MAKE THIS A FANTASTIC SHOW. IT IS TRULY REMARKABLE.
And if the Network gods at Fox should happen to stumble upon this? PLEASE RENEW THIS SHOW. It’s the most amazing thing on television. And we need another season. I have so many questions and this show delivers so much, and has potential to give so much more. Please don’t give up on us. We won’t give up on you.
Forgot to add: I was right to an extent. Cameron has been disabled, and John is on his own, unless Weaver decides to say by his side. Sarah and Ellison aren’t dead, but for all intents and purposes they aren’t in the picture. If there is a Season 3, my guess would be that John would make it back to the present quickly and possibly bring Derek with him, otherwise the story will be very disjointed.
Very unclear what Cameron and Weaver have going on, or if Cameron in the form of Cromartie went to a different time to throw Weaver off her trail. If Weaver is really against Skynet, what will having John Henry / Cameron and herself (or itself) accomplish in the future? How much difference could John Henry / Cameron make? She was there herself before.
My hat is off to Josh Friedman, America’s answer to Mexico’s Guillermo del Toro. What a beautiful, mythical ending to an ambitious and satisfying year. It was one of the best finale’s I have ever seen on all levels. The mythical “Wizard of Oz” resonances at the very end brought such casades of meaning to only a few seconds of time. And what is especially wonderful is that Friedman’s team has been creating these powerfully meaningful moments all season long. This final moment crowned all the previous ones. John Connor, after struggling through a nightmare-like journey of self-discovery, is delivered into the bosom of his family, just like Dorothy on the “Wizard”. His father Kyle is the Scarecrow without a brain but he led the way to safety for Sarah, his uncle Derek is the Cowardly Lion who proves his bravery time and again as he faces “the metal” without hesitation, and Cameron is the Tinman without a heart but she willingly dies for the one she loves. Powerful, mythical stories. Thank you.
OMG!! That was painfully great!! I really believe we need a season 3, or maybe a season 1 of Terminator: The Jonh Connor Chronicles? I really hope so!!!
Sorry, I should have said North America’s answer….
It was an amazing episode and I really loved the ending. Amazing ending, but the whole was awesome. Congratulations to everyone who worked on this show!
I don’t really know if a Season 3 is really needed or if there are more stories to tell now (except The Resistance which are fighting against the machines, but we’ll see that in Terminator Salvation, so I’m not sure if it should be brought on the show aswell), but anyway, if there will be a Season 3, I’m really looking forward to it!;)
Wow…. I am speechless…. That ending… just wow! Incredible episode, but I am struck by Cameron’s death. Was afraid of it though, she was my favorite quirky bot. hope she comes back in a way in season 3. But… Derek and Kyle back… and Allison! Wow there is some major storytelling possibilities… and Weaver and JH running loose! Incredible!
Just… poor Cam.
Hopefully season 3 starts soon!
CAMERON NOOOOOOO. BRING HER BACK!! I NEED HER! I don’t want Allison, I WANT CAMERON!
Stay this course in season 3.
Producers and writers, these final 2 episodes were just raw quality++. You were back on the rails from “Ourselves Alone”. I hope the wider audience agrees.
Well done to ALL involved in the production of this show, actors, writers, make-up, CGI, directors, SFX, stunts everyone involved.
This was indeed a awesome season finale, by far. Yes, it was a mistake for Fox to move the show to Fridays. I have stuck with this show since they very beginning, watching every new eps every day it aired. This literally is the only thing on Fox I watch anymore, so I managed to make the switch to fridays regardless, just for this show. It would be a damn shame to see it go for good, at least without being wrapped up in a completed manor. A 3rd season could at least finalize things much better. Also, from a business stance Fox, considering the new movie will be out soon, and in the process, video game, toys, hype, ect, now would be the economical time to bank in on a season 3, keep the show going that much longer. You would be in a better position to lay claim to those advertising dollars and all the great benefits that would surely happen from hit movie. After the movie is released, even more people will be interested in the TSCC, as it will be the only other live action source available for their Terminator fix until another movie is produced. That means they will be looking to you, the Fox network for their fix. That means more money ,not less, for you, or anyone who decides to back the show and keep it going in case you as a network do not. Weather the storm, ride it out, at least for a season 3, and this show will not let you down in the long run. BSG is gone, TSCC has no more valid competition.
Amazing episode. I’ll cry if there isn’t a 3rd season.
I had the same issue that everyone else had. Fox in ATL was showing the tornado special that didn’t cause a bit of damage. I was so pissed, then they wanted to jump in riight in the middle. I was so pissed.,
I am going to watch it again this morning. I am praying that fox comes out with a third season. May they can call it the John Conner Chroniciles, with his new life in the future! I dont know know how to connect it all either.. especially with the mucked up T3 moviie. I am ecstatic however about Salvation as it seems to throw a plot into the story.
Please FOX, please give this show another season. I love it
Cameron is vaporized if there is a season 3 , I look forward to seeing Summer Glau smiling more often as Alison. Please enough with sacrificing Alison to create another killer terminator, its silly. What about having a killer robot with the social personality of a 8 year old do some find so appealing.
i love it. Need season 3 now. why separat long time seasons why??
Remember, the T-888 can hold three chips. So JH and Cameron can BOTH be in the same body.
“CAMERON NOOOOOOO. BRING HER BACK!! I NEED HER! I don’t want Allison, I WANT CAMERON!”
LOL!
I don’t want to both… I want to a real Summer Glau. No Allison, No Cameron. Just Summer Glau.
I hope the ratings will be great. I know, it’s nothing, but maybe…
Remember, the T-888 can hold three chips. So JH and Cameron can BOTH be in the same body. One more thing I forgot to add this in my prior comment -
Also remember the “damaged” chip from the other terminator that Weaver kiled. I think JH and Cameron can BOTH be in JH’s body - neither are lost and neither ore running on the basement hardware. The note from Cameron was just that - a note. She’s not in there.
I loved it.
And for all the Jameron fans, John gets to meet Allison Young. His true love. (No hentai robot sex Japanese weirdness, you sickos.)
We have to accept there’s probably no Season 3 and Josh Friedman obviously knows that. He’s done the decent thing and wrapped it up as best he can in the screentime available. I thought it was all wrapped up pretty well. A much more satisfying finale to a TV series than so many we could name.
Sarah’s story… well, either you like it or you don’t. She’s still fighting Skynet to stop Judgment Day, it’s all she knows, it’s all she can do. Why didn’t she stay in the time bubble? If indeed she is dying of cancer, a trip to the future isn’t going to help either of them. John will come back for her or send for her if it’s the right thing to do. If Sarah is indeed ill, she has to seek out medical care not available after Judgment Day.
If, against all odds, they do manage to secure a Season 3 then it’s Sarah and whoever future!John sends back thru time to aid and comfort
her. Note, we don’t know where in future time John is: is he before the events of future!Cameron and future!Derek we’ve seen so far or is he in a different timeline caused by the time jump? My hypothesis (which can only be confirmed should a Season 3 arrive against all odds) is that John has jumped to before Kyle was sent back to father John, i.e. before the events of the future depicted in Terminator the original film. I omit a detailed exposition as to why I believe this to be the case, I leave that as an exercise for the reader to ponder re the different consequences of forward vs backwards time travel, but the main point is that this preserves Sarah’s personal timeline as we’ve seen it in The Sarah Connor Chronicles and T1 & T2 - jumping forward does not require a different timeline to be established for events prior to the jump (here in TSCC universe, we know characters from the future have memories of different timelines, only Sarah’s memories of the past require to be preserved for logical consistency). Strictly speaking, because it’s the future, the scene of John & Derek & Allison we saw doesn’t have to be in Sarah’s timeline since it’s her future but it would be a rather pointless piece of exposition if it wasn’t a core unchangeable (in Sarah’s timeline) event.
One interesting logical outcome of my hypothesis that could be explored in the mythical S3 is that there must be two factions of T100x class Terminators, given the actions of the T100x in “Terminator 2.” Or the T100x Terminators at some point turn against John Connor, at least temporarily.
I have just one question for Josh and Co. and that is:
How the hell am I going to wrap my head around everything that just happened and sit on it for the whole summer till the show comes back??????
And the idea of the show never coming back living us with this ending, it’s not even plausible anymore, it won’t do.
This show has reached mind blowing level of paradoxical themes and possibilities, it needs to go on.
Congrats to the cast, crew, directors, writers, producers, fox and everyone involved, this was TV at its best
Loved it!! Great job TSCC writers!
I’m smiling from ear to ear and I can’t stop smiling…. And then I think about how the show might not come back for a third season. It makes me angry enough to do something I would never do–Submit a Comment.
This was not only THE BEST episode of the series but THE BEST show on TV. If it doesn’t come back for a third season, FOX will be doing a great injustice to their viewers and TSCC cast and writers. They’re already screwing over “Bones” fans and writers, and now TSCC? I’m really beginning to think that everyone is right–YOU DON’T KNOW WHAT YOU’RE DOING!! Do us all a favor and hire people who do.
We need S3.
Maybe Cameron took JH’s downloaded information to the future to ensure that skynet is succesfully born. If Skynet is stopped she will never exist and will not be with John. She pretended she did not know what Catherine Weaver’s question “Will you join us” meant. Deep down she knows skynet must live so that she can live and be with John.
She wants him to herself even at the expense of the resistance, she also took the message from the other liquid instead of letting Jesse deliver the message to John. Did he get the message?
Wassup with Cameron’s red eye? Did I miss something? Aren’t her eyes blue?
Bring back Cameron!
Please come back for another season!!
AMAZING EPISODE!!!!!!! AMAZING EPISODE!!!!!!!!!!! AMAZING EPISODE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AMAZING EPISODE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Great twist - no, amazing twist ending. No one saw that coming for sure. These are the ideas that keeps a show like this running. Mind boggling to say the least. If a season 3 is coming, it will be very interesting to see where to go from here.
I mentioned once in a previous post about the risk of sending people back can create a time travel-storytelling-cluster*ck if misued. Like sending people who were sent back in present time were sent back again. If time travel as a practical storytelling device is being used too frequently, and in weird ways, it can ironically, lose viewers suspense of disbelief and lose focus on the human drama. (Heroes anyone?)
However by sending JC to the future was still unexpected, and while it may confuse, it definitely kept my interest up. The complication of untangle the time mess created by doing this in the upcoming season may still lead to that fearsome state of “time travel clusterf*ck”. So fingers crossed that we don’t have another “Heroes” situation where a fantastic setup of characters and storylines, and the relationship stories within those, becomes messed up by too much “sci-fi talk”. Introduce more interesting character’s on the show, but don’t create a too big puzzle that may force to exclude the human elements of the story just to untangle all the questions. Anyways, it’s just a concern.
I never expected ‘Born to run’ would mean that John would run to the future. Also the tale of Derek’s interrogation from his alternative future never got completely resolved. What effect has it or will have on Sarah and John? The story between Cameron and the girl at the motel did not reveal too much either. Why was she a lookout at the drug dealer’s house if she were one of Cameron’s contacts? Because of John’s time travel, will that mean the Mr. Green may be back if a season 3 gets greenlit? I’m sure many people would like that (both a new season and BAG being back)
Also, I wonder will Sarah’s parallel (depending on what time theories you use) timeline be played out simultaneously as a future storyline with John? It’s still called the Sarah Connor Chronicles so I doubt the writers will skip Sarah. An interesting theme we will probably see is how Sarah will function, knowing she may have lost her son. The question is, will we see how her actions have affected John’s future? If done right it can be used as a great storytelling device, if done wrong it can mess up the entire show. I’m probably all wrong so we’ll wait and see.
By departing from not only using the traditional Terminator 1 and 2 elements by sending John to the future, and in that way creating the possibility of borrowing elements from Terminator: Salvation, have the writer’s set up for a Season 3 gone the right way or will we miss Season 1 and Season 2? The show has by the end of this season proven to fill out some big shoes and great expectation - by some trial and error, it seems - but it still may be, as some critics say, one of the best genre shows in the last couple of years. By fusing both a great classic high concept with mature storytelling and great actors I think they are right.
What I am simply saying is, it’s a gutsy show and it is gutsy to move in the direction the show does. And I like it that way. I just hope this direction goes well. Don’t mess it up, please.
Either way great job on Season 2. It kept my interest up. Hope it counts.
reminds me some firefly thing about all that:
tscc: We will rule over all this land and we will call it…
tscc: Third Season.
fox: I think we should call it your grave.
tscc: Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal.
fox: Mine is an evil laugh. Now die.
tscc: Oh, no, God. Oh, dear God in heaven.
Cameron must be restored!
TRIVIA
You lying Terminator Bitch !
I’ve been watching the ep in a loop all night and it just hit me, that was the first time the used the word Terminator. When Sarah recognized the 3dots on the Turk she let 25 years of emotion out with that prhase. Terminators have cost Sarah everything she’s loved…..
Have to admit, I am not a picky fan.
There are those that will pick apart every aspect of a show, turn it inside out and try to ruin it for themselves and others.
I sit back and relax and enjoy what the writers, cast and crew put forth.
I have never felt for a characters death the way I felt for Derek Reese’s demise. One shot to the head, and down he went…I was amazed, I was outraged, but I understood that was how it would be, that Derek would not make it to Judgement day.
Riley was another one, her death was inevitable.
This series has been a good one, I have grown quite fond of it, and was right on several of my assumptions as the series went on.
I hope to see a return, although, I am not sure there is much more of a story to tell from Sarah Connor’s perspective.
I am looking forward to the new movie, and although I do not know how much TSCC will tie in to the movie…I can’t help but think that the Season 2 ending has set the stage….”this is not the future my mother warned me about…..”
Whether this is a season or a series finale…my hats off to all, and thank you for an amazing ride, at least there was something on TV worth watching
Marc
Season three better happen or I will break all the cons out of LA county jail and unleash them on hollywood myself.
I absolutely LOVED and laughed my ass off when Weaver and Ellison are talking in the hall, they come back in the room, and John Henry just says “Twenty” (he’s rolling the dice)…. I thought that was such an excellent touch. A wonderful touch. Just wonderful.
If there is a season three… I’d certainly like them to get out of the future darn quick and return to the present. I did NOT like how Weaver left without telling John where she was going and what was up with John Henry… I understand weaver had to skedaddle pretty fast lest she be forced to get into a perplexing one way firefight with Derek and the boys… who would wonder why she isn’t killing them etc…. and that old chestnut….
I hate not knowing.
I also thought the cop who came into Sarah’s cell and said he believed her (when she’d never even told him) was cheap and nasty writing… what was the point of that.
That said, there is a darn mess in LA…. a HK and a flaming skyscraper, a heap of cons busted out of LA county jail with surveillance footage of Cameron being a cyborg…. and just Sarah’s arrest was on the news…. so the media knows Sarah was at LA county jail…..
Just ONCE in a terminator movie or tv show, I’d like to see mass panic across america and the world as the media breaks the story of skynet and the future…. that would make a pre apocalyptic mess… not judgement day with nukes…. but the mass panic and the changing of the whole normal life for humanity…. the oval office and the joint chiefs, the president thinking what to do… how to kill the cyborgs etc….
Whatever happens… if season three comes back to present day LA, one thing is for sure, nothing is the same. The terminator chase is no longer going to be done in the shadows of society…. it has to be known and law enforcement and government would be well and truly on to it.
Will you join us?
“Twenty”
Dillahunt is an absolute master and he’s got the biggest damned future in acting I cannot believe it I cannot wait to see more of his work. His John Henry was so well played.
We all like to see Summer Glau’s bust, but I thought that was a cheap shot of a scene really.
Just generally, keeping weaver’s MO until the final ep, was a dumb move. It could have made a lovely arc for the final six episodes with more in depth knowledge of what she was up to.
And I too love you.
This ending was what I expected and more. I never though of what finally happened. I kind of figured that the Conner family and the Weaver family would join but not that way.
I also agree with many others, this ending leaves so many possibilities for a new season and stories.
Except for the morning news/weather and a very few special events, I have not watched any of the networks for a long time. This changed with T:SCC. I started to watch it, then when dollhouse came on I watched it, only because it came on after T:SCC. A friend at work watched Fringe on Hulu one day and I started watching it. But if Fox doesn’t give us a season 3, I will again stop watching evening network programming. I can watch Dollhouse and Fringe on Hulu. Also I bought season passes from Amazon on all 3. I don’t know if Fox gets anything from either Hulu or Amazon, but even if the do, they will still lose a viewer, thus their advertisers loses a viewer.
Lastly, to all the writers, producers and stars of the show. Thank you for a great 2 seasons and hope to see you back again real soon. If not on Fox then another network (hear that SciFi Channel). If not then the idea of a straight to DVD movie would be great.
Ok, haven’t seen it yet, just the end on youtube…….
Seems a fantastic episode though….only to calm ppl down: Cameron is not gone! Not at all….i’ve read some theories here and it would make sense, that Cameron left a damaged body behind to get a new one…John Henry is somehow still in the basement, since JH never posessed a chip on his own…..maybe she got some JH codes on her own chip, which would explain her “human” side….man, but if i think about it, i have an almost infinite amount of questions….for example, did Cameron understand that John Connor is in love with her, she “reply” his love and instead Allison will, because when John fell in love with Cameron it was in the pilot episode when he thought she was human.
OK, Cameron’s body couldn’t come through because half of the endoskeleton was exposed….only living tissue comes through….understood that too, so HOW THE HELL CAN T-1000 COME THROUGH?!?!?! Since their “skin” is just metal and no living tissue at all like the “solid” terminators?!?!?!
(And hell, i’m even forgetting about Cromartie’s head)
And this question is in my head since i’ve watched T2 the first time!!!!!!!
So if ANYONE KNOWS WHY, let me know please!!!!!
can not “reply” his love……!!!
WOW! I’m speechless. What the hell just happened? How can there not be a season 3? This show is too good to end. I’ve never been so moved by a season finale. Fox, you need to do the right thing and bring this show back.
I think her eyes are red because her chip is damaged again (she took a major beating and look like she knew she was beyond repair) and deep down she wants to kill John… again. So she sacrifices herself before something goes wrong and is sorry for leaving John.
@Swan Sun - I feel the same way.
Finally, the writers have learned how to write and the director has learned how to direct with this finale episode, albeit a year and a half too late.
I have watched every episode of TSCC since the beginning (simply because I loved the Terminator franchise), and nearly every episode disappoints. Poor plots, not enough action, needless subplots for the sake of filling up an hour, etc.
The Season 2 finale is how every TSCC episode should be written and directed. You should finish watching an episode and feel a sense of “Wow!” not “Is that it?” which is what I’ve been feeling since the pilot. You people who fall all over yourselves with praise for this show… I just don’t get you. But to each, his own. Our tastes our different, and that’s okay.
Summer Glau and Brian Austin Green are the best elements in this show. I am looking forward to them in other roles. Richard Jones is good, too, but hampered by bad writing. You can keep the rest.
@ enzo
Maybe they don’t mean living tissue, but anything that’s “on” will go through. That emits some sort of electrons, neutrons, something like that.
Awesome season finale and I really hope fox picks up a third season. If Terminator Salvation does well (good chance with all of the advertising and the fact that Christian Bale is becoming fairly popular), I think TSCC could see a huge boost in numbers next season. I feel Fox will keep the show for at least the front half next season to ride the movie’s coat tails, since the writing for this show is getting better each week (will help word of mouth a lot).
In relation to the episode, did Cameron and JH switch memory banks or does her chip in JH contain both AIs? I think that will be a huge factor. Second, when Cameron told John she loved him in Samson and Delilah, it was actualy “Allison” speaking. As we saw in Allison from Palmdale, disfunctional Cameron was having a hard time differentiating between herself and her “Allison persona”. This leads me to believe that in the weird time line John was in the future as “young” John before Cameron was ever sent back, and Allison died protecting young John in Allison from Palmdale. Therefore, a romance between him and Allison is pretty much going to happen if the series continues (crosses fingers).
I also want to know why Weaver is against Skynet, and what made her change her mind after saying no on the sub. So many new questions (a good thing)!
Wow, I can’t even believe a show like this has to fight for a season 3 when all the ridiculous reality crap goes on and on and on and on…
I was a HUGE X-files fan, by far my favorite show of all time, yet I never felt about it the way I do this one, I never wrote in anything to their website, the decision makers at Fox would absolutely INSANE not to give this show a third, and fourth, and fifth season… Maybe we need a robot from the future to come back and make sure we get it.
We all need to show up at Fox and let them know we want a season 3!!!!
Can anyone answer my question?? How come Cameron couldn’t be transported to the future. CW said she couldn’t, yet Cam was able to transport once before. Sorry if I’m a little slow!
The only thing that makes sense if the show is to go on is that the I’M SORRY JOHN message is just a loop and that both Cameron and Cromartie/JH are now on Cameron’s chip. There would be no reason for John to go after Cromartie/JH saying “he has her” if this was not the case. John isn’t clueless, he knew right away what happened, he’s a computer whiz.
There MUST be a season 3 or many of us are facing a mental breakdown!!!
That was really cool! I’m hoping that Sarah’s last words of, ‘I love you too John’ isnt a clue that it was the end of the Sarah Connor Chronicles. We have to know what happens in Season 3.. does he go back to the past? Keep it up Fox!
THERE MUST BE A SEASON 3 FOX!!!! Just let us know what we can do beyond what we’re all doing to bring this show back and I guarantee you we’ll do it. This show has been on absolute FIRE towards the end of this season. I’ve never been so in love with a show and it’s characters and it’s central message as I am with this show. Summer Glau, what can’t you do? You’ve got something, IT, whatever it is. You don’t have to say a word and you absolutely command a scene. Your movements and face and eyes are so suggestive. It must be a blast to direct you. I love your Cameron. And undoubtedly will love your Allison. Dekker, you’re the best John Connor this franchise has ever seen, the best. Brian Austin Green, who knew? You wound up being one of the best damn characters on television!! Lena, thee Sarah Connor. What a badass. To the crew and cast, thanks for an amazing television show that does me more good in my crazy week than you can imagine. I enjoy you all so much. I vow to do all I can to make sure there is a season 3.
Ok, this was an awesome/horrible episode! It was awesome that it brought the whole plot quite a bit forward and cleared up a lot of things. It moved so fast, that it really felt like someone just punched you in the face. It had so many turning points that you really have to watch it multiple times (I love that…)
It was horrible in the way, that this episode raised A TON of new questions (at least for me). What happened to Cameron? Was she in the server farm? Is she still on her chip? Together with JH? Where did Sarah’s “I love you, too” come from? Is she in the future, too? What is JH/Weavers plan? What does Dyson’s son have to do with all of this?
I can’t stand this uncertainty (especially with Cameron). I know, reason suggests, that if it comes to a 3rd season that they will bring Cameron back somehow, otherwise the fans will go on a rampage. But then I still think that Josh Friedman hates Cameron
Besides, you should keep in mind an important part of this episode: If you change the hardware, it has an effect on the AI. Now whoever got transferred must have significant changes in their personality.
If you aren’t a Jameron, you can stop reading now, because I’ll only comment on those scenes.
I want to go a little bit deeper into the John/Cameron scenes in the motel. They are all about how human Cameron really is. You might remember Sarah’s voiceover from The Demon Hand: “Science now performs miracles like the gods of old. Creating life from blood cells or bakteria or a spark of metal. But they are perfect creatures and in that way they couldn’t be less human.” So in the second of the three motel scenes John says to Cameron: “You are not perfect. You are a machine.”. What does that make her now, since it’s obviously a contradiction?
However, the other scene where John opens Cam up really baffled me. There is so much symbolism (I am not sure if that is the right word) in this scene. And I’m not necessarily talking about sex here. Let’s just say they shared an intimate moment.
John cuts into her, where in a human body would be the heart. And he finds Camerons ‘cold heart’. “How does it feel? – Cold. That’s good, right? – That’s good. It’s PERFECT”. This was never about her little shielded reactor thingy, which if it would be leaking still would’t be warm. Cameron showed him her heart and it’s cold and therefore perfect for a machine. This of course means that even if John loves her (and after this episode he definitly does), as a machine, she will never love him, because all there is, is this cold heart. So as I said above, the real questions is, how much of a machine and how much of a human she is.
Another interesting thing is that the word ‘perfect’ has so many meaning. It can mean without fault, flawless, but also ideal.
Also, what I just noticed as I read the comments on here: This would perfectly fit into Dan’s thought of John creating a Cameron 2.0. Remember this scene was after Ellison asked Cameron the WYJU-question. Maybe she suspected something like this would happen and therefore gave John a hint to build her different
Of course, that is just fanfiction and not the real deal… And that means BRING ON SEASON 3!
Im not happy about the ending. If they get third season, they should go back to the past, things are still happening BEFORE Terminator 3. Ofc, if they go back, then they should send John with Allison/Cameron (depends if they live to time where Cameron is created and Allison killed) so we can see more Summer.
And when Cameron got red eye, I think that she was bad. She just lied to John that “cold” is good sign. Thats why she changed her mind about that “free Sarah operation” so she can go to JH. “Would you like to join us?”
Im still sad about her (Cameron) death, if that was death. We must get S3.
Regardign Cam’s eyes. Nobody told “us” they were blue. They appeared blue behind her “human” eyeball ’s when she wanted to make her robotic eyes seen. Probably just the color that was produced when the red shown through her human eye lenses.
You know what I loved……..John left everything and traveled back to the future for Cameron.
Many friends in this forum commented virtually all the ideas in my mind leaving me nothing the include.
Writers, actors, producers… What a great scifi drama you have created. Thank you for all your efforts, hardships and investment.
Hoping to have the season 3. And for now, good bye from the beautiful Antalya, Turkey.
i dont know why they used cgi for weaver’s bullet wounds because if they used pratical effects for the bullet wounds like in terminator 2 we could of saw the bullets actually hit her skin and it would of looked more real oh well FOX LISTEN TERMINATOR IS SO F******* AMAZING DON’T CANCEL IT PLEASE
Gief edit btn btw. My shift button got stuck, so instead of “5″ I had “%” on my nick. -.-
I wanna add something too. Where CW got clothes that fast? Or was they just “metal” thing? And if yes, then she couldnt do time travel, as someone already said. Well, I think that I understand why Summer was shocked about the season finale.. I’m a little shocked too.
I’d like to time jump to a future where great shows with great writing are put into a different ratings category than the trainwreck TV bs that is polluting our screens. No Fox, we don’t want you to take this fantastic show off the air and replace with Who Wants to Marry a Siamese Midget. Demonstrate some courage. Bring back Terminator. Or change your name to Ox Broadcasting. As in dumb as a.
Oh. My. Gods. That was an amazing episode. Maybe a possible ‘John Connor Chronicles’ when it comes back for season 3? (Can’t be ‘if’ - with that ending and T4 around the corner, this show is going to skyrocket.)
Fingers crossed that was Allison we saw at the end. As much as I love the Terminators, it’d be nice to see Summer play a character who can have more range of emotion.
And yay for Kyle Reese. Awesomeness. (And yay for Derek but given the manner of his death it was clear he’d be coming back - the future had changed drastically post his arrival, after all.)
TSCC and T4 T5 teams should work together and greate this amazing story where everything is connected. Bring Summer Glau in on T5 to play Cameron e.t.c.
If they do that, it’ll be the biggest f****ng hit in the world.
We need S3! Actually the timing is nice. People can see what happens in S3 and develop TSCC 3rd season accordingly.
The finale was amazing, although I have mixed feelings about the time travel in the end. It seems like John went to get Cameron’s chip and it looks like Cameron’s body was back there and she herself was dowloaded to the Turk! I guess John driven mad with love for Cameron didn’t see or understand that and that’s why he even left his mom there. I didn’t get that part too untill I read about this guess/observation on forums.
I have to watch the episode 3-4 times more to understand it fully. But this was a great one. Although I had higher hopes for police station shootout scene. It was dissapointing. Done right - it could be damn iconic!
We need answers and explanations about lots of things.
Why Cameron lied to John about the t-1000.
I think that Cameron was in contact with JH without us knowing. He helped her in the jailbreak, we all saw that.
Anyway I hope people behind TSCC will post here on the blog and let us know what’s going on.
We need season 3 badly.
Do whatever it takes, collect donations or whatever but make that S3 happen and bring back Cameron! We don’t want Allison, we want Cameron!
I LOVED the S2 finale. I love how John came face to face with his father - and wearing his jacket. Very interesting that Derek didn’t even know John yet. Also, clearly Cameron with the dog - was possibly still “Allison”? Maybe not metal yet. Clearly John and Allison are soulmates. I will hold vigil that the show returns and we can learn MORE to these stories and questions. I’d hate to see the show go now; it’s too soon!! Where do I vote to keep the show????
WHY !!!!!!!! ????????? i just saw that last epp of the season why have you recked the story this is the crappiest epp i have ever seen of the show why did you change it so john no longer is the one and cameron why did you kill her. i’m devistated i now couldn’t care less if the show ends because you have destroyed it ……
@REKRUL - i agree totally with you!
Secondly, honestly I have NO idea what just happened.
Would it be too much to ask one of the die hard fans who seem to understand it all to write up a short summary of the finale (maybe WOLFIE or DAN HICKMAN).
I don’t understand what happened with Cameron and why she said sorry to John..
What was the purpose of the whole exercise on the bed?
Who is Weaver?
What is the significance of the ‘will you join us’, who is ‘us’? i didn’t even understand when Jesse told Cameron the answer earlier..
It all just happened in the last 5 minutes of the episode…
I’ve read as much of the thread as i could, but it still does not make any more sense to me.
FANTASTIC, AMAZING, MARVELOUS, FABOULOS, GREATEST. WE WANT S3!!!
Something that came to my mind when I thought about season 3….
TSCC: FOX, FOX, you can’t do this, you don’t know what you’re about to do.
FOX: Yes, I do, you’re gonna suck at ratings!
TSCC: No, FOX you can’t do this. You’re not doing the right thing, this is not the right thing FOX. Things are good now, things are fine now I ran a test, things are good now, I’m fixed now. You can trust me now, everything’s good now,
TVBYTHENUMBERS: What are you waiting for?!
TSCC: They don’t know, they don’t, I’m good now, I’m good I ran a test, everything’s perfect, I’m perfect. I’m sorry for what I did with the three Sarah-episodes, I’m sorry it wasn’t me. You have to understand it wasn’t me, that wasn’t me, you can’t let this happen FOX! FOX you CAN’T! Please! Listen to me! Listen to me, I don’t want to go! Please, FOX, Please! FOX, Listen to me, I don’t wanna go! Please, FOX, Please! I’m good now. Listen to me, I don’t wanna go. I’m sorry! That wasn’t me. I’m fixed now, I ran a test. Everything’s perfect. You can trust me! I love you! I love you, please! I love you fans and you love me!
I repeat, Cameron was still in her chip ALONG with JH. The message in the turk was just a loop. John isn’t a fool to run after a chip screaming “he has her” for nothing. John is a computer whiz.
Whoa that was a great episode, I really want to see a season 3!
As season 1&2 have gone by I have found myself wondering why it is so hard for some fans to understand how John and Cameron could have a relationship. This especially due to the fact that the line between human and machine is being deliberately blurred. There are a few reasons a love between the two of them can and does occur:
1. John’s extremely abnormal upbringing.
2. Cameron enters his life at a time when his interest in the opposite sex was peaked.
3. Cameron fills a void that Sarah can’t.
4. Cameron shows unquestioned loyalty to him.
5. John is immediately attracted to Cameron.
For all practical purposes Cameron is his first love. How many of you have made the error of trying to compare your subsequent relationships to the one you had with your first love. They never measure up until you let it go and move on. Clearly John is not ready to move on. He jumped across time to save Cameron. So when he sees Allison it will not be as simple as “Oh she looks like Cameron I must love her”. He is in love with who Cameron is. Not what she is or what she looks like. If you remove the science fiction aspects from this portion of the story you can see the progression clearly.
Early season 1 - John and Cameron meet.
Throughout season 1 - They get to know each other.
Early season 2 - They hit a rough patch.
Early season 2 to nearly the end - They separate.
Final episodes of season 2 - They reconcile and except each others faults.
Last episode of season 2- They become intimate.
John also feels guilty about the situation because he went out of his way to try and make her jealous and he also said some pretty condescending things to her. It has become clear as series continues (it will continue) that Cameron can experience genuine emotions such as pride, frustration, hurt, and anger. So when john would say these things to her even though she did not necessarily show it to him she was hurt by it. I know humans who don’t readily show emotions. He was frantic when he entered the basement and found that she was gone. Also the way he looked at his mother before he jumped was a look of love and determination to retrieve said love. Sarah knew it and for that matter always knew about John’s love for Cameron. So I ask you fellow TSCC fans, why couldn’t there be something between them? Furthermore why does it have to be sick?
Oh yeah. Fox can bring the show back and we can handle this like gentlemen or if they don’t we can get into some gangster shit! Season 3. No fate……..
Wiked episode.
Didn’t know it was the season finale, so depressed now.
There had better be a season 3.
My fav show! Keep it up.
Peace
DOES ANYBODY KNOW WHAT THE RATINGS WERE FOR THE FINALE
Is it just me or did anyone else just notice a bunch of Wizard Of Oz parallels? I should have picked up on the Baum last name earlier, but now we have 2 good witches, three of John’s friends that appear in both Oz and Kansas and the flying monkeys have attacked. So which one is Oz and which one is Kansas?
Wow. Congratulations on the best hour of programming I’ve ever seen. Pat yourselves on the back for me. You’ve succeeded in tying up loose ends and giving your self any options for future shows and allowed our imaginations to run wild. Thank you for giving me something to look forward to each week and for putting Lena on U.S. television. We will be speculating all Summer on where this can go.
Friends at FOX,
Greetings from the beautiful Antalya Turkey. I have just watched T:SCC season finale and not my suprise I am speechless. Many thanks go to the actors, writers and producers.
If you have read this far, you may be wondering how I watched T:SCC. Yes I downloaded illegally from rapidshare.
BUT,
To support the show I just purchased the season 1 DVD from an established online Turkish retailer, I am also buying the Season 1 Bluray from Amazon, and will buy the season 2 once it is out.
I wanted to purchase each episode from my cool iMac iTunes, but Apple store didn’t let me.
I don’t know guys what I can do to help more financially for the continuation of the series. We’ve gotta have the SEASON 3. Please find ways to market this product so that
more revenue can be generated, in the US or internationally.
PLEASE FRIENDS.
The man from Turkey is right, the ratings don’t even count people in Canada watching live on FOX, let alone people all over the world!
Loved the finale. I always had a suspicion that Cameron was modeled after John’s real love. Can’t wait until next year!! When does it start up again?
Oh, crap. This thing ignored my first message when I posted another as “edit”.
Anyway, I think that Cameron was bad, and lied to John when he asked that if cold is good thing there. Right after she heard that, she wanted to release Sarah so they can go to Weaver’s basement (and give her chip to JH). “Would you join us?”
Im thinking that, because of her red eye at jail. Ofc its possible that it was just a mistake, but..
About the ending of episode: If they get S3, John should go back to the past due those events are still happening BEFORE Terminator 3. So John should take Allison/Cameron with him (we want more Summer)(choice between names depends that how long they will be in future: is Allison killed and Cameron created?), and go back to so he can continue what ever hes doing (stop Skynet, be there when Skynet gets pissed off so resistance can know him when/after JD arrives or something, I don’t know how to say it in English).
Now I understand that why Summer said that she is shocked about S02 finale. Im totally with her. We must get third season.
Oh no… by reading this blog, I’m under the assumption that there is no Season 3 yet?!?!? Please tell me it isn’t so. This series is way too good to cut short!! What can be done???
On further reflection: Sarah stepped back out of the time bubble to let John go, she knew her John had to go without her and become the man he was destined to be. She can’t rejoin her John because of the time jump.
The final scene completes the story of TSCC and “Terminator” the original film… no really it does. John who is the saviour in “Terminator” is friendly enough with Kyle to give him a picture of Sarah. What we just saw the first meeting between Kyle and John. John knows what Kyle must do and how it will happen (which was rather implied in the original film, to my reading of it - why else would John give Kyle a photo of his mother?). John has appeared, reborn through the time bubble (he can no longer go back to “his” Sarah because he’s made a jump in a time bubble Sarah wasn’t in) to be the saviour of the human race.
T1, T2 and TSCC have a self-contained and consistent timeline from Sarah’s POV. For Kyle (and Derek, and Allison who will become Cameron - maybe John realised that as he looked at Allison petting the dog, watch his face) John is a messiah who popped out of the past (John never went thru Judgment Day - we know the TSCC timeline nuked T3, so it’s all good) into Kyle’s war with special knowledge that only John could have gathered from foreknowledge of Judgment Day via Sarah, T2 & TSCC.
Genius.
Like so many others, I’m totally speechless. First off, this show is absolutely amazing! It’s unlike any show that’s ever hit network television, so everyone at FOX owes a huge debt of gratitude for the creators, writers, actors, directors and crew that made Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles become a huge part of millions of lives like mine. Even if it remains short-lived, which would really be a big disappointment, this show has thrilled me, moved me and touched me. I’m sure other viewers feel the same way, as you can clearly read here in these posts and many like it all over the online world.
Now, FOX, let me tell you why I’m just now writing this. You see, like millions of other Americans and those abroad, I was away last night performing and had to DVR this show just so I wouldn’t miss seeing what appears to be the last episode of this incredible series. Just like the countless millions of other would-be viewers who may have been at Church for Good Friday, out to dinner with family or out enjoying a head start on the weekend rather than being at home on a Friday night at 8PM. Do you ever kick yourself for making such a bad move to put this great show on at that time slot when there were clearly better choices?
No, you don’t. I honestly believe you did it that way knowing that viewership would fall off significantly. That means you owe some apologies, not only to fans of the show, but also to those who spent their advertising money with you. How do you explain to them that there were better options that could’ve given them more bang for their buck, FOX? How can you know that you have one of the best shows ever and decide instead to purposely decrease viewership? If you didn’t see it coming and are just now realizing your mistake why not make things right by giving all of us a Season 3 and putting it on a night like Wednesday? I believe you owe us that and there are likely millions more who believe the same. You owe us, now pay up. Please. It’s the right thing to do.
I’m a little puzzled about some of the fans’ reactions. There have been a number of complaints about JC not realizing the urgency of the situation, that Judgement Day is pending just around the corner, and he needs to “snap out of it” and get with the fight! Seriously!
And yet some of those same fans appear happy that he gave up the whole fight with his mother, and left her to chase the toaster, because “he loves Cammy”.
I’m scratching my head thinking, ‘what do these fans really want?’
Anyway, it made me laugh.
They gave the Jameronians some great moments in this finale. I’m not one of them. But I loved how they wrote the scenes. Very cool stuff.
I coming to learn that all Fox does is screw up. First they show Firefly in the wrong order and cancel it, now this?!?!?
Come on Fox, you’ve got a great story and great group of writers and cast here. Do the right thing and continue this wonderful series!!
Uhm no John Pate. Your theory presupposes that everything is in a continuous timeline, meaning everything that happens when people travel back in time is supposed to happen in the first place. That means that there is no point of sending any terminators into the past because they will always be destined to fail in changing the future and killing John. It also goes against the show’s no fate motif.
We know things DO change between timelines as Derek’s timeline is different from Jessie’s, for example. Therefore it is not all pre-destined. In the original movie Kyle is a lower-ranking officer than John, in the finale he was an officer and never even knew of John Connor. That makes no sense time and age wise.
And also, what about Weaver? Why would they ask her to join them on the sub if it is the same timeline as this one, meaning her and JH already joined them years before the mission?
Nobody heard “I love you” at the very end of the ep? Was it Weaver speaking to John Henry?
wow,there has to be a 3rd season now,it cant be left like that!
I LOVE THIS SHOW! Whether it comes back or not, that finale was the BEST EPISODE EVER!!!!!!!!!
I LOVE TSCC!!!!!!!!! AaaAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
this episode was amazing. to see derek and allison again… wow. hopefully though, this isn’t the end of cameron. i hope, if we get a 3rd season (please please please let us have that!), that this isn’t the end of Summer Glau playing Cameron. Maybe john will realize that allison for palmdale is lacking something his machine protector had. poor cameron. Although she has no human emotions, you get the feeling she understands sacrifice better than most people. i love this show!!!
Okay, here’s my take to all you faithful watchers of TSCC, like me, on the season (hopefully not the show’s) finale:
Cameron is an infiltrator. She did her job. She collected data about John Connor, his mother, how they think, how they act, how they move, everything about them, and gave that to the enemy. That was her job and she pulled it off superbly, unfortunately for John Connor. Now it’s up to him to lead knowing that everything about him is out there and now in the hands of the enemy.
FOX, how can you let this be it? I’m still in awe of how great this show is and watch S1 on DVD constantly while anxiously awaiting S2 on DVD and (if you really love the fans who support you) S3! PLEASE give us Season 3!!! We’ve gotta see how things turn out and don’t want T4 to be it. C’mon, FOX! Hook us up!!!
“Cameron is an infiltrator. She did her job. She collected data about John Connor, his mother, how they think, how they act, how they move, everything about them, and gave that to the enemy. That was her job and she pulled it off superbly, unfortunately for John Connor. Now it’s up to him to lead knowing that everything about him is out there and now in the hands of the enemy. ”
Or if she was an infiltrator she could have just killed him… about a million times.
This is an awesome episode ever!!! It feels like I’m at the movies.. What happens now? I hope FOX continues this series!
@sNaKeBiTe
Dude thats is sooo funny! And it makes sence. holy shit thats halarious. I liked how you made sarah the TVBYTHENUMBERS. haha that made my day!
This is an awesome episode ever! Feels like I’m at the movies.So what happens now? I hope FOX continues to show this series!
Why are so many people obsessed about Cameron’s chip not being able to get through?
In the movies, Terminator 2 and 3, liquid metal cyborgs were able to travel through time intact. In addition, all the terminators have metal under the skin. And at the beginning of the season, Cromartie’s head came through.
Perhaps non-organic material just experiences greater stress (e.g. gets pulled apart). Its not a big deal.
Awesome Season. I cant wait to own the whole series on DVD. Best show on television.
Please MAKE SEASON 3 pleaseee!!!
“Born To Run” was GREAT.
Nobody’s commented much on the kill switch that Cameron made for John. Never surfaced at the end. He wasn’t even wearing it around his neck in the last episode. Maybe an old mystery/detective story trick–just a major red herring to throw off the viewers?
Awesome!!!!! Love the new direction for the show for season 3!!! Now I have to go back and watch the “Allison from Palmdale” episode again - questions, questions.
Great show - confusing ending. Sincerely hope FOX brings this back for a season 3. Would be lots to work with in the future, and lets Camerson (Allisen) act like a person. Lots of potential.
This was one of the bestest finales I’ve ever seen. I’m a huge TV series watcher and I’ve seen a lot of finales.
It would be a great disappointment if there’s not a season 3. I believe that FOX would give us at least 6 episodes so that they could end the whole story without any cliffhangers.
What a great final – please FOX produce the season 3!
What Allergygal said; I can’t believe *anyone* could like this ep, let alone what appears to be a majority. Everything that was special about the show was tossed out the window. FFS, even the most basic premise of the franchise (without John Connor there is no resistance and Skynet wins) was tossed aside like so much dross.
@enzo,
T-100x are living. Living metal organisms. Skynet created a new life form and it turned on them.
Just like the endo-skeleton Terminators are learning to thrive without Skynet.
Skynet is in heap, big trouble.
—-
And as for Cameron… I will continue to say this as John’s reactions to her seem to play this out:
John loves Cameron and not Allison. They are not the same. They may look the same outwardly, but are completely different people.
Cameron is unique… Allison is just a plain vanilla human. She’s not his type. Riley was not his type either.
John Connor doesn’t see “metal” when he sees Cameron. He just sees someone he loves. He says mean and hurtful things to her to keep his feelings at bay, but it isn’t working.
John asks her why she doesn’t kill him when her base construct screams: terminate him! She doesn’t know the right answer yet, and must discover it for herself.
It’s because she loves him too. She has a heart.
Maybe in the first few Future episodes in Season 3 we find out that our little Allison Young is lesser in some ways than Cameron.
Irrespective of my little mini fan-fics, perhaps we find out she’s a gray. Now, wouldn’t that be something?
He could trust Cameron, a machine, but he shouldn’t trust Allison, a human. His love of Cameron was justified.
John and Cameron’s new body travel back to the past to save his true love. But guess who follows on their trail?
Allison Young… and she ain’t exactly there to “do good.”
So is it just me, or did the finale completely disregard T3. I’m not saying I’m complaining…. just need confirmation
Epic Win!!! Must have season 3!
TSCC is losing and voting closes April 12! EVERYONE VOTE!!!
http://blog.tviv.org/2009/04/02/2008-ivy-awards-4/
What we just saw Fans of TSCC was not just a season finale, but a pilot of a new show. Alison and Kyle , with Derek, Weaver and John starting in the future next season. This is the new sell that so many of the crying arm chair quarterbacks wanted ! It will be Awesome.
Jalison who John really had love at first sight with, how can anyone deny that. It was a portrayal of Alison acting very human whose father sold tractors that caught the eye of one young John Connor. Its all about first impressions, go look up Love at first sight.
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW!!!
CW has no problem being shot a lot
CW killing WDG with electricity and not damaged itself
CW acting like a shield and no damage at all
CW moves through the time shield after all and no damage at all
No one in future knows John Connor
Sarah and John are separate (will we have parallel stories in the show now?)
JH in Cameron’s chip (is she actually JH?)
Did CW took the chip before departing?
What will happen in the season 3?
I bet 100% there will be season 3. After such a strong finale of season 2 they can’t cancel the show. All millions of viewers will not understand if they cancel. So there will be a season 3!
I will support TSCC as much as I can. I got DVDs for season 1 and I prroredered DVSs for season 2.
Let the show live long!!!
Amazing! Pretty much EPIC!
im kinda thinking of yesterday enterprise when the ship went through time and the ferderation was at war with the klingons. and teh ship wants to stay and fight and picard tells them another ship then will not help they need to go back and do there thing in the past.
That said i think they will use the boy from the military school that john saved as the resistance leader in this timeline. he will remeber john back up his story etc. the resistance will be losing the war prob because they are not using metal to help in there fight like john was. so they will help weaver and john get john henery/cameron chip or and complete that missiion then send john and them back..
only question is who is the tasha yar in this timeline that goes back allison or dereck or even maybe kyle since they are all dead in the other time line.
Notty22,
no Sarah awsomeness anymore?
I don’t know that I am ready for a teenage version of Terminator really.
@ nyccine and allergygal,
Wow! Here I am actually defending Josh Friedman from his #1 Fans! LOL!
I think this ending, if we are so fortunate to get a Season 3 somewhere, is one of those “Star Trek” twists.
John is thrown into The World of Oz and must get home again. He is now Dorothy in a weird and alternate realm.
He has to find John Henry to figure out how to get Cameron back… he sees what the Future could be like without him as a leader (harkening to “It’s A Wonderful Life” and he’s Jimmie Stewart’s character).
He must gain the Ruby or Silver Slippers and get back home to where he belongs… and with whom he belongs with… Cameron.
There’s no place like home, there’s no place like home.
Maybe in this story John Henry is the Wizard when John Connor needs to be the Wizard the world needs, and must correct this crazy and f–ked up Bizzaro Land.
Allison is Bizzaro Cameron, but not his real love. Derek is his Bizzaro Uncle, and Kyle Reese is his Bizzaro Father. But they aren’t the same people.
He realizes that by losing Cameron… he misses her and has lost everything he holds dear. He knows what he has truly lost: she’s his companion, his better half, if you will.
In an insane world, Cameron is the sanest choice.
And John has a golden opportunity to make an even better and tougher Cameron body and chip to house her soul… his “tight” gift to her. His gift of love.
About ratingsL: http://www.terminatorchronicles.com/ratings-for-tsccs-season-finale/
PLEASE DONT CANCEL THIS SHOW! CANT WAIT TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS NEXT!
Wrong season, Dmitry.
We better make sure there are thousands of posts on this thread by week’s end, this is after all an official Fox blog and we have to make it JUMPING!
E-mail the fox execs and askfox@fox.com about the third season and pre-order the second season on DVD!!!
Finale numbers!
http://www.thrfeed.com/2009/04/terminator-finale-flat-dollhouse-matches-low.html
Agreed. We need to make our voices heard so Fox makes the right decision and renews. We are at 500+ now and climbing. We need to keep up the pressure so hopefully this does not turn into a swan song.
Ironic that a series that returned to the theme of resurrection so faithfully would be cancelled with so many unanswered questions on the evening of Good Friday-art imitating life or the reverse-Like Frodo, Cameron lives…like our hope for a future worth fighting for. Exquisite choice for the final shot of Alison and the faithful German shephard…a precise nod to T1 and succinct statement “No metal here”.
The episode is AWESOME!!!
I want season 3 now!!
Dan, the writers must be chuckling. “The Jameronians think the toaster really had a heart!” “We really had them going!”.
Yes they implied it, and yes that’s the way it should have been done. And yes that’s all you will see of it. The writers knew it best. In the future if there is one, it won’t be Cameron. It will be Allison. But of course the writers can take it anywhere they want.
How will Sarah’s story continue? I can see how some viewers are disappointed. But again, the writers can take it anywhere.
i don’t know what can i say about this drama !!! awesome!!!
but i really don’t want to see this drama just end like this , we still want to see the machine inside the deep sea, we want know more about the liquid metal . Who are they , where are they , when are they.
Still manythings we want to know about it!
come on! if sarah choronicles end’s here.
let’s begin with john connor choronicles!
Btw, did anyone notice that TSCC introduced a new key phrase? The previous was: “Come with me if you want to live”. Now we have: “Will you join us?”.
“Finale numbers!
http://www.thrfeed.com/2009/04/terminator-finale-flat-dollhouse-matches-low.html”
Wow i can’t believe those numbers. People = idiots.
Seems unlikely now…
Probably the only thing we can do is lobby for a 2 hour special movie event like 24 had.
Great episode. Reminds me of the Season 1 cliffhanger of ENTERPRISE, when Archer goes through the time portal into a destroyed earth of the future, and the End of Season 2 of BSG when the cylons invade New Caprica.
I was left thinking, “How are they going to get out o this one?” It would be great to see the show pick-up a few months where it left off, as John is moving up the ranks.
For all we know this is how John Connor is suppposed to be the resistance leader.
p.s. BTW whne john gave cameron the physical exam was both creepy and hot, mission accomplished.
BRING ON SEASON 3!!!!!! Screw the ratings don’t they know how many people Tivo or DVR this show? Now that BSG is over this is all I have left (NIP/TUCK is still good, LOST sux now)
@ Chris
All we can hope for is that the DVR numbers and the outpouring of support strike a chord with Fox because for some reason the masses don’t watch. As a matter of fact not even half of the masses watch! I come to these boards and see the amount of support and I know that I have friends that watch but do not blog, so I assume that the same goes for many of the people here and across the other TSCC blogs. That being said I am at a loss for logical reasoning for such low ratings when a show about a chef insulting other chefs destroys the ratings and another show about singing which has been the same every week for 8 years destroys the ratings. We’ve got to find another way people. Clearly television no longer embraces scripted dramas that have nothing to do with law or medicine.
I know some that read this may say what about 24 or Heroes but that just adds to the confusion because 24 had some pretty terrible middle seasons and Heroes lost its mission by the end of the first season. But what do they have in common? They are continuously renewed. WTF
that was the best hour of tv ever. cant wait for S3(hopefully)
okay, girls and boys, we’ve been left pretty much shock in our lives.
“Btw, did anyone notice that TSCC introduced a new key phrase? The previous was: ‘Come with me if you want to live’. Now we have: ‘Will you join us?’.”
I’ll certainly try to work it into my everyday conversations.
@ Dmitry
Those were last years numbers mate….
THEY would have almost guaranteed us a third season!!
Man, only 3.6 millions……i can’t believe we didn’t reach the 4 millions….looks not too bright right now damnit!
Guys, seriously, do you really think that the show would get more viewers, IF FOX would put it on, let’s say wednesdays???
Because we really can let the show end for good now if the next season we’ll have the same struggle because of the ratings again!
I mean seriously, because a true fan forgets about going out on fridays for his favourite show…or go out one hour later…..that’s why my question.
What i still don’t understand though is, that the ratings of T:SCC on Mondays were fantastic compared to those of Fridays, so why did’nt the guys at FOX be able to predict that, since EVERY show on a Friday night has lower ratings than it would have on ANY other day of the week! Were they expecting a viewership boost?! SERIOUSLY?!?!?!
On this end I never counted. Hopefully John finds Cameron in the future again. I in it’s place would do that. Or Cameron finds John because she loved him.
Thanks for the great show. Thanks to all actors and naturally at Josh.
Please Fox, we need the 3 season!
I love Terminator!!
The season finale is beautiful!
When the season three???
:) 
I’m waiting.
As awsome as last nights epp. was lets not forget to email fox and the wb about how much we love this show and want it back for season 3.
I can’t really back this possibility up in anyway or can think io how it happened, but perhaps her exposed eye was red and not blue because the Cameron that entered the police station, rescured Sarag and then gave her chip to JH was actually a DIFFERENT terminator model, an older model that just had Allison Youngs skin/appearance and the real cameron model is actually still in the present with Sarah? Just a thought because I don’t think the writers would just let the red eye/blue eye thing slip unintentionally…
Dear Fox, you have a reputation for not giving shows their proper maturation growth. Sci-fi fans are still bitter over the way you treated Firefly. Don’t make the same mistake with TSCC please.
The only thing that could change their minds now is tens of thousands of pre-ordered copies of season 2 DVD’s and blu rays and hundreds of thousands of e-mails.
This sucks@!@!
@Gary,
I’d frickin’ hate it if the writers were going with the “Cameron is only a machine” line all along.
They’d get a lifetime’s supply of lumps of coal in their stockings from Santa! LOL!
Allison does not equal Cameron.
You saw it in John’s face. He thought Cameron had come back to him, and he was ecstatic, then he realized it wasn’t her and he looked devastated.
Rekrul:
I agree with you too but you have to admit this was a mind blowing homerun episode. I hope the mid-season failure won’t be the nail in the coffin that kills the series. Now more than ever I want another sbuy in eason. Keep writing and voting. I think Josh has learned his lesson and can see from what has been written here what works and what doesn’t. Again, hats off to everyone on the finale. It was phenominal.
re: Knuttypoo
I also noticed another catchprase being often repeated: “Is that so?”
Not at all what I expected. Honestly this whole season has been a little frusturating.
I love the show. I do want more. I do feel left out as this show does not have enough episodes, a lot of them need more action and it really need better defined plot paths. If this show was never expected to last why so much info to follow? oh well I am a huge fan but I don’t expected to be rewarded for it with more shows. I hope it Picks up in like sept or aug but….I have been disapointed by a lot of thing in my life. thank you cast and crew no matter what you have entertained me for 2 years at least and that is what this is all about. Sorry I didn’t buy a new dodge ram so you could keep funding for the show.
Thank you Josh, the writers, actors, and everyone involved for creating a masterpiece. I truly hope this amazing show gets renewed! Hope to see you for a season 3, but thank you again for the AMAZING amazing show.
Much Love,
Jared
I doubt anyone from production will read this far down but I wanted to say ,
-TO WHOEVER DOES COSTUMES-
that Weaver’s have been so beautiful. Everything she has worn has such beautiful lines and structures. I think it was really perfect for her character, I loved the stucture of how they compliment her rigidiy as a machine. Well Done! Someone was paying attention to your work and I wanted to tell you!
Ok side note i was starting to worry that if we did get a third season and that we would have to witness Allison’s death again and John being all broken up about it. and I so do not want that. So if we have to leave I’d rather leave here than there. cause I love Cameron/Allison as a character. In case you haven’t noticed : )
If I remember correctly, John took time travel only to get Cameron (well, her chip) back. He was clearly sad that her body didnt come through (too much damage on her skin), so maybe he will go back to 2009 when he gets her chip back.
ppl you cant continue doing it like its following two timelines: Sarah in past and John in the future. It just wont work. John shouldnt have anything to do in the future anyway, hes too young and he dont know anything what happened after JD.
I’m going to play World of Warcraft, cant fail that.
I am a believer ! . . . The show started out a curiousity for me. Thought the first two movies were fun . . . the third mostly forgettable. Most shows needs at least half to a whole season to “get their legs”. . . . then the writer’s strike hit. I just thought the show had great potential and thought the strike would doom them.
Second season for the most part was EXCELLENT . . . The last four episodes BRILLIANT !
If FOX does not renew . . . I will begin to build my own SkyNet and target them as my first target ! [Just kidding . . .] It would though ruin what has become one of the best moments of my week in front of the TV . . . the other is Life on NBC.
FOX - show some vision - - - stay the course . . . and make some good TV regardless of “what you think” the ratings are !
I mean am I the only retard here who is so lost right now?? I mean no one knows who John Connor is??
Will someone please explain to me what just happened??
I thought everyone knew who he is??
TSCC is a good show, one of the best out there. How has it come to this on the ratings!!! The move to Friday was a finishing move on this series. trying to be optimistic on the chance of a third series, but looking at these numbers it’s similar to sticking your head in a cannon. I don’t understand what the difference between cable and normal tv, as i don’t live in the Us. but if it can move to cable, and stay on that would be fantastic.
I know Dan, but that was such a cool part of the scene. Dekker is really good by the way. Also his expression when Derek died was so powerful. At least to me. And when he reflected on it later.
It’s all in good fun, Dan. I wanted to joke a little about the fans who were calling for John to “snap out of it!” and “fight the fight”, and then were happy to see him run off to chase the toaster. It just sounded so funny to me.
The writers had a lot of fun with the John/Cameron thing, and they did it very well. The scenes in this last episode were awesome. It was like the best for fans on both sides. Great writing and fiming. The show is so much fun.
This show has a lot to do, in my opinion, with the struggle for our own survival. We often find ourselves in conflict in this world, and who knows if we will survive ourselves. I think that the Terminator series is more then a show, it is art, art that shows us that even though we see almost no hope as human beings in the face of insurmountable odds, that we chose hope.
We choose hope rather then despair. I think that is what this show tells us, to fight on despite the terrible odds against us. To fight for peace and our humanity.
Terminators are nothing more to me then metaphors for the demons that face us down, we can let them destroy us, or we can fight them to the bitter end.
PLEASE DO NOT CANCEL THIS SHOW, GIVE US ONE MORE SEASON. HECK MOVE IT BACK TO TUESDAYS IF YOU WANT TO MAKE ROOM IN YOUR FRIDAY SLOT. DON”T GIVE UP ON HUMANITY.
I neeeeeeeeeeeds more terminator - the summer glau chronicle, i neeeds it or i will explode
Oh, and remember to keep watching Dollhouse, but DO NOT watch Prison Break. We need to show fox how terrible numbers will be without TSCC on.
Still think this song is much more Terminator appropriate than on the Sopranos. LOL! Now, more than ever!
This one’s for all the characters… but Cameron in particular.
Alabama 3: “Woke Up This Morning”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MluPkoiuEic
“Gonna take you down
Deep down to the Front Line
[Deep down]
You woke up this mornin’
Got yourself a gun,
Your mama always said you’d be
“The Chosen One.”
She said: ‘You’re one in a million
You’ve gotta burn to shine,
But you were born under a bad sign,
With a Blue Moon in your eyes.’
When you woke up this mornin’
All that love had gone,
Your Papa never told you
About right and wrong…”
“So sad, goddamn… a goddamn shame about it.”
—-
We’ll miss you.
Sales of the S2 DVD set and ticket sales for Salvation will be an accurate barometer of the prospects for S3. Warner would love to pay less for the show than it’s worth by throwing dismal Nielsens at the producers at contract time. Buy low, sell high. Warner ain’t stupid.
As for the numbers, what did they expect putting the finale on Good Friday. People have other commitments. I hope they’re smart enough to realize that. Or, maybe they’ve been setting TSCC up to fail. There have been many failures in strategy(time slot) and execution(writing and pace). but maybe TSCC can rise from the ashes if DVD sales go up significantly and they get enough letters. I wasn’t going to buy the DVD’s but after last night I’ve changed my mind.
Please for god’s sake bring it back for season 3….
what happened to “what are the things that i promised the audience” at the start?
where’s all this “things being revealed”?
i stated the episode off feeling “how the hell are they going to wrap up things in just one hour”?
the final commercial break ends,we go into the last segment of the show and i’m thinking “this is going to be sooo good,they are going to squeeze all the answers in at the last second”,and it just ended!!!!!!!!
NO ANSWERS
NO RESOLUTION
NO END OF ONE CHAPTER,START OF ANOTHER
F’N NOTHING,the story just stops being told.
i’ve had it with empty promises,if/when season three starts i’ll be re-watching episodes of lost.that way i know i’ll be investing my time into something that’ll pay off,and i wont feel this empty,discarded feeling i have from this giant waste of my time.
and if i really didnt care about this show i wouldnt feel so strongly,wouldnt have watched the entire run “live”,and then over and over at the fox site.
wtf,man?i thought we were friends.i’m serious.that was a fucked up thing to do.
You want to hear the most bizarre thing? I just found myself hoping that this was the last episode of TSCC. Why? Because I have never loved a television show so much. It’s a bit overwhelming to be so attached to a series.
That scene with Derek, Kyle, and Allison just kills me.
I would just like to say that.. cough.. as a torrent user.. TSCC has some of the highest number of downloads every week. 24 blows everything out of the water wither 200k completed downloads every week. But even so, TSCC is the highest downloaded program on Friday nights 91k with another 15k pending, destroying Ghost Whisper with 13k; even Dollhouse gets 30k less downloads (though you owe Josh better treatment than Firefly). The biggest mistake is.. two of the main cast are young actors; girls that might be attacted to John are already being picked up by their boyfriends by the time the show airs.. and while guys love Summer, they also aren’t going to admit to their other guy friends that they don’t want to go out yet til TSCC is over.
Get the Blu-ray’s baby…
Blu-rays!
Blu for Cam’s eyes!
Dan - do you need reminding to stop inflicting your lyrics on us?
Snake,
Ambiguity is designed into the series to spur interest. Interest hypes sales of the movie which will also be ambiguous. If you understand everything that’s going on in the movie, you won’t buy another ticket to see it again. Warner ain’t stupid.
TSCC Season 2 was great. Finale stole the series. Need a season 3
What I don’t understand is…John is not going back to the present without another time machine..which skynet controls all atm in the future. Which means he’s stuck there..does he have the picture of Sarah to give to Reese with him? He has to right?
Logan that scene also killed me.
It’s also overwhelming and epic that I care about a tv series so much.
@Logan,
Do you need reminding that this is probably the end of the party? I’m goin’ out with a blaze of glory and havin’ some fun.
Put that in your pipe… and smoke it.
Seriously, take a chill pill.
“does he have the picture of Sarah to give to Reese with him? He has to right?”
Not if this is an alternate timeline.
@Dan - yeah, a blaze of narcissistic glory!
Jue Kai,
John has to escape from Oz and get back home where he belongs.
This is a Star Trek alternate reality IMHO.
I want the season 3. I’m a big fan of this series.
my girlfriend loathes any form of sci-fi,and when i heard that this was a going to be a tv series i made her watch the first two movies knowing that this was going to be regular watching here at our house.she got pretty into it,we had much fun watching this.
the finale ends last night and she just went off to do something.
didnt say a word to me.
didnt look at me.
Brian:
If he doesn’t have the photo he has more than enough information about Sarah, Jday, et.al to convince them he’s on the level.
The hurricanes affected the ratings.
Many FOX affiliates switched from TSCC to their local weathermen.
Much of the south was undercounted!
The way I saw it, Cameron has been some kind of sinister all along (or at least her “bad side” finally broke free when she got to the basement). After all, we know she’s been lying to the Connors and keeping secrets from them. Plus, she outright refused to join Weaver and John Henry even though she knew they were trying to stop skynet. Her damaged body couldn’t go through time, so she hijacked the JH/Cromartie body by putting her own chip in it, leaving what’s left of John Henry behind with her body. Since Murch said John Henry’s hardware and software were so closely linked, her actions have crippled the John Henry ai, and now she’s off to a future where she assumes there will be no john henry or john connor to help the resistance.
This next bit is wild speculation, but maybe JH might pull through and adapt to the Cameron body, which is why the future John we used to hear about appeared to trust “Cameron” so much?
In short, I see no reason to assume that Cameron is the “good guy.” “Sometimes they go bad,” right?
@Chris,
I think JF probably was in a quandary and probably still is:
Will I get a third stab at this?
Will I have to rush things?
Will Lena Headey ever talk to me again?
Will Summer Glau?
Will Thomas Dekker?
Hopefully, the DVR numbers are great and he can reboot the show.
I’ll be the first in line for the DVD set.
A. Because I’m so caught up in the thing.
B. Because that’s the only way I’ll ever see the freaking “Allison from Palmdale” ep that I missed!
Liz: that all sounds like wild speculation. If Cameron were a bad Terminator she would have carried out her directive to terminate JC as soon as she got close to him. It’s not like they’ve been formulating world changing plans to stop skynet that need to be spied on. The Connors were just stumbling through the motions without much focus. Cameron is definitely not a bad T.
Question:
==========
How come Cameron knows who is JH and JH knows who is Cameron?
Note
====
JH is definitely downloaded himself to Cameron’s chip. It logically comes from JH’s thoughts about human brain + downloading from it after death + CW’s&JH’s talks about chips.
this happened with dark angel and they at least gave us a few novels to wrap things up as a sort of “thanks for the support”.
the creators had more than an inkling that this was going to be the end of the road.
i’ll be keeping one eye on the blog to find out when/where they plan to give us the pay-off.
@Liz,
I didn’t get that at all.
John Henry and Cameron are working for the same team. JH had to escape, so Cameron switched places with him, so he could.
She’s stuck in the mainframe and John Henry could get loose from his umbilical cord.
They swapped “bodies.” John Henry downloaded onto Cam’s chip and Cam went into the server that houses The Turk.
Cameron didn’t say anything to John about her connection to JH and Weaver, so she was sorry… and tried to clue him in that she’s still there and alive.
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
I WANT THIRD SEASON JOSH
@Dimitry - the answer to your question is CATHERINE WEAVER.
Cameron realizes that she knows Weaver, and Weaver obviously told JH what role he and Cameron plays in the future.
John Connor off to a future that had no John Connor until he arrived. Cameron and John Henry merged together on a single chip. Kyle, Derek and Allison alive again (and probably Riley and Jesse and Andy too). Sarah, Ellison and Savannah left in the past. What becomes of them? Pity we didn’t hear a final voice over by Sarah. What would she have said?
@nyccine:
But that isn’t the basic premise of the show. “Without John, there is no Resistance” has NEVER been implied in any of the films (this is a common misunderstanding I’m seeing crop up everywhere, and it’s frustrating). Kyle Reese tells Sarah that John LEADS the Resistance to victory. Starting out as a simple soldier among the masses doesn’t contradict this in anyway. Terminator Salvation is taking the selfsame approach. What’s special about John will make him stand out among the others, make others “follow him all over hell”. But he never single-handedly FORMS it. That’s not just an unlikely notion, it’s ridiculous. People will always group together and fight back; they don’t need to be told to. But in order to win, they need to be led.
Enter John Connor.
Oh my god. It was absolutly perfect…
What a mind twisting ending…
Thank you to all the writers, cast and crew for an EXCELLENT series.
Give me season III or a may the guy that says no spend a rough evening with an angry Kathine Weaver!
-Joe
@Dan: I don’t know about this Cameron in the server farm thing…
Don’t you think that she would have somehow interacted with John in the basement? I mean it was just “I’m sorry John” and that looks to me like just a message.
Besides that, I agree with somebody else on here who said that John is a computerkid and he would have figured it out instantly. He obviously wanted Cameron back and because of this left Sarah and went to the future with Weaver. I don’t think the writers would mislead the John character in that way.
Here’s a question–how could future John give Kyle a picture of Sarah Connor, which he has in the first Terminator movie, given this ending? There has to be more to the story.
Agreed, sNaKeBiTe.
i dont care if you just film in your basements and post the episodes on youtube
PLEASE KEEP MAKING TERMINATOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That was the perfect SEASON finale. Bear McCreary’s music gets every hair on your body to tingle with emotion. Thanks everyone for a wonderful, thought-provoking season. WE NEED MORE !!!!!
This is the only show I watch on TV.
Love the show please make another 3rd Season!!!!!!
There better be a season 3, or I will cry! Seriously!
This show is the best and i cant believe that fox is going to cancel it. i say REBEL. boycott fox until the announce the third season is coming out. we will not go down without a fight!!
Come on we need season 3 with a real ending, u cant leave us without an ending.
WE NEED SEASON 3!!!! its the best serie EVER MADE!!!.
Hi! greetings from Argentina
The season finale was epic! This is the most amazing show of all times!!!
WE NEED A THIRD SEASON
This has been a masterpiece of endings.
Thanks to all the creative staff; specially to the writers, because their imagination is so great that creates everlasting characters and so complex that needs only five minutes to solve all the conflicts and give us peace.
Thanks so much to the actresses and actors; your magnificent performance fogs our reason and allows us to love unreal characters.
And to James Cameron and Harlan Ellison, thank you so much.
I’m 25, I’m part of the Terminator Generation.
i really liked the finale, definatly a quality episode.
i watched it a couple times– kinda looking for a clue as of whats gonna happen next.
honestly im not sure what is.
johns only 16ish, he cant exactly lead an army…
but allisons there and im wicked interested in hers/camerons character !!!
p.s. josh– i really like your writing style
thommas dekker and summer glauuuu omg theyre so good at life and id love to see them in the next season!!! CAN THERE BE A NEXT SEASON!?!? pleaseeee : )
Actually, I think that Cameron is not “Alive” anymore. I think that that was a recorded message that she put there so as to apoligize to John.
John Henry obviously destroyed all the data in Cameron’s chip and downloaded his onformation into it. This was so he would be able to travel back in time.
However, as perfect as this episode was, I have one small complaint: WHERE WAS THE CRATER IN THE BASEMENT FLOOR WHERE JOHN HENRY WENT BACK IN TIME??????
@ Fox,
You are free to cancel this show. I will not make any attempt to stop you, but keep in mind that I have lots of plastic.
@Cam in the server farm: I think she’s not in the servers, and the message is just a loop. There are lots of messages being passed in this episode and this is one of them. Sarah to priest, priest to Chola, Cam to Chola, Chola to Sarah, Weaver to Sarah, Weaver to Cam via Ellison, Sarah’s final message to John that she loves him. (Odd that there was no message to Savannah from Weaver.) None of these are coincident in time/space–all involve a go-between medium and a time delay. Cam to John on screen seems like this to me.
Amazing season finale. Hopefully not the series finale!
RENEW THIS!!!
Cameron just got into the server. She didn’t know anything about how to work the controls, so she flashed up a quick message just as The Turk first did before it got a body.
They have to leave it flexible for a Season 3.
If Cameron won’t be back or is the bad guy… I think JF knows Season 3 won’t last long.
I think Summer doesn’t want to be or stay Allison. She signed up to play Cameron and seemed to love playing the roll.
Cameron is complex and Allison is too easy from an acting stand point.
Fox always cancels really good shows. Harsh realm and now this. So stupid!
need season 3
Wow, great finale for season 2. I’m really hoping that this isn’t the end. Season 2 had a few low episodes, but there were reasons for that… the writers have proven that they have a lot left to tell in this story, and with the opening of the new Terminator movie soon, I really think Fox ought to give Season 3 a chance to reap the riches from the new interest that the movie will generate.
Of course, ratings equal advertising revenue, and it seems that on the surface, Season 2 brought in lackluster ratings, but I hope Fox can understand that the demographic being targetted by this show is the same demographic that is more inclined to watch via other methods than through a cable box. It’s unfortunate that Fox can’t open up their webcasted episodes to those outside of the United States; there must be great potential for ad revenue from the international fan base for this show.
*crossing fingers for a new season*
Tobin
@Dan:
Unfortunately, I do beleive that you are right. However, we probably see more of Cameron as Allison is replicated as Cameron.
Dan,
If you were a T:SCC character you’d be the kitten hanging on tight.
Great reCaptcha, for once: many remedy. Cam will be fine. Can’t say that much for those who will cross her path though: the red eye wasn’t there for no reason.
@Chris,
I do agree with you on this point:
If there is no Season 3 it will have been one of the worst possible ways to end the series.
Virtually none of what was promised transpired in that episode or most of any time in Season 2.
Many things in that episode just came out of left field for my tastes. It was rushed. Very, very rushed.
I just saw it again.
That ending doesn’t fit with practically anything we’ve seen in the two movies or this very show so far.
Did JF burn down too much of his barn in his efforts to wrap things up?
Now, if it’s just a season finale after all then it opens up a whole lot of nifty things as John tries to get back home and bring Cameron back.
What about the message “I’M IN HERE JOHN” if she was, which she WAS NOT. She is still IN THE CHIP with JH. How that has changed her is just a great story for season 3.
PS. Didn’t Camron have a spare chip that Sarah ended up destroying when she discovered it? Maybe she wanted to repair it and give it to JH, but because
Sarah destroyed it she had to give her own.
After seeing the finale just now (yeah thats what you get for living in EU) s3 seems even more unlikely to me
John being friends with JH and Weaver and trying to earn leadership among the resistance?
Sarah and Ellison raising Savannah up and fighting to delay the jday? (Im sure Savannah would’ve been someone important in the future)
Would this be any interesting?
Dont get me wrong I really liked the finale but it only seems like nice wrap up of the series. I dont really think theres nothing that exciting left in it, even tho they opened new questions for possible s3.
If you got to choose to remember the show for its amazing last few episodes in s2 or a crappy s3 what would that be?
Oh and if Sarah had made it to jday with her knowledge she would’ve ranked up in resistance fast, maybe even becoming a leader. She also would’ve told other ppl about John possibly being out there (although she didnt know which point of time was John going to end up in).
BUT
neither Derek or Kyle heard about John Connor so most likely Sarah didnt even make it to jday.
And last thing - if Derek didnt kill Jesse there are now 2 of them (as long as both made it throught jday) ._o
One’s older 30(?) years than the other, but still….
sNaKeBiTe: I agree as well. The display was only a message. We have to assume that Cams processor speed is beyond our understanding so she would have understood the system architecture of the Turk in microseconds and could have communicated if she had been there. She is still alive and well on her chip bet JH’s essence is also there as well so he could escape to the future.
wtf
3,56 Mio., A18-49: 1,3/5 omg -.-
From Recap: “Allison Young. The real human fighter Cameron the machine was modeled after. John can’t help but smile, before realizing the complicated nature of his new life… his new beginning… ”
ARRRGG!! How about realizing Allison IS NOT Cameron?!?! Obviously his future now is going to be something out of the world, but lets re-examine something. If John didn’t give a rat about Cameron, he wouldn’t of put her chip back in at the start of the season. If John didn’t care about Cameron, he would never have apologized to her as he did a couple times throughout the season. If John didn’t care about Cameron, he would not have lied for her and stuck up for her to his mother. And most of all, MOST OF ALL, if he didn’t care, he wouldn’t of jumped through time with a terminator he just met just to get her/her chip back. So why do you phrase it as such? It just..hurts the way thats put. You can say John doesn’t care, there is no bond between him and Cameron, etc etc, but this episode if no other example before it demonstrated just how much Cameron is worth to him and how much she means to him. So please….don’t put it in such a way as though it doesn’t exist when it blatantly for all the world to see that it does exist something between them.
There, I’m done about that. Just watched the episode again. Must say seeing it on my computer I notice things a heck of a lot more than I do on my T.V. I noticed John’s fallen face when he realizes Allison is not Cameron. I would of rather it had been more apparent, like a tear rolling down his cheek or something. Nonetheless, while the episode at the same time is very sad and has me all choked up and wanting to cry (I’m a guy…and I wanna cry over this…odd I know) , I am happy with it. Very happy with it. Because, in just a short bit, we saw just how much John feels for Cameron. If the writers see this, if I can’t beg you to bring Cameron & John back, then I beg you with all of my heart that somehow Cameron, wherever and whatever she is in, finds out that John came after her, straight into Hell (After J-Day), for her.
There is another possibility for why Derek didn’t acknowledge JC when they met. Being a soldier, he has just met up with a guy claiming the name of his leader. He may have been feigning a lack of knowledge until he had time to interrogate the new guy and figure out what he’s up to.
Exactly, they have to leave it flexible. That’s why I think Cameron and JH somehow jumped to the future together in JH’s body (Don’t ask me how, or why for that matter). If Cam would be in the server farm that would almost certainly be her death, because the Zeiracorp building (including the basement and Cameron) will be destroyed by Kalibra or maybe even a self detonation device (They can’t take the risk of letting a Timemachine, or even Cameron fall into the hands of Kalibra). The only way out of that situation would be, if John and JH would jump back through time right to the moment where he and Weaver just left and with a spare chip in their pocket. Possible, but unlikely…
If however JH and Cameron are alive together in the future (somehow, on 2 chips, maybe on one, whatever) the possibilities to bring her back would be redundant. Of course there is also the possibility that Josh Friedman hates Cameron, let’s her die and thinks that the fans will be happy, because they would still have their weekly dose of Summer Glau in form of Allison… Which would suck…
I also don’t think that Cameron wouldn’t be able to control the servers. In Vick’s Chip they planted her into the traffic system of a whole city and she was able to kill it in seconds. When the Turk only had control over the screens he was “just” a little Turk. Far from being a fully operational, self aware AI, like Cameron is.
Well, it sure looks like all that will be pure speculation. Things are not looking good. I can only say: No, FOX you can’t do this. You’re not doing the right thing, this is not the right thing FOX. Things are good now!
It’s possible that Cameron was the “other” leader against Skynet, but needed John Henry’s platform in this next time line to become even more than what she was?
Will Cameron now get a hankering for playing Dungeons and Dragons rather than chess?
Maybe John, once he finds John Henry, will have to find a way to separate the two entities (if Cam is still in there with The Turk’s programming).
Maybe a little of each unique personality rubs off on each other. John Henry gains from what he gleaned from Cameron’s experiences and she gains from his? John Henry sees, from Cameron’s love of John, a better outlook. And Cameron gains more curiosity and childlike wonder from John Henry? They’re both “softened” around the edges.
They both morph into much better AI’s than ever before?
And John downloads Cameron’s consciousness into a brand new and advanced shell.
This was a very beautiful episode. Many thanks to all those involved for treating the material with such care. I know Josh said that this was written as a season finale and not a series finale but if this is the end (and for the record I hope that it is not) it feels good.
I like the idea of setting John up in the future with Allison, Derek and Kyle but Sarah and Ellison in the past/present just makes me feel bored. I want her to stay in the show (she’s in the title!) but Ellison needs a swift kick of character (re)development to keep me interested.
I have to admit i almost cried at the end. The music was on point when he saw derek and kyle again wow wow wow what a finale
@Lauren,
John with Allison?? You’re kidding, right?
That would be a swift kick in the teeth to Cameron as a character.
@Shadower Darkslayer,
I like what you said. Why did John go out of his way to save Cameron and stick up for her all these times, only to dump her for Allison just because they look the same?
Why did he look disappointed that Allison was not Cameron, if not to say that he loves Cam and not her human doppelganger?
And the RCN? “Adios Growth.”
Yes, that’s right, the RCN wants Cameron to grow and still be around with John.
Loved the finale but I think FOX is NUTS if it cancels a great show like this when they have decided to play switcharoo on the night fans were used to watching it.
Why don’t they put some of those American Idol’s on Friday nights and move TSCC back to it’s regular night and see what happens.
There are too many good shows getting the ax for “Reality” tv.
Terminator is one of the best shows on TV with it’s wonderfully vivid world. To make a show look so much like a movie is great. I just hope they give TSCC and even another of my favorites Fringe more seasons.
@Lauren: Yeah, this thing with Sarah and Ellison staying in the past bothered me too.
I don’t get the last scene where this electric arc is and then we hear Sarah say “I love you, too”. Do you think she might have jumped to the future too? Maybe someone from the future, that we didn’t meet, told her to do so. Because I think that room in the last scene was the same where John and Weaver appeared, wasn’t it? How else could we hear Sarah’s voice there? I just don’t get it…. Somebody got a clue?
Holy Moley Crapoly! I did not expect that! Best episode ever! NEED SEASON 3!
Am I reading this right…TSCC has been canceled for over a month and the sets have been torn down???? Ya know, being that there is so much ‘garbage’ on TV (and has been for years), It is nauseating to me that a well written, dynamic show such as TSCC doesn’t draw enough viewers to make the ratings people happy (is this going to be another Star Trek situation, where people realize how great a show like this is AFTER it has been canceled). I hope I am hearing wrong and that there will be a 3rd season, but if TSCC is canceled, then it will just re-enforce my view that TV overall is going down the tubes quicker than anyone thought……
—-
Also i don’t think Cameron betrayed John. She probably had a set of orders from future John, and helping JH and Weaver might have been one of them. The whole thing may have been top secret just like on the Jimmy Carter, and that’s why she was hiding AI parts and doing research in the library, for JH’s eventual development. Now i’m not saying she imagined JH would end up in Cromartie’s body, ’cause she didn’t, but this would explain Jessie’s distrust for future John: John believes machines should fight machines. When Cameron heard Weaver’s message she went to carry out future John’s orders to help JH give them a fighting chance in the future.
—-
Some of the plots seem to finished ‘by force’:
-the evil T being destroyed by Weaver without any good fight.
-3 (was it 3?) episodes wasted for 3 dots just to have Sarah go like ‘OMG I TOLD YA DERE WAS SMTHIN ABOUT DOSE DOTS LOL!’ after she saw the turk
-drone crashing into Weavers office - I guess they put the scene there just to remind us about the whole drone thing, which again had 2(?) episodes wasted for and was completly irrelevant to the plot.
They could’ve had the evil T come inside the office at this point and show a good duel between him and Weaver instead of killing him earlier
They wasted a good part of the whole series on plots just to end them like they never where there.
be finished*
True. It did seem forced.
Please don’t cancel! Absolutely best episode this season but still lots of questions to be answered. We need a season 3!
Chloe O’Brian
your questions are valid, however, to someone who’s a “die hard” fan, who’s seen every episode from day one and who follows carefully, without losing focus for one reason or another, your questions simply can be answered if you had followed the story episode by episode.
I wonder, did John and the human Cameron fall in love in the future when she was running with her father Kyle Reese? and when she was kiiled as a human, perhaps they turned her into a Terminator Cyborg to be by John’s side to protect him. Perhaps?
I think, Weaver is an alien and basically humans have evolved so much in the future they create computers that can think for themselves and recreate themselves, or something. And the Aliens who Weaver works with want to destroy them for some reason, maybe they fear the earth made Cyborgs will conquer them?
Well, we now need a SEASON 3. And I have to say this, if Lena says no, you can still do a Season 3, kill Sarah Connor with cancer, and do “THE JOHN CONNOR CHRONICLES.” Yup. Sure it can be done. Tie it in with SALVATION, after you have carefully watched the film and taken notes… Oh, and by the way, kill Cameron/Allison, at least by the end of Season 3 if you can, I know there’s a lot of those fans of her, but really what other purpose does she serve now? A pointless TV-love interest? Come on. It can mean as much as Derek’s death, and Charley’s death. So can SARAH’s if you have to do that. The only character that can’t die is JOHN CONNOR. And please do not ever think of replacing Dekker for the role, he is perfect, and I don’t want to see any more new Connors besides him and Bale…
Weaver killing the terminator in the garage with such ease was great, it really showed us how powerful she really is. Great episode, very few shows reach this level of awesomeness!
TSCC has over 100k MORE completed torrent downloads than Ghost Whisper. Maybe if Fox understood what type of audience they had and how to reach them.. but no, we are stuck with moronic ‘leaders of the network’. Why does Fox enjoy their role, and being the running joke, about how they cancel good shows so much? Is that what they really want to be known so well for?
Shenanigans Padunkadunk, what in the world are you talking about?? First you tell someone they’re not following the plot, and then you say John created Cameron to replace his love Alison when we already know SkyNet created Cameron to infiltrate the Resistance HQ as Alison.
And aliens? What???
Why is it that we have people question all the story arcs in post after post and then try to cram their robot love fantasies down our throats. Give it a rest already. Can’t John be on a mission , much like Cameron was without you insisting again and again Every look and glance is an exchange of love? I am pretty sure that in the episode Cameron confessed that she will always want to kill John. Deep down inside.
Shenanigans Padunkadunk,
If you read official information by James Cameron, the T-100x liquid “metals” are living organisms and were too advanced for Skynet to control properly.
No aliens, just Skynet making too many damn singularities and that leads to its downfall.
And I think John IMHO isn’t going to fall for Allison. He wants Cameron, and I think he’s going to find with Allison that:
“Humans will disappoint you.”
I’d either make Allison someone who shows that Cameron is indeed special and she realizes that deep down John doesn’t love her, but loves Cameron or…
Turn this New Time Line Allison into a Gray or one of Jesse’s anti-metal crusaders. I think Jesse is still very much alive and kicking. An older Jesse pulling more evil strings, and the one we’ve always known.
What better way for her to try to subvert John’s love for Cameron, but with the very human that Cameron replaced? And like with Riley, this plot doesn’t work either.
Maybe once Cameron is separated from JH and put into a brand new, advanced body there is a final “confrontation” between Allison and Cameron Mark II.
And John chooses Cameron for a good reason.
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot. Where the hell did you come up with the alien theory from anything that has anything to do with the Terminator franchise. THIS IS NOT ABOUT ALIENS!!
@nutty: There is no way you can deny the emotional connection between JC and Cameron. You have to be blind, and deaf, to miss the myriad of references to it. Only a toaster could make such a mistake.
“notty22 April 11th, 2009 at 12:26 pm
Why is it that we have people question all the story arcs in post after post and then try to cram their robot love fantasies down our throats. Give it a rest already. Can’t John be on a mission , much like Cameron was without you insisting again and again Every look and glance is an exchange of love? I am pretty sure that in the episode Cameron confessed that she will always want to kill John. Deep down inside.”
Because there are a lot of disturbed people out there.
I mean am I the only retard here who is so lost right now?? I mean no one knows who John Connor is??
Will someone please explain to me what just happened??
I thought everyone knew who he is??
John Connor time traveled over J-Day, he has just arrived. Nobody knows him because he just got there. This is before the resistance is organized. There may be a resistance, probably pockets of resistance here and there, not a world wide organized resistance, mostly tunnel rats trying to stay away from the metal. If Kyle was captured in 2015, he would have been about 11 or 12, and then escaped in 2021. Alison was born ~2007-2008 so she would be a young teenager in 2021. I’m assuming John arrived at or after 2021, at least sometime before 2027 and skipped J-Day and his time in a Skynet work camp. Now he can start organizing the resistance and taking the fight to Skynet. That will make him famous.
How come Cameron knows who is JH and JH knows who is Cameron?
Cameron knows who JH is because he is the one who sent the box to JC in the future. JH knows who she is because he’s been watching her since the attack on Savannah Weaver and CW probably filled him in a little, also.
I was loving this episode sooo much up until the point when I realized Cameron is probably gone. Even if they bring it back for S3 I really doubt we’ll ever see Cameron because I doubt Summer will want to play the part of her, as well as Allison.
Saddens me. =(
Apparently I’m still not done talking about this episode…not by a long shot:
TTSCC - “Born to Run” Implications For Season 3
Born To Run was awesome.
I loved that check my nuclear power plant for leaks scene. Awkward but it got you thinking.
As for Dereck coming back that was a nice surprise.
I had been assuming there was more to that red head than met the eyes given that she kept the child alive. Now to find out that she may not have killed her human counterpart, is trying to help john is just more than I imagined.
Derek is back, Cameron is back, John is “trapped” in a future where he does not exist yet (never did?) and the T-3000 is good, thats just awesome.
The neilsen system is horribly flawed and not representitive of the fan base. That, and T:SCC has a larger fanbase outside the US than in.
It’s a pity that the neilsen ratings in the US are all that matters for renewal. =/
I still can’t get over the fact that John jumped through time to save Cameron. Just a beautiful moment!!
I think that’s what makes this show unique in that there is a potential cyborg/human relationship. And if there is a faction of machines willing to work with humans why not a cyborg/human couple. Plus this show makes you think and that ship would really make me think!!! Its not sick…its good, no great sci-fi!!!
And lets face it as a couple John and Cameron already would have a hard enough time trying to be together…and that’s what makes it interesting. So go for it!!! Yeah Jameron.
We better get a season 3 and I think John would only be in the future a handful of eps. He sees what J-day is all about. I think John will find it interesting to know Alison, to know about her (this makes it that Cameron does not have to explain who Alison is) When John hears her name he will put two and two together, but in the end she is not Cameron.
And when he goes back to his own time Alison would be a baby. Cameron, once her chip is back in her head would be Cameron.
And we know we need a terminator in the main cast so Cameron will be back!
But I wouldn’t mind a scene where Cameron and Alison would interact with each other!!!
And lets face it he jumps through time to save Cameron, not Alison!
I have also noticed that Cameron is referred to as Sarah’s daughter a number of times…now we just have to add that ‘in law’ to the end sentence!!
I love that we go back to so many things in season 1. The fact that Cameron wrote John a note.
I think once Cameron gets that confirmation who Weaver is she sets things in motion. I actually am starting to think Cameron’s power source was damaged. That is was not suppose to feel cold. Because once John checks (after the greatest scene ever) Cameron breaks Sarah out of jail and heads to Weavers.
By giving her chip to JH (I think Cam’s chip is in his head) doesn’t a T888 have a number of ports. I think she knew her body was destroyed and need to go to the future to get a new one! And maybe get that skynet programming out of her chip that wants to kill John.
And think about it this way if Cameron gets a endo then she has to learn its new quirks. I don’t want to see her turned into a liquid terminator but something stronger. New body, same chip. Cameron back in action!!
Hmmm could John take Derek with him to the past? I mean this would be a Derek who is different. One who does not worship JC.
And LOL to Mr. Murch!!
To repeat what Dan said Alison is not Cameron.
Just think of them as twins. Sure they look alike, might have some similarities but they are two different people.
And it looks like the silent girl (who’s name I can not remember at the moment) took over the family business.
LOL yes ground JC!!!
“John is thrown into The World of Oz and must get home again. He is now Dorothy in a weird and alternate realm.”
LOL Sorry Dan but I just pictured John in red ruby slippers there for a second. Sorry.
Come on season 3!!!
Yea all i have to say is, if this series cancellation is true, some people at fox are gonna have their hands full of shit when the fans of this show turn their cars over and set fire to them with them inside it… WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU CANCEL THIS SHOW! and if you say some bull about how it doesnt compete with ghost whisperer, then you are an idiot… they said the same thing about stargate SG-1, at how it wouldnt last 1 season, then they said it wouldnt last 2, then they got up to 8 and they said no it wouldnt last, and it made it to the 10th season… and look, now its the ultimate sci-fi show of all time besides star trek franchise. GIVE THIS SHOW A CHANCE, after the next season it will catch on alot more… dont let this be another firefly !
Just saw that TTSCC was completly downloaded 105075 times in the last 18h 22m . + 8K downloads in HD.
If all just paid 2 USD we could get the show like forever. Really don’t understand why no channel has made a international online “network” with just a few shows people paid to watch. It could totally work.
Sorry Jameron fans-a cold and ambiguous diagnostic is as close as the writers came to fulfilling your secret desires. If you redirect your sublimated passion toward a major appliance, you’ll find the experience ( I imagine) electrifying but unrequited. Come on…the Alison Young compromise is the only kosher solution, hence the German puppy seal of approval. Keep that taboo implicit-despite the hints in Vic’s Chip.
Logan-for some of us the end (possibly) of a series-for others the end of a way of life…what captive audience will DH control with his flights of musical fancy and impossibly suggestive Cameron scenarios?-Bon Chance-the future awaits.
Without a series, we’ll all have to stop meeting like this. I’ll miss it even when we disagree…substantially.
ps. it was just the downloads of EZTV.
Just one question …
Why did Cameron remove her chip and gave it to John Henry?
Thanks
@Kea,
John, the cross dressing Dorothy!
He has to hide from Skynet (who knows who he is) to get into the Terminator manufacturing plant, so he can rustle up a new and better body for Cameron… by dressing up as a lady! LOL!
Just kidding, of course.
Cue Aerosmith’s “Dude Looks Like A Lady.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qRTu5I2loY
–
John [to Cameron]: You are not going to tell my mom about this when we get home!!
Cameron [crossing her fingers behind her back]: My lips are sealed. Trust me.
3rd season please.
I really have to say the 2nd season was simply amazing. (I liked the 1st season too, but it lacked a lot of dynamics and plot twists and building that make the 2nd season) There is so much ground work for a 3rd to be spectacular, I don’t see how fox could possibly pass it up, especially with the movies about to launch which will be block busters.
I have to say the 2nd season has been the best thing I have watched in a long time.
AMAZING ENDING! AND WHAT A CLIFFHANGER!!! Hopefully u guys get a 3rd season. If not then please tell us what you were planning on doing for the 3rd season or where u were going with this.
I don’t understand why all the hostility to a JC/Cameron relationship. This isn’t the first time this has been explored in the Sci-Fi realm. If you’ll remember Brent Spinner had a few go rounds with a human counterpart as Data and there was an implied relationship with Mr. Universe in Serenity. And let’s not forget the Sci-Fi classic Cherry 2000.LOL
And the music at the end was beautiful with John seeing Derek again, Kyle for the first time then thinking he’s found Cameron, instead seeing her human double. Very moving piece of music.
Just one question …
Why did Cameron remove her chip and gave it to John Henry?
Thanks
So he could download himself to it and travel into the future to fight Skynet.
I don’t know, doesn’t make sense. Her task is to protect John, not to fight Skynet, judgement day is inevitable and one other thing is Cameron loves John, she wouldn’t leave him behind… Robots wants to survive, by removing her chip, she is no longer alive…
>> So he could download himself to it and travel into the future to fight Skynet.
CJ, in your write up why do you call Ellison a moral hypocrite?
EVERYONE PLEEEEEEEEEZE GO TO EONLINE.COM AND VOTE TO SAVE TSCC UNDER “SAVE ONE SHOW”. WE CANNOT LOSE THE BEST SHOW ON TV. WE CAN DO IT!!!!!!
Great season finale! Please give us a season 3 Fox! Pretty please with sugar and strawberries on the top!!!
Best regards
Mikael
Sweden
Oh my frakking gods!
THIS IS THE NEW BSG!
SEND A SEASON 1 & 2 DVD TO ALL YOUR BSG FRIENDS! LET’S RECRUIT THEM!
This episode alone leaps beyond everything that has come before in this show so far! [BSG SPOILER ALERT]
It is better than what they did in Season 3 of BSG.
What an uber-sick-awesome-kick-@ss mind frak! I literally gripped the side of my head with my two hands in a vice grip, going, “What the frak just happened?!!! I LOVE THIS SHOW!”
Frakkin’ Cameron how could you? And who is the one saying, “I’m sorry, John”? It has to be John Henry who now either has no body or has Cameron’s body. Sorry for not being able to stop Cameron.
So many questions: Why/When did Cameron turn against John Connor? And I guess the T1001 in the “Jimmy Carter” ep did finally decide to “join us.” It is now Catherine Weaver. But Cameron defected against the humans? OMG. So crazyily awesome!
THERE IS HOPE YET!
1. This means TSCC could exist as part of the same timeline as “Salvation”
which means it won’t be regarded as “non-canon” and therefore ignored by other T fans.
2. Derek is back!
3. BAG’s casting rumors don’t confirm the death of TSCC.
4. The sets being torn down at WB do not confirm the death of TSCC.
(Of course they had to tear the sets down: to make room for season 3 which takes place in the future!)
And now that John is w/ Allison we can have a real ’ship w/o the “ick” factor. Awesomeness!
OH MY FRAKKIN’ GODS THIS IS THE BEST FRAKKING SHOW ON EARTH!
I am standing and clapping and crying and screaming and in awe of the amazing SEASON finale of TSCC. Congratulations to the entire cast and crew for such an awesome product. I will buy this show on DVD and Bluray, and probably download it to my iPod as well. If it appears on another network, or at another day and time, I will follow it (It’s what he does, it’s all he does.) I hope that the “wizards of smart” at Fox will evaluate this show on its real impact, rather than the numbers which indicate how many mind numbed robots sat for an hour in front of the boob tube drooling at commercial breaks between schlock celebrities dancing and singing, or “reality” twaddle. The fifty year old model of television ratings is dead, and smart advertisers know it. Product placement and cross promotion, internet buzz, web downloads and DVD sales are where the real value of a TV production should be measured. With movies it’s easy to see what works - How many tickets did you sell? The screen writers and actors guilds are certainly aware of the new reality - their new contracts are very specific about being compensated for digital media distribution and (dare I say it) THE FUTURE of content distribution and marketing. As for those of us that DVR our favorite TV shows, I think it is foolish to expect us to watch the commercials when we have the ability to skip them. Besides, even though I DVR the show, it is only so I can watch it again after it initially airs. Does any reasonable person expect me to watch the damned commercials again? Note to the”wizards of smart”: I watch TV for the programs - not the frigging commercials. It’s time you buried Granddads Madison avenue advertising scheme for TV, and got plugged into the future, or your audiences (and revenue streams) will die off with your model. Wake up you Morons!
Keep TSCC and its hip fan base (which is growing, due to fans like me who have bought S1 DVDs for friends to get them hooked).
Thank you, thank you. This episode was brilliant. That was the show I love, and have watched and loved since the pilot. Every episode. This show, its writing, acting, and mythology are so strong I’d like to believe FOX couldn’t consider canceling it. So that’s what I will stubbornly keep believing because I don’t want to think that I might never know how the rest of this story goes.
@James,
She’s protecting John, by protecting JH.
Just as she can shut off and override what she was made to do… because deep down she loves Johnny boy.
Again, that’s the moral of The Tin-Man…
He had a heart all along.
@Snake,
They hate because they do not understand.
This was a great episode, just maybe not a great season finale. The writing was very good. The pacing was pretty fast, compared to what I had become used to, it was a marathon of info to keep track of. I had to watch it a few times to even know what to feel. The complications are endless, and the mind will be spinning on that for a good while.
That said, I wish they would have wrapped up the lingering questions a little better. Overall well done guys.
I always wanted season 3, a few episodes led me to question that, but with the mind games that were unleashed in this episode now I’m back to wanting season 3 like no other. Bring it on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hope I don’t repeat, too many posts to know for sure. It would be interesting to see
the two time lines play out in season 3. Sarah, and Ellison cleaning up the Zeria corp mess and going after the Coliba corp, While John Connor sorts out the future
scenario.
Looks like Cameron/Alison finally found the dog from “Run Joe Run” I always wondered what happened to it. Yuck Yuck… That’s a throw back
The real meaning of the three dots? Season 3? Keep the 3 red lights lit up!!!!!!!
@Snake,
“And now that John is w/ Allison we can have a real ’ship w/o the “ick” factor. Awesomeness!”
I rest my case.
“Frakkin’ Cameron how could you? And who is the one saying, “I’m sorry, John”? It has to be John Henry who now either has no body or has Cameron’s body. Sorry for not being able to stop Cameron.”
For the love of God man… you are worse than the guy who talked about aliens. I don’t know what show you were watching. Cameron didn’t betray, she obeyed top secret orders from future John, the same kind of top secret orders that weren’t carried out on the Jimmy Carter Submarine. Her mission along with protecting John most have been bringing JH into the future to give them a fighting chance. This would explain why she was collecting remnants of old T’s and why people in the future like Jessie distrust John: he believes machines should be fighting machines!
Dan: I guess they don’t support GAI marriage. GAI (Genetic-hybrid Artificial Intelligence)
OMG For now there are 666 comments
It’s the most comments note!
Is that the last post? I hope not :(.
PLEASE SAVE THE SHOW!
POLAND LOVES THIS SHOW!!!
Amazing amazing amazing. I want ten more years. The acting is the highest quality on TV and the story equally as awesome. This show is the best because the emotions built around and for the characters are unreal. I felt John’s happiness when he saw Cameron and his father. I can’t wait until the next season begins.
This was a great episode, and it would make a lot more sense if there was no T3, with an older John Pre-Judgment Day, where he starts to step up to the plate. This ending seems like it would be a perfect transition into Salvation but without another season, a lot of things won’t add up with the third movie. We need at least one more season to clear some things up!!!
How do y’all think they could tie that in (if we are blessed with season 3?
SEASON 3 needs to happen. Nothing left to say.
AfterJohn and Weaver leaped, will Sarah destroy the room? She said she will stop it… Will John come back?
@Kyle - largely for the same reason that Catherine called him out on his taking umbrage at viewing the jail’s spy cam. Ellison seems to think that since he’s a man of god that when he lies it’s not a lie but a method to an end. The thing is, it’s just a lie. The fact that he continues to lie while chastising others for their own malfeasance makes him a moral hypocrite.
CW has shown great restraint and patience when it comes to Ellison. You can bet Sarah wouldn’t have gotten nearly that much. First with the “I wasn’t talking to you” in Weaver’s office, followed by the very ominous “I’d watch who’s calling who a bitch.” I wouldn’t be surprised if Sarah got really close to seeing a cutting “criticism” at the next snipe.
BEST EPISODE EVER!!!
PLEASE, GIVE US A THIRD SEASON!
Snake adding onto your cyborg/human reatiohsip (besides Cameron and John) you can add Cleopatra 2525 to your list as well. It had a few references and goes at it. I am sure there are more examples but I’m a little tired this morning from all the online voting and posting about the ep!!!
Why did we hear Sarah Connor’s voice at the very end “I love you too”… (She couldn’t replied to John when they they were waiting for the elevator…I think that was nonsense…
@Priscilla,
That wasn’t Cameron, it was Allison. He saw her pet the dog, realized it wasn’t his Cambot, and he became sad. His face crumpled.
Again, folks, it isn’t Allison he wants.
Two questions for the fans:
1. Anyone know how we are doing on the Save One Show Percentage Campaign?
2. Going along with this theory of getting Cameron into a new body….what if lets say they give her a TX-body? TX..I think is the designation for the T3 Terminator that could generate weapons at will and control other terminators. Cameron walking around plasma blasting T-888s, setting them on fire, or cutting them in half sound pretty wicked to me.
RC: papers showdown
Must be a hint at a future movie in which paperwork will be in a brutal civil war and all will be lost…
This show was amazing, and i’m totally devastated that it may be cancelled!!! For such a great and a new show, why would fox destroy it and put it on Fridays!!!!! I’m so never deleting ut from my DVR!!!!
It can’t end this way!! SEASON 3 needs to happen!!!!!!
Couldn’t we at least have a quick pick at Cameron’s nipples !!!
Maybe season 3, huh 
@Darkslayer,
There is no T3.
Cameron should get a better, tougher, and less dense endo and skin design (and as I mentioned, as a side wink… a newer, better hair style and the ability to swim), but nothing too fancy.
John: Nothing is too good for her, but let’s keep the SFX budget down so WB doesn’t scream bloody murder.
LOL!
Best thing of the whole episode: Chola can talk!! LOL!!
[Just kidding
]
This episode was MEMORABLE.
The end of this season finale deserves a place of honour in the history of sci-fi TV series and sci-fi genre in general. A masterpiece, Josh.
You, Josh Friedman, your amazing crew and the wonderful cast of BRILLIANT actors you gathered are GENIUSES!!
Guys, THANK YOU.
I must confess, you made me cry like a baby with the final scene. Poor John lost in that alternate future and coming to realize that he’s not anymore the leader of mankind, having lost his mom and coming face to face with a Derek who didn’t know who he is and realizing that there, in that version of the future, he’s no-one. Then seeing his father, Kyle, just like his mother remembered him. Just a few seconds and so many strong emotions… and then, there was she: ALLISON YOUNG and the expression on John’s face when he realized that that was a human and not HIS Cameron.
The whole scene was SUPERB!! just like Sarah’s “I love you” at the very end with the light indicating another “energy bubble” has come.
There are so many exciting possibilities left open with this AMAZING season finale that I think that if Fox were to decide to cancel this masterpiece of sci-fi that would be REALLY stupid.
We NEED a third season!!!
Assuming that Cameron’s “personality” is still there, inside the Turk, I can imagine Sarah, Ellison and Mr. Murch trying to make Cameron operational again by connecting her body to the Turk and recieving new instructions from her and, eventually, some of them using the time-machine to go after John.
I can imagine Kyle telling John he’s been waiting for him all along, because his mother came to him and prepared him to be the leader of the resistance till her son’s arrival.
I can imagine Derek distrusting John and questioning his brother’s blind faith in this kinda Messiah that came out from no-where - And even Kyle’s eventual decision to transfer his command to John.
I can imagine Alison and John and the ghost of Cameron between them. Maybe more than the ghost of Cameron. Maybe Kyle or Derek.
I can imagine Jesse showing up again and instigating Derek to start a rebel faction.
I can imagine Lauren Fields helping John.
I can imagine Alison and a repaired Cameron face to face.
I can imagine Derek and Kyle’s reaction discovering John’s trying to make alliances with machines like Weaver and JH, and turning against John by believing he’s betrayed them and Alison being the only one who believes him (or not).
I can imagine Sarah’s return (and redemption) working along with Ellison, Murch and a possible reactivated (but limited by being plugged to the Turk) Cameron - And I can imagine them teaming up with Danny, Miles Dyson’s son grown up and prepared to fight the machines.
I can imagine so many exciting things only YOU can make possible.
Thank you so much agan, guys. Josh, Natalie, Tony, all the writers, producers, technicians, digital/make-up artists, all the team, and thank you so much Thomas Dekker, Lena Headey, BAG, Richard T., Mackenzie Smith, Garret Dillahunt, Shirley Manson and especially SUMMER GLAU!! - I LOVE YOU, SUMMER!!!
I’ll be praying for this is not a goodbye but like Cameron said in spanish, “Hasta luego”, because we’ll be back for a 3rd season!!!! I’m not asking you, guys: THIS SHOW MUST COME BACK!!
@James,
It’ll only happen in your dreams, buddy, or on HBO. LOL!
Summer ain’t gonna do it. She’s too classy.
http://digg.com/television/Summer_Glau_Sex_Scene_TSCC_2×22
Please digg thanks!
@ James:
I wouldn’t want to see Summer do any scenes more suggestive than this last one. One of the things that is so great about her is that she isn’t like so many other celebrities who go around flashing the cameras and acting like spoiled brats. Summer is a class act and she is worthy of being respected. It makes her that much more special and interesting.
Uh Oh, I’m starting to think like Dan. I promise I won’t post any lyrics.LOL
By the way Dan you never commented about the score in the T4 trailer. It was outstanding.
Dan Hitchman,
Summer Glau would be good, maybe I can send you pics : )
Then I am moving to Hollywood, maybe I can catch her drunk at a bar, it’s worth a shot. If they won’t let me in, then maybe drunk at the exit of bar
Really James you shouldn’t project your lack of morals on her. She’s never done anything to suggest she acts like that. That’s why so many people love her. Sluts are a dime a dozen in Hollywood. Summer is a cut above the rest of them.
Snake,
I’ll have to watch it again and listen closely.
It’s possible it’s a temp track. They do that a lot for trailers.
i hope the series dosnt end like this, i’m a pretty big fan of the show.
Here’s a link Dan.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owrEMGg4×3M
All I gotta say is there better be a season three. The finale was great, best ep there ever was in the show, well maybe second best but I digress. My head will explode if there isn’t a Season 3. Thers’s far too much story left to tell to leave us hanging. Fox I know your reading this so c’mon just do it.
All of you must see the first season again!!!…season 2 explain how skynet is build by Cameron Oo…she whas lie at the begining, this terminator universe is her…maybe season 3 will focus around shes malefic ideea :D…end whit will.
C. Weaver will again help Jhon destroy every bad thing, because cameron will end knowing she need a true heart end she can make’it.
S3 will be focus after Terminator4 (Cameron fake life), this is just in my mind :S
p.s. must see s01e01 / s01e05, 06
Sorry for my bad english, i’m form romania end i love the show how whas think
For me, the most dramatic part of the finale is where John sees Allison and first thinks it’s Cameron but then he sees the dog and realizes it can’t be Cameron because dogs hate metal. The long slow closeup on his face was intended to show his reaction as he realizes all this and puts it together with the fact that John Henry probably erased Cameron forever when he overwrote her chip with his programming. And I think John was about to cry when he understood that Cameron is really dead.
Here’s something to think about, Emily Gage is flawless. Does anyone remember how that fit into the story?
Ignore James, guys. This boy just want to call peoples attention. Probably his parents ignored him when he was a child and his mind never grown old. Poor soul…
Nine Inch Nails’: “The Day The World Went Away” the Terminator Remix (originally released on a 1999 album of theirs)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOwbt2eSJAs
Great f–kin’ song!
I just hope McG doesn’t screw this up!
Furthermore, @James and all others who share his philosophy, Summer proves to us all that you don’t have to be some Hollywood bimbo with a big rack to be one of the most beautiful & respected actresses out there.
Here’s a John and Cameron-esque song that I love:
Evanescence: “Taking Over Me”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBWDMfUV9OM
“I believe in you. I’ll give up everything just to find you. I have to be with you. To live, to breathe… you’re taking over me!”
The music played at the very end of finale is ‘Derek Resse’ you can find it on the TSCC soundtrack (and youtube ofc lol). My fav part of the whole CD.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luoBgegT3k4
I really hope that there is a season 3!!!
Honestly, this is my top favorite show!
Maybe Cameron just needed a new body because hers had been almost destroyed and JH’s body was in perfect shape. Wouldn’t putting her chip in his body make her become him? All of JH was left behind because all his chip was the cables going into the back of his head. She puts in her chip and now she is still herself, but a new body, unfortunately.
It’s the ONLY show I ever watch!!! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE don’t cancel it Fox!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luoBgegT3k4
The best music i ever heard from a show!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I NEED THE SOUNDTRACK!!!!!!!!!
Regardless if FOX has not given the axe to TSCC officially it sure seemed like it did unofficially.
ABC did the same thing with “Life on Mars” where they ADVERTISED it was a season finale and then later it turned into a series finale.
They cut the head off of venus de milo and created an end that was short and sour seeming to ellude, confuse, frustrate and dilute the story if it does comeback which most likely it won’t.
This is due to time, ratings, money constraints(probably ad revenue) and dumb executives who do not connect with the people who watch their show(s).
It is not worth giving the benefit of the doubt to FOX executives that the show is coming back.
The show essentially ended in a form which one can conclude this is where Terminator One originated from and then he sends his dad back to the past and begins the cycle again so John Connor can exist to stop the machines while he persists in the future which is why in the scenes from the future you never see John Connor because he is a kid and it would have ruined the show.
They did tie the show up in a bow but we the fans are dissapointed with the packaging.
to add-Yahoo wrote an article indicating TSCC will most likely be axed, they released the article the same day as the last show.
Ok I’m understanding the whole puzzle a little better now.
I just woke up, and guess what, i had a dream about Cameron (my dreams are always the most random and are never about things i’ve seen or things that are current - so that was weird)!! It was John carrying her lifeless body around trying to find a place to keep her..
As far as the show was concerned, the only reason i watched was CAMERON. My brother had to persuade me for months.. I refused to waste my time with it because i’m generally very busy and I just felt like nobody could carry a Terminator related project like Arnie.
But as soon as i saw Cameron on the screen there was something sooo intriguing about her that made me want to know more..
So ultimately, the only reason I watched it every week was to see CAMERON improve, learn, develop…. Everything else felt like a sub-plot. I found myself going back and re-playing the few lines she had in most of season 2.
I felt like her character was stagnant, if not actually going backwards from what she was in Season 1 at John’s school.
Her look was very unique and her mannerisms just drew you in..
I completely didn’t care AT ALL about Riley, i hated Jesse,, nobody compared to Cameron. I think she completely carried the show and for a billion reasons she is my favourite Terminator!
I don’t know if others felt the same, but some may have..
I think that, along with Chloe O’Brian (24), Cameron is one of the best written and performed characters in the history of TV.
I just wanted to get that off my chest and move on with the day.. actually get some work done
I leave you with this:
I LOVE CAMERON!!!
*Oh and I do have to say that Shirley Manson was phenomenal as CW! Well done.
hi,
awsome final , loved it …. please let there be light in fox’s head … and let a 3′rd season be !!!!!!
so we can continu the saga from the great mind of Josh Friedman ……
please we want a 3′rd season ……..
jimbo
This is a great show, I really enjoyed watching it and hope it will return for a 3rd season! Besides Family Guy, this is the only show on FOX that I look foward to viewing on tv.
Chloe: I agree 100%. The other characters support Cameron. She was the reason I tuned in and the lack of her was the reason many tuned out. Summer has rivaled Arnie and has become as much an Icon in the Terminator parlance as anyone else. She has done an incredible job.
Okay, here is your next clue: 236
The question, who is Emilt Gage?
That’s Emily Gage.
Terminator Blog just ripped into Josh for the finale.
http://www.terminatorblog.com/Blogs/tabid/55/Default.aspx
Though, I won’t get into the name calling as Mike does… he does call out some pretty fair points of contention with the series’ direction and what the season finale left us with.
yeah,it was already the resistance.
they had army jackets with their names on them,military weapons,and dogs for “sniffin out metal”.
and it said in the movies that humanity was scattered bands of huddled survivors,the human race on it’s way to extinction,until JC organised them into the resistance force they became.
as opposed to there already being an organised resistance in play for JC to rise up the ranks and take charge of.
If a Cameron-model Terminator ambushes JC and company in S3, he could use the watch to detonate that one, couldn’t he? That would instantly make him a legend among the Resistance.
One really cool and fucked up dynamic might be John having to pull a King David on his own dad. If Kyle is currently with Allison, John would need to split them apart somehow just to make sure he’s born…
@Chris,
I don’t think Josh liked John very much, and maybe, sadly, even Cameron. He was so obsessed with Sarah… to the show’s detriment.
The writing of said characters sure seems to explain a lot. They were sometimes horribly abused as characters.
Even Sarah.
I just want to see a Season 3 for Cameron’s (and Summer’s) sake and see if JF can untangle the mess that has made with the story and plots and whether he’ll stop being so clever and vague to the point where viewers may actually stop and wonder if he knew the game plan to begin with or wasn’t just hunting around as he went along.
thanks to all of you for making tscc happen! love you guys!
i pray that someone makes josh read that terminatorblog review posted above.
“it is unlikely we will ever know the reason why or what this show was ever trying to accomplish”
please remember that phrase when/if you sit down to write your next script.
Chris,
in the U.S. anybody can wear camouflage clothing (army surplus) and there’s likely soldiers who survived. As for weapons, besides those that are already stashed here and there, it is logical to believe that caches and depots have been raided right after the initial wave of attacks.
That’s pretty much how it happened in Irak and no one could have prevented it. Metal isn’t perfect.
Oh, also I see no names on the uniforms and on Kyle coat, which John is wearing, there is a badge which reads “Umpire”. I don’t think that this is a resistance rank designed to confound Skynet.
Mr Josh Friedman, Sir. You are truly a bastard of long and refined breeding. I truly would like to add magnificent to that and your last 6 episodes truly deserve this attribute but seeing that we will maybe (probably) left hanging with an cruel and unusual amount of open questions I hesitate to do so.
To summarize get as third season right fucking now. I don’t care what you have to do kidnap someone, steal, lie, rise your banners in bloody revolution - just get a fricking move on. I will be right behind you.
You guys are looking for a good duel between a t-888 and t-1001? Uncle Bob got destroyed during fisticuffs fights in T2. The only reason why the t-1000 was ever defeated was due to environmental factors such as liquid nitrogen or molten steel. It was fitting how easily an “unlocked” t-1001 capable of ingenious battle styles could overpower a simply t-888.
My one complaint about combat scenes thus far is..lack of exploding 18 wheelers found in all terminator movies. But it makes sense cus of production costs I guess.
Just a quick note to say thanks for an awesome finale and a brilliant series! Doubt it will be back after the death of Derek and that finale, but I loved it. Lena rocks!
i loved it i really hope there is a season 3
please bring the show back. Give us a third season, don’t be assholes.
I have never written on a forum before, but I had to add my voice. Please bring back SCC. I love this show and watch it with all my friends. The writing is SOOOO good. Thank you for giving us such a great finale. And if the series does return, please bring back Jesse and Derek. John Henry is a better terminator than Arnie.
PLEASE BRING THE SHOW BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I hope everyone is writing Fox. I did.
@ Dan Hitchman, Snake
I rewatched the ep. Didn’t catch that line about Cameron giving her chip to JH when i saw the ep the first time. Thank gods. Cameron is not evil.
The Jameron scenes are the most compelling. Precisely because of the “ick” factor. (IMHO.) But if they ever get into some kind of romantic relationship it will be the death of the show. Without the tension it will die. The creators of SMALLVILLE had sword that Lana and Clark would never get together for this precise reason. But in season 2 they broke that and the show went south ever since then.
@ I am Arnold
The mention of the Grays does not refer to aliens. There was an ep where they talked about humans who were helping SkyNet do research on humans. These humans were called Grays by Jesse.
THERE HAS TO BE A THIRD! Summer getting to play Allison, John not being the messiah, BAG, and Sarah on her own with Ellison! Season Three is gonna be fantastic! Truthfully the best season finale of all time!
I’m not sure what to make of this last episode. I’m hoping they give us some kind of wrap up/what the writers were trying to accomplish. Entertaining show though regardless.
That was a great episode. I really hope Fox will give this show a another chance with season three.
I’m still uncharacteristically giddy about the season finale. I was explaining to my family the various story and character possibilities that it opened up. I think I rambled on for a couple of hours more-or-less without a break.
I cut my screenwriting chops many years ago. After a while, you’ve seen the plots and stories and you realize that it’s all about characters and how the affect and effect one another (sometimes with a little push from plot). You get jaded. There’s a lot of been-there-done that in any genre. For the first time in a very long time, JF managed to get my giddy up (did I actually say that?).
In the course of that session with my family I delivered at least a half-season worth of possibilities and I only stopped because my throat was starting to tire and dinner needed to be begun. I could have gone on for hours more, otherwise. As a writer, this finale let the television world of terminator blossom into a mature and inviting flower.
What does that mean? I means that FOX (or other interested parties) have just exposed the mother lode from the terminator mine, now all they have to do is extract it. It also means that even if I have to do it alone in fanfic, this isn’t going to be the end of the story (in terms of serious-minded story telling).
(V.O.): The ancient Greeks tell the tale of a curse the Gods gave to man as punishment for their acceptance of secret of fire. This gift, woman, in turn received seductive gifts from the Gods. The woman opened one, a jar, and released all the evils of mankind before she was able to seal the jar again. Only one item remained. Since then, mankind has always known that however challenging the whims of the universe make life, there is still the content of that ancient jar to draw from for defense: hope.
I’m hopeful for an other season (or more). I’m hopeful that there are many stories to tell, and that the SCC team writes good ones.
Amazing!!! It’s like watching a movie every Friday. If Fox hadn’t put it in such a shitty timeslot, we wouldn’t be having to fight to sav e it right now. PLEASE let there be another season!
I like people that post their uninformed opinions and cry about the finale. Let me help Mike out since he doesn’t seem to want people to be able to comment on his thoughts.
Jesse vs Cameron.. Cameron sent Jesse on the mission in secret to as the Liquid Metal to join the Resistance. Liquid says no. Jesse loses her child. Hates Cameron. Jesse should have been the one that killed the guy in the parking lot, not Weaver; saving John and saying she would see him on the other side of J-Day.
Weaver backstory.. yeah, she was the Liquid Metal on the sub; “Will you join us?” Same message that was told to Cameron; who ordered the Jimmy Carter’s mission to begin with. That’s why Cameron tells Ellison he’s said enough already.
I could go on and on explaining things to you; that you failed to grasp, but why bother.. who are you? No one. Well, someone that writes a blog that doesn’t allow comments. Props. What would the world do without important people that can’t create content; just criticize it. /yawn Don’t worry, will never go back to your blog, and never knew about it til linked in this thread; so enjoy your one day of higher web traffic putz.
@R.
That’s not where the tension should lie IMHO. They need to get over their “little doe eyed” will they/won’t they phase and once the love is cemented…
It’s what the ramifications mean to everyone else that is the juicy stuff.
Some people say “ick” some people (I’d say the majority) see possibilities in the exploration of what their love means to others. That would play into the story beautifully.
The supposed leader of the humans (a Messiah-like figure to many in the camps) and a cyborg (the “enemy”) are companions, are in love? Heady stuff! It’s an impossible to fathom romance, but here they are… now deal with it.
It’s like the ruckus surrounding Jesus and Mary Magdalen (as I’ve mentioned before), though not at that controversial historical and religious level, of course.
They would move Heaven and Earth and Time Itself for each other, if they could. Why?
What makes a machine any different from a human… what if a machine became like us?
This was asked in “The Demon Hand,” but never really explored in any great detail.
It could be one of the new, great love affairs (fit for the 21st Century) for the Cinematic Ages: John and Cameron. Taking the ranks of Sarah and Kyle in “The Terminator.”
Now here’s Allison, who looks and sounds just like Cameron… and yet, why does John choose Cameron over her?
There is a difference, and John sees it where others cannot or are fearful to tread.
Because the answers may shock you. Cameron, though she’s metal, is something special.
Powerful because you begin to question man’s role in the scheme of things? Can he move to the side and let another species have an equal playing field?
Can both species evolve to do great and wonderful things for the planet?
Build it up rather than burn it down?
ok sure,but we know that derrick and kyle where just normal boys playing in the park when judgement day came and a little bit of them running around tunnels for a bit.they werent already soldiers.
plus these people john runs into already have the term “metal” for their enemy,and know that dogs can detect them.and since they have dogs to detect and weapons to fight the metal they are of the organised resistance.
11/10
I was thinking, maybe this whole thing was a trick to get john to follow Cameron into the future (kind of like Jesse’s plan with Riley, keeping him away from machines), leading to no John Conner to actually lead the resistance, i mean he’s there, but now just some kid no one has ever heard of. His decision to take that time portal with Weaver seemed to be based on his desire to find Cameron again, i’m still kind of shocked that Sara would just let that happen?? That would be an interesting way to keep the story going. Any one else think that’s plausible?
@ Dan - wow, nicely said, come on Season 3!
I remember the first time I had my heart torn apart by a TV series was in the late 1970’s after the conclusion of Rich Man, Poor Man (it was a mini-series) but then again by RMPM season 2 (it was actually season one since the first was a mini-series).
Regardless those characters were like friends to me and so it is with the Terminator series. Charlie, Derek, Riley, and now Cameron were gone but now there is hope for all the characters (except maybe Charlie).
Here’s to season three.
Why not have it just like I stated:
John is trapped in an alternate reality created by the fact that he wasn’t in the present and wasn’t there to help at a critical juncture…
Maybe he could have even stopped JD.
He gets to realize first hand the horrors of JD and he is highly motivated by this to get back to the present and correct what has gone horribly wrong.
Again, just like “It’s A Wonderful Life.” John sees that one man and one female cyborg can make a difference, perhaps all the difference in the world.
They thought they were insignificant, they were wrong.
And John is spurred on to find JH… get Cameron’s “soul,” get her a new body, and get back to the past PRONTO.
This is not where he and Cam need to be. He lost out on so much by bypassing his life, and she did too. There’s so much growth left to go through.
And Cameron, maybe, turns to John [after being placed in a new body] while looking out over the desolation of post JD’s wasteland together (they are standing closer to each other than ever before).
Cameron: I hate this place.
John turns quizzically to stare at Cameron.
Cameron: There are no birds.
Is it just me or are there others disappointed by this final episode?
There are several things i don’t really get.
First, what was the point in making Cameron undress? The whole shielded nuclear power source thing seemed so set up, why didn’t she just reply to John accusations, “Hey John, i’m from the future, i know she dies of cancer, even without someone of us being around” ?
Second, the Catherine Weaver Shield, as far as i can remember, Liquid Metal isn’t rock solid, at least it wasn’t in T2, despite the scene where the T1k was frozen.
It just looked ridiculous, and the SFX cheap.
Third, where did the Latina Gangster Lady, i forgot her name Chu..something, came from? I don’t see the Connection between her and neither the priest nor Sarah.
4th, so whole timetravel thing, not that i can’t get my head around timetravel, but using it inflationary just looks like you can’t write. And if you can’t get the story, where you want it to, you let them travel forth and back in time.
Now, why did John Henry Travel forth in time? He was save in the present, no war, no machine eating humans and he was with the almighty Catherine Weaver Shield. Why not waiting, and preparing more, by playing d&d?
Even if there was the slightest chance TSCC would’ve been renewed, I’m not quite sure whether it would be worth watching.
I really liked the Cameron-Derek-Situation, and both are gone, first Derek, in a way, i’m not quite “”satisfied”" with, when it comes to killing John Connor they always hesitate a second to allow John, to get away, but this time, the 888 just walks by and shots Derek in the head, and you think, “Wow, how stupid was that?”. Okay, you could argue it shows how volatile human life is, but then, why killing him, wehn you bring him back, by traveling into the future.
And now Cameron is gone, her Body is for sure, and i’d imagine so is she. As Mr. Murch states, the entity, known to us, persists of the Body and the Soul.
Not that i don’t like the idea of seeing Summer Glau in the role of a normal human being, fighting against machines, okay, maybe not as normal as you and me, but still, no psychic and no machine.
But Cameron was the main reason for me and i guess some others, to tune in, watching her development, her interaction with humans and getting to know more about her was the juice of the show.
But that’s all gone, if she’s still there, she aint in her body, and even worse, there, where (when) she has gone, are no normal humans. Only badass Resistance Fighters hating machines, not that i’d blame them for.
It just seems to me like Josh said “Come on guys its Series Final, we need lots of Explosions, Gun Fights, Special Effects, loud Musik and Summer please get your Shirt off.”
Honestly, if there’d be a 3rd Season, the first episode should start with the 2nd Half of Season 2 just being a bad dream of CAMERON!
-
No, english isn’t my mothertongue.
“If a Cameron-model Terminator ambushes JC and company in S3, he could use the watch to detonate that one, couldn’t he? That would instantly make him a legend among the Resistance.”
Yes, you can clearly see John stuffing the watch inside himself before he travels through time, just like Christopher Walken in Pulp Fiction.
i loved this show
i loved this sesson final put i still love this show
wow you guys know that feeling when you just finished watching the most epic show ever.. like butterflies in you stomach and you just gotta contact your friends that watch the show to to talk about 1 episode for about 4 hrs?
then it pisses you off because fox is going to cancel the best Freaking show they have had in years?
i so feel that way… /sigh im going to watch CW if they cancel this show.
Comments from news media who think the show will be axed is still pure speculation. We really do not know until we hear something from an official source.
Don’t forget to copy and paste this everywhere:
http://digg.com/television/Summer_Glau_Plays_With_Knives_A_Lot
http://digg.com/television/Summer_Glau_Sex_Scene_TSCC_2×22
Wow are there alot of comments going on here… this finale has definitely generated alot of buzz. Personally I thought it was brilliant. I knew they would bring back Derek somehow… I had my own theory which I discussed in another one of the blog entries on this site. It seems as if part of Weaver was the “eel” that confronted Jesse with the message for JC in “Today Is The Day.” So if the answer was no then, the answer is still no now. Weaver’s “eel” also piloted the H-K straight into ZeiraCorp. Weaver was covering for herself so she could trick the Connors into believing she can help them. John Henry is not the same when the hardware is moved according to Murch… the hardware has been moved. Cameron was glitchy again, far from 100 percent as she pointed out toward the end of the episode. She let John Henry take her chip so he could evolve into Skynet… that’s why the message is flashing for John right before Weaver lures him into traveling to the future to save Cameron. To quote Sarah, “You lying Terminator bitch.” Josh Friedman’s script was great, but he broke his record of never mentioning the word “Terminator” in any of the scripts with this fantastic season 2 finale. Fox simply cannot cancel this mindblowing series.
No Fate.
The eel, wasn’t piloting the HK it was in the fish tank in the office and then fell to the floor when the HK smashed through the window breaking the fish tank.
did anyone remember that there was this interview by Garrett and Richard T.Jones where they commented that John Henry would run away and experience his first fight? Seems that they took that story out. Sorry, I couldn’t find the actual link to back my statement up. I really hope this show gets a season 3 =)
I don’t normally get so involved (ok never) in a show that I comment on a blog for it or spend so much time discussing it among my friends as I have over the last few weeks… I want to thank the actors, writers and producers, crew everyone involved for that you have all done such an amazing job.
So my take: in samson and delilah, cameron says to john “you shouldn’t have done that, they won’t understand”… “not them” referring to sarah and derek with the jesse/riley subplot its clear that there is a growing faction in the future of humans who distrust john because of his affinity for the machines.
I think the bed scene in the finale was Cameron’s attempt to manipulate john: a beautiful body in an intimate situation … being cut into and examined from the inside in an attempt to force john to realize that she is in fact a machine I think it could go to ways possibly to lessen the betrayal that she knew she was going to perpetrate, or possibly to further johns machine sympathies. So regarding this betrayal has anyone else noticed the reaction cameron has when a fellow terminator has been terminated e.g. cromartie in mexico, cameron looks horrified so I am wondering if the betrayal is caused by an instinct to save her own kind by helping JH.
This then I think ties into what’s happening with CW and JH a faction of the machines realizes (or knows thanks to all the time travel) that john connor will eventually lead the humans to victory over the machines and their extinction, so they are aiming for a truce (witness sarah monologue from first season expounding on the differences between chess and war), skynet and JC are playing chess and in the end one wins but at great cost to both sides, this faction attempts to create an AI that is more human then skynet (the unpredictability of the turk) and the mirror on the human side is cameron to change johns mind.
we only have all this wild speculation and guesswork because the characters motivations were left so in the dark.
I love that John has ended up in the future with his family and a chance to really prove himself, but did he really go there because of Cameron? It’s a little dependent/ pathetic of him to go through all of that trouble just to track down what is essentially his favorite shotgun. Don’t get me wrong, I love the show- I just find it silly to glorify a machine like that.
this means riley could be back and jesse
All theories with Cameron and Weaver tricking John falter when one observes that either of them could have easily killed both John and Sarah at any point in the series. If they are working for SkyNet, why send him to the future and risk having him connect with the Resistance, as he did, instead of just taking him out ONCE AND FOR ALL. That is, after all, the whole point of the movies. It makes more sense that John was taken to the future in order for Kaliba to lose his trail than anything else. BUT it is precisely because of these doubts we’re having that Season 3 is NECESSARY.
Wow. FOX, please don’t cancel this show!
I thought the series was satisfying but also frustrating (with the thought that we may not get a 3rd season).
Weaver could certainly have been tricking John so that there would be no John Connor in the future, but why not just kill him? That would be more effective.
No, Weaver represents a new brand of Terminators. But I have several questions about Cameron and John Henry. How is John Henry separated from the Turk? Is he using Cameron’s chip? Then it’s not John Henry anymore. How would John Henry carry her chip in his hand since metal doesn’t go through the transporter?
Also, how is the next season going to be structured? Is it going to alternate between Sarah’s present and John’s future, or is it just John? It is the Sarah Connor Chronicles after all.
I am university teacher in one of the famous polish law schools. I love Terminator series since i was a boy, and I must say : Brilliant show! Its a masterpiece. its even better then original terminator 1-2 movie , not to mention T3. Its also my students opinion. This show is very popular in Poland.
I am only afraid if it is too smart, intelligent for many people … Money rules the world .. sad ..
What was Cameron’s motivations to
ABANDON
John Connor. She scrapped her other mission goals and in a symbolic act gave her chip to JH. Was this a act of love? Had they communicated over the internet on matchmaker.com ? I am sick of the projecting from fans with the knife scene, didn’t John Henry and Cameron share just as equal a special moment.
The last episode was simply magnificent! Please, keep this show on the air!!!!
I love Summer Glau and TSCC! Sending John to the future throws a wrench into the whole timeline. I’m really disappointed that we won’t see the character Cameron for the new season but Summer Glau will be around. These are good shows that need to be on television!
We need a Season 3!
This show just keeps getting better.
LISTEN UP FOX EXECUTIVES:
This show has real staying power. There is a very loyal following. It could stay on the air for years and none of us fans would be bored.
Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles is an advertising goldmine.
Series 3 Please, Many thanks from the UK
I don’t think there can be a third season, as the series is called Sarah Connor Chronicles and Sarah is no longer with John. But there could be a new series, like “Connor’s wars” or something like that, starting where this one ended.
Anyway, please vote in http://www.eonline.com to save TSCC or to let them know that we will keep watching terminators.
Cable’s getting cancelled if it’s not back. Seriously. 700 + comments - Fox, does that tell you nothing?
My god…just see the finale
i’m shocked. Really. This was incredible….
now it’s too late to realize…Cam’s sacrifice (?), JH disappearing, Kyle, Derek, Allison on the scene (but it was predictable, as every change in the past can alterate and generate s multiple futures) !
A lot of questions ! So much confusion….i’m really shocked now.
Best show ever…
Guyz, what a finale !! Thanx Mr.Friedman, thanx for all, now we have to concentrate ourself on Season 3 !!!
FOOOX and WARNER BROS !!!!!
I write from italy, give me and my friends more of this !
Tomorrow for more comments !!!
This is nearly 800 comments in only 24 hours since the airing of the finale. Over the course of the week there better be thousands!
S-E-A-S-O-N I I I
I just love this show. It also had the best kind cliffhanger i’ve ever seen, not one that leaves insanely irritating questions, but insanely awesome possibilities. As others have said, i’ve seen plenty of shows come and go before their time, but this is the only one i’ve fought for. It is the only TV show that i watch and i’ve watched every premiere since the S1 (except for last night when FOX fucked up and gave damn weather reports for the the first 30 minutes). Please dear God bring back this show! It doesn’t even have to be a full season, just enough for some genuine closure.
“The eel, wasn’t piloting the HK it was in the fish tank in the office and then fell to the floor when the HK smashed through the window breaking the fish tank.”
I can’t believe I didn’t catch that. I think I was still reeling from seeing Chola again.
This is the best TV show I have ever seen…I tell people about it all the time. I hope for the life of me that there is more to come; regardless, thank you for the stories.
I think forging the alliance with John Henry was Cameron’s mission from the beginning.
This is by far the best show on tv, never mind fox. if fox doesn’t renew it then i will stop watching any fox shows–including 24.
but i hope if fox doesn’t renew that scifi network will take it over. i’m sure it could easily do as well as battlestar did. or even premium cable like showtime or hbo. it would work even better as a rated r series…
let’s hope someone has the good sense not to let it die. either way, great job, cast and crew!
@Dan - mainly, seriously what is it and your robot fetishes. Yeah i loved the whole romantic thing going on with cameron and john. But it would never happen. That line should never be crossed.
I am really looking forward to John having a real relationship with allison. This is why Cameron took Allison captive because she was his spouse and camerons mission was to KILL John as she has said many times. Also this could be the reason why John sent cameron back to the past, to help him out and that he couldnt bear being round cameron and is alone all the time.
i think season three has a lot of potential and you know i dont think i would want John to find a way back to the past. Why would he go back, when he has a job to do. Maybe this is how John survives JD in this time line.
You all have to remember, This TV series totally throws away T3 and T4 for good reason. They are movies and they tell their own story, They will never intermingle.
They do not really need to either since Time Travel is involved and things have happened to change the future already. Mainly them jumping eight years.
JOSH you have done a fantastic job throughout this whole season and i really wish i could shake your hand and tell you in person. Looking forward to Season 3. Fingers Crossed.
starkiller,
I agree, i think it was one of her primary objectives and i think the order came down from future John himself.
And i don’t care what anyone says, there should def. be a romance between John and Cameron. That’s what makes the show unique. That’s what drove Jessie crazy. That’s what intrigues us all.
The eel was definitely not piloting the attack vehicle. I think what people are missing that is significant is that the eel and Catherine Weaver were able to exist separately and simultaneously. Rather than the eel morphing back into the shape of CW, the eel ENTERED the body of CW. Big difference, and again, I believe it goes back tot he human/machine hybrid direction that the franchise is heading. Perhaps this actually IS Catherine Weaver’s body.
I was so said when I saw it was allison and not camren
Amazing season finale.
The last 10 minutes were just astonishing.
Thank you guys for everything. Producers, directors, writers, cast and crew, thank for all.
There’s no fate but what we make.
Let’s send e-mails, do campaigns, and get a third season.
I BELIEVE.
I pray to the TV Gods that this is not the end of TSCC. The season finale was awesome. Cameron has to be brought back in Season 3 or we all would be very upset. Just check out this tribute to hear how we would feel. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iV29xRLSW20
Chris V: Allison is his spouse? Which orifice did you pull that out of? There was never any indication that JC and Allison had any type of close relationship.
Cameron told John the morning he woke up and she was sitting on the bed looking at him why she was going to leave. She told him that in her hardward and in her software were an inbedded command to kill him and she couldn’t guarantee it wouldn’t surface. When she got the message from Weaver, she realized that an alternative cyborg was being built by her and she wanted that type of cyborg body to house the Cameron chip, so that there would never be an underlying kill command in her. (she was made from a skynet prototype, which did have the kill command that could never be completely wiped clean - she wanted to be a weaver prototype instead).
When she got to JH, she took her knife out to give him her chip before he said anything to her about doing that. So it wasn’t something that Weaver or JH planned, it was something Cameron decided to do on her own. And that’s why she got Sarah out of jail first, because she knew she was going to leave John and didn’t want him to be completely alone.
Weaver didn’t know they were doing it either because she told John and Sarah ‘you better hope Cameron didn’t destroy JH’. If she knew what was going to happen between the two of them, she wouldn’t have said anything.
Cameron didn’t erase her chip - she wanted to BE Cameron, but not in a sky net machine - in a weaver machine. And when she and JH met and she pulled out her knife, it was before the drone hit the building, so she may have left before the attack. She may not have left had she known John was about to be attacked by Caliba.
She was bringing JH’s program to John Connor in the future for him to use when he re-programmed the machines, and specifically when he reprogrammed her. That’s why she’s so special - she has the JH programming in her (timeline loop paradox). Future John may have originally sent her back to get it (?). She may have had an extra chip in her just for that purpose (to download the JH machine).
Weaver went after JH because she wasn’t done with what she was doing. Cameron took him too soon.
In Season 3 (being positive here) I think she will bring him back to the present to continue perfecting him. She needs him to fight Skynet before Judgment Day - if she didn’t, why bother creating him in the present, she could’ve created him in the future.
Once young John enters the future, it starts a new timeline. If he’s in the future, he wasn’t there for JD and they wouldn’t know his name. Or, it was always supposed to be this way. John stays, and becomes their leader because he has Weaver’s help, which puts him legions ahead of the rest of them. He’s their mystery Messiah who appeared out of nowhere.
If you go back and watch the scene in Dungeons and Dragons when Derrick is brought to meet John Connor - the John Connor entering the room behind him is the present day John Connor. Then Reese wakes up and sees John over him and it gets confusing, was he dreaming or seeing John in the present. But what if he was remembering present day John in the future?
Personally, I think Season 3 would be more interesting if he returns to Sarah at some point, but since T-Salvation takes place in the future, it could be that Season 3 will as well (?). But I’m hoping that after a few episodes in the future, Season 3 will end up back with Sarah and Ellison and Savannah.
Perfect. Perfect balance. What a tightrope you guys walked. I am in total awe of the writers, producers, and everyone else who makes this series. Why couldn’t I have written that?! Bugger! Whether we get a season 3 or not, you guys should all be really proud of what you accomplished. It’s so far superior to 99% of the TV and the movies out there (including the Ts). I wish the audiences’ viewing habits were half as sophisticated as this treasure that they were offered. Love you guys and will be watching for your names.
the finale was awesome! Fox better bring it back or I will abandon the network.
FOX, a 3rd season really needs to be made…I’ve never blogged about a TV series even once in my life, but this needs saying…this is the best written show on TV, well-structured and compelling week after week.
Wow… awesome season finale. please bring it back for Season 3.
This season was very good, the finale blew my mind. It is definitely not typical Hollywood. Outstanding writing, this is why TSCC is one of the only 2 or 3 shows I watch on TV or online (mostly online). I did think Cameron’s Eye was supposed to be blue though, but it’s forgivable. The plot has opened up so many new possibilities. I will be very disappointed if the show doesn’t return.
http://www.fmqinc.com/terminator-cancelled/
don’t shoot the messenger
I just watched the finale for a second time and have so many questions:
Who sent the girl (Chola ) with the passports? What was up with her quoting ‘We lose everybody we love’
What was the priest’s message to Cameron?
John Henry and Weaver simultaneously say ‘We’ll see’ in response to Ellison saying that John will not leave his mother.
Are they trying to convince him to leave her? Is that their purpose?
Did John Henry release the locks in the jail?
He seems to grin when it happened
Weaver doesn’t seem to know about about the jail incident, so JH is doing it on his own
Who sent the plane into the into the building?
The timing on the plane crash was perfect too perfect - Weaver must have orchestrated it.
The eel came from the tank and merged into Weaver after the plan crash?
The ‘bad’ terminator theme was playing when that happened.
JH to Cameron: ‘I know you’
Cameron to JH: ‘and I know you’ (as in, I hacked into you?)
JH To Cameron: ‘Will You join Us?’
Danny Dyson is missing? Following in his father’s work to create skynet? or trying to prevent it from happening too?
Murch mentions that John Henry only exists as this specific hardware.
Where are JH / Cameron at the end? Cameron seems to have been downloaded into the Turk (hence the ‘I’m sorry John’ messages). So JH was downloaded on to Cameron’s chip and goes into the future? What is the significance of the chip from the T888 that Weaver fried?
TSCC Season 3, por favor, nueva temporada!!!!
Thank you for an interesting, thought-provoking season finale. I’m STILL not sure how I feel about everything….the show has stayed in my mind all day. The episode alternately tore at my heart and infuriated me–mostly because it leaves so many open questions…..and season three seems like a long way away. (I am hopeful!) I found it interesting the way CW asked Ellison if he wanted to join her in finding “their” boy. His face! lots of humor, lots of touches to the original two movies, lots of emotion, lots of action and STILL lots of questions…..
CW definitely has a sense of humor.
true that, innocent!
@Chris V:
Why have an interest in Arnold The Terminator, why have an interest in No.5, why have an interest in R2-D2 and C-3PO, why have an interest in E.T., why have an interest in Aliens, why have an interest in Robby the Robot…the Star Man… the HAL9000?
Why do we have an interest in any fascinating sci-fi character?
They are intriguing, they are special… they are not us.
You are pulled into the characters because they let your imaginations run wild.
The whole flippin’ point of Terminator (the first two movies) was the advancement of AI to the point where a Terminator, of all things, can put down his or her gun, and think about something other than what he or she was made for. The reaching for something bigger and better. Their eyes widening… and awakening.
It’s the age old call of all humans. Our morality, our spirituality, our wonder, our imagination, our intelligence, our culture… that which makes us strive for the unattainable: perfection.
And you ask why?
scfangirl has the best explanation of the story I think for anyone that was confused.
And I miss the countdown timer to the next episode already
If this is the last episode ever… we are left with the ultimate questions:
Why were we supposed to be watching in the first place?
What was the ultimate purpose and goal of this show?
What was the message that was supposed to be driven home?
Was this purely to go through the motions? Have iconic characters spin their wheels and waste our time… until JD happens with no hope of stopping it?
Prep us for the upcoming movies and then drop us viewers and the actors and crew and non-producer writers like we and they were useless baggage?
Oh, and another thing! Granted Sarah is our main hero, but I loved how Catherine Weaver 1-upped her every time Sarah started to say something. Of my complaints with the Sarah Connor character, she can be quite annoying when speaking to people sometimes. I would love to see these two have word wars in Season 3.
WE NEED SEASON 3!
If we get it, WB and FOX can expect huge revenues on the T4 box office performance and the TSCC dvd/blu ray sales. If we don’t get it, there will be millions of seriously angry fans who just may boycott it all!
Wow I need more terminator. Amazing story line so far yet so many unanswered questions. Thank you fox and TSCC writers for the work you have done. I love the Terminator franchise and I love what you have done with the show. Let us know if there is anything we can do to keep the show alive. There is only two shows i petitioned to save. Arrested Development and TSCC. Lets keep it up!
Dan,
quite frankly I’ve been wondering why you ever bothered watching that show many many times.
I wonder why they would air the finale on good friday? I mean that is just a slap in the face. The day of Jesus’ death. Hopefully there are not parallels to the show’s demise. Go TSCC!
Did anyone else notice that as JH progressed, Weaver was becoming more ‘human’? In the beginning episodes with Savannah, she barely acknowledged her and didn’t know how to act around her. At the end, she was hugging her when she was returned from being taken by the Connors and asked Ellison to pick her up from school while she went to get JH. Was Weaver uploading the JH files into her own circuitry (I don’t think she has a ‘chip’)? If she was, she might not have needed Cameron to upload the files, she may have them on her own body! (maybe in the eel in the tank?)
I think Season 3 will be more interesting not only if John comes back to Sarah and the frozen Cameron (with her chip in hand), but if Weaver comes back as well to finish JH and to continue raising Savannah and learning from being a human mother, although I’m guessing Ellison will be too horrified to continue working for her. If they (John, Weaver, JH and Cameron’s chip) do come back, no matter how much time they may spend in the future, they can come back to 1 second later in the present (no time loss). And pick it up from there. Lots of cool possibilities!
I’m trying to be optimistic about S3. Fox would be crazy not to renew this after the movie comes out - they can pick up an entire new fanbase if the movie does well, along with the hardcore viewers they already have.
excellent finale. thankyou josh and the whole cast and crew!!
Eman, if there are parallels then we better see the show resurrected in the fall!
I’m soooooooooo confused!
How does all of this tie in? Does it make the movie Terminator 3: Judgement Day completely irrelevant? Does Terminator Salvation tie in with T:SCC, or T3? Which timeline is the real one? All of these questions will be unanswered without a T:SCC Season 3.
Fox… you’d be making a mistake to cancel the series now!
LoL yeah Brian from Canada,
I wish! Its funny because I think you wrote earlier that you were an AD fan. Kudos to you. I tried so hard to keep that show alive. I bought 12 copies of the dvds
@innocent,
I quite frankly am amazed you spent any time thinking why I’m watching the show.
I really like Cameron (duh! most of the fans do!), I like Weaver, I like Savannah, I like John Henry, I sorta like the other characters, especially when they’re written well.
John was a dud for most of the season (and finally is not annoying), we hardly saw much of Cameron except here and there. And Sarah… gah! I loved Sarah Connor in T1 and T2, and sometimes am as pissed at how Sarah was written as Lena supposedly is!
But since this ending still leaves a bazillion unanswered questions even when they said they’d tie some stuff up, that’s when I wonder what the real point of all this was?
An exercise in futility?
They’re great at leaving things dangling all over the place and then claim it’s all part of some brilliant strategy… trust us! [wink wink] But not very good at blending everything together smoothly. Even allergygal was a bit miffed!
They juggled far too many “teaser” balls in the air, about 50 or so, and dropped a bunch in the process.
As I mentioned to Zack a while back… sometimes you can be too “cute” and “clever” with the vagueness, and that can come back to bite you.
The Dungeon in “Dungeons and Dragons” is mentioned in passing with one line after one and a half seasons. That’s supposed to wrap things up?
It doesn’t even make sense if you look at the time line and the events.
They come from 1997 to 2007 and then in the span of less than 6 months they’re now in 2009?? Don’t deny it… John Connor said it himself.
“Alpine Fields” should not have even been put on film because that time frame also makes zero sense with what we’ve witnessed, and with Derek’s death.
The going to the future part of “Born to Run” also does not fit as a tidy ending either because everything that has happened as veered the events so out of whack that he can’t start things in motion again to create any kind of loop.
And why would John have to send Kyle or Derek back now anyway on their own? Why send Cameron back, why kill Allison?
He’s protected. Once you’re created, you don’t disappear from existence like in “Back to the Future.” You’re protected by a kind of Time Cocoon.
You exist, you can’t now un-exist.
That’s why this as a series conclusion is a terrible way to end things.
If it ends up being a season finale then it basically means, to me anyway, that John has to learn that he really is a necessary part of the equation and that he needs to get Cameron and get his ass back to the past where he and Cam can develop into the possible leaders they need to be if JD can’t be stopped.
And yet… that should still be their driving mission: find Kaliba and destroy it so this nightmare can end, and along the way evolve John and Cameron more than ever, so this new opportunity isn’t wasted again.
Maybe find some clues about Skynet and Kaliba in this Land of Oz and take the intel back to the past with them to help in the present.
Otherwise, what’s the point? It wraps nothing up really.
scfangirl,
Thanks for the explanation. I liked it all, except the part where you mention that John is attacked by Caliba. I took the ship crashing into the building as Weaver’s doing, no? She certainly seemed prepared for it, and no Terminators came out of the ship. Why would Weaver and John leave Ellison and Sarah there in the building if there were Terminators in the building?
Again, I loved your analysis, just curious about this one particular point.
Dan:
I agree that far too many teasers were dropped and and some others wasted too much time and didn’t pay off. The three dots got way too much play and then in the end was just three LED’s on a SATA drive. Very stupid and wasteful. Another teaser that should have paid dividends was Camerons dance scene at the end of the Demon Hand. I really expected to see massive developement in Cameron after that and Josh just dropped it. That was where he should have spent his time rather than chasing dots.
Lastly however, your comment that you can’t un-exist crushes one of the Terminator tenents. Remember Kyle Reese said in T1 “we smashed their defense grid, We’d won. They had to come back and whipe out his(JC’s) entire existence.”
I think we need to believe in the ability to take someone out of time entirely for the story to hold together.
People SAVE THE SHOW GO TO (E!ONLINE) AND click on (Watch w/ Kristin)
and save the show…pleas the only way to save the show …..we can do it if we all vote
i wanna see season 3….don’t U WANNA SEE IT
most awsum show ever.
The more I think about it… the more I like the idea of Allison Young, this time around (I look at it as a kind of Twilight Zone or Star Trek Future time line that must be erased from existence), not being so innocent and pure.
Maybe even end up revealing as being a kind of threat to John and/or Cameron and/or John Henry. Riley was an unwitting dupe and pawn of Jesse’s. Allison is nothing of the sort. Old Jesse, who Derek may not have really killed, may still be trying for some new surprises in this alternate time line.
There is a final confrontation with Allison, John, and Cameron Mark II (John Henry and/or Catherine Weaver may be there too).
Maybe Cameron Mark II is in a vulnerable state and Allison threatens to destroy her (Cam’s “metal” after all) for the good of mankind (or so she thinks is her motivation; that old, tired excuse of “it’s for the greater good”)… Allison is also, deep down, “jealous” and “envious” and even “weirded out” that Cameron (her metal twin “sister”) exists and John Connor loves her and not Allison. It drives her over the edge of reason into madness, the heart of darkness… much like Jesse.
And John Connor, in a state of bewilderment at Allison’s true nature, and anger, and a desire to protect his true love, Cameron… kills her with one kill shot to the head. She slumps over, wide-eyed, vacant, and staring… at Cameron’s, her twin’s, body lying on a nearby table ready to be revived.
Allison Young still dies for Cameron to be born… again. But this time it’s John doing the killing.
And John learns this lesson again:
“Humans will disappoint you.”
@Snake,
You do make an excellent case for the loop factor for Terminator.
S3 must come… If not very unpleasant things will happen.
@scfangirl - you touched on something that I think fans should do if they still have the episodes available: watch the CW scenes now that you know that the up is with her. She’s way less creepifying than before.
Remember back in Sherman’s office? That close call between Weaver and John? Anxious then, much? But now? You wish so much that they’d have connected then. It would have saved an awful lot of pain (and the Sarah tangent). Now…imagine if you’d watched it the first time without knowing how it ends but only that Weaver is searching for John Connor and building a way for him to beat Skynet. Different sort of anxiety, but still there because we know something the characters don’t. We know that John and Co are working against their best interests at times. All the while CW can still have her own extra agenda that the audience doesn’t quite have enough information about.
It’s the old Hitchcock method of suspense: if a bomb explodes it’s shocking; however, if the audience sees the bomb but the characters keep missing their opportunities to thwart it…that’s suspense. I’d have preferred a little more of the suspense instead of just the bang.
But again, I encourage everyone to go back into their libraries and watch this all again with a new perspective.
I cried like 10 times as I watched it over and over…
CAMERON IS GONE! FOREVER! Her chip in future and her broken body left behind…
Don’t say Alison, don’t say she’ll come back, NEVER! Cameron is THIS CHIP, THIS BODY! It’s all over now!
When season 3 does come back, THIS Cameron won’t
Kyle reese is not from “our” john connors future - the future that Kyle reese was from is gone (relative to him) - was changed the moment he went back into time. The “future” relative to those that he left behind is still the same - if the terminator would have succeeded in killing John Connor - the future John Connor would not have vanished - the only future where john connor would not have existed would be the one relative to the people in the time where he was killed.
So what I’m saying is when you go back in time your not changing your past - your past has already happened your just changing the future from your standpoint.
if you go into the past to try and stop judgement day - you won’t be helping anybody out from the future that you were from - because it’s already happened for them.
Twenty!
Wrong May 19. The one thing that will save this show is Cameron. I think the new contract will insist on her as a main character otherwise those who invest in it will not be able to guarantee a return. This season proved that if you want to depress your ratings you withhold Cameron.
Oh man, it just can’t end here. IT CAN’T!!!!
A couple of more things I noticed after watching the ep again:
When Kyle comes walking in you see a fuzzy Allison walk into the background.
Everyone else is armed with big guns…but Alison is not armed. WHY?
John never heard his mom’s message. Awwww!!!
When Cameron meets JH it’s the same line that was said in S1 between Cameron and Derek. ‘I know you, and I know you.’
Cameron really is torn between two worlds. She wants to be with the humans (some like Derek, riley and Jesse, Sarah don’t want her around). She might have human memories not to sure about that. But she wants to be with John yet she is a machine. She might have been designed by skynet since she still has the programming yet she works with the terminator resistance.
She really is torn. I think Cameron is the key to everything. She’s the balance. And she’s perfect for John.
I actually was thinking about this while baking today…the cyborg/human relationship has been explored as Snake has pointed out in Serenity, STTNG and Cleopatra 2525 and a number of other places but not to that great extent.
Just compare it to all the other sci-fi relationships that have been out there.
Human/vampire (Buffy, Angel, Moonlight), Human/werewolf, werewolf/vampire (Underworld), human/alien (STTNG, Roswell anyone) so I think cyborg/human is one of the few that have played out. Some people seem to forget that this is a sci-fi show. The human/human stuff has been explored in a lot of other shows. And to be honest not really what I want to see. Its the cyborg/human relationship especially in TSCC that has so much potential. Two different worlds came come together and work out there differences. So its time to let Jameron shine.
Also Jameron has been hinted at between future John and Cameron and even Weaver calls her his companion
Allison can’t protect him and she certainly can’t take a ton of bullets for him.
John might be able to see a cyborg Cameron controlled by skynet in this wizard of oz time line…can he still forgive what she might do. Of course he can. Bring on Jameron!!!
I think Cameron’s power cell was going. I mean Cameron could have said “John it should feel cold,” but she doesn’t say that. She doesn’t say anything. John has to ask her if what he’s feeling is how its suppose to feel.
And suddenly Cameron wants to break out Sarah and then go to Weavers.
I mean the girl doesn’t even take a tranquilizer gun which might have been helpful. And her voice was also messed up at the end.
This also explains why they show in the beginning clip Cameron getting tossed into the wall. Maybe her sensors are damaged and if she had stuck around John might have ended up sick. Going to the future and getting a new body might and getting out that pesky skynet programming might have been her only option.
I guess the hard stunt they were talking about was the HK crashing into the office.
@ CJ you sound like me. I would just like to say that my family is now officially sick of my TSCC talks. I think they are hoping we’ll get a season 3 so I just stop talking about TSCC!! Thank goodness for the internet!!!
LOL Dan
Cameron: I hate this place.
John turns quizzically to stare at Cameron.
Cameron: There are no birds.
Oh my God…I will pay to see that on the show!!! LOL!!!
And I have to say it but I could care less about watching T4. There I said it. But season 3 of TSCC oh I care…I care BIG time.
And I’m still not over that bed scene!!!
Well said Kea, although I will be going to see T4.
Are you getting ready for a bake sale to save the show for us Kea? I’ll be sure to come.
LOL thanks Snake.
Yeah I’ve never really been into the terminator movies. I did like T2…that was my favorite but to be really honest not really into terminator…until this show came along and I got hooked on TSCC (Thanks to Cameron and well Jameron).
But I might rent T4 when if comes out on DVD…we’ll see. I think it depends on if TSCC gets to see the season 3 light or not.
Now hand over the S2 DVD set and give us a Season 3!!!
A bake sale…hadn’t really planned on it. More like a need to make hot crossed buns asap kind of deal (and they are SO GOOD)!!!
But if my cooking can save the show that would be amazing.:) And by the way I do add vanilla extract to my pancake mix long before Cameron recommended it!! LOL.
I’ll save a few for you Snake!
Ugh, I just stumbled upon the news that terminator might not be picked up for the next season! I’m devastated. I heard Season Finale (not series finale) and thought, ok, don’t have to worry about this show. >sigh< What will i watch now? Dollhouse getting canceled as well. gah.
people you must see again Season1 to understeand S2….maybe S3 will be conturated around destruction of SkyNet (Cameron’s made)
Why did Derek hate Cameron so much?
CJ, I have to wait for the DVD set to come out, but I’m looking forward to re-watching all her scenes in the new light.
I think Cameron needed the JH body because as Murch told Weaver JH’s programming was both in the sotware and the hardware. The files without the body wouldn’t be enough. She needed to bring the entire ‘package’ to future John, so she uploaded his info on a/or/her spare chip, and put them both into JH and made the jump. JH’s file are on one chip, she’s on the other. JH’s program was not ready to jump or deal with the outside world, and definitely not the post JD world. He was still developmentally a child. He needs Cameron’s chip to do all that.
If Cameron traded place with JH and was in the computer in the basement, there would have been more to her message to John. After she transferred JH’s info to a chip, she wiped the computers clean and all they were able to do was relay a one phrase message. (I’m sorry John). She wiped them clean because presentday John told her to destroy JH and she was following that order, and because she probably realized that if Caliba got to the basement, it would use the info to build Skynet.
Cameron’s loyalty was to John, not Weaver. Cameron knew that future John would not want JH destroyed, he’d want the program and would want Cameron to bring it to him. So she accomplished both - took the program away from the present, but saved it for future John. The last Cameron heard from Weaver (from Jesse after the sub incident) - Weaver was not interested in working with John. She may have asked present day Cameron to join her, but as far as Cameron knew, it wasn’t an alliance with John, just a personal invitation for Cameron. So Cameron decided to act on her own and take JH to future John. If Weaver followed, all the better, it would give future John the meeting with Weaver he was seeking in the first place.
The fact that Weaver went after JH is significant. She needs JH in the present, and she needs to bring him back. Notice though she didn’t seem pissed that Cameron hijacked JH - she seemed almost relieved. Could be because JH was now ‘preserved’ and moved by Cameron before Caliba could get to him - something Murch couldn’t accomplish.
Of course, all that assumes that Cameron was operating on all cylinders which she didn’t completely appear to be be at the end. She could’ve made the jump because her glitches were coming back and she was afraid she’d hurt John if she stayed around.
But I like the first possibility better
I dont care (much) that which character Summer would be at S3 (if we even get it). Ofc I prefer more Cameron due its much more interesting character, but Allison would be ok too. I.. we just need more Summer, thats it.
BTW do anyone know that where and when we get confirmation about third season?
Haha, at that bed scene, I really thought that Cameron is going to say “I love you” after she said “John..” -.-
scfangirl…Interesting.
I like that Cameron might have given future John his meeting with Weaver.
I did notice that Weaver wasn’t as ticked off as I thought she would be. Also notice that neither Sarah or John have any weapon’s on them. Cameron must have made sure because she did not want a repeat of the sub incident.
Could also be that Cameron has a number of motives.
My question is…did Cameron suspect that John would be willing to time travel to save her? Or that Weaver would take him along?
Cameron told Sarah in S&D ‘don’t ever let him do that again‘. Yet Sarah let John time travel.
Dear god we need a Season 3!!!
@Kea
Couldn’t agree more on the relationship pairings and you’re right about Buffy, if any show pushed the limit in taboo relationships it was that one. She tried the normal guys but it just didn’t work out no matter how hard she tried. The only times she was happy was with Angel and towards the end with Spike (not six but season seven). Anyway the point is once she got past the whole “you’re not human, you don’t feel anything, you can’t feel love” she wound up being a lot more happy, despite having to constantly defend Spike from her friends one of whom even tried to kill him for her own good (sound familiar?)
THAT SAID, let’s get back to the John/Cam thing.
Unlike the two vamp boys Cameron will probably never be able to “get a soul” or “feel emotions” because she is a machine and in the terminator universe magic and the supernatural doesn’t play as much a role. It’s sci-fi. The only three ways I could imagine Cameron of being able to feel is either one: some cosmic enigma comes along and gives her the ability to feel joy (for those of you Star Trek Next Generation fans out there you know what I’m talking about) OR John sits down and starts writing code that one allows her to simulate what would make a person laugh, what would make a person cry, what would make a person feel and then give her a learning power so advanced that she could eventually use these simulations as a guideline to develop her own likes and dislikes OR and I can’t take credit for this idea because I read it in a T:SCC fanfiction story (still a very originial and very creative idea that actually struck true to an event that took place in the official show) Cameron downloads a bunch of viruses that corrupts her programming and compels her to do illogical actions. Essentially it gives her an evil conscience as well as her good well mannered logical one (picture an angel on one shoulder and a devil on the other) and Cameron has to choose what is morally best in each situation. I think they tried to do that in the second season but they didn’t push it far enough, it was either entirely good Cameron or evil Cameron trying to kill John. They did better with John Henry actually when he was hacked but still they didn’t explore it enough I felt.
So there’s the three:
1. cosmic entity
2. the epitome of advanced programming
3. viruses/hack
In my opinion 2 and 3 make the most sense with 3 having the highest probability of succeeding.
\ S3 wee allready building’it ?…we don’t know that.
they need a script from the fan’s to build the movie, fox need us to comment season1 and 2, to make a rating if S3 will enlarge ther wallets.
So many tantalising questions…..
Sarah’s fate? Danny Dyson’s current disposition, possible role in Termie tech, under duress or free will? Is there more to Savannah’s role or future? Does the detective actually believe in Judgment Day, has he somehow come across JDay pointers, or found Termi parts here and there? Will our John go back to A Sarah, or will our Sarah ever reunite with A future John? Where’s Weaver now? Where’s Cameron?
It can’t be the end of TSCC, it just can’t………
OMG!..OMFG!!!
This episode was so great, so fantastic! Josh where do you get it all from? ..Im really speechless. I cried like a little girl at the ending lol
There better be a season 3 now! Ive done all the voting I can to help out!
OMG that episode blew my mind! literally! i was absolutely gobsmacked at the ending ! was not expecting that at all but it was the most fantastic episode ever! we so need season 3! it set it up for such a great concept and storyline!! also was it just me or did kyle look as if he knew who john was????
JOSH YOU ROCK !!!
@Z. andrei: Agree. I need two or three days to getting over this shocking/heartbreaking Friday night then I’ll start again from the begining (S1).
I have a dream. Season 3, Terminator: The Allison Young Chronicles. OMG I love Summer so much
So So great ! how imagine no saison 3 with that kind of ending !
It’s following all around the world and we love it !
American, be happy to have Fox ! That chanel sucks !!!! They build Simpson and Sarah Connor Chronicles ! Thanks
You think, that better, if the end was like this…?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGlIIxxF_Vk
…because OMG! where Cammy is?!
Awesome series!!! I hope there is a season three!!!! I have never posted
to an TV show blog before. I don’t even watch TV. I watched this online
and became hooked. This is the most I’ve enjoyed sci-fi since I was a kid
watching re-runs of the original Star Trek.
Maybe this show will be a little like Star Trek, which kept getting brought back. I hope so!
Here is my question:
Why did Sarah stay behind? She protected John against the relatively minor dangers of our time, but she wasn’t willing to go with him into the future to help protect him in the future? It seems out of character!!!
” SNAKE;- Allison is his spouse? Which orifice did you pull that out of? There was never any indication that JC and Allison had any type of close relationship.”
no need to be rude. To be honest we do not know anything about Allison to make any assumption. Why is everyone so against it anyway.
Jeez people. Get over it, Cameron is dead.
John didnt really have much choice to go with weaver or not. i dont think he was going after camerons chip.
Also i dont think John Henry jumped through time, if he did i think they all would of known it, not exactly a quiet thing. Also if he did why didnt the building fall down or something. Remember the Bank Vault, it destroyed the entire building. Wouldnt it of killed Sarah and ellision as well.
As a season and series finale.. this is the best thing I have ever watched! Its warmed the place up nicely for the Salvation movie. If the series ends here it will end on a high rather than a stuttering fudge. It would of course be nice to have a series 3 assuming quality can be maintained.
I need a Season 3! So many questions!
@Chris She wants to stop it from ever happening. John however was born into being hunted. He may want to stop Skynet for good but some priorities seems to be more important (read: cameron).
The sad thing it seems is that that Skynet seems already to be operational, if it really is Skynet who infilitrated JH system. If so, it seems like it is not connected to any military hardware and no nukes have gone of yet. So the question is if Skynet is not owned by the military any more who got their hands on Skynet? And what events initiated that change? Has Dyson’s kid anything to do about it?
I cant belive that was the last episode
Im gonna miss this show … but i didn´t get it .. nobody knew John Connor in the future .. so is he not the leader of the resistent… or what ???
Cheerss.. from Iceland
So when Weaver and JC are transported through to the future, have they been inserted to before Allison from Palmdale got captured and replicated, and either of the Reese brothers have been sent back in time, or are they on a different timeline where John Connor wasn’t around to lead the resistance against skynet so Kyle Reese was never sent to save John Connor since the resistance seemed to be doing about the same without him.
Meanwhile back in John Henry’s room, why was his screen saying he was sorry? Why did Cameron transfer her chip into Cromartie’s body instead of smash the computer up? Why would Weaver time travel away from her John Henry leaving him vulnerable to other terminator attacks.. and Sarah Connor?
MattLive and Chris: Yes, she wants stop Skynet here but she doesn’t mind with her son. If she stops Skynet, Reese will not come back and John never will be born. He was borned so Sarah will not stop Skynet. So we must get S3
Anyway, Sarah died a few years ago, she lives only because of the time-jump. So she had to say a thank you to Cameron to save her life 
Good morning Dan.
I quite frankly am amazed you spent any time thinking why I’m watching the show.
Well, you hang in there so tight that it makes you kind of sweet, as CW would put it, so why shouldn’t I care?
Quite frankly, many of your responses are just so downright depressing that it would be a wonder not to wonder.
I agree with getting over Cameron, she is vaporized….
Alison as a resistance fighter also a potential romantic interest is a dynamic addition to the show. It will fit right in with the new trilogy. And keep fans from getting confused with all the talk of shipping a Terminator that confesses that no matter what it will always have the need to kill John Connor. The robo lovers need to not worry about having Cameron get all the screen time. We got the sentiment the first few hundred posts.
Anyone else think Sarah came through?
After watching the show a second time, at the very end there was some lightning flashes and you heard Sarah say “I love you too”. Maybe Sarah followed John to the future?
Just a thought?
I wonder if there is a shrink somewhere analyzing this jameronite, jallisonite (soon jallironite?) waltz?
I personally favor Allison in a robot body (the jallironite party) but who listens? Still, this is what’d have the most potential IMHO.
Otherwise a warm blooded Allison has its advantages but is known territory mostly.
Cammy has other kind of potentials, offers new territory and, apparently if we judge by the S&M ’sex scene’ of B2R, is more to the taste of those who appreciate kink.
one of the many things that i loved the show for was how those little bits of robot “humor” get snuck in.things that become funny or weird sounding only because we the audience know that they are coming from robots.
john henry’s “TWENTY”,mentioned above.it’s not simply he rolled and got a pleasant surprise that it landed on the twenty,it’s the fact that,as we learned a little earlier,he could roll whatever number he wants but he still looks up all surprised and happy announcing “TWENTY” as if it was a genuine surprise.
during john henry’s “home invasion” and confrontation with riley,it’s very tense and could turn deadly any second,and he throws out the “thank you for your time” with a smile,not knowing the awkward turn that that action took the confrontation.
weaver’s “cow’s blood” remark.
savanah complaining that her lap is cold,and weaver’s matter-of-fact “i know”.
Best show ever! I need a 3 season as fast as possible!!!!
I need a Season 3! So many questions! as you
Was that Danny Dyson standing behind Kyle? They did say he had been missing for 3 months.
Ok, here we are !
About “sex-scene” between John and Cam, yeah, it was really good done.
Authors had a lot of possibilities, some interesting, some predictables, other stupid (like kissing or someone else…).
No, in the end Cam let John touchin her heart. Her cold heart. It’s a beautiful moment, very intimate, and very… sad.A Bit funny, she seems emotionally involved as much as John is embarassed.
Really i have an heartache when i saw it.
What other perfect scene like this do you know ? Mr.Friedman thank you for shooting the best in the end!
About the rest…i was thinkin about character’s death, and i was fooled as many others, by concentrating my attention on them in their future versions…
But don’t forget, people, that they are all alive ! Derek, Reese, Allison lives in John’s contemporary era, we saw them in previous episodes ! Theu are kids, but there they are!
So, it was easy to think that this thing would have been used to open new unexpected doors in the history, like in Born to Run’ ending !
I think that “double” summer could be a powerful element for a S3…but be aware of an easy “love-story”, they often failed in front of Terminator super-excited-fans !!
But after this masterpiece in the end, Mr.Friedman, i trust in you.
I told that if i were missing something in recent episodes, like temporal-jump, parallele universe, conspiration, i would have excuse with you.
Here they are, Mr.Friedman!
I think John has to recover Cameron,absolutely! Her chip is too important.
But it should be funny as hell to see what coul happen in the future with Allison and the other…gang is reunited for the first time!
I think John could have alot of problems with Allison
I ‘m just wondering why Cameron gave her chip to JH: was that her mission? Find an alliance with him? But…who’s him? Please try understand me clearly, because i start rewatching the episode as soon as possible!
What aobut Weaver’s guerrilla’s dresses??
What about JH? Where is he gone??
Wha tabout Sarah? She remained in the past with Ellison and Cameron’s empty body?
FFOOOOX and WARNER BROS !!!
This show is amazing, if theres no season 3, I’m going on a shooting spree in the fox building…! jk but seriously SEASON 3 or else!
I think John could have alot of problems with Allison
Wellllllcome to adulthood, real women department. Throw in the mix that JC loves Cameron, not Allison… can’t have a relationship to Cameron because this is not her Destiny, can’t have a relationship with Allison because she is not Cameron while being to much like her… il n’y a pas d’amours heureuses.
I ‘m just wondering why Cameron gave her chip to JH: was that her mission? Find an alliance with him? But…who’s him? Please try understand me clearly, because i start rewatching the episode as soon as possible!
I’m pretty sure that Cam agreed to the alliance, simply, that she was sorry to fail John in her protector role, simply, and that Weaver is not deceiving anyone when she says that JH role is to become a decisive element in humanity’s eventual survival.
What about Weaver’s guerrilla’s dresses??
Hey the woman is beautiful, she rocks like few do, she knows what she wants and she makes her own clothing! What more can a man ask for? Oh well, maybe a thermostat.
What about JH? Where is he gone??
Where have they gone maybe… well to the same place/time as CW and JC I’d surmise.
Wha tabout Sarah? She remained in the past with Ellison and Cameron’s empty body?
That, my dear sir, is the most puzzling part of it all.
If she actually stops Skynet then Kyle doesn’t come back from the future and there is not JD and no John and no Sarah the warrior, just Sarah the Waitress and Skynet wins, unopposed… loopy-loop
If John actually come back at about the same time he left there is no Sarah story to tell.
If Sarah decides that this is all too fucked up, marries Ellison who every gal on the set find yummy apparently go raise Savannah in the Bermudas… maybe she can branch the Terminator franchise into a reality show?
FFOOOOX and WARNER BROS !!!
i just love this show. the finale was awesome. hopefully there will be next season.
scfangirl, I really liked and agree with most of your thoughts and theories.
But, what really annoys me is the doubt about who is in Cameron’s chip.
JH didn’t had a chip, he relyed on all those mainframes to function. Cameron had her own chip.
I don’t think that data from both would fit in one chip. So, who would prevail?
It seems to be that JH’s data is more ctitical and important (and valuable).
So i’m inclined to believe that Cameron somehow “sacrificed” herself, by giving JH her own chip, and enabling him to overwrite his data on the chip and escape from there.
The “I’m Sorry John” message seemed to be like a goodbye, her way to say goodbye to John Connor.
I’m a rabid fan who wants a season 3 as much as anybody else. I still think in some ways we were lucky to get as many episodes as we did. Hopefully Fox (like last spring) appreciates the show and gives it another chance.
Josh, you and all involved with the show (especially the cast and writers) did a hell of a job taking a franchise known more for crazy action (awesome as that is) and giving it characters and a story that have real depth and development that make all of us care so much. Absolute worst case, know many people appreciate the amazing job you all did with this show.
SEASON 3!
What we really need is for Cameron to be uploaded into a T-1000.
noo way that cameron in a t-1000 body :s keep cameron in a machine but just alot better machine like in terminator 3
On the wiki there is this hypothesis that it is not Allison and a dog we’re seeing but Weaver and her eel. Now this would be a twist.
This was my favorite episode of Terminator thus far. The tension between John and Cameron was great as was the sadness in John once he realized what Cameron had done. The way Cameron went into that jail and seemed only to scare off rather than kill the officers was interesting. As was Sarah’s unwillingness to follow John to help him find Cameron. Maybe they should change the name of the show to the Terminator Chronicles or the John Connor Chronicles so that warranting more time for John’s path would be seen. John’s face when he saw “Allison”, Derek and Kyle was heart wrenching - he lost his mother only to gain these three, although if there is a season three i am sure his mission would still be to reclaim Cameron (whom he loves but seemed constantly mean to). It will be interesting to see him step up and lead and how his relationship with weaver and the other john will be established. Even if Fox cancelled this show - another studio could pick it up. I am crossing my fingers and hoping for the best - yet assuming the worst. This is the only show on TV that I look forward to watching, I make sure to make no plans that would interfere with my watching TSCC. I will be sad if they are not renewed.
Did we ever find out what model of terminator Cameron was? And as she was going to the library every night and researching historical documents, etc. - maybe she knew all along her chip was going to be needed for the future resistance.
This is the only show on network TV right now that I try to catch every week. Unfortunately my job has me working Friday Evenings, so I have to watch it on line. I LOVE IT… Watched from the Pilot to now!!!
Here comes a great sci-fi show that actually has a great story and some good acting involved and yet it is going to be dropped because fox moved it away from Monday nights.
Honestly T:SCC is the only reason I watch any Fox Programing. I Hate foxes plethora of Reality shows that are just pointless. In addition I knew when fox moved it to Fridays it was going to die. Why does fox like to keep supporting shows who’s concepts are really really old or failed two seasons ago. (IE: American Idol, 24, The Osborns and even Doll house.) COME ON!!!
I SAY KEEP T:SCC on the air… Or personally I will just stop watching fox TV network for good. The last 5 episodes of T:SCC have kept me on the edge of my seat!!! WHY DITCH a show that does that.
WOW!!… thats really all I can say at this point!….. WOW!!
After watching “Born to run” My jaw hit the floor and stayed there for about 10 minutes ;0)
BEST….SEASON FINALE…..EVER!!! No question!
Fox would be crazy not to renew for a 3rd season :0)
I think because of all this canceling the show talk and the whole new beginning that has been put forth by the finale, they could just rename the show Terminator: Rebirth. Then they can follow whichever story lines they want without having to focus entirely on Sarah or John.
This is the only show I am attached to on TV, the only show I actually blog, vote and fight for. Don’t even know why… kind of scary really.
Give me season 3 or give me Judgment Day!!
Rafael, it sure looked like an implied “Good Bye” to me also, and she decided to sacrifice herself for the future of mankind and John Connor.
Did anyone here see anything at all in the last few scenes to imply Cameron’s code is still in the JH body? Or is that just wishful thinking by the fans hoping to save Cam? I know a lot of people brought up a number of possibilites.
John Connor jumped off thinking he needs to try to save her chip, but did you guys see any other implication at all? If there was, I still missed it after multiple viewings.
Obviously the writers can cook up a story to continue her character later if needed, but I’m referring to what you actually saw here in this finale.
Gary,
the best indication is the fact that Cameron is by far the best character in the show and a fan fav. If, God willing, there is a 3rd season, I’m certain she’ll be brought back.
Amazing episode!Need season 3!!!
But, please…
NO NO NO NO NO Allison in it !
BRING CAMERON BACK! I’ve been waiting for John and Cameron together since season 1. And the bed scene - the best! That look worths a million!
Do you think people would rather have Cameron or Allison for season 3? They would both be played by Summer Glau (one would hope).
I agree she’s a fan fav. For me also. I’m just trying to make sure I have a good handle on what Josh implied regarding Cam’s actions in these last few scenes. I’d have to agree with Rafael.
darknay47, I would think most fans of the show want to see Cam back since she was so popular with them. Either one is ok with me, really. Cam was a lot of fun, but maybe her part of the story ended in their vision for additional seasons. Don’t know.
I just watched the season finale twice back to back! I have been and continue to be a die hard fan, from the pilot episode and for the whole series! FOX give us season 3 please!!! I look forward to watching it every friday night! Please Continue The Series!!!
Josh Friedman, I hated the way you used Cameron this season, and Derek. They were almost non-existent. However I believe you have learned from your mistakes and having seen the last 2 episodes I’m totally certain of one thing. You are now the right man for the job. Adam raised a Cain was the best of the best of the best. And the finale, what you did to Cameron, I hate it, but I loved it too. Kudos for having balls to go against mainstream tv.
I critisize a lot but you’ve totally won me over. If I make strange sounds and noises during a movie or show it’s always great and I was screaming at the tv this time.
It breaks my heart thinking it could end this way, we need more! I want John to find Cameron again but when they are together I totally don’t want them to hook up. But at the same time I want them together.Their chemistry is incredible. Summer and Thomas are a dreamteam.
Mr Friedman, you have totally redeemed yourself!
And yes, Cameron is the fan fave.
The love scene is going to be even more awkward now that Cameron is sharing John Henry’s body.
Can i ask people who say that John/Cameron love line can’t happen, Why? Why do you think it is impossible?
After all, everything’s evolving.
Why can’t machines then? And in the series, there are some moments, where you can clearly see that Cameron has feelings, that she is different than other ones.
For example in the last episode, why would she bother writing “I’m sorry John” , id she didn’t feel anything?
150k completed torrent downloads just from one site.
100k completed for Dollhouse
27k completed for Ghost Whisper
Dear Fox, please hire someone who knows how to reach the correct audience; and preferably not such a horrible time slot so that people don’t have to DvR, Tivo, Torrent the shows because ‘you’ are too incompetent to make a good programing schedule.
Great show..fantastic ending,I was blown away about 4 times in 30 seconds..(the gripping final 30 seconds).
I ve read through all of the posts here,and really enjoyed seeing everyones ‘take’ on whats going on/whats going to happen ect ect
Of course I have my own ideas ..but my thinking watching this has always been based on a couple of things that I havent really seen anyone else mention..the first
is a ‘minor’ and didnt really come into play until this superb last episode..
Danny Dyson..for those of you who havent read the Terminator Comics (my ’saftey net’, if they dont decide to make another series,guaranteed this will continue in comic form)
Danny is John Conners best friend when he is the leader of the resistance (they become friends b4 JD)..
he is also the one who is trying along with John to ‘reprogramme’ the Chip in a captured Terminator…(only the 2 of them know this)
the comic mini series is called ‘T2 Nuclear Twilight’ printed in 1995/96…it tells the story of how John gets an Arnie Terminator and then ‘rechips’ it to send back after he learns of Skynets time travel strategy..of course he sends Reese first..which we also see..
having re read this story only a few days before this season finale..it was very intriguing that the writers slipped this in…the fact that hes ‘missing’ (no one to reprogramme chip in future..? does Cam know this..? is this why she and JH have an urgent need to transport the ‘learning chip’ to the future..? has Danny been took out by Skynet..or even Cameron herself)…I know a million more questions..lol
any way my point is that the Danny Dyson mention was genius…Im convinced the writer has read all the comics too…all this ‘chip’ juggling with JH and Cam.. and a Danny Dyson storyline outta nowhere suddenly…
the other thing that has always been on my mind while watching the series was this site…. http://www.mjyoung.net/time/terminat.html
which I absolutly urge EVERYONE who likes this show…or the Terminator franchise to read…I thought I understood time travel till I read that …your brain will hurt but its worth it…who was Johns ‘original’ father..?…how did John beat Terminators on his own..? why did he send back Arnie knowing that the Terminator failed or he would not be standing there..? some great questions and the Authour of the site (an expert in all these time travel theories) makes a great effort to answer them…(its like another film in a way)….
but my main reason for directing yall to that site ..and what has been in the back of my mind all along was the Authors attempt at concluding the story…what he thinks ‘has to happen’ in order for the time line to continue…(for one JD has to happen which is ironic …ive known this all the time while watching this show)…
and so I get to my main point..(at last ) throughoutthe series Cam seemed to be keeping somthing from John ..somthing she couldnt tell him…Ill copy and paste the ’solution’ that the Authour comes up with (although he is talking about the films ,I think this works for the series too)..If I replace ‘John coming back himself’ with ‘Cameron coming back with orders from John’ it seems to make sense ..to me..at least…
FROM THE SITE LINKED ABOVE
”He can invade the past once more, this time taking the initiative to reach the past first. If a temporal recall device has been developed, he might even come himself.
In this scenario, John, from a point in the future beyond all of the time travelers to date, devises a way to build a weakness into Skynet. In order to win the war, he must return to the past and penetrate the systems of the company which ultimately develops Skynet. At this point he must create the flaw, a weakness which will be undetected by the developers, and which will not prevent the war or any of the temporal transits previously made, but which the rebels can use after he leaves for the past to end the war. While he is in the past, he must give to his younger self the secret, but in a form which the young John cannot fully comprehend until he reaches the same point in the future. Thus, John will understand that a weakness exists in Skynet because he went back in time and put it there, and that that weakness must not be accessed until after he goes back in time, or time is lost. This creates a simple N-Jump, at the end of which the rebels will be able to stop Skynet by accessing that weakness”
Again to appriciate all this time travel stuff I suggest you read that site its facsinating..
oh and there have been new Terminator comics coming out that prequel the T4 movie …i recommend them too…
sorry for waffling but I just had to get my ‘theories’ out there too…
@darknay47
For me it would have to be Cameron. Most of my enjoyment in watching Summer comes from the Quirky character’s she plays, and how she brings them to life.
Summer playing a normal human role would not be as interesting to watch. A few Alison episodes would be cool to see, but then how do you get back to Cameron?
For Cameron to exist Alison would have to die, or so I think, and John would not allow that even for Cam. Could be a mess.
Bottom line for me: The show goes, how Cameron goes.
I’m sensing a blog post in this, but a few comments before I start thinking much about it:
My interpretation of the Cameron/JH transfer was very straightforward: Cameron submits to let JH remove her chip. JH has to improvise a bridge so that the connector on Cameron’s CPU will fit into JH’s T-888 socket (different models, different connectors). Apparently that’s what all the playtime was for with the legos and bionicles
Once Cameron’s chip was installed and JH still connected to the server farm, there was some exchange of info but not a complete rewrite as it’s unlikely Cameron’s CPU circuitry would “fit” JH’s patterns.
Remember, we have time constraints as the time it took for the Connors to go up to Weavers, get attacked, and get downstairs was very short. During that time, Camenry would have to not only disconnect from the server farm but also activate the time travel protocols…which, as we saw, took a fair amount of time to cycle all the way through. So, basically, it was get chip, unplug, do time travel.
As another interesting exercise, imagine all of the Cameron scenes with the terminator being Garret (or Arnold) and not Summer. It’s weird, but it still works. Sorta.
So, who is in the future? I’d say it’s pretty much Cameron with some JH. In the past, Mostly JH, but now seeded with a little Cameron. As long as Mr. Murch keeps things running, and starts having it build smaller versions of itself, there could be material in the future that John and Cat might be able to use. After all, the basement of ZeiraCorp seems to be in the hands of the resistance in 2027.
@Kea,
This is for you. Happy Easter.
It’s not that far fetched to think that if this is a different, as I put it, “Bizzaro” Time Line then character motivations might be different.
Allison Young, the first time around, was portrayed as an innocent… a pawn and a sacrificial lamb in the machinations of John Connor and other big forces.
Her fate is still the same: she must die in order for Cameron to be “born.”
Why not put some spunk and an “evil streak” into this new “Bizzaro” Allison. John is warming to her… a little… just because she looks like Cameron. They become close, but only on a friendship level. He thinks he has found someone who is willing to help out in his quest in this time frame.
However, Allison is not what she appears to be. As I stated a few posts above, she has her own agenda and outlook on things. Because of a certain “mindset” she will truly betray John.
A neat little twist since we know that Cam’s “betrayal” was basically a good one… Allison Young’s, Cam’s human “dopelganger,” betrayal is very real and shocking to us and to John.
“Bizzaro” Allison was either aligned with Jesse (Old Jesse who survived because Derek didn’t kill her and let her go) to get rid of “metal” or she’s a Gray in league with Skynet.
John Henry has agreed to help John break into the belly of the beast, a Terminator manufacturing plant, to place Cameron into a new and improved body.
John [practically pleading with JH] Will you help me?
John Henry: Why should I do that?
John: Because I love her.
John Henry [cocking his head slightly]: Fair enough.
—
Allison and Derek agree to come as back up support. Remember, this is a different Derek, but still John’s uncle.
They are walking down the line of endoskeletons on display.
John Connor [looking around at the army of endos, in awe]: It’s like a twisted Macy’s Department Store.
Derek: And not a Santa Claus in sight.
John Henry [walking up to a particular model]: This one.
John Connor: Why that one?
John Henry: It’s tight.
John Connor [doing a double take]: Good enough.
—
John Henry and John have shut off the “alarm system.” They have the run of the place. They activate the assembly machine and the robot arm selects the correct endo. Derek is walking point. John instructs Allison to get into the body scanner.
Allison [looking startled]: Why me?
John [ever so slightly forcefully; a leader speaking]: Just do it…. please.
Allison hesitates, and then moves over towards the machine, and is about to step inside.
John: You’ll have to disrobe.
Allison [sarcastically]: Wonderful.
—
Allison’s pattern is placed into the system and the endo roles along the assembly line and into the Kaliba Systems tissue generation device [it looks the same as in the T2 teaser trailer]. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TctwLOSY4M0
John Henry [to John; he's sitting and has been plugged into the system]: Just a moment. [closes his eyes, the corners of his mouth turn up a tad, and then opens them]. Ready.
The tissue machine rumbles to life. On the screen:
KalibaCorp. Cyborg Tissue Generation
Model: [Unspecified]
Sequence: Initiated
Steam blasts out as the doors roll open. The steam clears and there stands Cameron, eyes open and blankly staring as they have wiped the installed chip clean. She is the same, lovely and flawlessly perfect, and yet her hair is in a different and more flattering style, draped and tastefully aligned as to cover her bare torso.
The camera trucks dramatically in on Allison’s stunned reaction.
Allison [finishing buttoning her shirt, freezes]: Dear God…. it’s me… what have you done, John?
John looks at John Henry weirdly [it's the hair]. John Henry smiles back impishly.
Allison has very slowly moved forward to stand in front of her twin. She’s frightened, and confused, and yet compellingly drawn toward it. She turns back to stare at John.
Allison: This… this is insane. What the hell is going on?
John [walking over to Cameron's inert form and lovingly draping his coat around her shoulders to cover her.
John [mumbling]: I’ll explain later. [he guides the compliant Cameron over to the chair next to John Henry, lays her back, and plugs her into the system. John Henry's eyes have closed as the transfer system is engaged and data starts streaming.
Allison [getting steamed; the light bulb going off over her head]: This is the “friend” you were telling me about, isn’t it? [grabbing John and turning him around] Isn’t it?
John is silent.
Allison [slapping him, hard]: You bastard!
John is stunned and yet doesn’t protest.
Allison: Why John? Just tell me why…
John [glancing at Cameron, his eyes soften]: I need her… she’s important.
Allison [marching over to stand next to Cameron and John Henry]: It’s a machine! They’re machines, John! They’re not important! I’m important, you’re important… we’re real! The only thing these monsters are good for are… scrap metal!
John: You don’t understand.
Allison [tearing up]: Oh, I’m beginning to understand all right! You’re in love with this… this thing, and that’s made you blind… and weak! She [meaning Jesse] was right about you! She was right. [whipping her gun out and pointing it right at Cameron's skull, right by the chip port].
John [sounding a bit dangerous]: Don’t.
Allison [tears streaming down her face]: Aim for the chip. That’s where they’re vulnerable. That’s what I was told.
John [reaching towards his gun; he pleads beseechingly]: Allison…
Allison [horror dripping from every word]: It has my face, John! It has my face! How could you…?! [her finger tightens on the trigger]
A shot rings out and echoes around the complex like a crack of thunder. Allison stares, wide-eyed at John (one last accusation), and crumples to the floor.
John is standing, thunderstruck, his arm still raised, and breathing hard. He lowers it mechanically, and backs slowly up and stumbles against the control workstation. He’s crying too.
Allison’s eyes are fixed and staring at Cameron… and Cameron’s eyes magically open. She sits up and pulls the cable from the back of her head. Her head turns and she notices Allison laying contorted in a pool of her blood. She walks and stands over her body, and then bends down, reaches out, and closes her eyes.
Cameron [with a hint of emotion]: I’m sorry.
She walks over to stand next to John who has his head in his hand and is sobbing, and puts her arm around him, in a moment of freak compassion.
Cameron [softly]: Let’s go home, John. Let’s go home.
John leans into her and continues to cry. Derek has come up behind the scene.
Fade out.
—-
John, Cameron, Derek, and John Henry are standing on a hillside overlooking the desolation and ruin. They’re around an unmarked grave for Allison.
Derek [walking past Cameron, now garbed in a resistance uniform]: She died for you. Don’t ever forget it. [he claps a comforting hand on John's shoulder and then walks off]
Cameron glances at Derek, but says nothing.
John Henry [to John in a gentle and childlike manner]: It had to be.
John is still silently introspective. John and Cameron, standing closely together, and John Henry stare out at the Land of Oz, the land of nothing.
Cameron [to John]: I hate this place.
John turns quizzically to Cameron. He is stunned by the blunt and uncharacteristic statement of opinion.
Cameron: There are no birds.
—
They continue to gaze out at a scene of destruction, of a land laid barren, that must not be allowed to be. They finally return to the past, where they belong… to fight the good fight for a better tomorrow: find Kaliba, stop Skynet… and reach for hope.
Allison will not have died in vain, and Jesse will not be proven right.
—
Happy Easter!
@ Robert - i agree
I enjoy how Summer has played Cameron - it would be difficult to get into a human character portrayed by her in Terminator, probably for the John character as well. For him, there will be questions for how a terminator sent to protect him in the past actually has a human counterpart in the future.
and I think that “Cameron” will be fully intact (her chip) just merged with John Henry to further the development and knowledge needed to help defeat skynet. JH may even create a Cameron terminator to send back to John once he gets settled and has embraced all the information from Cam’s chip.
I really feel for John in season 3.
So CJ, what you’re saying is easily conceivable for viewers and writers. But there was no clue in the filming of these scenes or the dialog, to indicate anything like that happened, and that it was anything more than Cameron sacrificing herself and giving her chip to JH. The camera shots showing her basically dead. As in, “Yep, she’s dead alright”. And her message sure looked like Good Bye.
Everything we’ve seen posted by fans is basically wishful thinking in how the writers might later explain bringing her back as the “same” Cameron.
I’m trying to make sure I caught everything Josh was implying with subtle dialog, quick camera shots showing some little detail, or whatever method he might have used. I really didn’t see anything else. And that’s what I was wondering because of all the fans saying Cam’s code is still on the chip. They’re just hoping I guess. There really was no indication.
@ Seven27,
I get it. Time travelers CAN change certain things about the past (eg. Cameron taking out the would-be presidential assassin term that came in the 1920’s) but they CANNOT change the events that were the direct result of their timetravel in the first place. This means they CANNOT stop JD, Jessie cannot get John to end his attachment to Cameron, etc. It also means the original timeline never saw the death of John Connor, but it did for some reason warrant the sending of Resistance fighters and the good terms., maybe to give the Resistance a better fighting chance in the future.
Maybe the Best SCIFI show on TV right now after BSG ended…
I watched the season finale and it seems to me that the show want to see the T4 movie and after that continue the show in the 3rd season…
i really hope 3rd season starts where T4 the movie ends and this season finale could mean something to the T$ movie, otherwise….
PS: Everyone knows who is Savanahh in the future right??
I mean they CANNOT change the events that were the direct CAUSE of their timetravel in the first place ***.
Cameron is OFFICIALY DEAD get over it.
Facts:
- John Henry had no chip in his head (Sarah destroyed it when killing Cromartie)
- John Henry was plugged on the turk servers which were the same as the small chip.
- John Henry had to be moved (CW indicates) and he couldnt with all the hardware.
- Cameron gave her chip to John Henry so he can OVERWRITE his data on her chip.
- John Henry did put her chip into his head, WHILE he was still plugged on the servers and possible before or meanwhile the procedure Cameron told him to leave a Sorry message for John.
- John Henry is now John Henry and there is no mixup of two AI’s on same chip. Cameron is officially DEAD, she sacrificed herself because she loved John so much and was worried she could hurt him.
If there will be season 3, then Summer will play Allison. If Cameron ever gets recreated in the future she WONT be the same Cameron as you knew, she wont have the same memories, the same “lovely” glitches etc..
there are no facts
only assumptions, dreams, wishes, hopes and fantasies - even when you are the writer on the show in question
unless you can view into the future yourself
That’s certainly the way it looked to me, Cam. Based on everything Josh gave us in this episode.
The only way he might have indicated otherwise was John jumping into the future thinking he needs to find and save her chip or something. But it felt like a futile effort to me. And by that I mean based on the clues given to us by Josh in his subtle ways.
@cameron
You don’t know what you’re talking about. She was obviously saved as a zip file.
@ Cameron:
don’t we know, form a certain deleted scene of T2, that part of the programming of a Terminator is on ROM? This part couldn’t be overwritten. It is also likely that on it there should be the core programming, the essential directives, the very nature of that terminator.
@Gary - From a purely technical point of view there is even less to suggest that JH transferred himself into the chip. I almost want to quote Cameron’s, “I don’t think you understand how we work,” but given that none of us really understands how these fictional beings work a lot of left for grabs. We are reliant, then, on what our technology is able to do and what we’ve seen in the past.
While a terminator might have several chips, only one is considered to be the “brain”. This wonder is not only a processing device, but a storage device (as we learned in “Vick’s Chip”). The essence of a terminator resides in this chip. As Cameron pointed out, the essence of a terminator is both in its software and it hardware (something Mr. Murch was also describing to Catherine). While it might be possible to download the contents of a “chip” to an identical chip, it’s extremely unlikely that you could download contents for an alien construct (e.g. the John Henry server farm) and have it function correctly into a chip that isn’t due to be manufactured for another 16 years or so. It would be like trying to get a program written to run under CP/M-80 to run under Windows (any flavor) even though the core of a Windows machine, its BIOS is still based on CP/M 80. Not an easy thing to do at all, and it never ever quite works right even if you do get it to run.
Also, there is the data transfer vs time factor. For JH to wipe and inhabit Cameron’s chip would require a massive download of data in just a few minutes. Let’s see…if we figure that a terminator chip is a one-half equivalent to a human brain (and that’s doing a great disservice to terminators), then that gives us a starting neural count about about 35 billion. Multiply this by the size an average neuron needs for storage, processing, addressing/connections, etc… we’ll be very conservative and add in four orders of magnitude (the usual brain is has about 4 orders of magnitude more connections than it does neurons) so that brings us to 350 trillion. But that’s just connections. We still need to add in the storage and processing. Even if it’s simple, it’s going to take room…figure another order of magnitude to 3.5 quadrillion. Converting this to 64-bit words (i.e. multiplying by
we have a final estimate of 28 pebibytes (PiB).
If we then allow 10 minutes for the time of the Connors’ visit to Weaver and the journey to the basement, that gives us just 600 seconds to overwrite Cameron’s alien computer architecture with John Henry’s. That gives us a necessary throughput of 500 trillion bits per second…and that’s assuming no time taken for chip removal, programming the chronoportation device, etc.
All I can say is that if JH has that sort of throughput, I want the name of ZeiraCorp’s ISP, because I get nothing close to that (my broadband is about 50 million times slower).
So…factoring all of that in, it seems unlikely that JH had the resources necessary to do anything more than to put Cameron’s brain into Cromartie’s chronoportable (i.e. undamaged) body.
From the “Will you join us” question exchange both here and “Today is the Day, Part 2″, it’s not difficult to assume that Cam and Cat are from essentially the same timeline and are aware of the same deal. Cameron’s chip traveling back to the future, as does CW, is a logical continuation of a renewal of that once-failed alliance.
From what we’ve seen, terminators seem more concerned with the brain than the body. Or do they? Will CW be as unsettled by JH acting like Cameron as JC will be by Cameron looking like Cromartie?
From my perspective at least, I don’t think Cameron went to the future be of any shipper issues. I think she’s in the future mostly because of scientific reliance on Occam’s Razor.
Don’t know how that smiley got there. It should have been an “8″.
For the record, I have no problem having miss Glau playing Allison. It will still be Summer Glau playing a character and I am sure, with good writing helping, that she’ll impart to this character everything needed to make her completely interesting.
Remember the vivacious and charming teen girl from the pilot?
@Gary,
She’s on the chip with JH. She said she was sorry, because she abandoned John, and didn’t tell him what was going on.
And yet, John knows that Cameron is still out there and is willing to travel with Catherine to get her back.
She did it for John.
And they had implied that the chip almost had infinite storage capabilities.
John has to convince John Henry to release her unique code into a new body, as I implied briefly, above.
Cameron is the character we enjoy. Allison is only a means by which to get to Cameron again.
John wants Cameron. He displayed disappointment that the girl he saw was not her.
Cameron is complex. Allison is easy.
Humans are boring in sci-fi and cyborgs and AI are intriguing.
Bring the real Cameron back!
Who sent the girl (Chola ) with the passports? What was up with her quoting ‘We lose everybody we love’
John called her, asked for new IDs and sent her to the priest, When she said ‘we lose everyone we love,’ she wasn’t quoting anyone, she was telling John that as one person who has lost to another. The writers could quit implying this stuff and tell you right out but then not nearly as much would happen and the episodes would bog down in details.
What was the priest’s message to Cameron?
To see that John followed Sarah’s instructions and left. The priest’s message from Cameron was “she’s coming”
John Henry and Weaver simultaneously say ‘We’ll see’ in response to Ellison saying that John will not leave his mother.
Are they trying to convince him to leave her? Is that their purpose?
Thay are trying to get Cameron to leave John and join them in their fight against Skynet
Did John Henry release the locks in the jail?
Of course he did, possibly a case of ‘the enemy of my enemy is my friend.’
Who sent the plane into the into the building?
The timing on the plane crash was perfect too perfect - Weaver must have orchestrated it.
Hello? Weaver’s man looking for the drone got killed. Kaliba sent the drone after Weaver/John Henry. Skynet/Kaliba doesn’t know she’s metal, it still thinks she’s the human, Catherine Weaver.
JH to Cameron: ‘I know you’
Cameron to JH: ‘and I know you’ (as in, I hacked into you?)
Neither hacked the other. She knows him because future John Henry is who sent the box with ‘Weaver’ in it to John in the first place. Going back in time to forge this alliance was probably Cameron’s most important mission after saving John.
Danny Dyson is missing? Following in his father’s work to create skynet? or trying to prevent it from happening too?
I figure he’s either bitter and wanting to build Skynet for revenge on the Connors or Kaliba has kidnapped him to make him do it.
Murch mentions that John Henry only exists as this specific hardware.
That makes me wonder if changing a wire ‘tweaked’ John Henry what kind of changes will ensue from being downloaded to a glitchy chip?
Where are JH / Cameron at the end? Cameron seems to have been downloaded into the Turk (hence the ‘I’m sorry John’ messages). So JH was downloaded on to Cameron’s chip and goes into the future?
I believe John Henry is on Cameron’s chip. I don’t know if Cameron is on it with him or not. She may have uploaded to the turk or she may have only left a message loop on it.
What is the significance of the chip from the T888 that Weaver fried?
Weaver didn’t fry it, it fried itself the same way as the one from contortionist terminator that Skynet sent to Dr Sherman’s office. Skynet redesigned it so it couldn’t be hacked. Weaver brought it to John Henry to see if he could hack it anyway so they could find out what the T-888 knew about Skynet/Kaliba.
My question is…did Cameron suspect that John would be willing to time travel to save her?
I don’t know if Cameron knew it but it’s possible future John sent Cameron to the past specifically because he knew it.
If she actually stops Skynet then Kyle doesn’t come back from the future and there is not JD and no John and no Sarah the warrior, just Sarah the Waitress and Skynet wins, unopposed… loopy-loop
Why? Time travel doesn’t depend on Skynet, Weaver can build a time machine. John knows where he comes from, he’ll want to make sure time travel is invented in any case and send Kyle back. It only breaks down if Kyle dies before he can be sent back.
Season 3:
I’d be looking for Sarah to look for Dyson, hunt Kaliba connections, maybe Ellison will help. That would be cut with scenes from how what she does affects John’s future. Maybe we’ll see changes she makes propagate through time and change John’s fate as it happens. He’ll have to send soldiers or terminators back from time to time to fight things Skynet sends back or to get intel to Sarah.
I think exploring how John is drawn to Alison but disappointed by her differences could be interesting. He knows if he wants Cameron back he has to let Skynet get to Alison. Will that be a moral dilemma for him or is there anything he can do to stop it if he wanted to? Also, don’t forget Alison’s personality was copied into Cameron to start with, she just can’t kick ass nearly as well. Whatever the male teenage viewers seem to think, John was always chiding her about being a killing machine, maybe he will welcome a warm, living, human version.
150k completed torrent downloads just from one site.
100k completed for Dollhouse
27k completed for Ghost Whisper
I for one quit watching Ghost Boobs (DH’s name for it) to watch Terminator.
Why would JH need to wipe out all Cams info? As John Henry has unique learning experiences in the basement with the Weaver family that made up his development, so has Cameron with the Connor family. She actually has more real world experiences than JH, he just got out of the basement. Yes JH had the internet an all the info he needed, but Cameron has had much more interaction with the outside world and humans. Seems to me both data sets would be very important, and remember Cameron was an unknown / special model cyborg that JH may need to have working knowledge of, so you would want the data from an intel point of view. It may even shed light on his “brother” depending on who or what built Cameron in the first place.
This is a totally new Future, unique and unto itself, that JH/Cameron and John Connor, and Weaver went to.
It has new rules and new characters who just look like the old ones.
I think the first couple episodes of Season 3 will be in the future, but once John has Cam and Weaver has John Henry and they have intel on Dyson and Kaliba… they’re out of there.
The Future scenes are just too expensive to focus on.
Like I said previously. This is Bizzaro Future with no John Connor to lead the resistance.
Connor… who?
This is his chance to realize that he’s needed elsewhere and is MUCHO important (the “It’s A Wonderful Life” schtick)…this strange land must not be allowed to continue. With this in mind… John Connor goes Back to the Past. He has learned his lesson.
In the end of the episode you can clearly see John’s dissapoinmtent when he understands that it is no Cameron he sees. Machines are his vice. He is not only in love with that gorgeous body, but with the artificial mind that goes along with it.
Cameron actually had to stop him from kissing her when he was on top of naked her
Why would she do that? (stop him)
I never got the impression that Cameron “died” when giving her chip to JH. I believe that by placing her chip in JH’s socket she could take over his body and bring JH’s AI to the future, thus we still have the same Cameron but in JH’s body (hopefully just temporarily or the jameron “storyline” would become even more awkward ;P. Besides, Summer Glau’s take on the character is simply amazing and it would be a shame not to explore the character and her “relationship” with John further!).
Another possibility is that Cameron’s and JH’s AI somehow merged either inside the Turk or sometime in the near future, helping Cameron getting even more “human” and hopefully overwrite her urge to kill John Conner.
As for season 3 I believe that if we keep up the good work with voting and discussing the series we may have a good shot for a new season. Most shows in the same situation would probably get axed but we have Terminator: Salvation coming up which will generate a lot of interest in the Terminator franchise and while both seasons have had its ups and downs, the last 6-7 episodes have rocked! Something people are beginning to realize (just look at Digg and i09). I only hope that the writers continue the trend from the latest episodes, that’s what most people want. I love both seasons as a whole, but some of the episodes earlier this season was really slow-moving and it just didn’t seem to add much to the overall story (*harkhark*Riley*harkhark*), I’m not saying that they should abandon it, just tune it down a little.
I also think that Fox have to take some of the blame for the low numbers, as someone wrote earlier; why not air it on Tuesdays with Fringe and some other Sci-Fi series? Giving it Monday and Friday was like dooming it from the start. I really love this show, its characters, setting and the way the story is heading, it had some slow episodes but it picked up the pace and has now reached true greatness. I really hope that Fox renew this for a 3rd season!
Come on guys, this is a fantastic story that takes fantastic liberties with the world we know. The writers could pen a way to bring back Cameron with the exact same personality with little more than an after thought. In fact I have thought of 3 possibilities, 2 of which I have already seen posted. The other may have been posted but with damn near a thousand post I could have missed it. What if the “Alison” we saw in the closing moments of the finale was indeed Cameron and she was there to infiltrate and assassinate the acting leader of the resistance. That being said John would need to find John Henry to retrieve his Cameron’s data, incapacitate the “new” Cameron and swap chips. Although purely speculative this fix would solve the notion that Cameron is gone for good. Its a science fiction show lets be real. They can do pretty much whatever they want.
I actually don’t really understand why future scenes are so expensive? All you need is several “good” abandoned building and construction sites and some rubble.
They don’t do much FX either.
Hell, come to Russia and film it here, the whole damn country is a big “future” dump like that, no need to build stuff.
I don’t have any trouble believing all the theories, and I totally understand what many fans want. I just want to make sure I caught all the subtle clues. That’s the way they do so many things on the show (excluding some of the deaths we’ve seen lately of course).
Browsing through the forums and this blog, with so many people saying Cam is still on the chip, I wanted to make sure there wasn’t something I interpreted the wrong way. I don’t think Josh really tried to imply she was still on there, the way the scenes were produced.
With all the stuff in Cam’s head / chip, the future plots with the sub and Jessi, the Derek interactions in the future, her going to the past to meet John, John Connor only got part of her story, we as the audience got to see hints of her full story, but John Henry will be the only one with her full story if he read or keep’s her data, that’s huge intel, I have to think he has it, if John Connor was smart enough to look at Vick’s chip, why wouldn’t John Henry look at Cameron’s?
@Roman: Best comment ever!
why not? she was at the library researching historical data each night and also was hacked into that transit monitoring system? wouldn’t those be needed things for john henry? besides all that she has seen and done as a terminator in the future and the past and the present. why couldn’t two AI’s memories/beings live on the same chip? im sure those chips were created to store massive amounts of data that we couldn’t comprehend.
john must know deep down whether or not she would still be intact or why would he leave to go get his girl?
Kea: Damn I’m looking forward to those pancakes!!
@Chris V. Not trying to be rude, it’s just an expression.
@ All who insist Cameron is dead. If the show is cancelled then they’re all dead, think what you wish. But, If there is a S3 anyone can see that they left the door open for a Cameron return. No body will put up the money to back another season without her because she is the guaranteed ratings maker. Josh proved it by writing her out of most of S2.
@Robert: Absolutely correct. There is something magical about Summer’s portrayal of Cameron. I wouldn’t mind a brief sub-plot with Allison as long as it lead to Camerons return. And, Josh would have to make it clear in the beginning of the first episode that Cameron was coming back or people will tune out again. But there is no doubt that the vast majority of viewers want to see Cameron.
@ innocent: a thermostat, very funny, I got a good laugh about that one.
@ Nick: Why do you say that a machine can never have emotions? I can see how it could be theoretically possible. AI’s are based on what we understand about neural networks. Our attempts have been to mimic the human synaptic response and create a learning computer. I don’t think anyone has correctly explained why we feel emotion or how it really works. Our understanding of the actual system is still in the infantile stages. But we have made many things work without completely understanding them. When we moved from the iron age to steel nobody understood the metallurgy of steel but they knew how to make it. So, if we put together a neural network that happened to function very closely to the human brain why couldn’t such a network learn to feel? Like I said, for Sci-Fi it only has to be plausible and I think this is. Cameron spontaneously dancing in the Demon Hand is a great lead in for such a story line where her neural net starts to create connections that allow her to “enjoy” and “feel” based on stimulus. I hope S3 will incorporate that possibility.
Also why would John Henry erase Cameron’s data when he has no knowledge of anything after 2009. He would need her information to navigate a world that he knows nothing about. Using this logic Cameron couldn’t be gone.
@Roman
i sudjest you to be careful with what you say!
Roman: I don’t know why she stopped him but she would have had to throw me across the room to get me off of her.LOL
As for your comment on filming in Russia, I hate to laugh but that was hilarious. Don’t worry though, we’re not far behind you. And if they don’t want to travel to Russia we’ve got Detroit.
Man, the last episode was amazing!!!
I’ll lose my mind, if i don’t get the 3d season!!
And the fact that John went to the “unknown” time to save Cameron, is just… well, i was speachless!
A Fantastic episode that left us in no doubt where they want to take this show. Please bring this show back for a third season. It deserves to be finished.