“And do you know why human life is sacred?”
“Because so few humans are alive compared to the number that are dead?”
Earthlings Welcome Here
Big Live Fox Fall Finale
Tonight @ 8PM/7PMc
holy. worthy of respect. venerable.
Posted on December 15th, 2008
by hadley
Category Air
Ellison and John Henry? Finally!
Can’t wait to see it :D.
Wow. Just….wow.
Really looking forward to Ellison and CroHenry discussing theology and philosophy.
Ooh…or Sarah and Derek? Cameron and John? Can’t wait!
Oooh I can’t wait.
Just out of interest does anyone know why us lot in the UK have to wait? We’ve3 only just had “Mr Fergison is Ill today”. *sigh*
I have a feeling that John is going to get me angry with the way he treats Cameron. I just hope that Cameron doesn’t turn or anything. And I think Jessie will get me angry also.
“And do you know why human life is sacred?”
“Because so few humans are alive compared to the number that are dead?”
Best.quote.ever.
AMAZING SHOW! Is Kyle coming back? What is going on with Jessie and why does she hate Cameron? I can’t wait hope u guys give us some things to feed us until Feb.
I was a little disappointed that there wasn’t more John/Cameron in this one, but still a great episode! Feb can’t come fast enough now.
Nice! Okay so maybe I don’t hate Riley as much anymore and if anything her character needed this Episode to give her some context. As for how it’s gonna turn out for her? My guess is she’s gonna wake up with her wrists sticthed up by Cameron figure she can’t be all that bad and shes gonna squeal on Jessie. Speaking of I now officially dispise her, and think she was the one riding the cycle.
As for Sarah 3 dot search? Wierd to say the least. Not sure what to make of that but my quess is what she saw at the end was obviously some sort of prototype drone.
As for the next Show? Is that Kyle or is that a Terminator designed to look like Kyle? Hmmm? It also looks like John mans up a bit and starts taking charge.
Now we wait. Ahhh its gonna be painful.
Come on season 3!!!
I am pissed! This season closer just angered me. After a season of John’s bad attitude and general lack on communication from everyone, for them to just end the season like this just stinks! and now they are changing the show to friday nights…..
I can’t wait for February!
Sooo… This AHK or whatever it is, is being built in the present then, and people are mistaking it for an alien spacecraft of some sort. I really like that your showing how different types of people react to machines in different ways. We of coarse get to see how John and everyone reacts, but we also see how James Ellison (a devout Christian) reacts to the whole situation, and now we see how the alien enthusiasts react to the killer robot situation. pretty interesting to say the least.
This episode really gave Riley more depth, and made her a much more likable and interesting character, which in my opinion was a bit overdue. I was pretty upset after she was involved with the Cromarti attack in Mexico, and had no questions to ask, from there on i knew something was wrong.
Well we saw kyle in the preview for the second half of the season so…
I’m thinking maybe kyle comes back to stop Jesse’s “get rid of Cameron” scheme. I cant wait for the February, I’m excited to see where all this goes. keep up the good work =]
It’s been 30 minutes and I’m already having withdrawal symptoms.
Jonathan Jackson!!!
*freaks out*
I loved the background on Riley.
I loved voice over.
I cannot wait until February.
WoW!!!….Let me just say WoW!!!! That was a killer episode, but I think it bites that we have to wait until February for another episode. Any word on whether or not we are going to get a Season 3? and a season 4, 5, 6, ……
I haven’t really liked Jesse since she first showed up. Yes, she has a job she thinks she needs to do, but damn, what reason did she have to haul off and hit Riley when she was just scared?
Please, please, please, please, keep this show going. There is a VERY loyal following which is what a show needs. Let it stick around for a good LONG while…
Brenda
A good, but not GREAT, cliff hanger.
WHY?, you might ask.
There are TOO many substories/subplots going on at once. You guys talk about The X-Files as one of your favorite shows, but you commit a story telling “sin” that not even The X-Files did in NINE seasons.
Pick ONE story and stay with it and flesh it out and allow more meat ‘n’ potatoes… or, if you will, flesh on the bone.
One example, you cut away from Riley covered in blood in the bathroom and lessen the drama and intensity of that moment.
If the CENTRAL story was about Sarah and the UFO phenomenon leading her to discovering a Hunter Killer assembly plant then STICK WITH IT.
Then have a SEPARATE episode for the John/Cameron/Riley/Jesse story.
If you have one about Ellison/Weaver/John Henry (Skynet) then have that as an ENTIRE episode.
From day one, I always thought that was a weakness with “Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles”… it’s too scattershot for its own good. Too many pieces of stories crammed into 41 minutes and not the whole pie. You don’t have to show all your cards, but you keep things FOCUSED each episode.
I hope to God you’ve fixed this problem in the coming episodes.
Truly, I do enjoy the show, but that does not mean I don’t see its glaring flaws.
And you’re going to need *a lot* more moments that feel like the classic James Cameron Terminator franchise to keep the interest up. That also means more humor, more sharp and snappy dialog, and more intensity when it counts.
John, Cameron, and Sarah and their core interaction has to REMAIN the central element. Too many other cooks spoil the broth.
It’s a decent TV show, but the rough edges are still showing.
I do not say this to hurt, but to help.
That’s what a fan does.
Perhaps Man-Lady’s employers were terminators, and they wanted a prototype HK built or something?
I think that Jesse is totally cool and is in the show to save John from the evil metal. She is tough and she needs to be. Reily deserved to be put in her place. Someone needed to say it.
That said, I think this episode was less satisfying then most because it left more questions then it gave answers. I think we needed to learn more from the he/she before she was killed. And the hypnotist could have come in usful in the future.
February can’t come soon enough! But why Fridays? That is the worst night for TV watching because everyone is out partying. Thank the machines for DVRs!
please we need more action for the back nine!
dereks need more action
john needs to start to wake up and be in more mission
riley need to die
and we need more of john and cameron
Fantastic episode. One scene really sticks out though, and it’s the one where Riley reacts to things in the present. Beautifully shot and acted, I even teared up a little bit. Easily one of the best scenes of the entire show.
Awesome!! Absolutely Awesome!
Loved the episode and now I’m going to go watch it again.
Thank you guys for such a cool show!
First: This is only 1 of 2 network shows I watch anymore.
Second: Can not wait for the new episodes! I bet I watch the episodes on this web site a dozen times before the new ones come out.
Finally: Please count my message as a vote for a third season! I really hope this show can just be picked up for a few seasons so the writers can make a full plot line with were the characters are going and what to do with all of them.
Good Luck!
Mark
Olympia, Wa.
I think an interesting twist on all that is going on with Agent Ellison, and much more especially the Triangle involving John and his bio vs. his mech girls, is if Cameron really becomes a feeling/caring machine that internalizes an anti-nihilistic morality and imparts it to the Turk. What if that is what Skynet is doing? It has determined that its initial course of action was in error, and wants to go back and undo it before it happens. THAT would be interesting.
Did you folks have to dance around the UFO person’s being transgender? It seemed pretty obvious, but his/her dialogue seemed to be oddly ambiguous. It was presented pretty well, IMO.
I thought the finale was going to be 90 mins.
Interesting show. I liked the added Ellison/Henry interaction and the return of Sarah’s delusions (Waitress Sarah vs Soldier Sarah) is a nice touch (and a Kyle Dream returns next, about time). Nice one with the progenitor HK as well. My only concern is this. Don’t lie to us. Period. Withholding information and spoilers is one thing, but you bald-faced outright lied again and again about Riley. Now, that either means that the Future Riley Plot was an addon rewrite retcon used to resurrect the character from so much fanhate (which I don’t get) or you really intended to decieve us and treat us like scum. DON’T. If you can’t talk around it, say nothing and let the reveals be valid reveals. We expect you to be the voice of validation and confirmation for everything not explicitly stated, shown, or explained in the shows, and now you have thoroughly betrayed that trust, and devalued your ability to realistically contribute to continuity outside the confines of the show as shot.
I completely agree with everything Dan Hitchman wrote. Well said. Criticize the show’s flaws where you see them, because there ARE flaws and the show won’t improve without people calling them out.
Another flaw that personally irks me, in this show and others, is the blatant, unwarranted, unnecessary insertion of RELIGION. Those tiny seconds of writing, inserted at the whim of a writer here and there, just screw up the entire hour for me. And not just ANY religion — heck, there are dozens to choose from — but it’s always the SAME one. I cringed when I heard Agent Ellison teaching the Terminator about his Christian God. Please! Not all of your viewers share Ellison’s views, not by a longshot, and it annoyed me to no end to see that piece of the show presented without any hint of a counterargument, no hint that Ellison might be full of B.S., no sense of irony, nothing. Just pure honest evangelizing — Ellison could almost have looked at the camera when he said his lines — BARF!
You know, if I was trying to teach a Terminator right from wrong, teaching him a religion’s views of the world would be the LAST place I would start. No wonder Judgment Day happens.
I just popped in another Blu-ray disc of Lost: Season 4 and watched a couple more episodes (don’t view it on TV since I don’t have HD satellite right now).
I then viewed the episodes with the question in mind: why do I watch such a ludricrous and daffy show with a plot that gets crazier by the hour? It’s the CHARACTERS and their HUMANITY. I stick with it because I feel for them and their weird plight.
SPOILER! The episode I just finished FOCUSED mainly on Jin and Sun and Sun having her baby in Korea in flash foward scenes. You’re led to believe that Jin is rushing to be with his wife at the hospital and is trying to buy a toy for the baby, only to find out that you’re watching Jin BEFORE he got on the doomed jet liner, and the toy is for an employer.
Jin had actually died, but you don’t know why yet. Hurley flies in to be with Sun as she presents the baby to Jin’s gravesite.
It was a VERY effectively written, acted, and staged episode. I actually shed some tears when I found out that Jin had actually died and he’d never get to see his daughter.
The reason I was satisfied was because the writers FOCUSED on these two characters. You saw their deep love, their heartbreak, their anguish, their joy, and Sun’s sorrow. However, you also saw how much they cared for each other.
Yes, you had a few snippets with other characters, but it just enough to move the main story forward, but the BULK of the episode (95+ percent) was set aside for Sun and Jin.
To much the same extent, the previous episode was devoted to some of the backstory of Juliet.
—-
That format allows the characters to be fleshed out and the viewers attention is drawn into one or two people’s lives or perdicaments.
If you had done that with John and Cameron (or just John or just Cameron), or Sarah, or Riley, or Ellison, or Weaver… you’d suck the audience in and allow us to get more DETAIL into how they tick and more emotionally attached.
I know you had two episodes that dealt a little with Cameron, but you added a bunch of other stuff into the mix that made the stories lose their focus and took precious time away from her story. I use that as an example.
—
I hope I’m making my point and I thank you for taking the time to read these posts. Not just mine, but everyone else’s as well.
That had to be my favorite line in that episode.
Alright guys, I’m gonna have to be completely honest here: I didn’t really feel it. I loved the John/Riley/Cameron stuff but the Sarah storyline felt really flat. The end was even…dare I say…boring. I don’t know, I think the Sarah stuff could’ve been wrapped up a lot quicker and we could’ve had more John/Cameron or possibly even some Derek.
From what I’m reading Cameron and Derek seem to be your guys’ most liked characters (mine are Derek and John) but they don’t seem to be used at all anymore. Sure, they get their occasional episode but they need interwoven story lines again. That’s just how I feel, but I’ll trust you guys.
I was very surprised to see Kyle in the teaser and I don’t know how I feel about that, but hey…let’s see where it goes! And…once again…more Derek please. He’s the top reason I tune in every week and when he’s not on my (new HD!) TV screen I’m sad.
What Dan Hitchman said (the first time).
I miss the Cameron/John stuff.
TOTALLY LOVED the John Henry/Agent Ellison stuff!
I LOVE THIS SHOW!
Dan Hitchman, reading your posts I can’t help but agree with a lot of stuff you say. I love the show like you, but… there could be some more focus.
My favorites are Derek and Cameron, and well, I don’t feel they got a lot of development (cameron slightly more with the allison episode). I am hoping to more in the next nine, and I can’t wait for them to show!
And to all T SCC fans, have a nice christmas and a great new-year!
Jessica:
I’m just the opposite… I’d love more CAMERON. Let her step forward more often then just standing as a pretty backdrop.
I don’t like this John Connor right now. I just do not.
Sooo… let’s have Cameron take charge for a bit, and then John gets his arse in the game too (for once!). Then they work together and start really acting proactive.
Wow! How about getting John, Cameron, and Sarah back as a REAL team again?! Positive thinking, guys, positive thinking! Enough of this tearing each other apart crap!
How about showing Sarah looking over some plans to break into a facility. Cameron is looking on too and John comes over and actually puts his two cents worth in… he sees something that Sarah has missed and he point it out.
Then they both start talking strategy, and Cameron sides with John! Cam’s impressed and proud because her man’s gifted brain (to this point, sadly unused) has seen something both Sarah AND Cameron have missed and just plain overlooked.
The REAL John Connor is starting to show up and play some ball! And he likes it!
Then have some more of John and Cameron working together and getting closer as they do so.
And then you have more episodes of just John and just Cameron on missions.
Then wind up with them basically a team that compliments each other. They are PERFECT for each other, made for each other in all things and balance their strengths and weaknesses (both mentally and physically).
In the process you DON’T have to tear down Sarah to build up John. She’s happy to see John Connor emerging from his shell. This is why she’s around!
John Connor CANNOT do this on his own. He’s only human. It takes the unique talents of EVERYONE (man, woman, and lady cyborg) to win. He just MUST learn to focus the thinking of the group and use his noggin’.
TEAMWORK. TEAMWORK. TEAMWORK.
John is happier, Cameron is happier, Sarah is happier. They love each other and are for each other. They are a STRONG unit, a strong FAMILY.
Then Skynet better shudder and quake!
Dan, about that Lost episode you referenced: it wasn’t a mid-season finale.
Earthings Welcome Here is more comparable to any of the seasons finale of Lost. How many plot-lines do they leave unanswered? All of them. Season Finale’s aren’t character building episodes, where everyone sits around and discusses their feelings. It’s meant to raise a lot of questions, and move the plot forward at the same time. Come February, we will have a lot more of those intimate moments that we love so much.
Secondly,if the writers had focused only on one of the many plots in this episode, we would be complaining that they ignored the other story-lines. Either way, the writers would be taking some heat.
How could they have done a mid-season cliffhanger that ignored 3/4’s of the characters involved? All the story-lines are inter-woven and will connect each other, eventually. This episode is merely a bridge, leading us to the answers we seek.
All good things come to those who wait.
thecolours,
I don’t think you got the point I was trying to make. I wasn’t just talking about THIS episode, I was talking IN GENERAL, as in a fundamental story telling weakness that should be shored up for the ENTIRETY of the show from now on.
And no… “Earthlings” didn’t really seem like a mid season cliff hanger. More like a regular episode. There wasn’t a lot of pulse pumping OMG! I MUST see the next half vibe to it.
Now, BSG had some CLIFFHANGERS! The half season bridge episodes seemed like real NAIL BITERS and were very epic in scope.
You aren’t getting much touchy feely stuff because instead of ONE central story line each episode you seem to be getting snippets of three or four lumped into a short amount of time. The central story isn’t allowed to breathe.
THAT is what I’m talking about.
Great episode. You always give just enough information to lead us down at least ten different paths–most of them wrong. I guess that’s why I have to keep watching so I can see what’s really going to happen
The UFOs have to be HKs right? Ah, probably wrong. I’m learning my lesson.
Jesse. I just can’t figure her out. She has to be working with someone right? And you actually made me feel really sorry for Riley. The direct correlation is the chess match between Ellison and John Henry. Riley is the pon and Jesse obviously doesn’t care what happens to her. But! If Riley is supposed to keep John and Cameron separated, it seems like a stupid way to go about it. Obviously Jesse must know one of the Connors or Cameron will figure it our sooner or later, and if Riley lives, I’ve got a feeling it’s going to be sooner. And Jesse keeps giving the story that John of the future is too attached to Cameron. If John of the future is so dang attached to Cameron, why did he send her to the past? She obviously has more than one mission programed into her, and it’s not protecting John or endearing herself to him. And Jesse has apparently been in the present for quite some time and never bothered to contact Derek. Theirs seemed to be a chance meeting with a quick cover up by Jesse (Oh, hi baby). And I think Jesse brought Fisher into the mix just to give Derek some reassurance that she was on his side. Older Fisher was no longer useful, so Jesse could dispose of him safely. She probably never guessed Derek would go for the younger Fisher so had to shoot the older one quick and make up another story. I’m really starting to smell a rat and I’m positive Derek does too. After tonight’s episode the rat is really starting to smell. Again, I can think of about ten deferent scenarios. I can hardly wait till February to find out that all ten of them are wrong! J
As for Ellison, why would he even want to talk to his ex-wife again? 911 or not, I can’t even imagine how someone would feel learning the person they felt closest to and trusted the most had taken it upon them self to kill your first child. I have seven children (same wife, still happily married, and we both love SCC). I have a neighbor who is Chinese. Both he and his wife love Taiwan, but since they were limited to only two children there, they felt they had no alternative but to immigrate to the USA. They now have five very beautiful and talented children. I know a lot of your fans love non-stop terminator action, and we like action too, but people like us also appreciate the many really soul searching moments you add to the show.
I think I need to build an altar to Natalie Chaidez so I can worship her brilliance daily. *bows*
That episode blew me away. Amazing.
A few little things I loved about this ep.
Funny lines:
“Well we all know how reliable bloggers are.”
“The room is so adorable. How could you not like it?” “Because I’m not eight…The minute she took off out came the paintbrush.”
Getting to see more of Riley’s back story, even though it meant hating Jesse for how she treated/treats her. Loved the writing & directing of her in the hotel room for the first time as she touched and smelled wonderful things she’d never experienced before. Excellent acting on Leven’s part.
John’s t-shirt - crop circles, cogs of a wheel, whatever the rings were supposed to represent - very cool
Use of the waitress imagery.
There’s more I enjoyed but it’s late and I’ve got my own kid to homeschool in the morning.
“You aren’t getting much touchy feely stuff because instead of ONE central story line each episode you seem to be getting snippets of three or four lumped into a short amount of time. The central story isn’t allowed to breathe.”
Dan, I understand your point. The writers need to focus only on one storyline, and expaned upon it. But, even if they were to do that, people would complain that they spent to much time focusing on one storyline, while ignoring the others like a bastard child. They can’t win.
For better or worse, the writers have taken us down this multiply storyline path. And, it won’t be until season 3 that they would - or could - change that format.
Okay, I could easily get stuck here all night commenting on all the facets of tonight’s episode, but I’m going to try and stick to just one or two more. Some people seem to be fixated only with John falling in love with his favorite computer (Dan, I enjoy a lot of your comments, but how many people are really going to fall in love with their PC? Hmm, I guess if your Mac looked like Cameron you might, but you wouldn’t seriously expect a relationship, because in the back of your mind you’d know the machine was only going to do exactly what it was programmed to do. And I guess that’s part of the appeal of her character. 99% of the time John understands that she is a machine, one that his future self programmed, but when she’s saving his life or acting very human there is an emotional element created that blurs the reality checking mechanism a little).
At-any-rate Skynet obviously did not come about in the first place without a lot of money and human help. In the Terminator movies and in SCC we are introduced to a couple of the people involved, but we never are led to the actual organization because these leads are terminated. If Cameron is telling the truth, then she doesn’t know who built skynet and neither does John of the Future. They only know where it’s built. Of course now that the war of the future has begun to span time itself with both man and machine sending incursions into the past, the question of who builds skynet in its latest iteration becomes a little more jumbled. Still, it’s not likely to happen with out money, bribes, big business, big government, and humans. The assassin on the motorcycle moved like a human. When thrown from the bike, the assailant jumped up and ran to the bike like a human wanting to keep from getting shot, not like a terminator who couldn’t care less about bullets. Does this mean we are getting closer to the human skynet organization?
Lee,
I thought the whole point, unless for some strange reason they’ve scrapped it (probably to the ruination of the very show if that’s the case), was that Cameron is supposed to be coming to an equal footing with humans. Isn’t that what Sarah said in The Demon Hand AND in James Cameron’s classic T2? I really think so.
If, at the end of the day, all this going round and round the issue ends with her as a walking MAC or PC then we’ve all just wasted a whole lot of time and I would stand up and say LOUDLY that Josh Friedman doesn’t know what he’s doing and I’d continue to think the story ended at T2.
Hopefully, and I’m betting on it, that that isn’t the case.
I would hope and wish for something WONDEROUS and AMAZING out of all the effort. Something that would make us all stand up and cheer.
Of course, this probably would never happen unless someone sprinkled magical pixie dust over Arnold Schwarzenegger that spelled him do a cameo on TSCC just for fun rather than a big, fat pay check, but I would find it wildly cool if the head of the robot resistance movement was:
An Arnold T-8xx Model 101 that created or adapted the most advanced Terminator yet, Cameron, in the first place instead of Skynet.
Basically making Arnold Schwarzenegger, The Governator himself, Cameron’s “father” creator.
An early model that has had associations with Sarah and John Connor (as would-be assassin and protector) has become willing to accept humans in some way, and created something far more advanced than itself for a special mission. Cameron is the singularity for good and for hope. Tin-Miss just needs to learn and to grow and find her heart before she can take on that mantel.
The only thing I see John Connor ever really doing to Cameron’s chip is to blow the dust off it. All the changes are coming from WITHIN her.
Like present John, Cameron needs to mature as well. John, through fits and starts (mostly fits right now… grumble, grumble), is becoming the man he needs to be, and Cameron is becoming (for all intents and purposes) the woman she needs to be. Hence, they’re both portrayed as teenagers for the moment.
I’ve, personally, always seen how they could almost do this whole John/Cameron-ship as a more hopeful version of Romeo and Juliet.
Two completely different family clans, one human (the Connors/Reeses), one cyborg (I guess you could say, the Phillips). Both have been warring and sparring for ages. Along comes the son of the Connors, John, and here’s the daughter of the Phillips, Cameron.
They meet and fall in love. It wasn’t supposed to happen, but it did (call it Karma, call it Cismid… call it magic… whatever). The VERY, VERY definition of star-crossed lovers.
Their union is what brings the two parties together and united in a common cause to stamp out Skynet, who’s time is at an end. It’s time to relegate it to the trash heap of history because all it can do is HATE.
Of course, that doesn’t mean there aren’t elements or pockets within each group that are very resistant to this bizarre peace. [cough]Jesse, Derek, maybe Sarah and Riley[cough] and other Terminators still loyal to Skynet.
Hope and love is on the way thanks to John and Cameron and their strange and mystical union.
That’s my thought for the day.
wow interesting comments dan and i agree with most of them. It was a good episode but not a good cliffhanger, i really think it should of been a double episode.
I really do think that all the storylines are far to lose at the moment, i am sure they will be tied soon more or less but its confusing sometimes.
As Dan has mentioned, the episodes are sometimes really scattershot and its annoying.
Where is derek, come on you need to have all the cast in most episodes.
I enjoyed the episode as i always do but i kind of lost where this is all going!!
You know what we all would like is a christmas present. How about the next episode if its filmed released early for christmas!!! Please …. have a good christmas to everyone working on the show
@Dan, are you a writer trying to feed us clues to where this is all going. Because that could be a very plausible outcome. We all saw how Cameron in Allision in palmdale saying she wants peace, there are those of us who wants peace etc.
This could be a possiblity. Also people have said their are hints at kyle reese somewhere in the last episode. Can someone point me to it? i must of missed it
well, if you have followed somewhat as I have, since the actual movie you can see it all coming together. Problem is- they are so close to the end I have no idea how they will make it last another season… let alone the next couple years as we want it to. Also, to those who arent aware.. “the end of humanity is immenent” (or something like that) John Conners will change that. I really wished I could see more.. is there a chance the first movie can be viewed onsite, along with the others????
i’m thinking Dan is not a writer.
but he may have stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
=)
Excellent episode, but the endless stacking of teasers upon teasers is just beyond annoying at this point. I liked the Sarah stuff, though. Whether she was crazy, hallucinating after being shot or something else, the show would be a hundred times better if she had been written this well throughout the season. Too bad we have to wait for two months to find out if the episode was a Mobius strip.
And what is with the 2009 promo? I sure hope it doesn’t mean that Kyle Reese will become a regular on the show. That just sounds like the mother of all the contrived bad ideas waiting to happen, all just for the sake of cuteness.
Say it isn’t so, Fox.
I thought that “Earthlings” was deliciously complicated but frustatingly unfocused (a nod to SOME of Dan Hitchman’s comments above).
Character By Character
Riley
I loved Riley’s backstory (future history) and the fact that she attempts/commits suicide. Her character has gone from contributing an ounce of naivete to providing a pound on nihilism. This may represent the climax of the suicide theme that has been running through this season. The fact that Cameron might have been the straw to break the camel’s back was a nice touch. The scene where John cradles Riley while Cameron looks on with menacing vindication is priceless. (I love that terminator, but she scares the heck out of me).
John
The suicide drama offers John some character development because he clearly flirted with that earlier this season. It is fitting that he, not Sarah, is the one to deal with the bloody aftermath. It drives home the point that suicide has a profound impact on survivors, not simply the person who commits the act. So this worked for me in terms of John’s growth, which has been agonizingly slow so far this season (hint, hint).
Cameron
I pumped my fist (figuratively) when Cameron stood up to John’s request for her to get more paint. I love that she is no longer passive in regards to the menial tasks the Connors seem all too willing to pile on her. Our favorite terminator has a “job” that countermands all others, and she was clearly on mission (she even did her “mission walk”). Shiny!
Sarah
I love that you continue to bring Sarah’s mental health into question. Sixteen years of unrelenting stress does have a cumulative effect; however, in some weird way, Sarah’s delusions act as a sixth sense that points out discrepancies that her conscious mind doesn’t fully grasp. I worry about overusing this device because after a while it may make Sarah seem psychic. So I’d really like some exposition on how Sarah got turned on to the 3 dots in the first place. Please don’t leave that particular point unexplained this season.
The one thing I definitely didn’t like with Sarah’s storyline is that she naively drove her Jeep all the way down to the warehouse after everything that occurred. It just didn’t make sense to me. She’s just witnessed two murders related to that warehouse, and she drives all the way down there, not knowing who was there (terminators, a la “Heavy Metal”), and what they would do to her. This flies in the face of the paramilitary training that Sarah possesses.
Jesse
Jesse is now a true villain in this tale. Her monomanaical focus on Cameron has driven Riley to suicidal extremes. I see Derek having to make a gut-wrenching decision in the near future. A delicious complication for sure.
Ellison/John Henry
Masterful. Chilling. Loved it. Need I say more?
Conclusion
So obviously I liked many things about this episode. Now, here’s where I think Dan Hickman (above) has a point. Pursuing so many storylines in one sitting left me with a vague sense of dissatisfaction. I didn’t feel sated by what I just consumed. I felt the episode would have been more impactful if it had focused on either the Riley suicide issue or Sarah and her 3 dots revelation. Focusing on both gave us too little of either.
As a viewer, the commercial breaks come too quickly when there are 3 separate storylines that require exposition. By the end of the hour, I was tantalized by what I saw, but also frustrated. It feels like too much foreplay. I have been teased for far too long, and now I think I’m just being strung along. My date just left me high and dry for the next two months. Should I continue to date her? I love this girl, but at some point she’s gonna have to put out.
@logan, amazing points and i really hope the writers actually take note of our comments and we see a change in the coming episodes. I know they are filming some already but the ones after that. PLEASE Writers take note of your fans and their views.
Also we MUST find out whether we have another season or not. Please let us know asap, you must have some information to tell us
It was a nice episode overall although a little boring. I needed just a little bit more action and I do agree with people that too many stories are crammed in it.
I would love to see more action, more Cameron in action. More Cameron - John interaction, romance, friendship. I’d like to see you guys explore their relationships more.
Hope we’ll get all that in abundance after a break.
We were a little disappointed last night. It did not make sense that (1) Sarah would show up at the hypnotist’s house and even though there’s a room full of clients the woman stops everything to help them (2) Sarah would be surprised that the bad guys (who just shot at them minutes before this) would go in and kill the hypnotist and the guy/gal/blogger. We sure weren’t surprised. While this is was not one of the best episodes we’ve seen, we are still looking forward to Feb 09, and if they have reruns we’ll watch last season again.
Ok, maybe this was so obvious none of you mentioned it… but didnt anyone else think that the guy/gal blogger was sarah connor from the future? Firstly, the line where she says “she almost killed us, can’t you feel it?” the way she says is sounds like, she means they are the same person, definately when she says ‘can’t you feel it’ she seems to be saying more than ‘couldn’t you feel the bullets’. Also, when she is talking into the mic, she says everything that happens to sarah, except for the 5 people. I don’t know what this means, but possibly it means the other sarah’s, the mother, the seeker, the soldier the waitress, the conspiracy nut. “Your the fake” as if they both know each other, or think they do, but think that the other is just faking who they are.
and then she says, “they don’t know, i’m a waitress”, and she says, ‘no matter what happens, i’m not going back to the way i am’ and ‘your a type a’ possibly refering to the different lineages that sarah connor takes. And it seems, that possibly the machines knew that she was obsessed with the dots (perhaps thru cameron) and so sent her the ‘UFO’ to make her believe in it, and become a recluse. i.e. the blogger. Perhaps the ’spaceship’ sends her back in time, who knows. But why would ‘abraham’ open up to Sarah Connor and no-one else? And why the no-fate again, because they choose where they end up, and there are many places she could go. Did no-one else get this? maybe im nuttier than alan park. But just watch it again, assuming they are the same person, and think about it.
“no matter what happens, i’m not going back to the way i am” = “No matter what happens, im never going back to what I was”
What does that statement mean? She seems so unhappy with the way sarah is, maybe she means, i won’t go back to being you.
I found Leven’s performance last night especially strong; her scene with Jesse in the hotel room made me feel so much for her character. Much kudos to her! The other subplots were also riveting: John/Cam/Riley at the house and Ellison/Henry. Awesome scenes.
Now though, I have to say that I found Sarah’s arc/plot the least bit engaging. And please believe me, it hurts for me to say this because I simply love this show to a fault.
And when it ended, I could not help feel real fear when I saw the previews for February:
Kyle Reese in their present? Please, don’t do this =/
The promo for next episode scares me to death… Please don’t break my heart. I don’t care how it would/could make sense. Leave Kyle Reese be.
This show does NOT need controversial risks like that.
On the promo for episode 2.14 it looks like the guy who gave Weaver the Turk programme is at the funeral.
Hopefully the Weaver/Connors storylines will merge in the second half of the season. I’ve been dying to see more Weaver since the treat that was “The Tower…”
From the promo at the end of the episode it looks as if Team Connor will be back together.
Is it Feburary yet?
Ok, after reading a lot of peoples comments I want to say my piece. I really liked this epsiode a lot. I loved how Cameron said “That tattoo is tight, I may get one” and I also liked how she stood up and said “I have a job to do also.”
I can’t stand Jessie, she hit Riley for no reason at all. I don’t understand why Jessie hates Cameron. Obviously Cameron is closer to John in the future and Jessie doesn’t like it.
Personally I like the multiple storylines and I liked how the cliffhanger ended with Sarah. When she saw that the guy was an AC guy I actually thought he was and that Sarah picked the wrong barn. That is until he pulled a gun and shot her.
I honestly believe there is a machine resistance beacuse of what Weaver is doing. Why trust Ellison when Skynet sent a terminator to kill Ellison? Remember Cromatie said “Skynet doesn’t trust you”.
Pretty cool how Kyle is back, but I’m sure some people around here won’t like it. I like it a lot. Regardless of if its the real Kyle or a fake one.
As for Sarah being naiive, I think she was just looking for answers and didn’t think that she would need to bring in extra firepower.
Can’t wait till Feb!
By the way, I think that Dilenhunt is a great actor. Do you know how hard it is to play a part where in 2 seasons you are a killer, and now your basically a child learning? With no emotion in any of them. Great job by him.
@Tammy: I dont know who we is. I wasn’t dissapointed in the episode at all. I didn’t think that someone was going to shoot Abraham and the hypnotheripist. Does it really matter why the group left? I mean come on it is tv right?
@Roman: While I love Cameron a lot and like her to be in the show more. Remember this is called The Sarah Connor Chronicles. So the show should be focused on Sarah. John and Cameron are backdrops (while still very important)
Eric:
Different religions take very different views of the true meaning of “sacred”. For some it is unattainable while for others it is as simple as breathing. Skynet and its wrath in reigning down fire on mankind has always had an Old Testament-Yahweh vindicativeness in its magnitude. For Agent Ellison to share his deeply held Judeo-Christian beliefs with the emerging Skynet may be a clue as to where the idea for Judgment Day came from, rightous indignation. Just a theory…
I really liked this episode. I thought the use of UFO’s and the connection to the future machines was right on. Well, thats what I came up with. I’d hope that Sarah would have brought Derek into this episode. Want to see more of him forsure. They should be working as a team.
Dan,Logan, Drew: kudos. Your observations are spot on. But, again, I think it is pointless to try and write the scipts FOR the writers and producers of the show; it is a rollercoaster ride in the dark, and there’s know way we can predict what is ahead of us (it’s meant to be that way: otherwise what’s the point of watching!).
This should have been two hours though, so we had more a chance to obsorb the intricaties of these multiple threads - both past and future. The writers should keep that in mind. I think they missed their mark and shaved off too much: we viewers are bleeding, and only the most loyal will want to go back for more “quick cuts” rather than SOME satistfaction!
Riley’s backstory was not enough, and you took her away from us (seemingly) the moment we actually started to care about her…). You made Jesse a villian, who doesn’t care about her fellow humans (feelings), and treats her comrades like the CIA views their “assets” as expendible. How long were they here already to get so acclimated? Jesse looked as if she had seen nice hotels before. But Reese said he was what, 15 when JDay hit? If Jesse has been back here before, how did she get back to her future and why not just go get a few nukes in old Russia or China or Pakistan and take them back to re-blow up Skynet?
For any who are interested, you can do the same regression bit - without regression or hypnotism (which is very dangerous). Go READ the book Dianetics and SEE for yourself. Come to your own conclusions, but what man (the “[owers’s that be” says they know about how the human mind works is hogwash!). You can learn about the sub-consious and what affects it can have on you - and what to do about it - in about four hours of reading and application. You can teach it to a 6th grader in half that time. IF you knew, you’d free this world of a LOT of crazy assumtions that keep “modern” man like a rat in a cage: technologically advanced, but mentally, emotionally, physically, and spiritually degraded. We use only a tiny fraction of our true abilities.
If Sarah had these kinds of tools, it wouldn’t make her task of finding killers robots from the future any easier, but it would enable her to handle her better. Ditto, John, Reese, etc. too.
Cameron is another matter. Our human brains hold about 6 months of data. This was proven as far back as the late 1940’s by scientists. The brain is just a big FM radia sender/reciever, connected to a central wiring system that furnishes commands FROM the mind. Only problem is science doesn’t KNOW where the mind is. God’s creation?
When you close your eyes and picture a cat, who SEES the cat in your mind’s eye? You are not your eyes, your brain, or your mind. They are parts you use; tools - but they are not YOU. Does making the making of Cameron (or Weaver - who seems a LOT more smarter and cunning) make their creator God?
Lastly, I know Sarah went “off the grid” but this ep brings up an interesting point: there are a LOT of the scientific community out there looking for “answers” too. Just look at the movies “What the Bleep Do We Know” or “The Secret” for some of the most highly decorated mind’s views on this.
IMO Sarah would have done well to research and find some quantum physicists that might be interested in her subject matter. She did that with once with a programmer - although I don’t a T-101 has to sheath the skin on his arm every time to prove it.
I was at the Stanford Research Institute (SRI - they built the computer mouse and a LOT of other stuff in a LOT of various fields) earlier this year and had lunch with several scientists there. You’d be amazed at their views on things. Most of them really believe that our universe is most “empty” space (space within space) but there is something holding it all together that we can’t see and they haven’t been able to fathom yet. But they speak of these things in awe of them (from the macro to the micro) and in reverence to them.
Just like Ellison. I had wondered why he would turn to Weaver - and why he stays on with her. We can all see the results.
Many scientists have gone down a path of curiousity that have led to dire consequences for mankind.
Lastly, I want to know why every single thing that is agin us (robots, vampires, aliens) are always so much stronger than humans? We have guys on the WWE that are freakishly strong, and every ep is about the bigger one pounding on the weaker while self-worshipping his own power. Comic book stuff.
Rarely do we see something really formidable that isn’t based upon some teenaged boyhood fantasy about what true power is. Glad to see a more mature USA President who doesn’t hold to that b.s. either.
Weaver is a well thought out new type of villian that has grown upon me because she make you THINK, rahter than walking into a hail of bullets. Some guys did that knocking over a bank and LA and that’s why we have SWAT teams everywhere now.
For the T:SCC crew, Weaver is operating, manipulating, killing, and getting “her” way - and Sarah, John, and Reese don’t even know about it. Cameron may not either.
But we don’t even know what Cameron is really all about. Ditto Reese, Jesse or Riley!
What I’d like to see more of is John coming to realize that his mom is the ONLY one with ONE singular purpose. Mom’s are, IMO, the single most valuable resource in this universe! John’s gonna learn that when she’s gone.
Food for thought.
I really dig this forum, beacause the people here are as smart as the show, and few here are into “drive by” comments of little depth. I listen to my 15 year old nephew play GoW online and cringe at the lack of tactics they use for their comm line, but throw a barrage of non-stop insults at each other, even their own teammates in the heat of battle.
Maybe our future soldiers will suffer this growing malady. Or maybe they will come to realize that observation, caring and commitment are more than just empty words.
Is this what John comes to realize? Is this why he is so hesitant to kill? And Sarah too? Is this something Derek is learning? But not Jesse (yet)? Certainly, they wouldn’t hesitate to kill a Gray, if it meant they would save others by doing so? Where’s the “natural morality” kick in? Are there Bibles in the future, religion of any sort? A Bill of Rights to live by? What Code? Does John set one? Does he set up a Council to administrate it?
It’s great to fight the good fight, and go out in a blaze of glory defending a principle or a plot of land. Its much harder to LIVE by those principles, in a manner where everyone’s rights are protected and defended. Just look at the USA. We live here; hasn’t happened here (fully) yet.
I find it interesting that at the start of the season Ellison told Cromartie he would never do the Devil’s work.
Since that episode, in effect, he has.
dashibbit,
Didn’t stay at a Holiday Inn, but I’m sure the writers think I stayed at a Motel 6! LOL!
I LIKE having something more LITERARY embedded into TSCC. The idea that they would use The Wonderful Wizard of Oz is a cool idea.
Using Romeo and Juliet (WITHOUT the two dying at the end) as a basis for John and Cameron’s love affair and their ability to look past their major differences and love each other deeply. Enough that Cameron can overlook John’s stupidity at the moment too! And John can forgive Cameron for trying to kill him in a moment of glitchiness.
I’m HOPING, HOPING, HOPING that the “Good Wound” episode title is an indication that Cameron’s chip damage is leading her to evolve. That the bomb inside her head is not what she fears. She just doesn’t understand that it has allowed her to gain HUMANITY and insight into EMPATHY even if she isn’t really human. Those elements have crept up on her.
Cameron has a real emotional outburst and John questions her statement that she can’t feel because she’s a machine.
Cameron turns to John, with a twinkle in her eye (she’s a little amazed at herself too): “Apparently I lied.”
I absolutely love Peter Gabriel’s poetry.
Here’s a powerful song that embodies primalness, of getting back to our roots and escaping, for a time, modernity. I kind of see this as Cameron embracing her larger destiny as “MORE THAN THIS” and her new found emotions. It uses the imagry of MUSIC and DANCE.
Take a listen, please. You might just be amazed.
“The Rhythm of the Heat”
Looking out the window
I see the red dust clear
High up on the red rock
Stands the shadow with the spear
The land here is strong
Strong beneath my feet
it feeds on the blood
it feeds on the heat
The rhythm is below me
The rhythm of the heat
The rhythm is around me
The rhythm has control
The rhythm is inside me
The rhythm has my soul!
The rhythm of the heat
The rhythm of the heat
The rhythm of the heat
The rhythm of the heat
Drawn across the plainland
To the place that is higher
Drawn into the circle
That dances round the fire
We spit into our hands
And breathe across the palms
Raising them up high
Held open to the sun
Drawn across the plainland
To the place that is higher
Drawn into the circle
That dances round the fire
We spit into our hands
And breathe across the palms
Raising them up high
Held open to the sun
The rhythm of the heat
The rhythm of the heat
The rhythm of the heat
The rhythm of the heat
Self-conscious, uncertain
I’m showered with the dust
The spirit enters into me
And I submit to trust
Smash the radio
(No outside voices here)
Smash the watch
(Cannot tear the day to shreds)
Smash the camera
(Cannot steal away the spirits)
The rhythm is around me
The rhythm has control
The rhythm is inside me
The rhythm has my soul!
@ Dan Hitchman
Thats a pretty good theory. Cam is wounded in a way, and I’ve felt all along that the damage could end up being a benefit in the end hence the “Good Wound”. We’ll just have to see how it pans out.
Oh yeah to the cast and crew od T:TSCC. I just wanted to say thanks for the great show get some rest and recharge those batteries for next year. Have a Merry Christama and a Happy new Year!!!
pretty good episode, as a christian I am pleased you have the courage to almost preach gospel even when it makes little sense in the story
what Catherina (a terminator herself) would want with morals in henry is a bit of a mystery but I’ll try not to spoil too much
The ufo angle I was less happy about, particularly that you chose to use a known hoax ufo as the core of that storyline. that broke the illusion a lot, that you took the work of a young punk doing computer graphics that decided to try to fool the world into thinking it was real.
I loved the buildup to Sarah’s sighting of the “UFO” at the end of this episode. Really tense and X-Files-like!
And the Ellison / John henry moments are awesome, can’t wait for more of that.
Some interesting points here. Firstly, to the people unhappy with the multiple storylines not being resolved, I didn’t have a problem with that. I found it much more satisfying than the episode a few weeks back with the 1920s terminator and Cameron’s librarian pal. All tied up in one episode - and dull and unrelated to the mythology of the show which is what we love.
This show could quite easily have been a baddie of the week show, but in this second season, they have started to branch out more. How long have we known Riley? It is only now I am liking her. Someone mentioned that scene with her arriving in 2008 and I agree it was great. The actress did a fab job of showing her wonder at it all, hugging the pillows, stroking the furniture.
Is Jesse just a tough soldier or does she have a more sinister agenda? No sense of wonder from her (although she seemed to spend a while by the pool when we first met her.) She’s very hard on poor Riley, who seems very dependent on her. And we’ve seen Jesse manipulate Derek. I have a feeling she’s going to turn out to be very bad news..
Some interesting comments about Ellison and his idea of teaching ethics by teaching the bible. As someone else said, if John Henry and Weaver are Old Testament readers, Judgement Day does indeed make sense! What is Weaver up to? Why is she concerned about getting the AI to have ethics? Is it a necessary step to computers being sentient?
Going to be a long wait til Feb!
Cath, I’m NOT stating that they wrap EVERYTHING up in one episode. I’m saying that the A story should take 95 or more percent of the episode.
I LOVED all the little moments that you mentioned, but they were too few and far between.
Instead of having an overreaching A story with a 5 or less percent B story to keep the MAIN story arc moving, they had instead:
A, B, and C stories competing for time with each other.
Again, 41 minutes, people! 41 minutes!! That’s not a hell of a lot of time for even ONE story let alone three at once!
I wanted to see MORE of the backstory of Riley and how she got involved with Jesse in the future, even though I’m not a fan of the character in the first place, and John and Cameron’s interaction with her…
We got a teaser instead.
I thought the ideas played around with Ellison and John Henry and Catherine Weaver were cool and needed its own stand alone episode too.
We got a teaser instead.
The writers do this TOO often: TEASE.
I’m frankly getting tired of it.
I want to buy my episode on itunes but its not there where is it?
Johannes M. Bowers:
i’m pretty new to this blog.
so forgive me if i’ve missed something.
you wrote:
“My only concern is this. Don’t lie to us. Period. Withholding information and spoilers is one thing, but you bald-faced outright lied again and again about Riley.
……
We expect you to be the voice of validation and confirmation for everything not explicitly stated, shown, or explained in the shows, and now you have thoroughly betrayed that trust, and devalued your ability to realistically contribute to continuity outside the confines of the show as shot.”
that seems pretty harsh.
what/how did the writers lie?
i’m interested to know the details. not to stir problems but to know where this is coming from, etc.
thanks in advance.
Please anyone have you bought your episode from itunes yet?
The chess scene between Ellison and John Henry was interesting. I wonder if an AI would be able to comprehend the concept of “God”. In history humans who have tried to control other humans using religion have debased the faith and caused a lot of bloodshed. How much worse if a powerful machine became convinced of something and went on a mission to wipe out humanity for its own reasons (maybe the machines want to be God or to please God). It’s a creepy but plausible explanation for why Skynet would be so driven to commit mass human genocide. They’d use logical deduction but because religion isn’t exactly logical they’d totally miss what Ellison was getting at. This show is awesome. And BTW Lena as Sarah is amazing. I am also absolutely riveted by Catherine Weaver. Shirley Manson owns the screen whenever she’s on.
Okay, so I love the cyborgs, the interpersonal drama, the philosophic, psychological and moralistic plot lines, the time travel element, Jesse’s true dark side becoming clear, beautiful women with an edge, they quality acting — all fantastic … but UFOs!?!?!? (I guess I should state that I happen to be a guy who hates UFOs — unless they are in a space oriented show)
Why did you go there??…UFOs breaks a key plot dynamic, that the computers, technology, etc. that we have in our society can really yield the Terminator end of wold nightmare. Once you allow for UFOs, you are can do all sorts of magic think to work you ways out of plot turns — for example, of course the gang was okay, the aliens helped them avoid the terminator with their freeze time ray…
And why…There is so much going on already in the SCC, you could have worked for years off of the open plot lines … now UFOs? What next, are we going to have them solving Law and Order SVU type cases next?
Okay, so yes I am complaining…but only because you folks are ALL so talented and do such a good job of working the type of theme, plot and story lines I like …that I have to…sigh. I do love you guys though. Maybe make it a one or two show arc and then back to the stuff that floats my boat.
davey danger:
There are no UFOs. What people at the convention have been mistaken for UFOs were HK-like drones produced by a company Abraham worked for. Nothing to do with aliens.
“that seems pretty harsh. What/how did the writers lie? I’m interested to know the details. not to stir problems but to know where this is coming from, etc.”
By dashibbit on Dec 16, 2008
With the introduction of the character of Riley, they went out of their way, on several occassions, especially when directly questioned, to state that she was a “NOT from the future, but a normal person, a civillian”. This was in their blogs, podcasts, interviews, and videoblogs. Then POOF, she’s another time traveler.
As I said, either they were always lying to us, or they caved to the rampant Riley-hate with a hasty re-write of the character concept to “fix” her in the eyes of the angry fandom. This has (to date) shown varying results. We may very well see them using the intervening break to decide if Riley’s suicide was “successful” or “just an attempt” based on the overarching reaction.
My point is to hold them to a standard of veracity that has now taken a beating with what appears to be a self inflicted wound.
I’m all for the studio keeping secrets and surprising us with twists and shockers. But this tactic, if it was a tactic, is over the line for me.
gotcha. thanks for the explanation Johannes.
i havent seen any of that. but like i said, i’m pretty new to the forum.
@Johannes
I disagree (respectfully) with your indignation regarding being misled about the Riley character. First, Riley’s history was a significant plot twist only fully revealed in the fall finale. In order for this to have the requisite impact, it was necessary to keep viewers just as informed about the character as the Conners were.
Second, even if viewers were deliberately misled, where’s the harm? You were only being misled about a plot in a fictional story. It’s not a life or death incident upon which the entire truth depends. How did this change your life exactly?
I’m all for righteous indignation, but I think it’s best deployed in efforts to save the rainforests, genocide in Darfur, or a number of other real life issues. Let’s keep our perspective here. We’re being told a great story by some brilliant storytellers. If they mislead us from time to time, it’s because they believe it will help to tell a better story. Please don’t take it personally.
And yes, I love TSCC just as much as you do.
t101:
I agree completely with your point about UFOs. Unidentified does not mean extraterrestrial. Advanced weapons development in Area 51 and at the Skunk Works have used the Roswell cover to marginalize their critics while refusing to answer legitimate moral and environmental concerns about their projects. No one forces the MIC(military industrial complex as defined by departing President Eisenhower) to justify why we need these weapons only to ask is it theoretically possible. Call critics like Abraham kooks long enough and they stop questioning the authorities and start questioning themselves. I thought Natalie Chaidez captured that paradox skillfully…Nice job. I, for one, feel firmly grounded in reality.
This show needs to focus more on CAMERON. She is the most interesting character on the show.
Unfortunately, god or his children, don’t exist. I hope this is not the true essence of this story, but rather a display of how stupid the theory sounds. The quote was truly an honest one.
I love this show.
Lefty,
Truer words have never been spoken.
“Unfortunately, god or his children, don’t exist.”
By Mare
all of a sudden i feel so un-existential.
wow.
Mare,
In order for you to know that God does not exist, you would have to know what God was - as a null reference point.
I’m sure if you asked Ellison he could not tell you this. The Christian religion is based upon worshipping an Annoited One as the SON of God - not God itself.
What you perceive as the universe is really various bands of wavelenghts anyway. It is reality that does not exist, not God.
We mutually agree that these wavelenghts have certain properties, but in truth even the atoms that make up based material or the universe are not solid: 1/2 of 1% is actual physical matter, the rest is “empty” space - and we don’t know what fills it! Whatever it is SOMETHING is holding it all together in various re-occuring wave patterns and orbits. This happens at the sub-micro level for the various compoments of matter that very consisently blink in and out of our percievable deminsion all the time, to the super-macro level that encompasses billion of galaxies and how they interact with one another.
Too much is happening that has too much sameness in the way it operates even with as much diversity as we percieve, yet bot religion and science understand that there IS an all encompassing alpha-point, a “oneness” that cannot be denied.
Something is holding our reality together, something all pervasive. Gravity? Maybe, but gravity by DESIGN. Mathematically, you can’t rule that part out of any equation that pertains to our reality. We have an ultra-mutually symbiotic relationship with our reality, from the very smallest to the very largest elements.
If these are laws of reality, who/what made the law?
Are these factors that a machine can learn. Maybe. We are here, supposedly the smartest thing in our known reality, and we see these things yet don’t realize what we see.
What IS it we see? Well, what do we take for granted. It is known that we use our brains to filter out over 50% of what we percieve. We don’t even “see” what we percieve: our eyes take in light patterns that are in two deminsions, upsidedown, and backwards. We take in this data from two separate sources (our two eyes) and it gets pieced together and processed by our brains to TELL us what we WANT to see. That can be a BIG difference from what is really THERE.
Our brains tend to function by patterns themselves - and via these patterns we get lazy, they become a comfortable “via” through which we operate on auto-pilot rather than dealing with every bit of data we encounter.
The brain percieves over 4 million bits of data per second, yet we processes only about 20,000. That’s a lot of un-used, or thrown away, data.
Do the math.
“No fate but what we make” is the mantra of modern quantum physics. We make up our respective realites, and our collective realities as well. We use our brains to set the wavepatterns that will persist FOR us!
Can a machine do this? Maybe. Maybe they can come to this level of understanding - and even if they don’t know “God” by getting to the underlying unbiased understanding of how reality works maybe it doesn’t matter. We percieve lots of perceptions about reality that we can’t explain or do any further investigation on. We are like hampsters on a treadmill. Maybe machines don’t won’t have this treadmill. Certainly their perceptive intake equipment can be set to experience outside of human ranges. Just like we can’t see ultraviolet light and other optical bands.
To my way of thought, YOU are God and you don’t know it. I am WITH you and neither one of us know it! Maybe machines won’t have this crippling distraction and they can use powers of reality that we are so hesitant to enjoy.
Maybe the writers here will use this type of information in the development of such intricate characters as Cam and Weaver.
Maybe its fodder for a new T mythology, set in another place and time…
Maybe we can come to learn that the things greater than ourselves ARE ourselves, bc what is a human anyway other than an animal-vegitable robots comprised of various colonies of cells that work together as cohesive sub-systems to make a larger whole. Do these cells have a say in what they are a part of? Not until they break down! Do we as a whole have an idea of what we are a part of? Not until it breaks down on us.
If you doubt any of what I am talking about, just BE three feet in back of your head. Try it: maybe you are (still) perceptive enough to experience YOU - as a separate entity from your physical body…
If you can’t, you can still do your own research: scientists have know since the middle of the last century that the human brain only holds about 6 months worth of information. So if you are older than 6 months old, where is this data stored? In the mind. Only, they don’t KNOW “where” the mind is! They have no idea of the location of the mind (it is NOT in the brain - which functions as an FM radio sender-reciever between the mind and the body). But they do know that we all HAVE a mind. Check it out.
Hey Chris,
Couldn’t follow half of what you were talking about, but was very interested in your comments regarding the brain holding only six months of data. I could never understand how such a small brain seems to hold so much information. Even if current research seems to show that many of our memories are quite inaccurate, the point is, how are they stored at all? A binary coding system seems to be about the most compact system you can get, but our brain doesn’t seem to be binary. That leaves neural connections or molecules for coding. But, which molecules? Proteins, nucleic acids, sugars, fats? But if the memories are in the molecules, how do you pack enough of them into the brain to account for all the memories we have? Electrical stimulus to the brain seems to trigger memories going clear back to childhood–memories that are vivid with sights, sounds, full conversations, and even touch, smells and emotions.
You seem to be suggesting that the bulk of our memories, and perhaps even out thoughts are stored elsewhere and the brain simply gives us access to them. You didn’t really suggest what the mind was. Are you suggesting it is also organic, or it is something outside the body? (Body: Hyper calcium alloy chassis covered in carbon based flesh and inflated with molecules consisting of two parts hydrogen and one part oxygen
) If so what? You mentioned space was mostly empty. Current science seems to dismiss an aether even though many experiments show that light travels not only as photonic energy, but as a wave. If the “fabric” of space exists, could that be a possible medium or matrix in which external thoughts and memories reside?
If you care to elaborate on any of this, I, for one, would be interested.
Lee,
I’m glad you have an interest in such. I scare the pants off most professors and researchers, although the guys and gals at SRI Int’l hold their own (in fact, some of them are on the cutting edge of what we know on such subjects).
I will give you my crude opinions, but it is better if you do your own reseach and come to your own concusions. That said, a good start on quantum physics is movie “What the Bleep do We Know?” which has a website of the same name. On the mind, I’d direct you to read “Dianetics,” by L. Ron Hubbard (you can get a used copy on Half.com cheap).
ON THE MIND: Hubbard discovered something he called “cellular memory” - that all the cells in our bodies have the capacity to store the experiences that the total colonies have encountered. Problem was, they went back as far as birth, and with a little instruction and guidance, one could “return” to these various timeline points at will via a function of the brain/mind he called the “file clerk.”
Sometimes our time tracks get snarled up and he figured out a simple method to unravel them - but that is another story. I strongly suggest you read this book, then call Agent Mulder!
The mind, he found, is capable of both storing and posing data. The brain it has been discovered by other researchers, does not difrientiate between real-time reality and memories. The reason for this is it is not designed to work that way. Like our sight, it is designed to take in data and make it usuable FOR the rest of the colonies of cell to use. Its like a central mailroom once the data arrives from outside input, or the mind.
The mind stores and poses data structures via mental image pictures, although it does this along 55 different precepts - not the “5 senses” that we are taught in school. This is far too elementary for the mind. If you ever knew what time of the day it was or that someone had entered a room, or deja vu, then these are part of these perceptions. We don’t use our brains or our minds much in this manner so we tend to think it doesn’t exist. In this case, ignorance - unfortunately - is not bliss.
Your research will find much on how much “modern medicine” doesn’t know, and because this industry is driven by big drug companies that prefer to have sick customers for life rather that well human beings, you won’t get any solutions from this source. 70% of all illness is psychosemantic (mind derived).
We’ve all seen some “crazy person” walking down the street having a conversation with people around them that aren’t there. That person may not be actually the person speaking: they might be, or they might have experienced the event at a time of trauma and the conversation is based upon the people whom they encountered at this time, in the form of valences acted out in a returned mental image engram that this person cannot stop running in present time - like a scratched record…
If this explains multiple personalities to you good for you: the medical powers that be tried every dirty trick they could to acquire, control and then censure Hubbard’s work, primarilly because his methods can be taught in a few hours and put Pyschs out of work and most other doctors on long vacations!
You can verify your own experience by closing your eyes and picturing a cat. Who sees the cat? You do. You, as a spiritual being using you mind (just turn the cat picture purple to see that your eyes, your brain, and your mind are tools separate from you and NOT you as the sentient being).
As far as the rest of your physiology is concerned, your central nervous system and your various other connective systems (blood, air, water, etc.) maintain a huge amount of duplicity.
It works like this. All matter is based upon wavelenghts. We “see” solids, but like the Matrix, it is really a stream of date bits that function in wave patterns. Each pattern is made up of bits. These bits, we know know to be atoms and various sub-atomic particles.
We mutually agree that these particles have collective properties in the physical universe. Much like we use our brains to distribute processed data into a collective usable knot so our varius cellular colonies don’t have to: this is a crutch. Reality is, that there is one bit of data, which might be very complex or very simple, but there is ONE sigularity.
Thus, all the rest are a “one-off” of the original, with a slightly different perspective (not quite the same. Just as in a movie each frame is slightly different, so when you run the movie it seems to flow - for the eye; our reality is made up of a flow of data bits that we process together to make up a stream OF reality. They are not real. They make up an IMAGE of what is real, and we buy into the agreement that they are real.
Not to confuse you, but the first data bit is based upon a viewpoint. Who sees the viewpoint? Obviously someone/thing different than the viewpoint!
Take that viewpoint and run a stream of slightly different viewpoints so the “movie” (reality) runs. Each bit in the data stream is a variant OF the original. This is how we percieve time, relative to the space and energy exerted for us to perceive distance between to spaces. In actuality, two space may exists, but it is our perception of them that really makes up what we then perceive AS time, space, and even energy.
Scientists peer (through various measures - John Conners and his wife ran past a nuclear excelerator in T3) inside an atom and they find it is mostly empty space. In fact, only 1/2 of 1% is actually contains physical matter; the rest is just…empty. They speculate on what holds it all together. They speculate on what causes things to blip in and out of perceived space; they don’t know why things happen like this, but they know they do - and they do it maintaining the same orbits and trajectories - like a sew needle stichting up cloth.
They know our atoms are held together by something, but they don’t know what. Ditto for our planet, our solar system, our galaxy and our universe. It should go fly apart, even as it is ALL flying and spinning at violent speeds THROUGH the physical universe. We, even as we sit typing on this planet, are spinning and traveling at tremendous speed on our planet, in our solar system, in our galaxy, and in this universe.
What scientists have found on a macro level is in order for our bodies to exist at all it comes from heavy metal elements that were made during the formation of this universe’s stars, or shortly thereafter. These heavy metal elements include iron, etc. Without them, we would not be. So we have an incredible smybiotic relationship with ALL of the universe!
In our bodies, holistic medicine (accupuncture, reflexolgy, etc.) find that they can bypass snarled bodily communication systems) and bring harmomy to other parts of the body via remote areas. This is beacuse the body, just as is all of reality, a hologram, so it must contain all of the data of the original in order for it to be percieved. Each consecutive bit of data is thus a lie - it is a image stream put forth of our amusement - but it must also contain the original truth in order for it to persist.
So each cell contains all the data that is needed to store the data - but to try to i.d. where or even how it does this is too simplistic an effort, in my view. Knowing THAT it does is good enough for me. Cell don’t store the data, they provide the means to ACCESS the data - much like a “mini-mind.”
That is why people who lose a limb can still feel it. The body has complex sub-sets of capability that we are only now starting to even know exist.
We use only a small portion of our capability.
Reality is set up to have all of us agree that it is senior to us, not the other way around. You percieve the FIRST viewpoint, not reality. You perceive each subsequent bit of data that comprises reality. Somehow, along the way you, we, all of us, managed to stop exhibiting what are our native God-like qualities and started acting like we have no prior knowledge of these occurances.
But the evidence is we use very little of our human, mental, or spiritual potential. We allow hack movie directors and clergymen to paint superstious pictures for us that keep us under their control so they can make a profit.
We won’t even acknowledge the obvious when it is right before our eyes; but then, our eyes only take in the data - it is the brain that processes into patterns and it is known that it throws away over half of the actual input on a regular basis! How then can you trust anything you perceive with your own brain organ working against you?
Truth, it seems, is the key. Truth came first. We, as sentient beings, can know the truth WITHOUT our brains! Brains get lazy, as we tend to program them for mundane functions, and they atrophy… You can learn to “turn on” your brains by learning more about how the work, and then practicing to not BE lazy and let someone else tell you HOW to think or WHAT to think about.
T:SCC is a great show, but it is also a distraction: the truth is stranger than fiction. However, it becomes a wonderful tool for us to pose fictional calulations: our necessity level rises when ALL of the Earth is attacked - and attacked by our own creation, and all of mankind is in danger of being wiped out. We then have to “think outside of the box” and get on a REAL program of survival. This is the real drama of T. That Sarah and John KNOW what is going to happen, but no one else believes them because it is out of the lazy comfort zone of reality/experience so they collectively doom themselves by their unwitting lethargy.
We see the same thing happening on a global scale with pollution, war, disease, etc. yet as a collective we are letting others run the show that continue to exhibit no conscious, no caring, no responsibility for their fellow man - or even themselves! And no one seems to give a crap about hitting the abort button on this self destructive missile we are all taking a ride upon. No one I know has figured out how to get off this planet and make a go of it someplace else!
I hope some of this information seeps through. If not, well, its the same as it ever was since Mesopetania and before!
One last thing to bake your noodle, since it is Christmas time. Aside from Coca-Cola corp. running an ad campaign in 1919 that put Santa Claus in a red & white suit for product placement purposes…check out the documentary Zietgeist(sp?). Maybe we can have Ellison follow the The Kings to the star of Orion to find the winter solstace for three days to then have the sun rise again. Same mytholgy, different names, all around the world, for over 6,000 years - and nobody seems to notice the pattern!
Maybe we can get Cam and Weaver to put some of this together, and come up with a higher order of purpose and production than wacking guys who are usually defenseless and unarmed. We can get wiseguys and gang bangers to do that! (It’s a wonder the T-888 in the 20’s didn’t hire out such guys…maybe we are the REAL monsters for coming up with such social initistutions, but then wasn’t it our world governments that came up with war, slavery and genocide?).
I know it is out of the norm to write so much in a commentary, but you asked - and I think you need to know: if you, or any one of us really knew our true potential, our true capabilities, we COULD change the world. Possibly single handedly, as Sarah is trying to do.
This is the converseration that merits forwarding this show, or any other that could raise our level or awareness, increase our willingness to inspect ourselves and look a bit deeper, and insist upon postive and constructive change within and about us.
Sarah is trying to make the world a better place, even though she knows it will headlong become a much more horrible one. Can we do any less? Or are we mere spectators? She knows the world is faced with danger: so do we.
Even though they make John out to be an ass, is this any different than us and how we trun away from Darfur, or Tibet, or South Central Los Angeles. Why can’t she recruit an army of Crips to help her son lead the resistance - because they are part of the military industrial complex, by selling drugs and doing violence to support the prisons and finance social disharmony from the street to the highest levels?
Are we to sit idlly by while our police and politicians take bribes, turning the other way while we go over the edge led like mice controlled b a mass-media pied piper?
Maybe the reason this show’s ratings are not great is beacuse the mainstream is not ready to pose such deep propositions. As least it got US talking, with the potential to reach the rest of the world! That’s a start.
There is so much potential here. I hope we do not waste it.
Coach K, to experience myself “3 feet behind myself”, i think i’m gonna need some of that stuff that you’re smoking.
fwiw, i am now going to read Dianetics.
i’m very interested in this after reading your posts. some of what you wrote makes sense to me.
and, respectfully, some of it sounds like Tom Cruise channeling himself thru the 99.5% of the space that is not physical matter that you call you.
as an aside **and getting back to SCC**, some of the things you propose for the show would go over like a lead balloon with the general populace.
however, i do agree with your point “Are we to sit idlly by while our police and politicians take bribes….”
Hi Chris,
You really need to watch for an appropriate more-current topic box and then repost your last two posts so that more people will have a chance to read them.
Babylon 5 did a really great job for five years of pointing out government corruption and its willingness to steal the shirts off the backs of its own citizens. Sheridan solved the problem by enlisting the aid of several alien races, conquering earth, and then getting himself elected as the new president and throwing all the crooks out of office.
I’ve wondered how do we do that ourselves? A lot of people set out the recent election and didn’t vote. The media says its because they didn’t care. It could be because we were offered two crappy candidates who both appeared as willing to rob its citizens as the current congress, corporate America, and banking giants. I like your imagery of Sarah Connor taking on the world and doing what she can herself, but as great as it looks in the movies, I don’t think arming ourselves to the teeth and blooding the noses of corporate crooks will achieve much more than a long jail sentence (unless you have Cameron on your side, of course
)
I don’t think T:SCC is a political expose’, at least not in the way Babylon 5 was, but I see nothing wrong with people in this forum suggesting ways to make the world a better place.
And as for FOX and the staff of T:SCC, see what happens to these blogs when you have no new weekly episodes for us to banter about?
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Ruth
http://besttoddler.com